Spearker cables..fact or fiction?

hearingimpared · March 2009

C3PO sighting.

inspiredsports · March 2009

heiney9 wrote: »

Seafire,

So how did that conversation go with Polk HQ this morning? Just wondering if you were able to reslove anything?

Seafire, also waiting for more than a day now, I really would like to see if your Cat 5 designs would work for me. Please post them. Second request. I can't get my ears on them if you won't share.

sucks2beme · March 2009

TECHNOKID wrote: »

Very basic set-ups so far... :

Nothing wrong with that. A cheap system doesn't need good cables.
It needs appropriate cables. But beware. That's how most of us started.
After a couple rounds of upgrades.................:eek:

seafire · March 2009

TECHNOKID wrote: »

Ah! I knew I seen this before, took me a while to dig this through old discussions. I wouldn't have the patience to do such nor the will as I didn't think it be worthwhile. However, the article is very interesting.

http://www.venhaus1.com/diycatfivecables.html

Thank you technokid.I have stopped posting on this thread but what is interesting to me is the following:although I dont braid my wires it shows that I do have a point because others have used it too and have had good results with it.The author of this thread now manufactures hi end cable but still says this is a very good sounding cable that runs with and in some cases kicks hi end cables butt.Nothing wrong with my ears:D.
Just glad I'm not blind as a mole like some of the sheep on this forum;)

seafire · March 2009

inspiredsports wrote: »

Seafire, also waiting for more than a day now, I really would like to see if your Cat 5 designs would work for me. Please post them. Second request. I can't get my ears on them if you won't share.

Hi scroll back i did post some designs and how to customize them for your own system.Techonokid just pointed me too a site were someone else tried cat 5 with good results.However I do not braid mine so some interesting variations.See the link in technokids post;)

[Deleted User] · March 2009

treitz3 wrote: »

Who the F?CK is this dude in black and white beating this poor dead horse! Animal Mother F?CKIN Cruelty. Where's he at? I want to find him and have a walk down with our backs against one another and guns in holster. Count me down someone.

Halen

Fongolio · March 2009

seafire wrote: »

I will call Polk Audio today and ask them to review this thread and decide.

I'm mildly curious as to how that conversation went.

comfortablycurt · March 2009

TECHNOKID wrote: »

If the post is casual and civil, nothing wrong... He asked a legitimate question that deserve an honest answer without going back in the BIG debate...

Those weren't the posts I was referring to. I was referring to the posts that simply said to "put this thread to rest". I was pointing out that by making a post in this thread telling everyone to put this thread to rest, they aren't really helping "put it to rest". They're actually helping to keep it awake.

If you think any constructive conversation is going to come out of this thread at this point...wow...think again.;)

edit-Damn! I just realized how many tags there were for this thread...lol

ND13 · March 2009

Fongolio wrote: »

I'm mildly curious as to how that conversation went.

They put him on permahold.:D

[Deleted User] · March 2009

I will get back on track here. I started out not believing that speaker wires make any form on contribution in the search of audio bliss. Speaker wires were at most a form of connecting my speakers to my equipment. I had all kinds of self convictions about the limitations of wires, such as what about the inside of speaker cabinets and so forth.

All that I know is that it does not take an Engineer or whatever level of personal achievement one may have to hear a difference. Mathematically or scientifically nothing can be proven, not a damn thing. Just what is accepted for the time being. The fact is this and simple as this, either you hear or you dont hear a difference. One civil and simple answer to solve the problem is to get together with those that hears the difference and learn from them. If after all the experimentation and you still do not hear a difference, then that is that. Feel good that you do not hear a difference, less money you need to spend. By the same token, if you hear a difference, get ready for a new audio budget.

I went down the road already about differences in wires and what not. I am neutral today. I am jealous of those that hears a difference, maybe I lack the knowledge of synergy of all the components. But I am open to be converted, and I want to know how to create that synergy. I am here to learn.

I am in Dallas and willing to meet anyone in the area to dissect this. The thing is, you have to be open minded and willing. Personal insults will never get positive results, needless to say get togethers to test the differences. Lighten up everyone, attack the problem not the person.

Halen

Fongolio · March 2009

halenhoang wrote: »

I will get back on track here. I started out not believing that speaker wires make any form on contribution in the search of audio bliss. Speaker wires were at most a form of connecting my speakers to my equipment. I had all kinds of self convictions about the limitations of wires, such as what about the inside of speaker cabinets and so forth.

