Dreadnaught Avel-Lindberg 1000VA Transformer Group Buy?

vmaxer

nspindel wrote: »

Good news to pass along. Just heard from Melanie that these should ship by end of next week!

Also - Voltz and MrBuhl, Melanie confirms that you guys have done a buy/sell of this unit, and it will ship to MrBuhl.

Many thanks for doing this for us!!!

Toolfan66

Glad the cases are done!!

MrBuhl

Many thanks Neil!

drumminman

Thank you Neil.

LeftCoast

I am brand new the the SDA club. Is there any way to still get in on this, or has the ship sailed?

Dennis Gardner

LeftCoast wrote: »

I am brand new the the SDA club. Is there any way to still get in on this, or has the ship sailed?

You will have to either wait for the next group buy, order 10 yourself from A\L, or wait until someone gives up on their SDAs and wants to unload their transformers. I imagine a few of these will hit the forum for sale in the next few months as they serve absolutely no other purpose to anyone other than SDA modders.

westmassguy

LeftCoast wrote: »

I am brand new the the SDA club. Is there any way to still get in on this, or has the ship sailed?

The 800VA Toroid is a stock Item with Avel-Lindberg

LeftCoast

westmassguy wrote: »

LeftCoast wrote: »

I am brand new the the SDA club. Is there any way to still get in on this, or has the ship sailed?

The 800VA Toroid is a stock Item with Avel-Lindberg

Thanks for the info. I think I'll just wait for another group by of the 1000VA, even if it takes awhile. I'm a pretty patient dude and I'm up to my eyeballs in other projects anyway,
Meanwhile I will do other upgrades, like Toolfan's rings, etc, and just enjoy what I have and be patient.

crispybrown

Dennis Gardner wrote: »

LeftCoast wrote: »

I am brand new the the SDA club. Is there any way to still get in on this, or has the ship sailed?

You will have to either wait for the next group buy, order 10 yourself from A\L, or wait until someone gives up on their SDAs and wants to unload their transformers. I imagine a few of these will hit the forum for sale in the next few months as they serve absolutely no other purpose to anyone other than SDA modders.

Isn't it basically a high quality 120v-to-120v isolating transformer? Some audiophiles like placing those between the power supply and equipment, so assuming you live in a country with 120v ac power, you could do that and convince yourself it improves the sound of a system without SDAs :-P

nspindel

Sorry to get hopes up, but Melanie just emailed me and said she misquoted the shipping date by one week. These will ship by Oct. 10.

ZLTFUL

crispybrown wrote: »

Isn't it basically a high quality 120v-to-120v isolating transformer? Some audiophiles like placing those between the power supply and equipment, so assuming you live in a country with 120v ac power, you could do that and convince yourself it improves the sound of a system without SDAs :-P

cripsybrown wrote:

I would be in for a group buy although I remain skeptical - how would replacing a wire with a transformer help if I don't run bridged amps? If it does, are there other 'random' places in audio circuits we can throw expensive inductors too and expect an improvement? :-). It smacks of cutting a digital signal to vinyl then playing it back and claiming better sound to me!

Translation: "I am skeptical and would rather insult others' intelligence rather than try it out myself and see if it really does or doesn't make a difference."

You can pick up the 800va toroid from A/L for ~$135 shipped. You can buy a case from Digi-Key and connectors along with the speaker cable of your choice for a total cost of under $200. You can recoup most of that selling a complete Dreadnought on the forum.
Frankly, for the $15-$25 you may lose, you have a ton to gain. So why not try it out for yourself instead of insulting everyone who has tried it and has experienced a difference?

nspindel

He is trying it out. He purchased one in the group buy.

crispybrown

ZLTFUL wrote: »

crispybrown wrote: »

Isn't it basically a high quality 120v-to-120v isolating transformer? Some audiophiles like placing those between the power supply and equipment, so assuming you live in a country with 120v ac power, you could do that and convince yourself it improves the sound of a system without SDAs :-P

cripsybrown wrote:

I would be in for a group buy although I remain skeptical - how would replacing a wire with a transformer help if I don't run bridged amps? If it does, are there other 'random' places in audio circuits we can throw expensive inductors too and expect an improvement? :-). It smacks of cutting a digital signal to vinyl then playing it back and claiming better sound to me!

Translation: "I am skeptical and would rather insult others' intelligence rather than try it out myself and see if it really does or doesn't make a difference."

You can pick up the 800va toroid from A/L for ~$135 shipped. You can buy a case from Digi-Key and connectors along with the speaker cable of your choice for a total cost of under $200. You can recoup most of that selling a complete Dreadnought on the forum.
Frankly, for the $15-$25 you may lose, you have a ton to gain. So why not try it out for yourself instead of insulting everyone who has tried it and has experienced a difference?

Maybe it doesn't come across that way here, but I see it as insulting my own intelligence: As you say many people here experienced a difference. I do not understand the science or logic behind why an isolating transformer would help in the sda link, so I am buying one to find out as you suggest.

