My 2.3 TL rebuild - so close it hurts

quadzilla

Yeah, they're Aural Thrills. They're the same ones I swapped out the sonicap coupling caps for claritycaps. I've done a couple of other mods to them too. They sound very nice. I also have one of his tube cables that uses a tube to invert the signal and charge the shield.

quadzilla

And it was great having you over Skip. Great to see you again. Now we need to find some caps to fix your amps and get those in there. Then I want to come over and hear those.

headrott

I have approximately 350 hours on the new Clarity Cap ESA and Duelund cast resistors mounted to one of Tony's (gimpod's) boards. I also used Larry's (Toolfan66's) idea of mounting the crossover boards on acrylic plates (I used dark blue) and unfortunately I did not take pictures of them so you can't see them but they look nice with the dark blue acrylic plates (even though you can't see them because they are inside the 2.3TL's:razz:). I previously had Sonicap/Mills on the original crossover boards as a comparison. I still only have a jumper in place of the Polyswitch. There is no resistor in it's place. Also, the associated gear I am using with the 2.3TL's is listed below:

Amp: Aragon 8008bb with MIT Shotgun S3 balanced cables
Pre-Amp: BAT VK-3i with 2 Bendix 5992 tubes and 4 1964 Amperex 7308 (made in USA) tubes
DAC: My own built DAC found here and using 4 Mullard 1959 longplate 12AX7 tubes and MIT balanced Shotgun S3 cables
Source(s): Denon DVD-5910 hooked to the DAC with my own built digital cable using VHAudio Pulsar Ag cable and WBT Nextgen Ag-152 connectors
Teac X-2000R reel to reel deck
Using various power cables from a VHAudio to Shunyata to my own built using NeoTech NEP-3001 wire and Wattgate 330i Ag connectors

With regards to the sound.......well......

If I was to sum up the Clarity Cap ESA and Duelund Cast resistor combination, I would use one word. Transparent. This was the first word that I thought of after the full burn in and I listened to the 2.3TL's. If you have excellent sounding gear (source, (DAC if used) pre-amp, amp, and cables (and of course a nicely mastered CD, SACD, tape or vinyl) you will hear excellent sound coming out of the speakers running the Clarity Cap ESA and Duelund cast combination. If you do not have excellent sounding gear and CD, SACD, tape or vinyl (or a combination of bad gear and/or source) then the sound you will hear not so nice audio coming out of your modified speakers.

I also agree with quadzilla that the Clarity Cap ESA and Duelund Cast resistors are on the warm side of neutral. Not overly warm, but pretty darn accurate to the source(s). The next thing I would say about the audio signature is how much more detailed the Clarity Cap ESA and Duelund Cast resistors are compared to Sonicap/Mills combo. I guess this goes in hand with how transparent the combination is as well. I was hearing micro details I had either never heard or barely heard with the Sonicap/Mills combo. I was impressed at how detailed the Clarity Caps and Duelund resistors are. This detail does not come with a price of the caps and resistors sounding too analytical though. I have heard some gear with detail amount in spades, but at a price of being analytical and having no life (tone) to the sound. There is tone with the Clarity Caps and Duelund resistors, but there is also details in spades. Is the Clarity Cap and Duelunds combo as full of tones as the Sonicap/Mills combo? I don't believe so, but I would also argue that the Sonicap/Millls combo adds some artificial tones to the audio signal. The Sonicap/Mills combo has a little overdone bass and is a little boomy compared to the Clarity Cap ESA and Duelund Cast combo. Also, the high end with the Sonicap/Mills combo is not as smooth as the Clarity Cap and Duelund combo. The Calrity Caps and Duelunds are very smooth and not harsh. I will not say perfect, but IMO much better than the Sonicap/Mills. Mind you that I am not using a resistor of any kind in the polyswitch spot, and I was with the Sonicap/Mills combo. The highs are very nice, IMO. Also keep in mind you that I have tubes that may be altering the high end output to a certain extent as well, those especially being the Mullards. The midrange is exquisit with the Clarity Cap ESA/Duelund combo. Both male and female vocals and especially acoustic guitars, violas, violins, Hammond B3 organs, and drums sound very natural and real with the Clarity Cap ESA/Duelund Cast combination on the crossovers.

I am going to have to wrap this up as my bloodsugar is getting too low, but I wanted to reiterate that if I was to summarize in one word the audio signature of the Clarity Cap ESA/Duelund Cast resistor comination, it would be transparent. I am very satisfied with the sound of my rig at this point. The audio signature of my rig is pretty accurate with nice smooth highs, accurate bass, and very nice tones without anything being emphisized too much or underdemphasized at the same time. Compared to the Sonicap/Mills combo I find the Clarity Cap ESA/Duelund Cast resistor combo an easily worthwhile and very positive change to the audio signature of my SDA SRS 2.3TL's. If you own some 2.3TL's I can easily recommend buying some of the Clarity Cap ESA's (quadzilla still has some I believe!) and Duelund Cast resistors to put onto Tony's (gimpod's) crosover boards. You will not be disappointed with the outcome. I hope this helps you guys out.

