Roger Russell FOS or legit?

treitz3
treitz3 Posts: 19,004
edited June 2011 in The Clubhouse
Simple poll question......do you think or "know" that RR is a genius or a complete windbag?

What side of the fence are you on? :D
~ In search of accurate reproduction of music. Real sound is my reference and while perfection may not be attainable? If I chase it, I might just catch excellence. ~
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  • Face
    Face Posts: 14,340
    edited December 2009
    This should be interesting.

    Btw, if you've heard the amps he designed, then you'd understand his stance on cables. :D
    "He who fights with monsters should look to it that he himself does not become a monster. And when you gaze long into an abyss the abyss also gazes into you." Friedrich Nietzsche
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  • ben62670
    ben62670 Posts: 15,969
    edited December 2009
    He probably can't hear a difference, or is blinded by the few measurements that we can take.
    Please. Please contact me a ben62670 @ yahoo.com. Make sure to include who you are, and you are from Polk so I don't delete your email. Also I am now physically unable to work on any projects. If you need help let these guys know. There are many people who will help if you let them know where you are.
    Thanks
    Ben
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  • treitz3
    treitz3 Posts: 19,004
    edited December 2009
    Face wrote: »
    This should be interesting.
    :D

    Below is a link to RR's theory on speaker wire for those who may not know him...

    http://www.roger-russell.com/wire/wire.htm
    ~ In search of accurate reproduction of music. Real sound is my reference and while perfection may not be attainable? If I chase it, I might just catch excellence. ~
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  • heiney9
    heiney9 Posts: 25,165
    edited December 2009
    I don't subscribe to his POV in any way shape or form, but he certainly is entitled to his POV. Now for my own POV, if you follow everything he claims, you're doing yourself a huge disservice and depriving yourself of some great audio discoveries.

    H9
    "Appreciation of audio is a completely subjective human experience. Measurements can provide a measure of insight, but are no substitute for human judgment. Why are we looking to reduce a subjective experience to objective criteria anyway? The subtleties of music and audio reproduction are for those who appreciate it. Differentiation by numbers is for those who do not".--Nelson Pass Pass Labs XA25 | EE Avant Pre | EE Mini Max Supreme DAC | MIT Shotgun S1 | Pangea AC14SE MKII | Legend L600 | BlueSound Node 3 - Tubes add soul!
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  • Knucklehead
    Knucklehead Posts: 3,602
    edited December 2009
    I was tempted to stay away from this one as I made a complete **** out of myself about a year ago, however, I dont think he's a windbag or a genius. I think that there are appropriate cables for every system. I hope thats a safe enough answer.
    Polk Audio Surround Bar 360
    Mirage PS-12
    LG BDP-550
    Motorola HD FIOS DVR
    Panasonic 42" Plasma
    XBOX 360[/SIZE]

    Office stuff

    Allied 395 receiver
    Pioneer CDP PD-M430
    RT8t's & Wharfedale Diamond II's[/SIZE]

    Life is one grand, sweet song, so start the music. ~Ronald Reagan
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  • Face
    Face Posts: 14,340
    edited December 2009
    Knucklehead wrote: »
    I think that there are appropriate cables for every system. I hope thats a safe enough answer.
    Exactly.
    "He who fights with monsters should look to it that he himself does not become a monster. And when you gaze long into an abyss the abyss also gazes into you." Friedrich Nietzsche
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  • concealer404
    concealer404 Posts: 7,440
    edited December 2009
    This is a conspiracy. Stop with your agenda to make us NEED $4000 cables. Thanks.
    I don't read the newsssspaperssss because dey aaaallllllllll...... have ugly print.