Similarly some people have reported an improvement from placing one in the power input path. Again I do not understand why that would/could improve the sound, but if I found myself with a nice a-l transformer and no SDAs, I would certainly give it a try. (Assuming I am correct in my assumption that the 1000va model is a 120v, 60hz compatible isolator. If not, it would be a good way to ruin an expensive transformer and perhaps start a fire...)

TNTsTunes

crispybrown wrote: »

ZLTFUL wrote: »

crispybrown wrote: »

Isn't it basically a high quality 120v-to-120v isolating transformer? Some audiophiles like placing those between the power supply and equipment, so assuming you live in a country with 120v ac power, you could do that and convince yourself it improves the sound of a system without SDAs :-P

cripsybrown wrote:

I would be in for a group buy although I remain skeptical - how would replacing a wire with a transformer help if I don't run bridged amps? If it does, are there other 'random' places in audio circuits we can throw expensive inductors too and expect an improvement? :-). It smacks of cutting a digital signal to vinyl then playing it back and claiming better sound to me!

Translation: "I am skeptical and would rather insult others' intelligence rather than try it out myself and see if it really does or doesn't make a difference."

You can pick up the 800va toroid from A/L for ~$135 shipped. You can buy a case from Digi-Key and connectors along with the speaker cable of your choice for a total cost of under $200. You can recoup most of that selling a complete Dreadnought on the forum.
Frankly, for the $15-$25 you may lose, you have a ton to gain. So why not try it out for yourself instead of insulting everyone who has tried it and has experienced a difference?

Maybe it doesn't come across that way here, but I see it as insulting my own intelligence: As you say many people here experienced a difference. I do not understand the science or logic behind why an isolating transformer would help in the sda link, so I am buying one to find out as you suggest.

Similarly some people have reported an improvement from placing one in the power input path. Again I do not understand why that would/could improve the sound, but if I found myself with a nice a-l transformer and no SDAs, I would certainly give it a try. (Assuming I am correct in my assumption that the 1000va model is a 120v, 60hz compatible isolator. If not, it would be a good way to ruin an expensive transformer and perhaps start a fire...)

Have you read this?

http://vr3mods.com/uploads/SDA_Handbook_2011_Rev3.pdf

ZLTFUL

My bad on the purchase side of it. You are trying it out for yourself and that is a good thing.

The short of it, on the power side, the isolation transformer isolates the downstream circuitry from the mains. This is primarily for safety as the user of an isolated device now has no contact with the main's power. The side effect/benefit is that any noise on the mains is not transferred to the secondary winding. The "new" magnetic field created by the secondary tends to be cleaner power than the mains.

On the Dreadnought side, it is to use inductance to transfer the signal which in turn decouples the ground from each side of the amp in non-common ground amps. This inductive signal tends to be cleaner.

(At least this is how my limited understanding of electrical theory explains it)

Moose68Bash

ZLTFUL nails it.

I have a Silver Circle Audio Pure Power One 5.0 power conditioner in between mains and all my equipment in my main rig. It is essentially a 5.0KV toroidal transformer with several receptacles. When I installed it, not only did I notice the "cleaner" sound, but my wife commented on it without prompting from me. Isolating the mains helps with SQ.

The isolation transformer in the SDA interconnect circuit helps with the 1Cs in SQ, even though that rig has a common ground amp. (My wife noticed the improvement in SQ there, as well.

Of course, I could not even use my mono blocks in my main rig with the SDA interconnect without the Dreadnought in that circuit -- they're non-common ground amps.

Sea

Have we lost the historical threads forever? I remember a thread that showed how the transformer was wired in, but I cannot find it now. I am, for one, going to need some advice when we get the transformers.

MrBuhl

Sea wrote: »

Have we lost the historical threads forever? I remember a thread that showed how the transformer was wired in, but I cannot find it now. I am, for one, going to need some advice when we get the transformers.

Amen to that! I might try to go it alone - but not without help! Here are a few I bookmarked.

http://forum.polkaudio.com/discussion/74472/the-ai-1-dreadnought-project-pt-1/p1

http://forum.polkaudio.com/discussion/158154/800va-dreadnought-build#latest

http://forum.polkaudio.com/discussion/160494/dreadnought-assembly-questions#latest

Some have pictures restored, some well...

Sea

Great. Thanks. There was some links that nspindel has posted further up in the thread that were dead. The wiring details were in third link of your post, Many Thanks.

agfrost

You guys getting ready? I've got most of my preparations done-I made two 8' lengths of cable to use with the Dreadnaught, and a separate 14 footer for use without. At one point I thought I might be completing my Speakon work before receiving the transformer, but it sounds as if they'll be arriving on our doorsteps pretty soon. I'll still find use for the single cable if I'd like to A/B a little or if in the future I decide to move the speakers along separately (no plans for that as of now!).



Left to do is a) Dynamat inside of case, and b) add the Speakon connector to my 2BTL's terminal cup. I've got a little extra bit of soldering work to do there, as I've got the B/B connector now and need to make the internal connection to what would be the blade connector in a pin/blade setup.

