Anybody else read this review?

TroyD

concealer404 wrote: »

I thought Crown only made pro-series amps? I may be wrong here, since i can't really be bothered to look it up. I had one briefly. It was LOUD. It sounded like ****.

Back in the day (and I'm talking WAY back..) There were a couple of Crown amps that were well regarded.....now, mind you, the folks that were saying this were also saying at the time (we are talking early Solid State) that the new solid state Dynacos were better than the Dynaco tube gear...and we all know what a load of crap that turned out to be.

Decent power, good bass, harsh treble...not much in the way of refinement. Which was typical of a lot of SS at that time.

BDT

concealer404

TroyD wrote: »

Back in the day (and I'm talking WAY back..) There were a couple of Crown amps that were well regarded.....now, mind you, the folks that were saying this were also saying at the time (we are talking early Solid State) that the new solid state Dynacos were better than the Dynaco tube gear...and we all know what a load of crap that turned out to be.

Decent power, good bass, harsh treble...not much in the way of refinement. Which was typical of a lot of SS at that time.

BDT

Ah gotcha.

I have a Dynaco SCA-80Q, so i can DEFINITELY relate to that. I'm not sure why i keep it around. Nostalgia i suppose.

jinjuku

TroyD wrote: »

Where did I say that I know it all? What I did say, since you seem to lack basic comphrension....is that I think you lack credibility on the basis that your experience level isn't there. There is nothing *wrong* with that....but, it's like who am I going to take financial advice from: Warren Buffet or the guy who fills the ATM machine. You simply lack the bredth of experience and like to pass off the opinions of others as your own.

There is a LOT of stuff I don't know....and I'm far from ashamed to admit it. Unlike you, who has your mind made up that you've got it ALL figured out.

Now, I'll also disagree. IMO, amplification is the last place I'd upgrade....I'm reticent to include speakers because they are the biggest variable and often drive the sort of gear you can use...so, not including speakers:

In order:
Source
Preamp
Amp
power cords
IC's
speaker cables.

This is my opinion because in my rigs, it's what I've found makes the largest difference. YMMV.
BDT

Wow, I don't know what to say. We are at a total 180 degrees. Speakers are easily the biggest influence on the way a setup sounds. Everything else is about getting the signal there (in as little alteration as possble). The speaker is where the biggest interpretation comes from.

Outside of sensitivity, resistance, and power recommendations what else I would worry about in a speaker driving my electronics purchase? I know you are going to throw 'synergy' out there. You let speakers drive all your other component purchases. I'll just make sure I have an amp capable of driving them:rolleyes:

Ricardo

なぜ『じんじゅく』かって?
神領(じんりょう)町にあって神領学習塾だったのが、いつからか生徒たちに『じんじゅく』と呼ばれるようになり、それがそのまま定着したから。ちょっと安易かな？

でも、中身は充実「地域密着型・かなりヤルゾ的」塾です。どうぞよろしく！！





2005年春、j-squareに新たにtower棟を増築し完成形となりました。


大学受験なら「東進」！じんじゅくtower棟４f
詳しくは下のロゴをクリックしてください。



四谷大塚net「全国統一小学生テスト」を実施しました。
参加の皆さんお疲れ様でした。また、保護者の皆様ありがとうございました。詳しくは下のバナーをクリックして下さい。





一般英会話クラス
無料体験レッスン＋インターネット割引キャンペーン中！
詳しくはこちらからどうぞ。


神塾のバス送迎が
朝日新聞、中京テレビ、nhkテレビ
に取り上げられました。

　朝日新聞朝刊の全国版に、自宅の玄関前までの送迎を実施する塾 (全国でも珍しいようです）として、取り上げられました。 いやな事件や事故の多い中で、学習塾がどのような安全対策をしているかの事例 として紹介されています。
　また、その後、中京テレビ、nhkにもバス送迎について取材され放映されました。

神塾の入退室管理システムが
cbcテレビ
に取り上げられました。
　最新のカメレオンコードを使い、生徒の入退室をリアルタイムの
メール送信で保護者にお知らせする「カザスシステム」が紹介され
ました。このシステムでは、塾からの緊急の連絡や重要なお知らせ
もメール送信で瞬時に送ることができます。また、家庭と塾を結ぶ
双方向のコミュニケーションツールとしての役割も果たしています。



