The world is laughing at US

F1nut

Common core math......

"Tell how to make 10 when adding 8+5."

The student wrote, “You cannot make 10 with 8 + 5,” to which the teacher apparently replied in blue ink, “Yes you can. Take 2 from 5 and add it to 8 (8+2=10) Then add 3.”

I'm at a loss for words.......

westmassguy

All part of the new world order. Makes me sick.

kevhed72

Not everything is a conspiracy nowadays....unless you are referring the the first Bushes NWO

daddyjt

FWIW, it doesn't have to be a "conspiracy" to be ridiculous... Here's the now infamous father's check written to the school in common core terms...

maximillian

Common core started with good goals - standardization of basic math and language skills. So a student in one state testing at the a particular level would be equivalent to another student at the same test level in a different state. It unified already established state standards across multiple states. That's it, that was it's initial goal. From what I read it also did not specify how to teach. It only specified what a specific age level child was supposed to know. It started without federal government intervention and grew because it actually was a good program. It had bipartisan support at the state level with many states adopting it.

What we have today is a quite different and worthy of ridicule and rejection.

heiney9

F1nut wrote: »

Common core math......

"Tell how to make 10 when adding 8+5."

The student wrote, “You cannot make 10 with 8 + 5,” to which the teacher apparently replied in blue ink, “Yes you can. Take 2 from 5 and add it to 8 (8+2=10) Then add 3.”

I'm at a loss for words.......

I am as well. Not having kids, I haven't followed the "core" teachings. But, if this is a common theme and not just one of the extremes, we are all in trouble.

It even defies logic if you look past the mathematical properties. On no level can I see the teachers statement making sense, let alone being a correct mathematical equation.

My opinion is solely based on the quote as presented here. Perhaps it's part of a larger exercise of some sort of abstract analysis. But, I'm not seeing it.

H9

tonyb

This is the larger exercise....

http://www.democratsagainstunagenda21.com/common-core-is-agenda-21.html

Parents don't want it, most teachers don't want it, yet it's another thing being shoved down our throats. While we pay for it with no option to get out. No option for most that is because most can't afford private schools while still having to pay the nut for public schools on your tax bill. If you could take that money and put it towards private school tuition, things would change, but they have your kids and your wallet captive.

Mikey081057

It all figures in to the overall scheme.

The new math is: you can pass legislation with 37 votes but not with 64 votes. 1 is greater than 64 you see? This is Bizzaro world stuff here folks. Time to watch Idiocracy again.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-Vw2CrY9Igs

mhardy6647

Four-thirds of Americans, including me, struggle with arithmetic involving fractions.

deronb1

Common Core is on its way out. The eggheads come up with something new every five to seven years to just8fy their jobs and keep the giant publishing companies in the black. Cant wait to see whats next.

tonyb

It's sad really, my 9 year old grandson got marked wrong on his math test with 8x5. His answer was 40, which is correct, but in common core it is not.

What kind of lunacy is going on in our public schools ? Apparently, the answer isn't as important as the means of which you achieved that answer. Thank God I don't have kids in public school today. I'd home school before subjecting them to this nonsense.

deronb1

Was it marked wrong because he did not use or show the process? Not that i think it matters, but i know many teachers who adopt a "my way or the highway policy".

tonyb

deronb1 wrote: »

Was it marked wrong because he did not use or show the process? Not that i think it matters, but i know many teachers who adopt a "my way or the highway policy".

The process he was told to use didn't come up with the correct answer. But he already knew what the correct answer was, so I guess you could say he was marked wrong for not following the process.

What good is it to follow a process that doesn't lead to the correct answer though ? What is the lesson being taught ?

Do as your told even though it's wrong ? The ends justify the means....even if it's wrong ? The correct answer isn't as important as the process ?

This goes against all that is logical by any sense of the word. This has more to do with conditioning young minds to a certain way of thinking other than what they are accustomed to. Education in a way is about conditioning young minds, but not indoctrinating them. Our public school systems are now the worlds largest indoctrination centers.

China, Russia, crazies in the middle east use the same tactics.....emotion, to indoctrinate their young minds. We talk about Math a lot when talking Common Core, but it's reach is in all subjects. What it does to English, books, History also should be of great concern.

Kevhed,

BTW....it was the 2nd Bush that signed on to Agenda 21.

tonyb

Here's a not too short version of what we are talking about.

http://americanpolicy.org/agenda21/

Read it, and tell me you can't see all the signs in your own community/schools/government. This is not some made up B.S.

scubalab

Common Core, and all it's associated issues and agendas aside...

As an engineer, I actually agree with the concept behind the method to solve the equation Jesse opened this thread with. However, the way it was presented and the question asked was horribly wrong and IS a joke. I was NOT taught math using the common core concepts, yet, I figured (on my own) a way that works for ME.