Jay

markamerica

LeftCoast wrote: »

Thanks for the info. I think I'll just wait for another group by of the 1000VA, even if it takes awhile. I'm a pretty patient dude and I'm up to my eyeballs in other projects anyway,
Meanwhile I will do other upgrades, like Toolfan's rings, etc, and just enjoy what I have and be patient.

Leftcoast, whenever there is another group buy, count me in.

TNTsTunes

agfrost wrote: »

You guys getting ready? I've got most of my preparations done-I made two 8' lengths of cable to use with the Dreadnaught, and a separate 14 footer for use without. At one point I thought I might be completing my Speakon work before receiving the transformer, but it sounds as if they'll be arriving on our doorsteps pretty soon. I'll still find use for the single cable if I'd like to A/B a little or if in the future I decide to move the speakers along separately (no plans for that as of now!).



Left to do is a) Dynamat inside of case, and b) add the Speakon connector to my 2BTL's terminal cup. I've got a little extra bit of soldering work to do there, as I've got the B/B connector now and need to make the internal connection to what would be the blade connector in a pin/blade setup.

Jay

I'm getting ready, my case arrived yesterday and now I'm waiting on the transformer. I'm not sure if Glen got his rerouted to me before they shipped. I have the dynamat, connectors and feet coming. Still need to get it all ready.

DarqueKnight

crispybrown wrote: »

Similarly some people have reported an improvement from placing one in the power input path. Again I do not understand why that would/could improve the sound, but if I found myself with a nice a-l transformer and no SDAs, I would certainly give it a try. (Assuming I am correct in my assumption that the 1000va model is a 120v, 60hz compatible isolator. If not, it would be a good way to ruin an expensive transformer and perhaps start a fire...)

ZLTFUL wrote: »

My bad on the purchase side of it. You are trying it out for yourself and that is a good thing.

The short of it, on the power side, the isolation transformer isolates the downstream circuitry from the mains. This is primarily for safety as the user of an isolated device now has no contact with the main's power. The side effect/benefit is that any noise on the mains is not transferred to the secondary winding. The "new" magnetic field created by the secondary tends to be cleaner power than the mains.

On the Dreadnought side, it is to use inductance to transfer the signal which in turn decouples the ground from each side of the amp in non-common ground amps. This inductive signal tends to be cleaner.

(At least this is how my limited understanding of electrical theory explains it)

ZLTFUL's explanation sums it up nicely. The link below is to a thread that shows a circuit diagram:

The AI-1 Dreadnought Project Pt.2 - Upgrade to 1000VA Transformer -Pg 7

ZLTFUL

DarqueKnight wrote: »

ZLTFUL's explanation sums it up nicely. The link below is to a thread that shows a circuit diagram:

The AI-1 Dreadnought Project Pt.2 - Upgrade to 1000VA Transformer -Pg 7

*blushing*

Mr_Hz

agfrost wrote: » You guys getting ready?

I've got my cases from Larry, ordered/received my female Speakon connectors. Ordered and have to go to the post office to pick up the cables from WestMassGuy/David for the interconnects. Just received my copper film tape which I will use to line the interiors of the enclosures, suppressing/reducing any possible RF interference. Many people talk of using Dynomat inside these enclosures... but to me it would seem copper used as an RF suppression agent is more effective than Dynomat as a noise suppressant. Am I missing something? Should both be used, or is that overkill?

Your input is welcomed...

westmassguy

Mr_Hz wrote: »

agfrost wrote: » You guys getting ready?

I've got my cases from Larry, ordered/received my female Speakon connectors. Ordered and have to go to the post office to pick up the cables from WestMassGuy/David for the interconnects. Just received my copper film tape which I will use to line the interiors of the enclosures, suppressing/reducing any possible RF interference. Many people talk of using Dynomat inside these enclosures... but to me it would seem copper used as an RF suppression agent is more effective than Dynomat as a noise suppressant. Am I missing something? Should both be used, or is that overkill?

Your input is welcomed...

Ron, the Aluminum Case Filters RF, the Copper Foil Filters EMI, and the Dynamat adds mass to the enclosure, to suppress internal and external micro-vibrations/resonances.

drumminman

Mr_Hz wrote: »

Just received my copper film tape which I will use to line the interiors of the enclosures, suppressing/reducing any possible RF interference.

Where did you order your copper tape? Can you post a link?

Thanks

TennMan

Did you consider adding a switch to the case to bypass the transformer? That way you could do an A/B test without swapping cables.

westmassguy

drumminman wrote: »

Mr_Hz wrote: »

Just received my copper film tape which I will use to line the interiors of the enclosures, suppressing/reducing any possible RF interference.

Where did you order your copper tape? Can you post a link?

Thanks

http://www.ebay.com/itm/251521269133?_trksid=p2059210.m2749.l2649&ssPageName=STRK:MEBIDX:IT

motorstereo

YEE HAH! Look what just arrived a few minutes ago; It looks like I'm the first one here and I'm certainly looking forward to my weekend project. Thanks to everyone that made this happen.