神塾 　tel　0568－84－9461
　fax　0568－56－0054

本校j-square 　愛知県春日井市神領町910
　j－square

三ツ星幼稚園教室 　愛知県春日井市如意申町6－17－1
　三ツ星幼稚園内

ひなご幼稚園教室 　愛知県春日井市神領町1031－1
　ひなご幼稚園内

※三ツ星幼稚園教室は、在園児または卒園生を対象とした英語教室のみの開講です。
※ひなご幼稚園教室は、在園児のみを対象とした英語教室のみの開講です。
※各教室のお問い合わせは、本校 0568－84－9461 までお願いします。






● 通常授業
　学力別クラス編成で力にあった授業が受けられます。やる気にとことん応えます。


● 夏期・冬期講習
　休みの時期だからこそできること、復習や苦手分野の克服のための集中講座です。

● 入試直前講習
　中3対象に公立高校入試直前に行います。

● 小6選抜クラス(中学入試)特別講習
　5年生内容の復習のための特講や、志望校別の過去問ゼミなどを随時開講します。

● 補習
　単元テストに不合格の場合は補習があります。強制参加。来ないと家庭へ電話します。

● テスト前質問日
　定期テスト前に自由参加の質問日があります。もちろん無料です。積極的に活用して下さい。




● 入塾金　￥10,500-
　新年度募集時、夏期・冬期講習募集時には半 額の5250円になります。
　兄弟･家族が在籍の場合も半額の5250円、3人目は免除です。
　両割引適用の場合は2625円です。


● 月謝　別途掲載
　「講座ご案内」をご覧下さい。
　じんじゅくには諸経費・雑費などの名目の使途不明な費用は一切ありません。

● 教材費　別途掲載
　「講座案内」をご覧下さい。
　じんじゅくの教材費は原則として実費です。




● 送迎可能区域
　春日井市東部の大部分と守山区志段味地区をカバー。


● 乗降場所
　原則的にご自宅前です。安心してご利用頂けます。

● ご利用上の注意
　安全と正確を最優先に運行します。定刻5分前にはお待ちください。 また、危険な行為などで安全な運行に支障が出る場合はご利用をお断りする場合があります。

● 協力費のお願い
　週1回片道利用　2100円／月～
　週3回以上往復利用　4725円／月をお願いします。

concealer404

jinjuku wrote: »

Wow, I don't know what to say. We are at a total 180 degrees. Speakers are easily the biggest influence on the way a setup sounds. Everything else is about getting the signal there (in as little alteration as possble). The speaker is where the biggest interpretation comes from.

Outside of sensitivity, resistance, and power recommendations what else I would worry about in a speaker driving my electronics purchase? I know you are going to throw 'synergy' out there. You let speakers drive all your other component purchases. I'll just make sure I have an amp capable of driving them:rolleyes:

Well, right. Sortof. It's not that simple. You have to make sure that you have an amp that is CAPABLE of getting the signal there with as little alteration as possible, so you can actually hear what the speaker is capable of.

And THAT is where synergy comes into play. Your argument leans GREATLY to the "All amps sound the same" end of the spectrum. No true. No argument even necessary.

The speaker is only one part. What you just said was that that ONE part of the setup makes a bigger difference than Source, Amplification, pre/pro, and cables do, combined, and that what you put behind the speakers, as long as it's powerful enough, doesn't matter at all.

WTF?

I get WAY less change in the sound of my system by swapping any of my 3 current sets of speakers than i do if i were to swap in my spare Adcom amp in place of my Onkyo. Yeah, none of it's high end, but the difference is there. I dare say that either is doing a better job of accurately passing signal than a crusty Crown amp.

heiney9

Wow you are rambling...........you stated earlier you believe amps sound different but then you just stated "make sure I have an amp capable of driving them" as a singular requirement. .

The amp and pre-amp are the heart of any good rig and the difference's are huge and the speakers can ONLY play what they get from downstream components.

You have sooooooooo much to learn. You think a Crown amp gives you a pure unadulterd signal.............you must smoke a lot of crack?

concealer404

Absolutely NOT reported.

jinjuku

heiney9 wrote: »

Actually in my 30 years in this hobby at various levels I've found that to be grossly false. Sure you need decent speakers and a decent front end, yadda, yadda, yadda. But I have found some very nice positive improvements with cables and if I had paid retail I'd have spent almost as much on cables as I did on my amp.

H9

That is where the biggest difference comes in for me. I don't want cables making a difference in the sound. I want them to be a transparent in my setup as possible.

