Emotiva Story.

Kex

xcapri79 wrote: »

... So other than the Surroundbar, what have they really done lately?

I think you may be completelly missing the point that I was trying to make. Polk Audio, as I understand it (and I am no expert) was built on technical prowess, and the ideas of one man, which does not always guarantee stellar commercial success, unfortunately, nor has it done for Polk Audio, perhaps, although the brand still has a very substantial following, and continues to be very relevant in it's market. It seems to have had more than its fair share of glory days and not so glorious days. It seems to me that things have been mostly improving of late, though, not going the other way. Polk may yet re-invent itself and enjoy some more glory days. We shall see.

Emotiva, on the other hand, is totally enjoying its glory days at present, but seems to have been built more on manufacturing prowess and commercial dynamics, as well as a "cool factor" in its Emo Blue design. Big numbers on their specification sheets (including w/ch and unit weight), the direct sales model as developed by av123, comparativley aggressive pricing and a lot of hype, with some help from Audioholics, have all helped put them where they are today. Otherwise, they do not innovate or invent anything new AFIK.

Remember too that the scale may not be the same either. In the recent discussion thread that became legend on the AVS forum, I believe the number "4,000" (happy customers) was used by the company representative in his response to the customer service complaint that was being voiced. That is not really all that many, and certainly fewer than Polk, in my estimation.

hearingimpared

xcapri79 wrote: »

Did you completely read the thread?
SDA's are not relevent to Polk's success today!

I did! You don't know what you are talking about.

SDA technology is used in many of their new products it's that good.


From what I see Emu needs more pie.

heiney9

xcapri79 wrote: »

I disagree. Most gurus on this forum that I've read would agree that the Polk LSi series is hard to drive. You always hear the minimum 200wpc @ 8 ohm amp rating/300 wpc @ 4 ohm rating amplifier requirement being used.
I know that my Emotiva's drive my Polk LSi's very well. Beautiful sound is what I hear. I've read numerous posts from those who successfully power their LSi's with Emotiva.
This lead me to purchase more LSi's and more Emotiva's to drive them in other rooms. They make a nice combination.

I drove a pair of LSi 15's with a 30wpc amp to levels beyond what most would consider too loud. No problem! Emo is entry level HT gear with no past to draw from. I'd bet in about 2-3 years (or sooner if the quality control issues continue) Emo will be a has been........ they aren't even that innovative.

IMO, you could do lot better than EMO......I was disappointed with what I heard and I was really expecting them to sound a lot better based on all people like you and your satisfaction with them. I was very underwhelmed. I'd say at this point they compare more favorably with BOSE, in the category of over promise, under deliver.

Polk has always been an innovative company whose products under promise and over deliver. Most Polk products actually exceed many other brands and models many times for a whole lot less. Now that's something you can be very successful at...........and they have been.

H9

P.s. I'll also add the 30wpc amps sounded better by a wide margin in both dynamics, clarity, depth, width, tone, decay and naturalness compared to the 400wpc Emo.

F1nut

Someone compared BOSE to Emotiva.That is garbage.

You're right, garbage.

comfortablycurt

xcapri79 wrote: »

I stood corrected in a previous post, but recently the SDA technology only appears in their Surroundbars as was reported in the Polk white paper and discussed on here.

Actually, the passive radiator technology that Polk became very familiar with, through the various SDA's produced over the years, is implemented now as well. Both the DSW MicroPro series subs, and the VM20 and VM30 loudspeakers use passive radiators. If they hadn't had so much success with the PR's in the SDA's and vintage Monitor Series, they likely wouldn't be using them still.


Polk can't, and shouldn't, be compared to Emotiva. Polk, to some extent, revolutionized loudspeaker design through numerous unique designs and innovations. The SDA's and vintage Monitor series were really what put them on the map. They have many dedicated customers now, simply because of the SDA's and Monitors. To say that the SDA's have nothing to do with their current success doesn't even make sense. It has a very big part in their success.

What innovations has Emotiva made to the world of amplifier design? None. They're simply taking a tried and true method of building SS amps, using cheapo components and selling them at bargain basement prices. It's good to see an American company succeeding right now, especially with the economy the way it is. Will they still be as successful in 2-3 years? I doubt it. Time will tell though. They're just the current flavor of the week. I've still never heard one personally, and I'm sure they are great for filling certain needs, namely HT. I don't think there's ever going to be en Emo in my living room though. There certainly won't ever be one in my 2 ch. rig though.