Greg

drumminman

headrott wrote: »

I have approximately 350 hours on the new Clarity Cap ESA and Duelund cast resistors mounted to one of Tony's (gimpod's) boards. I also used Larry's (Toolfan66's) idea of mounting the crossover boards on acrylic plates (I used dark blue) and unfortunately I did not take pictures of them so you can't see them but they look nice with the dark blue acrylic plates (even though you can't see them because they are inside the 2.3TL's:razz:). I previously had Sonicap/Mills on the original crossover boards as a comparison. I still only have a jumper in place of the Polyswitch. There is no resistor in it's place. Also, the associated gear I am using with the 2.3TL's is listed below:

Amp: Aragon 8008bb with MIT Shotgun S3 balanced cables
Pre-Amp: BAT VK-3i with 2 Bendix 5992 tubes and 4 1964 Amperex 7308 (made in USA) tubes
DAC: My own built DAC found here and using 4 Mullard 1959 longplate 12AX7 tubes and MIT balanced Shotgun S3 cables
Source(s): Denon DVD-5910 hooked to the DAC with my own built digital cable using VHAudio Pulsar Ag cable and WBT Nextgen Ag-152 connectors
Teac X-2000R reel to reel deck
Using various power cables from a VHAudio to Shunyata to my own built using NeoTech NEP-3001 wire and Wattgate 330i Ag connectors

With regards to the sound.......well......

If I was to sum up the Clarity Cap ESA and Duelund Cast resistor combination, I would use one word. Transparent. This was the first word that I thought of after the full burn in and I listened to the 2.3TL's. If you have excellent sounding gear (source, (DAC if used) pre-amp, amp, and cables (and of course a nicely mastered CD, SACD, tape or vinyl) you will hear excellent sound coming out of the speakers running the Clarity Cap ESA and Duelund cast combination. If you do not have excellent sounding gear and CD, SACD, tape or vinyl (or a combination of bad gear and/or source) then the sound you will hear not so nice audio coming out of your modified speakers.

I also agree with quadzilla that the Clarity Cap ESA and Duelund Cast resistors are on the warm side of neutral. Not overly warm, but pretty darn accurate to the source(s). The next thing I would say about the audio signature is how much more detailed the Clarity Cap ESA and Duelund Cast resistors are compared to Sonicap/Mills combo. I guess this goes in hand with how transparent the combination is as well. I was hearing micro details I had either never heard or barely heard with the Sonicap/Mills combo. I was impressed at how detailed the Clarity Caps and Duelund resistors are. This detail does not come with a price of the caps and resistors sounding too analytical though. I have heard some gear with detail amount in spades, but at a price of being analytical and having no life (tone) to the sound. There is tone with the Clarity Caps and Duelund resistors, but there is also details in spades. Is the Clarity Cap and Duelunds combo as full of tones as the Sonicap/Mills combo? I don't believe so, but I would also argue that the Sonicap/Millls combo adds some artificial tones to the audio signal. The Sonicap/Mills combo has a little overdone bass and is a little boomy compared to the Clarity Cap ESA and Duelund Cast combo. Also, the high end with the Sonicap/Mills combo is not as smooth as the Clarity Cap and Duelund combo. The Calrity Caps and Duelunds are very smooth and not harsh. I will not say perfect, but IMO much better than the Sonicap/Mills. Mind you that I am not using a resistor of any kind in the polyswitch spot, and I was with the Sonicap/Mills combo. The highs are very nice, IMO. Also keep in mind you that I have tubes that may be altering the high end output to a certain extent as well, those especially being the Mullards. The midrange is exquisit with the Clarity Cap ESA/Duelund combo. Both male and female vocals and especially acoustic guitars, violas, violins, Hammond B3 organs, and drums sound very natural and real with the Clarity Cap ESA/Duelund Cast combination on the crossovers.

I am going to have to wrap this up as my bloodsugar is getting too low, but I wanted to reiterate that if I was to summarize in one word the audio signature of the Clarity Cap ESA/Duelund Cast resistor comination, it would be transparent. I am very satisfied with the sound of my rig at this point. The audio signature of my rig is pretty accurate with nice smooth highs, accurate bass, and very nice tones without anything being emphisized too much or underdemphasized at the same time. Compared to the Sonicap/Mills combo I find the Clarity Cap ESA/Duelund Cast resistor combo an easily worthwhile and very positive change to the audio signature of my SDA SRS 2.3TL's. If you own some 2.3TL's I can easily recommend buying some of the Clarity Cap ESA's (quadzilla still has some I believe!) and Duelund Cast resistors to put onto Tony's (gimpod's) crosover boards. You will not be disappointed with the outcome. I hope this helps you guys out.

Greg

Thanks for the write up, Greg! Very interesting.