If I really need to improve my setup then it would be with speakers. But as it stands now, I am happy with my DIY's. But it's not stopping me from building another design or two. My electronics section is solid enough for me. I just choose other places in my audio line up to spend time and $$.

Ricardo

Ricardo wrote: »

なぜ『じんじゅく』かって?
神領(じんりょう)町にあって神領学習塾だったのが、いつからか生徒たちに『じんじゅく』と呼ばれるようになり、それがそのまま定着したから。ちょっと安易かな？

でも、中身は充実「地域密着型・かなりヤルゾ的」塾です。どうぞよろしく！！





2005年春、j-squareに新たにtower棟を増築し完成形となりました。


大学受験なら「東進」！じんじゅくtower棟４f
詳しくは下のロゴをクリックしてください。



四谷大塚net「全国統一小学生テスト」を実施しました。
参加の皆さんお疲れ様でした。また、保護者の皆様ありがとうございました。詳しくは下のバナーをクリックして下さい。





一般英会話クラス
無料体験レッスン＋インターネット割引キャンペーン中！
詳しくはこちらからどうぞ。


神塾のバス送迎が
朝日新聞、中京テレビ、nhkテレビ
に取り上げられました。

　朝日新聞朝刊の全国版に、自宅の玄関前までの送迎を実施する塾 (全国でも珍しいようです）として、取り上げられました。 いやな事件や事故の多い中で、学習塾がどのような安全対策をしているかの事例 として紹介されています。
　また、その後、中京テレビ、nhkにもバス送迎について取材され放映されました。

神塾の入退室管理システムが
cbcテレビ
に取り上げられました。
　最新のカメレオンコードを使い、生徒の入退室をリアルタイムの
メール送信で保護者にお知らせする「カザスシステム」が紹介され
ました。このシステムでは、塾からの緊急の連絡や重要なお知らせ
もメール送信で瞬時に送ることができます。また、家庭と塾を結ぶ
双方向のコミュニケーションツールとしての役割も果たしています。



神塾 　tel　0568－84－9461
　fax　0568－56－0054

本校j-square 　愛知県春日井市神領町910
　j－square

三ツ星幼稚園教室 　愛知県春日井市如意申町6－17－1
　三ツ星幼稚園内

ひなご幼稚園教室 　愛知県春日井市神領町1031－1
　ひなご幼稚園内

※三ツ星幼稚園教室は、在園児または卒園生を対象とした英語教室のみの開講です。
※ひなご幼稚園教室は、在園児のみを対象とした英語教室のみの開講です。
※各教室のお問い合わせは、本校 0568－84－9461 までお願いします。






● 通常授業
　学力別クラス編成で力にあった授業が受けられます。やる気にとことん応えます。


● 夏期・冬期講習
　休みの時期だからこそできること、復習や苦手分野の克服のための集中講座です。

● 入試直前講習
　中3対象に公立高校入試直前に行います。

● 小6選抜クラス(中学入試)特別講習
　5年生内容の復習のための特講や、志望校別の過去問ゼミなどを随時開講します。

● 補習
　単元テストに不合格の場合は補習があります。強制参加。来ないと家庭へ電話します。

● テスト前質問日
　定期テスト前に自由参加の質問日があります。もちろん無料です。積極的に活用して下さい。




● 入塾金　￥10,500-
　新年度募集時、夏期・冬期講習募集時には半 額の5250円になります。
　兄弟･家族が在籍の場合も半額の5250円、3人目は免除です。
　両割引適用の場合は2625円です。


● 月謝　別途掲載
　「講座ご案内」をご覧下さい。
　じんじゅくには諸経費・雑費などの名目の使途不明な費用は一切ありません。

● 教材費　別途掲載
　「講座案内」をご覧下さい。
　じんじゅくの教材費は原則として実費です。




● 送迎可能区域
　春日井市東部の大部分と守山区志段味地区をカバー。


● 乗降場所
　原則的にご自宅前です。安心してご利用頂けます。

● ご利用上の注意
　安全と正確を最優先に運行します。定刻5分前にはお待ちください。 また、危険な行為などで安全な運行に支障が出る場合はご利用をお断りする場合があります。

● 協力費のお願い
　週1回片道利用　2100円／月～
　週3回以上往復利用　4725円／月をお願いします。

What? You don't understand this? I'm just quoting jinjuku

TroyD

jinjuku wrote: »

Wow, I don't know what to say. We are at a total 180 degrees. Speakers are easily the biggest influence on the way a setup sounds. Everything else is about getting the signal there (in as little alteration as possble). The speaker is where the biggest interpretation comes from.