I've always visualized numbers quantitatively and for me it was always easier to add the 1's, 10's, 100's, etc. individually. That's what's being taught here... again, horribly wrong though. 8+5=13. We could either teach our children to memorize the basic addition/subtraction/multiplication/division equations for all combinations (typically 1-10), OR we could teach them how to arrive at the answer quantitatively.

I look at the question this way... 8 is close to 10. You only need 2 more to get to 10. You can borrow 2 from the 5 (leaving 3). Now you have your 10's digit and your 1's digit. Yes, I agree that it's much more 'lengthy' for this simple of an equation, but it most definitely helps once you get into larger numbers.

That's what's being taught here. The question was an attempt to ask how to do the first step. There would have been two acceptable answers - you can make the "10's" part by either taking 2 from the 5 and adding it to the 8, or taking 5 from the 8 and adding it to the 5.

Once kids "get" this concept, it usually makes math a bit easier for them. Case in point, I have two daughters 12 and 10. My 12-year old hates math, thinks it's useless, and struggles through getting mediocre grades. She just does NOT get the concept of breaking down the numbers to make things easier to add/subtract. My 10-year old is a wiz at math. She gets it. She consistently amazes me with more complex addition and subtraction getting the correct answer in her head. When I ask her how she did it... she basically explains how she broke the numbers down into the 1's, 10's, 100's, etc.

So, all this to say that although I somewhat agree with the attempt to teach this concept, to Jesse's point, I agree that taken out of context, the way this question was worded does in fact make us look like fools!

daddyjt

The wonderful thing about math, is that at least up to and including calculus, is that it's not open to interpretation - It's right, or it's wrong. period. It doesn't matter how you feel about the answer, and it really doesn't matter how hard you tried - It's right, or it's wrong.

I personally think it was a GOOD thing that our generation learned times tables, long division, and how to "carry" numbers in addition and multiplication. Those skills sent men to the moon, built the industrialized society, and built the computer age.

Mikey081057

Are the countries who are kicking our butts in education using common core? Honest question and I don't know the answer.

I under stand that CC is to "level out" education test scores at the US "State Level" but the focus needs to be on educating our students to be the 1st in the world not 36th.

In my mind CC might bring the lower states up but the top states down... which may give us a higher average but harm the top students. That's big GOV for you... You get what you vote for.

http://www.usnews.com/news/special-reports/articles/2014/02/25/how-does-common-core-compare-to-other-countries

.

BlueFox

scubalab wrote: »

Common Core, and all it's associated issues and agendas aside...

As an engineer, I actually agree with the concept behind the method to solve the equation Jesse opened this thread with. However, the way it was presented and the question asked was horribly wrong and IS a joke. I was NOT taught math using the common core concepts, yet, I figured (on my own) a way that works for ME.

I've always visualized numbers quantitatively and for me it was always easier to add the 1's, 10's, 100's, etc. individually. That's what's being taught here... again, horribly wrong though. 8+5=13. We could either teach our children to memorize the basic addition/subtraction/multiplication/division equations for all combinations (typically 1-10), OR we could teach them how to arrive at the answer quantitatively.

I look at the question this way... 8 is close to 10. You only need 2 more to get to 10. You can borrow 2 from the 5 (leaving 3). Now you have your 10's digit and your 1's digit. Yes, I agree that it's much more 'lengthy' for this simple of an equation, but it most definitely helps once you get into larger numbers.

That's what's being taught here. The question was an attempt to ask how to do the first step. There would have been two acceptable answers - you can make the "10's" part by either taking 2 from the 5 and adding it to the 8, or taking 5 from the 8 and adding it to the 5.

Once kids "get" this concept, it usually makes math a bit easier for them. Case in point, I have two daughters 12 and 10. My 12-year old hates math, thinks it's useless, and struggles through getting mediocre grades. She just does NOT get the concept of breaking down the numbers to make things easier to add/subtract. My 10-year old is a wiz at math. She gets it. She consistently amazes me with more complex addition and subtraction getting the correct answer in her head. When I ask her how she did it... she basically explains how she broke the numbers down into the 1's, 10's, 100's, etc.

So, all this to say that although I somewhat agree with the attempt to teach this concept, to Jesse's point, I agree that taken out of context, the way this question was worded does in fact make us look like fools!

Don't confuse people with the facts. They would rather believe conspiracy theories.

heiney9

Agreed, the idea is one I have used since I was young and long, long, before it was taught in schools.

The question is horrible in the way it's asked, simply horrible.

H9

smglbrth

tonyb wrote: »

What kind of lunacy is going on in our public schools ? Apparently, the answer isn't as important as the means of which you achieved that answer. Thank God I don't have kids in public school today. I'd home school before subjecting them to this nonsense.

Um..., ya, this is just ONE reason we home school all of our kids...

thsmith

I guess the problem lies in that we took something simple and made complex such that teachers cant get it right or easy to screw up, HOW IS THAT BETTER?

Nightfall

When I first saw Jesse's post I was very confused, until I read scubalab's post. Makes sense to me. Just a different way to get the answer. Might be easier for some minds, harder for others.

