Spearker cables..fact or fiction?

nooshinjohn wrote: »

I guess you have never had a run of bad luck in your life, except whe the doctor dropped you on your head when u were born. you arent selling anyone here that your theory has any value whatsoever so move on already. I think those that have invested big money in cables have spent their money wisely because to them it is a tremendous improvement in sound. to me, I would rather spend money in other areas, so choose not to go big bucks on cables. I paid 150 bucks for my main speaker wires and about 20 bucks a pair for my rca cables... they sound fine to me, but that is why people have choices. Stop trying to be the cable guru, because to most you are just full of ****, and to those of us that dont want to spend a bunch on cables you are also full of ****...

Simple question, to all of you that think he or thread is so full of ****, why don't you move along? Doing so would surely get the thread to die. Simple, when people always intervene with their but... simply means some different!

C3PO sighting.

To add to the above post.We all heard differences in cable but as we moved up the ladder these differences became minute.This is when the blindfold test was recommended and honestly we all failed dismally in the end not being able to call the sound signatures to the respected cables anymore and I now had a certain sonic picture in my brain to chase..after a couple different tries I came up with a cable or two that even fooled some serious die hard audiophiles in the blindfold tests.I would love for us to try that here for everybody's advantage.This would be done after your scientific evaluation:D

Fellas, please let this **** die. It's obvious that they don't want to learn anything. Let them move along in their sonic bliss as they appear very happy with their stance on this topic. To them, the world is flat, period.

bikezappa wrote: »

This post is an example and maybe an answer to GG's post about why many older members don't visit here anymore.

I just don't get why people need to be disrespectful to other members. Because people don't agree doesn't mean they can ridicule, call them names or make fun of them.

Sad.

This plagues MANY other forums on practically any topic or hobby you can name.

Well respected members with years of experience and domain expertise get shouted down by anyone with an internet connection and a forum account.

And the senior members with knowledge to share get tired of being 'deconstructed' to be on the same level as newbies or those who think they are supposed experts but have nothing more than a big bookmark of links to sites which they may or may not have actually read or have actual experience.

It happens all the time....and it is a shame....everyone is a frakin' expert...yeah right...

This post is an example and maybe an answer to GG's post about why many older members don't visit here anymore.

Yes sir, the one below is a perfect example.

seafire wrote: »

Ok been around this hobby for 25 years.Most of this speaker cable -interconect stuff is ****!! Yes if you use grandpa's twisted pair flex cable made for light bulbs you will hear a difference but if you buy good quality 99% oxy free pure copper cable 12 gauge and up its gonna sound good! Will its sound different with single strand compared to multi strand..yes but different is not always better so maybe the answer is that you can tweak some of your systems short falls with different sounding cable..tired of this ****! Same goes for inter connects spent thousands in years gone buy and your ear tricks you make subtle changes sound different = better because thats what you want to hear after forking 200usd for inter connects.YOU GUYS HAVE SOME SERIOUS TWEAKING TO DO BECAUSE THIS MEANS THAT SIGNAL TRAVELING FROM YOUR CD ON **** PCB TRACK THEN GOES THROUGH YOUR 250USD+ INTERCONNECT ONLY TO RESUME ITS SIGNAL ON ANOTHER CHINESE **** PCB TRACK UNTIL THE SPEAKER OUTS HAHAHA THEN WHEN IT REACHES YOUR SPEAKER AFTER TRAVELING THROUGH YOUR 1000USD + SPEAKER CABLE IT RUNS THROUGH YOUR KOREAN PASSIVE CROSSOVER WITH MEASLY TRACKS TO YOUR SPEAKERS WITH YOUR SPEAKER MANUFACTURERS **** CABLE TO THE SPEAKER HAHAHA GIVE YOURSELVES A BREAK GUYS FOOD FOR THOUGHT!!!

bikezappa wrote: »

This post is an example and maybe an answer to GG's post about why many older members don't visit here anymore.

I just don't get why people need to be disrespectful to other members. Because people don't agree doesn't mean they can ridicule, call them names or make fun of them.

Sad.

Thank God the "older members" you mention really are still here.

I've found they willingly mentor and contribute their wisdom to the mix when it's requested in a genuine and respectful thread. They seem to have an uncanny ability to recognize a (new or old) member's legitimate need for help, versus a member's need to "stir the pot".

Outside of this group and out in the world in general, I've seen many a sharp, talented, opinionated people fail because they were unwilling to accept mentoring of any sort. Sadly, that seems to be the case in many Internet forum threads.

Based almost solely upon knowledge I've drawn from this group, I've been able to make up for neglecting my audio hobby for 20+ years in less than 4 months. The end result . . . . amazing sound. I attribute a large percentage of the improvement to finding the right cables and IC's.

I'm so thankful that I did not keep to the advice of those who truly believe that cables and wires don't matter.