Outside of sensitivity, resistance, and power recommendations what else I would worry about in a speaker driving my electronics purchase? I know you are going to throw 'synergy' out there. You let speakers drive all your other component purchases. I'll just make sure I have an amp capable of driving them:rolleyes:

Ok, I'm going to try and use smaller words with less syllables.

I didn't put speakers at the top of the list because, one, it's sort of intuitive...obvious, not really needed to be said? Speakers tend to drive what sort of electronics you can use...so, I didn't include them.

Yes, I'm going to very much say there is a lot more involved than numbers. What do you know about electrostatic speakers? Do some research and then tell me it's a matter of matching numbers. There is WAY more to it than WPC.


BDT

RuSsMaN

Ricardo,

JINJUKUの教師は、知識や指導力はもちろんのこと、生徒のためにどれだけやれるかを重視しています。
つまり、ブランドとしての学歴だけではなく教師としての資質ややる気を第一に考えています。
新校舎J-SQUARE建設、J-TOWER増築と、校舎規模の拡大と生徒数増の為、若い教師が多いのが特徴ですが、みんなその若さをパワーにがんばっています。

教師(正社員)、講師(パート)いずれも、他塾とのかけもちではなくJINJUKU専任で担当クラスを責任持って教えています。
個別指導は大学生講師が担当しますが、その他は全て専任教師の担任制です。

英語コースには、現在3名の外国人教師が在籍中です。
いつ塾に来てもnativeの教師がいる環境です。英語に強い塾だというのもわかっていただけますね。

Anyway, that's how I see it.

Cheers,
Russ

TroyD

jinjuku wrote: »

That is where the biggest difference comes in for me. I don't want cables making a difference in the sound. I want them to be a transparent in my setup as possible.

If I really need to improve my setup then it would be with speakers. But as it stands now, I am happy with my DIY's. But it's not stopping me from building another design or two. My electronics section is solid enough for me. I just choose other places in my audio line up to spend time and $$.

The problem is, that cables DO make a difference...if you want them to or not.

Again, you are making my point for me....what you are satisfied with...many of us have found seriously lacking in ultimate fidelity...therefore, we find your opinions rudimentary.

BDT

heiney9

jinjuku wrote: »

That is where the biggest difference comes in for me. I don't want cables making a difference in the sound. I want them to be a transparent in my setup as possible.

Well better cables DO give you more transparency. Infact plain jane cables won't give hardly any transparency. Think of them as changing the sound for the better just like another brand/model of speaker will change the sound for the better.

You're arguments make no sense to me

Analogy: A race car driver states he wants to go faster but not add any horsepower because he wants to maintain good gas mileage but still wants to be faster than anyone else. In effect that's what your statement says. You want all this neutral, unadulterated, pure, transparent sound, but your missing 75% of the equation to achieve that

concealer404

jinjuku wrote: »

That is where the biggest difference comes in for me. I don't want cables making a difference in the sound. I want them to be a transparent in my setup as possible.

If I really need to improve my setup then it would be with speakers. But as it stands now, I am happy with my DIY's. But it's not stopping me from building another design or two. My electronics section is solid enough for me. I just choose other places in my audio line up to spend time and $$.

But how do you know which cables are transparent? You don't. You pick the ones that sound best.

The cables that you have now are shaping the sound in some way. Get used to it. The sound that you hear from your system is NOT only that way because of your speakers.

jinjuku

heiney9 wrote: »

Wow you are rambling...........you stated earlier you believe amps sound different but then you just stated "make sure I have an amp capable of driving them" as a singular requirement. .

The amp and pre-amp are the heart of any good rig and the difference's are huge and the speakers can ONLY play what they get from downstream components.

You have sooooooooo much to learn. You think a Crown amp gives you a pure unadulterd signal.............you must smoke a lot of crack?

I never said it was a pure, unadulterated signal. The DC 300A/150A were incredibly flat for the most part. I think there are guys at AudioKarma that would disagree with you.

My point is I hear bigger differences with speakers in sound reproduction than I do amp's. Hence that is where I spend my $$.

Face

He probably needs to use Monoprice cables to kill the harshness from those amps.

concealer404

jinjuku wrote: »

I never said it was a pure, unadulterated signal. The DC 300A/150A were incredibly flat for the most part. I think there guys at AudioKarma that would disagree with you.

My point is I hear bigger differences with speakers in sound reproduction than I do amp's. Hence that is where I spend my $$.