Emlyn

I have some experience with this through elementary school age nieces in Kentucky, which was one of the first States to adopt the new methods. From what I've seen of the new methods of teaching introductory math, it's the parents who are more confused than the kids because it is a different method than the rote memorization and single formula methods taught for decades. I tried to help one six year old with some homework mid way through her book and had to go back to the beginning and ask her to explain what was needed to figure out what was supposed to be done.

Schools have not been doing a good job of explaining why the new methods are better for the average child, and many parents tend to scratch their heads when they look at the "games" their kids are working on when there is a much faster, usually memorized, way of getting to the same answer. The new methods are mainly visually oriented ways of taking a kid through multiple steps so they better understand why numbers work the way they do rather than just memorizing methods. This is why I view them as games. They do seem to interest kids more than the older methods.

After looking into the methods, they do make sense to me as long as they aren't taken out of context. Schools could do a better job of realizing they aren't just teaching kids, they are relying on parents to help teach the kids too and many parents don't understand why schools are saying the new methods are more beneficial to the way kids learn math.

afterburnt

maximillian wrote: »

Common core started with good goals - standardization of basic math and language skills. So a student in one state testing at the a particular level would be equivalent to another student at the same test level in a different state. It unified already established state standards across multiple states. That's it, that was it's initial goal. From what I read it also did not specify how to teach. It only specified what a specific age level child was supposed to know. It started without federal government intervention and grew because it actually was a good program. It had bipartisan support at the state level with many states adopting it.

What we have today is a quite different and worthy of ridicule and rejection.

the road to hell...

afterburnt

If Jack has 30 candy bars and eats 25 what does Jack have now? Diabetes!

scubalab

Emlyn - you hit the nail on the head. I was thoroughly confused with my first daughter's math homework (our school district in Central PA called it "Everyday Math"). It used a lot of estimating, probability, and an entirely new way to multiply and divide (the multiplication was the "lattice method"). It took some getting used to, but it is an interesting way to look at math. I actually like the lattice method for long multiplication. You are right though, it was nothing like what we learned as children!

Skip - if you missed the thread from the other day (that has been closed), the sample Jesse references came from what I think was an actual question, answer, and teacher's comment (there are pictures of the actual assignment floating around out there). And yes, taken out of context, it makes the teacher look ridiculous (mostly due to the horrible wording of the question).

What grade/subjects do you teach? It's refreshing to get your take on things! I hold a lot of respect for you and your profession. If I were to change careers, teaching is where my heart lies. I teach many safety/construction/basic engineering classes through some contracts my company is fortunate to have, and those are the days I truly LOVE my job.

Peace ~ Al

tonyb

I don't have a problem with teaching different processes.....as long as all of them come up with the right answer. The right answer is not subjective, it's either right or wrong....no grey areas.

You cannot add 8+5 and come up with anything other than 13.
You can't multiply 8x5 and come up with anything other than 40. regardless of the process used, the answer has to be the same.

deronb1

I asked a group of 3rd graders: "If Brooklyns cat had 7 kittens and she wanted to give them to her 2 friends, how many kittens would each friend get?" The unanimous answer was 3 1/2 kittens.

I then asked them who would want 1/2 a kitten? There was giggling and some ewwwwwws, but it was a good way to start a lesson on Reasonable Answers. Practical applications of Mathematics has to start at an early age.

kevhed72

I thought the illegal immigrants were to blame....or was It Obama?
I have struggled through some well written and some poorly written examples of common core math with my kids. Since common core is relatively new to public schools, and our nations education system has been near the bottom of the global rankings for decades now....is it really to blame? Perhaps if parents volunteered more and took more interest in their kid's school work....maybe we're on to something there.

markmarc

A little general history on the CCS:

The whole movement to Common Core has been a classic case of putting the cart before the horse. The final standards were written with scant few master classroom teachers, most of the spots went to consultants. The standards were adopted without being tried out. Finally, they were adopted across the board k-12 all at once instead of starting with kindergarten 1st year, k and 1 second year and so on. (When Finland changed its methods they started with adding one grade a year plan).

This forced a serious of chaotic changes, students are having to learn information without having in some cases a foundation of previous learning. These holes have created all sorts of learning struggles among students, especially in math and science curriculums. The financial impact has been huge, textbooks and materials had to be replaced all at once in order to meet the CC standards. Of course, Pearson textbook publisher was the main driver and had many, many more people on the standards committees. They are laughing all the way to the bank.

I will say that by the end of 12th grade the standards make sense, the problem is that along the way some topics are taught in different sequences. The original goals of CCS were honorable, the problem was that the for-profit education industry and clueless political grandstanding overpowered proven educational research and best practices. Blaming teachers and instead trusting politicians and for-profit industry is a recipe for disaster.

jeremymarcinko

I guess it's better than having a classroom smelling like feet, because the kids ran out of fingers to count on.