    Living Room: B&K Reference 5 S2 / Parasound HCA-1000A / Emotiva XDA-2 / Pioneer BDP-51FD / Paradigm 11se MKiii

    Desk: Schiit Magni 2 Uber / Schiit Modi 2 Uber / ISK HD9999

    Office: Schiit Magni 2 Uber / Schiit Modi 2 Uber / Dynaco SCA-80Q / Paradigm Legend V.3

    HT: Denon AVR-X3400H / Sony UBP-X700 / RT16 / CS350LS / RT7 / SVS PB1000
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  • treitz3
    treitz3 Posts: 19,004
    edited December 2009
    concealer404 wrote: »
    This is a conspiracy. Stop with your agenda to make us NEED $4000 cables. Thanks.
    No agenda here.....just a simple question. ;)
    ~ In search of accurate reproduction of music. Real sound is my reference and while perfection may not be attainable? If I chase it, I might just catch excellence. ~
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  • concealer404
    concealer404 Posts: 7,440
    edited December 2009
    treitz3 wrote: »
    No agenda here.....just a simple question. ;)

    Your obviously one-sided poll is a disgrace to this hobby. :mad:
















    ;)
    I don't read the newsssspaperssss because dey aaaallllllllll...... have ugly print.

    Living Room: B&K Reference 5 S2 / Parasound HCA-1000A / Emotiva XDA-2 / Pioneer BDP-51FD / Paradigm 11se MKiii

    Desk: Schiit Magni 2 Uber / Schiit Modi 2 Uber / ISK HD9999

    Office: Schiit Magni 2 Uber / Schiit Modi 2 Uber / Dynaco SCA-80Q / Paradigm Legend V.3

    HT: Denon AVR-X3400H / Sony UBP-X700 / RT16 / CS350LS / RT7 / SVS PB1000
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  • heiney9
    heiney9 Posts: 25,165
    edited December 2009
    Knucklehead wrote: »
    I think that there are appropriate cables for every system.

    That's a good neutral stance.............but Roger Russell doesn't share this POV, just to be clear.

    H9
    "Appreciation of audio is a completely subjective human experience. Measurements can provide a measure of insight, but are no substitute for human judgment. Why are we looking to reduce a subjective experience to objective criteria anyway? The subtleties of music and audio reproduction are for those who appreciate it. Differentiation by numbers is for those who do not".--Nelson Pass Pass Labs XA25 | EE Avant Pre | EE Mini Max Supreme DAC | MIT Shotgun S1 | Pangea AC14SE MKII | Legend L600 | BlueSound Node 3 - Tubes add soul!
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  • vc69
    vc69 Posts: 2,500
    edited December 2009
    The problem with RR is that he stifles the curiosity and growth of some people in this hobby. They take his diatribe as the final word in audio philosophy and never search for their own answers.

    I'm fine with his point of view. I don't have to listen to his systems.

    I am abstaining from the poll though, I don't think he is a complete windbag and to say he is FOS is gross overstatement. Neither is his the final word.
    -Kevin
    HT: Philips 52PFL7432D 52" LCD 1080p / Onkyo TX-SR 606 / Oppo BDP-83 SE / Comcast cable. (all HDMI)B&W 801 - Front, Polk CS350 LS - Center, Polk LS90 - Rear
    2 Channel:
    Oppo BDP-83 SE
    Squeezebox Touch
    Muscial Fidelity M1 DAC
    VTL 2.5
    McIntosh 2205 (refurbed)
    B&W 801's
    Transparent IC's
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  • megasat16
    megasat16 Posts: 3,521
    edited December 2009
    He must be a Genius since he knows about Silver Wire! :rolleyes:

    Regardless of what he said, he provides a good entertainment value and I enjoy reading his site now and then.

    I didn't vote coz I know he doesn't fit to be called a complete windbag or a Genius! How about another option added to the poll?
    What about silver wire?

    Silver wire has lower resistance compared to the same gauge of copper wire. Smaller silver wire can be used for the same resistance. It may cost more, though.
    Trying out Different Audio Cables is a Religious Affair. You don't discuss it with anyone. :redface::biggrin:
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  • treitz3
    treitz3 Posts: 19,004
    edited December 2009
    megasat16 wrote: »
    How about another option added to the poll?
    It's too late to change the poll.

    What other option(s) would you have added if you don't mind me asking? I guess if someone has another "option" [or opinion], they could just simply post it as you and vc69 did.
    ~ In search of accurate reproduction of music. Real sound is my reference and while perfection may not be attainable? If I chase it, I might just catch excellence. ~
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  • F1nut
    F1nut Posts: 50,499
    edited December 2009
    Face wrote: »

    Btw, if you've heard the amps he designed, then you'd understand his stance on cables. :D

    Game, set, match!
    Political Correctness'.........defined

    "A doctrine fostered by a delusional, illogical minority and rabidly promoted by an unscrupulous mainstream media, which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible to pick up a t-u-r-d by the clean end."