That's fine. That's usually how it SHOULD go. So don't make statements that the ONLY purpose an amp has is to provide enough power to the speakers and that it doesn't nothing else to the sound.

TroyD

生活吮

Translation: life is suck.

BDT

heiney9

jinjuku wrote: »

I never said it was a pure, unadulterated signal. The DC 300A/150A were incredibly flat for the most part. I think there guys at AudioKarma that would disagree with you.

My point is I hear bigger differences with speakers in sound reproduction than I do amp's. Hence that is where I spend my $$.

You aren't demoing the correct amps then. And Crown is really very, very mediocre compared to some of the heavy hitters. You need to pop your cherry on some real "World Class" gear. Until then you won;t have a clue what some are talking about.

H9

concealer404

Come on, someone else reply before i go home. I'm biting my fingernails here.

sucks2beme

Russman and TroyD have gone through more speakers, electonics,
and sources than you could ever imagine.
Jinjuku, quit while you're ahead. They know old and new gear,
low and high end. We know they know. We aren't real shure where
you fit in, but they have a long history here at CP.

TroyD

jinjuku wrote: »

I never said it was a pure, unadulterated signal. The DC 300A/150A were incredibly flat for the most part. I think there guys at AudioKarma that would disagree with you.

My point is I hear bigger differences with speakers in sound reproduction than I do amp's. Hence that is where I spend my $$.

In this day and age...any solid state amp will measure flat. That is FAR from the last word in if it sounds like **** or not.

OOOHHH, Audiokarma....we've got a name-dropper and term-tosser in the loop.

Russ, I'm thinking this guy might be liv4fam and peterng's love child.

BDT

jinjuku

TroyD wrote: »

The problem is, that cables DO make a difference...if you want them to or not.

Again, you are making my point for me....what you are satisfied with...many of us have found seriously lacking in ultimate fidelity...therefore, we find your opinions rudimentary.

BDT

Your statement only holds water if you know what my setup sounds like. I have never dinged any bodies setups here. I am sure they sound fine.

jinjuku

TroyD wrote: »

In this day and age...any solid state amp will measure flat. That is FAR from the last word in if it sounds like **** or not.

OOOHHH, Audiokarma....we've got a name-dropper and term-tosser in the loop.

Russ, I'm thinking this guy might be liv4fam and peterng's love child.

BDT

You spend your $$ on electronics, I'll spend mine on speakers. 'Nuff said.

heiney9

jinjuku wrote: »

Your statement only holds water if you know what my setup sounds like. I have never dinged any bodies setups here. I am sure they sound fine.

No one is "dinging" your set-up. Just pointing out to you that because you choose to do your thing the way you do and then telling us we all full of crap because of what we do..............doesn't sit well.

You have been trying to justify to us and influence us to your way of thinking about how much importance one should put in certain things in the audio chain. Problem is you lack the experience and knowledge to credibly try and persuade.

Most of the rest of us have much more knowledge and experience all to varying degrees that totally shoots your theories down.

You're welcome to your opinion. But there are two kinds of opinions.....1) opinion based on what you think or have read and 2) actual opinions based on actual hands on experiences and evaluations of many, many types of gear not just a select handful

H9

TroyD

Go look up the price of a pair of Quad 988's....then tell me that I didn't spend money on speakers. In fact, ONE of my speakers is probably 5x what your entire rig is. Again, it's not bragging...it's an illustration that you aren't in a position to lecture about fidelity and how to achieve it.

Nope, I don't know what your setup sounds like....then again, I've heard Crown, NAD and Parasound and I'm telling you that I've got a pretty good idea of your level of fidelity....and mine is a good bit higher. That's not an insult or anything...it's a fact.

BDT

KASR

I frequent Audioholics....then I discovered Hometheatershack and the world was right again!

Systems

jinjuku wrote: »

Again certain calling polksters John Krukte a troll? Really? Again: it speaks volumes.

Really I must have missed Zaph being called such.

Systems

TroyD wrote: »

Back in the day (and I'm talking WAY back..) There were a couple of Crown amps that were well regarded.....now, mind you, the folks that were saying this were also saying at the time (we are talking early Solid State) that the new solid state Dynacos were better than the Dynaco tube gear...and we all know what a load of crap that turned out to be.

In the early days of SS an amp was "highly regarded" if it merely stayed working for more than a week.
JJ,amplifier design has come a long way since the DC 300 was introduced.

Face

Or didn't burst into flames like the Dynaco ST-120.