Wow, I started reading this thread because I am very new, and a budding audiophile. I have a very simple, humble set up. I was hoping to glean some good information, and hear some thoughtful, constructive comments. I was wrong. As entertaining as this thread has been, I am seriously upset that so many "adults" with the means to buy some of these great toys, are simply juvenile in their comments. I am no better than the next guy, and am not lecturing anyone. I am simply making an observation, and hope that I don't get hammered for threadjacking or anything like that. I am simply trying to learn something, and this thread has left a very bad taste in my mouth. I will be quite hesitant to return here, I think.
I am simply trying to give some people that have been here a while, the point of view of a n00b who is brand new to this forum, and looking for some guidance and advice, while at the same time not fear getting called an idiot or worse.
Please be kind, I really like this hobby, and hope that the decent people making helpful comments would continue to raise the bar here.
Thanks for taking the time to read this.
Matt

polkapolka wrote: »

I am simply trying to learn something, and this thread has left a very bad taste in my mouth. I will be quite hesitant to return here, I think.

Matt

Matt
Don't be discouraged. In hobbies of any kind, there can be alot of passion in peoples beliefs--passion sometimes results in heated argument. Nature of the beast. There are many extremely intelligent people here with loads of experience, you just need to learn how to filter the information in a constructive way.

Then:

seafire wrote: »

Ok been around this hobby for 25 years.Most of this speaker cable -interconect stuff is ****!!

seafire wrote: »

Well boys I am waiting for someone to challenge my statements on a technical / scientific level any takers????

Now:

seafire wrote: »

If I gave you two of my Cat 5 cable recipes would you be prepared to do the valuation for us pitching it against some top end and mid level product?

Thank you for the offer, but I will politely decline. Surely someone with 25 years experience in this hobby and who has a friend who happens to be an electronics engineer with an oscilloscope can conduct a study of this type. I look forward to reading your results. The only recommendation I would offer is that you properly document your findings. Not being able to substantiate your claims with documentation calls into question your credibility.

Also, when you were asked some very reasonable and very specific questions, you tried to ignore the questions and turned around and began quizzing me. When I pressed you for answers, you responded this way:

seafire wrote: »

Have to get hold of my friend today (electronic engineer) who's scope we used.

seafire wrote: »

I think it was both we measured

seafire wrote: »

I phoned my friend (electronic engineer)who owns the scope.

seafire wrote: »

If my friends memory serves him correct there were differences of up to 8db.

seafire wrote: »

I had to make a second call to my friend at the audio shop to find out what we had listened to in the last years.

seafire wrote: »

These tests were run in 2006 so we are both a bit vague.

For someone to come in with guns blazing and then, when asked for substantiation, have to turn right around and depend on a friend's "vague" memory and knowledge looks rather weak. In the future, when you decide to share the benefits of your wisdom, I hope you will be prepared to stand on your own knowledge and documentation.

seafire wrote: »

I often review new stuff and like sharing my opinions and findings but preferably with people that have the ability to engage in conversation and debate with reason;)

I don't think it's appropriate, or wise, to come in demanding a technical debate and not be prepared to adequately engage in it. This is the equivalent of walking into a saloon and demanding a gunfight, knowing all the while your guns are loaded with blanks. Interestingly, you had the unmitigated gall to say this of someone else:

seafire wrote: »

See what I mean you come out firing your guns without checking your facts because yo have a peanut brain.

Now, on to other things....

seafire wrote: »

I read your review which oddly features cables made up of SOLID CORE MULTI STRAND = 9 gauge.

What is odd about this? Solid core multi conductor is still SOLID CORE. This is my understanding of the difference between solid core and stranded wire:

Solid Core Wire - A single conductor encapsulated in insulation.

Stranded Wire - Multiple, non-insulated wire strands encapsulated in a shared insulation.

If I take two or more insulated solid core wires and then twist them together to minimize field interaction and increase the effective wire gauge, are you saying that this would cease to be a solid core wire configuration and would then become a stranded wire configuration? I do not think this is correct. A bundle of insulated solid core wires with the appropriate winding geometry is still solid core and has the electrical characteristics of a single solid core wire of the same effective gauge. This is one of the main advantages of the Litz and Hyper-Litz solid core speaker cable configurations.

I do not mean to be disparaging, but many of your comments display a gaping lack of fundamental electronics knowledge. Your concept of "extending the PCB all the way to the speaker" was pure comedy and made no sense whatsoever. I would ask that you think things through a little bit more in the future.

Good luck with everything.:)

polkapolka wrote: »

I am simply trying to learn something, and this thread has left a very bad taste in my mouth. I will be quite hesitant to return here, I think.

Please be kind, I really like this hobby, and hope that the decent people making helpful comments would continue to raise the bar here.

Matt,

Just as you can't judge a person by one small character flaw or a city by one bad neighborhood, you can't judge a forum by one small (or large) thread, no matter how obnoxious it may be. If you stick around, you'll find that this is one of the friendliest, most informative audio forums available.

No one, with any sense, is going to belittle you for asking an honest, straightforward question.

An internet forum is like any public gathering place. After you've been around for a while you'll become quite adept at filtering the good from the bad. The only folks who have a problem here are the one's who ignore what Confucious said millinia ago:

Welcome.

bikezappa wrote: »

Matt you have explained the situation and yourself well. I couldn't have said it better.
There are many smart and decent people here.
There are also many with a good sense of humor.
There are some that have a twisted sense of humor however.

Peter

Thank God for them.

Say whatever you like. You are welcome to the "last word". I am done with this "discussion". I have other, more interesting things to do today.:)