    President of Club Polk

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  • cfrizz
    cfrizz Posts: 13,415
    edited December 2009
    You forgot one option, 'Don't know & don't care!'
    Marantz AV-7705 PrePro, Classé 5 channel 200wpc Amp, Oppo 103 BluRay, Rotel RCD-1072 CDP, Sony XBR-49X800E TV, Polk S60 Main Speakers, Polk ES30 Center Channel, Polk S15 Surround Speakers SVS SB12-NSD x2
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  • treitz3
    treitz3 Posts: 19,004
    edited December 2009
    Yet, you still clicked onto the thread and posted......interesting. :p
    ~ In search of accurate reproduction of music. Real sound is my reference and while perfection may not be attainable? If I chase it, I might just catch excellence. ~
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  • megasat16
    megasat16 Posts: 3,521
    edited December 2009
    I think Roger Russell may lack a good hearing ability or lacks of experience with different gears or Synergy. I think He is confused about what one can hear with the placebo effects based on cost of gears.
    Trying out Different Audio Cables is a Religious Affair. You don't discuss it with anyone. :redface::biggrin:
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  • ben62670
    ben62670 Posts: 15,969
    edited December 2009
    Don't worry non believers the Ah's will be here soon.
    Ben
    Please. Please contact me a ben62670 @ yahoo.com. Make sure to include who you are, and you are from Polk so I don't delete your email. Also I am now physically unable to work on any projects. If you need help let these guys know. There are many people who will help if you let them know where you are.
    Thanks
    Ben
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  • hearingimpared
    hearingimpared Posts: 21,137
    edited December 2009
    A few years ago, when I was getting back into this hobby, I almost fell for his load of crap even though I proved to myself over a 20 year period that better cables make for better sound. Then I remembered all the high end cables I had amassed over the years and started switching them out and lo and behold they all sounded different, some better, some worse. That is when I came to the conclusion that RR is a charlatan pressing his own agenda.

    WINDBAG !!!
    !
    of the worst kind.

    The reason I say this is because people who are just starting out in this hobby of ours read his BS and decide not to try different ICs & Speaker cables thus depriving them of all of the delight this hobby can bring. Plus it gives those same people who won't try out different cables their BS ammunition to post his links in cable debates because they can't think for themselves or are too lazy to take the trip down the rabbit hole.
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  • pearsall001
    pearsall001 Posts: 5,068
    edited December 2009
    hearingimpared wrote: »
    A few years ago, when I was getting back into this hobby, I almost fell for his load of crap even though I proved to myself over a 20 year period that better cables make for better sound. Then I remembered all the high end cables I had amassed over the years and started switching them out and lo and behold they all sounded different, some better, some worse. That is when I came to the conclusion that RR is a charlatan pressing his own agenda.

    WINDBAG !!!
    !
    of the worst kind.

    The reason I say this is because people who are just starting out in this hobby of ours read his BS and decide not to try different ICs & Speaker cables thus depriving them of all of the delight this hobby can bring. Plus it gives those same people who won't try out different cables their BS ammunition to post his links in cable debates because they can't think for themselves or are too lazy to take the trip down the rabbit hole.

    Atta`boy Joe!!! you tell 'em like it is brother! My new MIT's are a testament to that. Did you order the Oppo yet?
    "2 Channel & 11.2 HT "Two Channel:Magnepan LRSSchiit Audio Freya S - SS preConsonance Ref 50 - Tube preParasound HALO A21+ 2 channel ampBluesound NODE 2i streameriFi NEO iDSD DAC Oppo BDP-93KEF KC62 sub Home Theater:Full blown 11.2 set up.
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  • nooshinjohn
    nooshinjohn Posts: 25,394
    edited December 2009
    vc69 wrote: »
    I am abstaining from the poll though, I don't think he is a complete windbag and to say he is FOS is gross UNDERSTATMENT.