How many hours do you have on the CC/Dueland combo, and how many did you have on the Sonicap/Mills? Though I have no complaints about the S/M's in my 2.3TL's I also haven't heard 'em with the more expensive cap/resistor combo for comparison.

What is the cost of the CC/Dueland mod?

Thanks,

Fred

quadzilla

If you do Duelands for the 22.5 resistors, the 4 will run 200-ish. I have 2 sets of caps left, 325 shipped. The biggest problem at this point is that if you don't have Gimpod's boards, or aren't willing to build your own point to point, then you'll have a very hard time fitting the caps on the stock boards. Add about 10 bucks if you want to put Mills in the polyswitch spot. That's a lot cheaper than what I did, because I used Duelands there as well, and had to buy a total of 6 to get the correct value for the polyswitch. But I don't regret it. That's the only place I disagree with what Greg posted; I prefer the .18 resistance I have where the polyswitch was.

It's not a cheap mod, but having heard the Sonicap/Mills, I think the Claritycap/Dueland combo far exceeds the regular S/M mods. With the Sonicaps, I always hear a hump in the bass centered around 60-70 Hz, and much less detail in the mids and highs. Even the bass has a lot more texture and detail, and actually images from a specific point, rather than just coming from somewhere at the front of the room. Soundstage also seems to be much wider and deeper, with more definite SDA effects.

Face

The improvement in spacial cues is why I love the Claritycap ESA/MR line so much.

headrott

That is one thing I realised I didn't talk about after doing the write up. I didn't talk about the improvement in imaging. Face and quadzilla are correct about the improvement in imaging. It is more pinpoint with the Clarity Cap ESA/Duelund combination. I don't know if it's a "night and day" difference compared to Sonicap/Mills. At least to me I'm not sure it is. There is a definate improvement in spacial imaging though. The most "night and day" differences I hear are the detail and transparency you get with ESA/Duelund.

As a side note, I have not even tried a resistor of any kind in the polyswitch spot with the ESA/Duelund combo. I really don't feel the need to with my rig. If I get too curious though I may put in the 0.5 ohm Duelund resistor in the polyswitch spot just to hear the differences.

Fred, I have a little over 350 hours on the CC ESA/Duelund crossovers and I am not sure how many were on the Sonicap/Mills but I would guess well over 2,500 or more. You will not be thinking about the amount of money you spent on the ESA/Duelund with gimpod's boards. You absolutely will not regret it, IMO. You will only be seeing the improvements and not focusing on how much it costs to attain those improvements.

Greg

drumminman

So many upgrades - so little time/money!

I can't say I'm unhappy with the S/M, and I'm hearing many of the things with them described with the CC/D components. Still, I'm curious and love doing this type of work. :cool:

Got to prioritize all this stuff: amp upgrade, Xover work, cables/connectors, refurbish Ludwig Vistalites, construct LR built in cabinets/shelving. . . .:eek:

As a side note I spent a couple of hours listening last night. My AI-1 Dreadnought has around 30 hours on it so far and the sound quality/imaging continues to improve. No question that burn in on this is real. My imagination is beginning to fail me on how much better these speakers can sound. It sounds like I've put a more powerful amp in place - more slam, tighter control of everything, smoother mids and highs. The DN is turning out to be one of the most cost effective mods yet.

quadzilla

Yes, I'll be building a dreadnought next month. The only question is which xformer to use? I'm reading DK's latest thread with some interest.

drumminman

quadzilla wrote: »

Yes, I'll be building a dreadnought next month. The only question is which xformer to use? I'm reading DK's latest thread with some interest.

Gotta say if I was building the AI-1 now, I would get the 1000 KVA transformer. But the 800 is no slouch. Whichever one you use I'm sure will put a smile on your face.

headrott

quadzilla wrote: »

Yes, I'll be building a dreadnought next month. The only question is which xformer to use? I'm reading DK's latest thread with some interest.

Rob, if you are going to build it next month I would wait for (we are expecting anyway) an evaluation of the Plitron 1KVA transformer that thsmith was going to purchase and send to DK to evaluate. I would probably just buy this one instead of the 800VA Avel Lindberg transformer. I am going to purchase the Plitron here soon. I am hoping to get a reply from DK or thsmith about whether the evaluation is going to happen or not. I posted about it yesterday, but there is still no reply. I will probably order the Plitron regardless as there is no better alternative that anyone is aware of for a 1KVA transformer. I was just hoping to get some specs before ordering to know exactly what I am getting for the $258.00. Anyway, I only think the Dreadnought will be better with the Plitron 1KVA not degraded. I would go that route. I will be.

Greg

quadzilla

That's why I'm reading DK's thread with interest. I already checked out the Piltron. I'm just waiting for the eval, same as you guys.

headrott

I'm still waiting to know for sure there is an evaluation.:cheesygrin:

Greg

thsmith

I guess I better get it ordered and sent to Ray.