We're getting to far off topic here though...any else for PIE?

Kex

xcapri79 wrote: »

... it is unfortunate that there are a few people that feel they need to put "Emotiva" in their place with a contrarian attitude.

I do not understand why sharing real life experience and the results of genuine listening tests should be considered putting "Emotiva in their place with a contrarian attitude". It seems to be just impossible for Emotiva owners to see beyond the hype and specifications and give honest impressions of their gear that do not just paraphrase an Audioholics review. Others actually end up doubting the truth about Emotiva because of the way most owners seem to support their marketing claims with almost blind devotion, not because they cannot believe that anything so cheap could be vastly superior to expensive name brand gear.

Emotiva gear probably deserves a worthy place in the market, that it has surely earned, but only that, and no further. It is not a replacement for the decades of expertise and research that some other brands have built up. I just do not believe that saying an XPA-? can output 200w/ch is an unconditional guarantee of sonic nirvana.

If you will pardon the car analogy, I much prefer a good six cylinder Mercedes-Benz or BMW to a slopppy eight cylinder Hyundai Genesis, despite the stupifying specifications and marketing claims of the Hyundai (bhp, 0-60, top speed ...). Something else makes me perceive the MBZ and BMW as clearly superior vehicles for driving pleasure and long distance cruising comfort. It's not all about specifications for cars or audio IMO. I'm sure the owner of a Toyota Camry will be very happy with a new Genesis though, and it might not be a mistake for them to make this upgrade. This analogy obviously has it's limitations, however, so perhaps it's time for some more PIE after all!

cnh

Don't mean to interrupt this thread...no offense to Hyundai or the German car makers. But I seem to remember that one of those German companies has been in the news with 'reliability issues'?

Am I wrong? As there have been a few people who've also mentioned reliability problems with Emotiva perhaps the German/Emotiva comparison is more appropriate. I am jesting...but not about the problems some high-end cars seem to have?

cnh

heiney9

cnh wrote: »

Don't mean to interrupt this thread...no offense to Hyundai or the German car makers. But I seem to remember that one of those German companies has been in the news with 'reliability issues'?

Am I wrong? As there have been a few people who've also mentioned reliability problems with Emotiva perhaps the German/Emotiva comparison is more appropriate. I am jesting...but not about the problems some high-end cars seem to have?

cnh

atta boy......we'll certainly make it to 1K now that you've dissed German car reliability. .

I decided I want Muffins instead of PIE

cnh

xcapri79 wrote: »

Are you saying Polk Audio invented the speaker passive radiator technology or used it as so many other speaker manufacturers have?

Hear's another question as well. JBL introduced a titanium dome tweeter some time in the 80s on its studio Monitors? Polk had been developing a vapor metal deposit technique on its tweeters around that same time? JBL eventually switched to a vapor deposit laminate technology for its lower end consumer line after it developed the pure titanium dome? Did JBL borrow Polk ideas for that titanium lamintate tweeter?

As far as JBL tweeters go (at that time the pure titanium diaphragm was considered the superior design). I don't really know where I'm going here except to ask those who know...since there seems to be an invention of technology issue being debated here.

I'm also pretty sure that passive diaphragm tech. is not a Polk invention....but maybe someone can weigh in here who really 'knows' this history?

cnh

LessisNevermore

Curt, passive radiators are not a Polk innovation. JBL was the first to commercially produce PR speakers. Even they, did not create the concept.

http://www.audioheritage.org/html/people/may.htm

Lowell_M

Oooohhh..... I like Muffins

Lowell_M

I have created muffins, but not commercially

cnh

How about donuts? Because muffins can have bran and be good for you--sometimes?

cnh

Lowell_M

Oh yea... and Polk just developed a proprietary technology for their subwoofers that stops distortion before it starts and allows you to run the sub with it turned up to 11. That seems like a notable recent innovation.

Lowell_M

cnh wrote: »

How about donuts? Because muffins can have bran and be good for you--sometimes?

cnh

I like that muffins keep me regular...

shack

a_mattison wrote: »

Oooohhh..... I like Muffins

Mmmmmm.....Lemon poppy seed muffins...I need me one of those.

Only thing is I still have some cheesecake left...It'll keep.

Just an update....I checked with EMO today. They confirmed that I have not placed an order.