    Fixed it for ya!;)
    The Gear... Carver "Statement" Mono-blocks, Mcintosh C2300 Arcam AVR20, Oppo UDP-203 4K Blu-ray player, Sony XBR70x850B 4k, Polk Audio Legend L800 with height modules, L400 Center Channel Polk audio AB800 "in-wall" surrounds. Marantz MM7025 stereo amp. Simaudio Moon 680d DSD

    “When once a Republic is corrupted, there is no possibility of remedying any of the growing evils but by removing the corruption and restoring its lost principles; every other correction is either useless or a new evil.”— Thomas Jefferson
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  • hearingimpared
    hearingimpared Posts: 21,137
    edited December 2009
    pearsall001 wrote: »
    Atta`boy Joe!!! you tell 'em like it is brother! My new MIT's are a testament to that. Did you order the Oppo yet?

    I'm weighing all the info in my BR thread and am going to start audiotioning different players after the New Year rings in.
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  • concealer404
    concealer404 Posts: 7,440
    edited December 2009
    Man.... 3 people think he's a genius...
    I don't read the newsssspaperssss because dey aaaallllllllll...... have ugly print.

    Living Room: B&K Reference 5 S2 / Parasound HCA-1000A / Emotiva XDA-2 / Pioneer BDP-51FD / Paradigm 11se MKiii

    Desk: Schiit Magni 2 Uber / Schiit Modi 2 Uber / ISK HD9999

    Office: Schiit Magni 2 Uber / Schiit Modi 2 Uber / Dynaco SCA-80Q / Paradigm Legend V.3

    HT: Denon AVR-X3400H / Sony UBP-X700 / RT16 / CS350LS / RT7 / SVS PB1000
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  • everpress
    everpress Posts: 862
    edited December 2009
    concealer404 wrote: »
    Man.... 3 people think he's a genius...

    That means three people are poor or stubborn....

    I'm both, but just because I can't test something out myself doesn't mean I'm going to **** on it.

    I mean, I'll not say that Ferrari is an overpriced Yugo just because I can't afford one or have loyalty that a car is a car.

    Hell, I'm mostly happy I can't afford to audition these high end wires for fear that I'll always hear the difference in my system back home.

    ? Harmon Kardon AVR 55 (dead; replacing with Onkyo TX NR-616)
    ? Polk RTA 11TL's (FR and FL)
    ? Polk TSi200's (RR and RL)
    ? Polk CS10 (Center)
    ? Polk PSW-350
    ? Grado SR-60i Headphones
    ? Fii0 E5 headphone amp
    ? iPod touch (8 gig)
    ? iPod Classic (80 gig)
    ? Mac Mini (as media server)
    ? xbox 360
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  • hearingimpared
    hearingimpared Posts: 21,137
    edited December 2009
    It's up to five!:eek::eek::eek:

    EDIT: How come the genius believers aren't posting?
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  • WilliamM2
    WilliamM2 Posts: 4,773
    edited December 2009
    I don't know if he's a genius or not, but he must be one smooth talker.

    Imagine not knowing a damn thing about audio, and still being able to turn it into a successful lifelong career. McIntosh must be run by fools.
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  • Sami
    Sami Posts: 4,634
    edited December 2009
    WilliamM2 wrote: »
    I don't know if he's a genius or not, but he must be one smooth talker.

    Imagine not knowing a damn thing about audio, and still being able to turn it into a successful lifelong career. McIntosh must be run by fools.

    Do I detect sarcasm there? :D
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  • Face
    Face Posts: 14,340
    edited December 2009
    WilliamM2 wrote: »
    Imagine not knowing a damn thing about audio, and still being able to turn it into a successful lifelong career.
    Compared to what was known then...
    wassada3e69f21488356328.jpg
    "He who fights with monsters should look to it that he himself does not become a monster. And when you gaze long into an abyss the abyss also gazes into you." Friedrich Nietzsche
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  • hearingimpared
    hearingimpared Posts: 21,137
    edited December 2009
    xcapri79 wrote: »
    http://www.quotedb.com/quotes/3292

    Well I see you are eager to display your google experience. What about your cable experience.
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  • NJPOLKER
    NJPOLKER Posts: 3,474
    edited December 2009
    It's simple, he has none.
    I'll tell you what. I would be skeptical if I had not heard for myself what cables can do for a system. Of course if you have a **** system a system of "whatever connections" would be sufficient.

    I am not saying that everyone should have hi-fi cables. I am saying low-fi cable are perfect for some.
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