All that I know is that it does not take an Engineer or whatever level of personal achievement one may have to hear a difference. Mathematically or scientifically nothing can be proven, not a damn thing. Just what is accepted for the time being. The fact is this and simple as this, either you hear or you dont hear a difference. One civil and simple answer to solve the problem is to get together with those that hears the difference and learn from them. If after all the experimentation and you still do not hear a difference, then that is that. Feel good that you do not hear a difference, less money you need to spend. By the same token, if you hear a difference, get ready for a new audio budget.

I went down the road already about differences in wires and what not. I am neutral today. I am jealous of those that hears a difference, maybe I lack the knowledge of synergy of all the components. But I am open to be converted, and I want to know how to create that synergy. I am here to learn.

I am in Dallas and willing to meet anyone in the area to dissect this. The thing is, you have to be open minded and willing. Personal insults will never get positive results, needless to say get togethers to test the differences. Lighten up everyone, attack the problem not the person.

Halen

This post I applaud. A non-believer open minded enough to say "show me what you believe to be the truth". Outstanding. Way to go Halen. I'd like to be in on that demo myself as I've never heard the real differences myself. But then I've never heard an A/B test with the really good cables. Just like Mulder though "I want to believe".

seafire · March 2009

Fongolio wrote: »

I'm mildly curious as to how that conversation went.

I decided not to call Polk as it would have been a childish option.Its was 4 am in the morning when my fuse popped and I suppose I said that out of pure frustration .I also made a decision that I was not going to let any childish name calling etc affect me anymore,There are some here on this forum that are nice and open minded and I will share my views and experiences with them;)

mrbigbluelight · March 2009

Ricardo wrote: »

Nice quote:

http://www.eaglecomtronics.com/Products/Cable_TV_Products/Signal_Conditioning_Products/Cable_Simulators/cable_simulators.html

That was very interesting and enlightening. Nice !

sucks2beme wrote: »

Nothing wrong with that. A cheap system doesn't need good cables.
It needs appropriate cables. But beware. That's how most of us started.
After a couple rounds of upgrades.................:eek:

I'd add, "Appropriate cable or appropriate wire", at least when it comes to a budget system. I like to think of my rig as a "budget system" rather than a "cheap system".

One final note, if I may: there should almost NEVER be a reason to call Polk HQ for any discussions here on the Forum. The justifiable reasons are very, very, very, very few.
If a person finds him/her self calling to complain about getting their feelings hurt, or people being mean, or ..... whatever, than ....... well, maybe it is time for a diaper change.

seafire · March 2009

mrbigbluelight wrote: »

That was very interesting and enlightening. Nice !

I'd add, "Appropriate cable or appropriate wire", at least when it comes to a budget system. I like to think of my rig as a "budget system" rather than a "cheap system".

One final note, if I may: there should almost NEVER be a reason to call Polk HQ for any discussions here on the Forum. The justifiable reasons are very, very, very, very few.
If a person finds him/her self calling to complain about getting their feelings hurt, or people being mean, or ..... whatever, than ....... well, maybe it is time for a diaper change.

True which is why I didn't make the call.Changed my diapers back up and bouncing again:D

hearingimpared · March 2009

seafire wrote: »

I also made a decision that I was not going to let any childish name calling etc affect me anymore,

You mean like this one;

seafire wrote: »

Just glad I'm not blind as a mole like some of the sheep on this forum;)

Not only are you a hypocrite you are a BS artist as proven by DarqueKnight.

seafire · March 2009

hearingimpared wrote: »

You mean like this one;

Not only are you a hypocrite you are a BS artist as proven by DarqueKnight.

Well the above statement seems to be applicable to you too.Where did I say that I will not respond.Just what gives others the right to name call and slander.Surely I have the right to respond although I must admit that I'M growing weary of this.:DIf my exchange with DK convinced you that I'm a BS artist then be it so.No skin off my back

hearingimpared · March 2009

seafire wrote: »

Just what gives others the right to name call and slander.

You seem to be the only one with that "right."

seafire · March 2009

I will be the first to admit that my threat to call POLK was impulsive and childish.
However I can rest assured that I am in good company in terms off childish behaviour by the nature and quality of the comments directed at me.
All is fair in love and war;)

comfortablycurt · March 2009

And here I thought Seabiscuit was done making a fool of himself/herself.