Kex

a_mattison wrote: »

Oh yea... and Polk just developed a proprietary technology for their subwoofers that stops distortion before it starts and allows you to run the sub with it turned up to 11. That seems like a notable recent innovation.

Well, heck! My Emotiva volume knob went from 0 to 80, and I listened plenty at 60, whereas my NAD volume knob only goes from -71 to +14, and I mostly listen at 0 or below. Now there's real power for you! I don't understand why this isn't in more Emotiva descriptions of their gear: "Our stuff will take you from 0 to 60 in no time, and beyond if you're in the mood. Others just give up before they even get started".

This is getting ridiculous, however, so I'm off to have some Coffee and Cake !

mantis

I thought I was going to get a history lesson on Emotiva but Instead I sat here and read a bunch of **** bitchin.

heiney9

xcapri79 wrote: »

What haven't you dissed?

You seem to be about as clueless as they come. Oh well some get it, some don't.

I have green velvet(like red velvet cake only green) Muffins with cream cheese frosting here in honor of St. Pat's day. A girl at work made them for me and I'm a be havin'g one real soon.

Lowell_M

Kex wrote: »

Well, heck! My Emotiva volume knob went from 0 to 80, and I listened plenty at 60, whereas my NAD volume knob only goes from -71 to +14, and I mostly listen at 0 or below. Now there's real power for you! I don't understand why this isn't in more Emotiva descriptions of their gear: "Our stuff will take you from 0 to 60 in no time, and beyond if you're in the mood. Others just give up before they even get started".

This is getting ridiculous, however, so I'm off to have some Coffee and Cake !

Touchy...touchy... My point was innovation.... not volume... in referrence to the comment that Polk hasn't innovated since SDA's. The new MicroPro subs are a significant innovation for Polk.

Was the "Our amps go to 11" Spinal Tap referrence lost?

We're having muffins now.. the cake is gone.

comfortablycurt

xcapri79 wrote: »

Are you saying Polk Audio invented the speaker passive radiator technology or used it as so many other speaker manufacturers have?

LessisNevermore wrote: »

Curt, passive radiators are not a Polk innovation. JBL was the first to commercially produce PR speakers. Even they, did not create the concept.

http://www.audioheritage.org/html/people/may.htm

I never said that they invented passive radiator technology, simply that they used the technology and were very successful using it in the SDA's and Monitors. They became very experienced with the PR technology through it's very wide implementation in the SDA's and Monitors.

If it weren't for their great success with the PR technology in the past, they likely wouldn't be using it at all in their MicroPro's or VM's. It was their vast experience with PR's in the past, with the SDA's and Monitors, that allowed them to use it so efficiently in the MP's and VM's.



In my second comments in that post, about Polks innovations, I wasn't referring to the PR's, but rather SDA technology as a whole.

BlueFox

mantis wrote: »

....a bunch of **** bitchin.

and a partridge in a pear tree.

Ricardo

Damn. I never thought this thread would last. Is there a prize for the longest and most stupid thread??

Toolfan66

My guess is PIE or MUFFIN's

Face

Toolfan66

Face wrote: »

I love it!!!! LOL,

Face

xcapri79 wrote: »

Well said.

Emo still sucks though.

shack

Ricardo wrote:

Damn. I never thought this thread would last. Is there a prize for the longest and most stupid thread??

This one is your baby. You should be SO PROUD!

heiney9

xcapri79 wrote: »

Now why would you say that after all of this?

Because it's true. Well, sucks is a strong term........I wouldn't say they suck.....but they fall pretty short, IMO.

But then as you've pointed out xcapri your opinion is the only valid one, as if we don't agree we're just contrarians.

H9

comfortablycurt

xcapri79 wrote: »

Just as Polk has applied the proven technology of others to produce and improve their speakers, so Emotiva has to produce and improve their amplifiers. I own and enjoy both.

Yes...I see your point, but I'm still not really seeing what you're trying to make of it.

As far as the Passive Radiators go, Polk took a pre-existing idea and applied it to their products. They used it to much greater success than many other companies ever have though. This really has nothing to do with the Emotiva argument, but rather the "SDA's have nothing to do with Polk in modern day" sentiment.

As I said already, they used the PR's with great success. Had they not been so successful with them in the past, they likely would not have been implemented into any of their newer products. So, the technology that Polk became familiar with during the SDA time period, is still being applied today. Not necessarily in the same form...but the ideas and theories are still alive.

I'm not sure what it is exactly that you're trying to argue about here, but good luck.;)