I was wrong.:rolleyes:

seafire · March 2009

hearingimpared wrote: »

You seem to be the only one with that "right."

Give it up will you be done with me and move on.The feeling is mutual:cool:

hearingimpared · March 2009

seafire wrote: »

I will be the first to admit that my threat to call POLK was impulsive and childish.
However I can rest assured that I am in good company in terms off childish behaviour by the nature and quality of the comments directed at me.
All is fair in love and war;)

Open mouth, insert foot.

seafire · March 2009

Give it up will you . Be done with me and move on.The feeling is mutual
Ditto for you too Comfortablycurt

seafire · March 2009

Gee my ignore list is growing longer by the minute:)
What I find very interesting is how the link that Technokid put up about cat 5 is conveniently ignored.I wonder why?:)

comfortablycurt · March 2009

seafire wrote: »

Give it up will you . Be done with me and move on.The feeling is mutual
Ditto for you too Comfortablycurt

Ditto for you too Seabiscuit. You keep telling everyone else to move on. Why don't you move on?

You've already made yourself look like a complete idiot. Since you joined this forum about 2 weeks ago, your over 200 posts have been almost entirely in this thread. They've really made you look like an idiot. You haven't given any quality information or evidence to prove your points, despite how much you might think you have.

All you've really done here is spew your PERSONAL beliefs around, and try to convince everyone else on the idea that your PERSONAL beliefs are fact. They aren't. You've repeated the same "evidence" over and over and over and over again...and none of it is solid evidence, and you have absolutely nothing to back it up. "My friend thinks that he might possibly remember us maybe testing this specific thing this certain way, but he's not sure". Yeah...that's really solid proof there.:rolleyes:

seafire wrote: »

Gee my ignore list is growing longer by the minute:)

Yeah, that's a good thing. That's the only way you're ever going to read any posts without being insulted here. You've built such a great reputation for yourself.

comfortablycurt · March 2009

Good call Mike. The office might be able to help him out.

Seabiscuit- Polk's CS may be able to help you add everyone on the forum to your ignore list all at once. At the rate you're going here, you're not going to have to many friends around here, aside from a couple of the other idiots we've got on board.

They might be able to recommend a good brand of diapers for you too. It seems like you're getting a lot of leakage out of your current ones, judging by all the crap you're spewing out.

Side note-Seabiscuits post per day rating is HIGHER THAN MINE!!!:eek::eek:

:eek: How is that even possible?

seafire · March 2009

comfortablycurt wrote: »

Ditto for you too Seabiscuit. You keep telling everyone else to move on. Why don't you move on? You've already made yourself look like a complete idiot. Since you joined this forum about 2 weeks ago, your over 200 posts have been almost entirely in this thread. They've really made you look like an idiot. You haven't given any quality information or evidence to prove your points, despite how much you might think you have.

All you've really done here is spew your PERSONAL beliefs around, and try to convince everyone else on the idea that your PERSONAL beliefs are fact. They aren't. You've repeated the same "evidence" over and over and over and over again...and none of it is solid evidence, and you have absolutely nothing to back it up. "My friend thinks that he might possibly remember us maybe testing this specific thing this certain way, but he's not sure". Yeah...that's really solid proof there.:rolleyes:

Yeah, that's a good thing. That's the only way you're ever going to read any posts without being insulted here. You've built such a great reputation for yourself.

Reading back I wonder when last some of you saw the sun shine?so deeply are you crawled up each other.The ONLY person that came to this thread with substance was DK!.The rest of you trollers only had negative comments without ANY SUBSTANCE.Although DK came with some evidence it was actually more to do with power cable than speaker cable.He then asked me some questions which I answered(although he claims I avoided some issues) its all here in the thread to see and ultimately the truth will prevail.I merely pointed out that there are other alternatives to manufactured costly speaker cable.Further it is my opinion that when you get to a certain level of quality, differences become so negligible of which I was witness to in our own blindfold tests.These are my findings and my opinions so what's up with that.Many shot me down but did not have the ability to reason why.When Technokid posted a link to someone else's link on cat 5 cable including evaluation tests and scientific background on the subject it is convenietly ignored.Further more I have no financial gain from any of my opinions here, unlike others.So my views are unbiased in my opinion.
Challenging conventional thinking is something I enjoy.With it comes ridicule from the masses.So what! I really don't care.At least I go to bed at night knowing that I do not live my life with horse blinders on. And that my friend works for me;).So carry on in your merry ways.TO EACH HIS OWN;)

Extract from the weblink that Technokid supplied:"Although I now use a new >DIY VH Audio speaker cable in my current system, the CAT 5 cables described above were among the best speaker cables I ever used. They bested Kimber 8TC, AQ Midnight, and even gave the expensive XLO's a run for their money (the XLO's were better, but not by the margin that the price would indicate)"

comfortablycurt · March 2009

seafire wrote: »

Reading back I wonder when last some of you saw the sun shine?so deeply are you crawled up each other.The ONLY person that came to this thread with substance was DK!.The rest of you trollers only had negative comments without ANY SUBSTANCE.Although DK came with some evidence it was actually more to do with power cable than speaker cable.He then asked me some questions which I answered(although he claims I avoided some issues) its all here in the thread to see and ultimately the truth will prevail.I merely pointed out that there are other alternatives to manufactured costly speaker cable.Further it is my opinion that when you get to a certain level of quality, differences become so negligible of which I was witness to in our own blindfold tests.These are my findings and my opinions so what's up with that.Many shot me down but did not have the ability to reason why.When Technokid posted a link to someone else's link on cat 5 cable including evaluation tests and scientific background on the subject it is convenietly ignored.Further more I have no financial gain from any of my opinions here, unlike others.So my views are unbiased in my opinion.
Challenging conventional thinking is something I enjoy.With it comes ridicule from the masses.So what I really don't care.At least I go to bed at night knowing that I do not live life with horse blinders on. And that my friend works for me;).So carry on in your merry ways.TO EACH HIS OWN

I highlighted the key words there. This is a very opinionated subject. Nobody is arguing the fact that you can use Cat5 as speaker cable. It is a lower cost alternative that works very well for some people. Not everybody though.

As you stated, in your opinion, with some cables the differences get so small that it's negligible. Just because it's negligible to you, doesn't mean that it is to everyone else. Some people enjoy squeezing every last little bit out of their system. This is a hobby ya know, just like any other hobby. People that are seriously into cars will spend hours upon hours of tuning and invest a lot of money into squeezing every last bit of power out of the car. A whole bunch of little tweaks that each get you an extra 2-3 horsepower and all of a sudden you've got an extra 30 horsepower. The same is true in audio. A little tweak here, and a little tweak there can make all the difference. That extra 30 horsepower could make the difference between winning and losing.

Everyone isn't necessarily worried about the fact that they could get "close" with something that costs much less. Close but no cigar as the saying goes. That extra 1% improvement in the system could provide someone with 100% more enjoyment of their system. If there is an improvement, it's money well spent.

ND13 · March 2009

How long do you think it would take one man to make an exact copy of VH's braided Cat5 in lets say a 10 ft pr?

I know that when I'm working, my time is worth about $35-40/hr. Several of these fellas make a lot more per hour than I'll ever see. Do the math, they ain't that cheap.

Most here would rather buy some PROVEN, solidly built cables from an established, reputable cable manufacturer than spend their free time away from their family and friends braiding some cables that are questionably "equal too" what they can get used and are aesthetically pleasing to the eye.

He shoots, he scores!!!

seafire · April 2009

Ok point taken on that one.Bear in mind though that we are talking about a point here.At which point does the new cable exceed that? There is a quality point achieved with other cable or cat 5 for that matter.Yes I agree there are better cables out there, but many may have cable that is actually inferior to that that one can achieve with cat 5 and may not have the money to directly upgrade to that that is superior;)

seafire · April 2009

ND13 wrote: »

How long do you think it would take one man to make an exact copy of VH's braided Cat5 in lets say a 10 ft pr?

I know that when I'm working, my time is worth about $35-40/hr. Several of these fellas make a lot more per hour than I'll ever see. Do the math, they ain't that cheap.

Most here would rather buy some PROVEN, solidly built cables from an established, reputable cable manufacturer than spend their free time away from their family and friends braiding some cables that are questionably "equal too" what they can get used and are aesthetically pleasing to the eye.

He shoots, he scores!!!

True good point but again you said "MOST'' and that is not all.I for one would never bother with the breading.I feel That I have achieved very good results as per my design and it allows for specific tuning of a system.I suppose if I was living in the ''BIG EASY" I would opt for bought cables.Someone previously ridiculed me about not using Ebay.I have had only bad experiences on Evilbay so no that is not an option

Spearker cables..fact or fiction?

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