Katrina ScumBag Thread

brettw22

why do you keep harping on Tuesday eve/Wed morning when the place was partially flooded after the storm Monday. Quit acting like they need the city to be at least 50% under before they do anything.

Demiurge

Heh...New Orleans isn't exactly Perriman, TX. It's a big city and stuff just doesn't happen overnight. Things could always have been done better.

This is also an entire city, not a few city blocks, like on 9/11.

I don't see what all the griping is about. NOBODY wants to see people die, period.

shack

brettw22 wrote:

why do you keep harping on Tuesday eve/Wed morning when the place was partially flooded after the storm Monday. Quit acting like they need the city to be at least 50% under before they do anything.

Because the flooding was minor (almost non existant) until the levies started giving way on Tuesday. Had it not been for the flooding the need for FEMA would have been very small compared to the Gulfport, Biloxi area. Without the flooding they would have been able to restore power and get NO back on line relatively quickly. They would have been able to get food, water, medcine, help into the city...except for the flooding CAUSED by the levy failures on Tues.

MacLeod

brettw22 wrote:

why do you keep harping on Tuesday eve/Wed morning when the place was partially flooded after the storm Monday. Quit acting like they need the city to be at least 50% under before they do anything.

Becuase there is a huge differnce from the town being partially flooded due to storm surge that will eventually receed and can be pumped out like has been done dozens of times before and the levee breaking away in 4 places in sections as big as 300 feet letting the **** OCEAN flood in at will!!!!!! I would think that would be obvious.

bknauss

I think a more appropriate first post should have been the faces of each leader of govt who did not help out immediately with this problem. I'm tired of the excuses... I'm tired of "oh, we couldn't get in there"... I'm tired or finger pointing. As one newscaster put it this weekend, if there were reporters who made it in on the first days and were helping out people along the way, how could our wonderful govt organizations not get in there and help out?

Obviously there is something completely lacking in our organizational structure.

Final thought: I'm going to stop whining now and help out. I suggest everyone else do the same.

petrym

http://www.effwa.org/main/article.php?article_id=1075

COMMENTARY

Blame Amid the Tragedy

By BOB WILLIAMS
September 6, 2005; Page A28

As the devastation of Hurricane Katrina continues to shock and sadden the nation, the question on many lips is, Who is to blame for the inadequate response?

As a former state legislator who represented the legislative district most impacted by the eruption of Mount St. Helens in 1980, I can fully understand and empathize with the people and public officials over the loss of life and property.

Many in the media are turning their eyes toward the federal government, rather than considering the culpability of city and state officials. I am fully aware of the challenges of having a quick and responsive emergency response to a major disaster. And there is definitely a time for accountability; but what isn't fair is to dump on the federal officials and avoid those most responsible -- local and state officials who failed to do their job as the first responders. The plain fact is, lives were needlessly lost in New Orleans due to the failure of Louisiana's governor, Kathleen Blanco, and the city's mayor, Ray Nagin.

The primary responsibility for dealing with emergencies does not belong to the federal government. It belongs to local and state officials who are charged by law with the management of the crucial first response to disasters. First response should be carried out by local and state emergency personnel under the supervision of the state governor and his/her emergency operations center.

The actions and inactions of Gov. Blanco and Mayor Nagin are a national disgrace due to their failure to implement the previously established evacuation plans of the state and city. Gov. Blanco and Mayor Nagin cannot claim that they were surprised by the extent of the damage and the need to evacuate so many people. Detailed written plans were already in place to evacuate more than a million people. The plans projected that 300,000 people would need transportation in the event of a hurricane like Katrina. If the plans had been implemented, thousands of lives would likely have been saved.

In addition to the plans, local, state and federal officials held a simulated hurricane drill 13 months ago, in which widespread flooding supposedly trapped 300,000 people inside New Orleans. The exercise simulated the evacuation of more than a million residents. The problems identified in the simulation apparently were not solved.

A year ago, as Hurricane Ivan approached, New Orleans ordered an evacuation but did not use city or school buses to help people evacuate. As a result many of the poorest citizens were unable to evacuate. Fortunately, the hurricane changed course and did not hit New Orleans, but both Gov. Blanco and Mayor Nagin acknowledged the need for a better evacuation plan. Again, they did not take corrective actions. In 1998, during a threat by Hurricane George, 14,000 people were sent to the Superdome and theft and vandalism were rampant due to inadequate security. Again, these problems were not corrected.

The New Orleans contingency plan is still, as of this writing, on the city's Web site, and states: "The safe evacuation of threatened populations is one of the principle [sic] reasons for developing a Comprehensive Emergency Management Plan." But the plan was apparently ignored.

Mayor Nagin was responsible for giving the order for mandatory evacuation and supervising the actual evacuation: His office of Emergency Preparedness (not the federal government) must coordinate with the state on elements of evacuation and assist in directing the transportation of evacuees to staging areas. Mayor Nagin had to be encouraged by the governor to contact the National Hurricane Center before he finally, belatedly, issued the order for mandatory evacuation. And sadly, it apparently took a personal call from the president to urge the governor to order the mandatory evacuation.

The city's evacuation plan states: "The city of New Orleans will utilize all available resources to quickly and safely evacuate threatened areas." But even though the city has enough school and transit buses to evacuate 12,000 citizens per fleet run, the mayor did not use them. To compound the problem, the buses were not moved to high ground and were flooded. The plan also states that "special arrangements will be made to evacuate persons unable to transport themselves or who require specific lifesaving assistance. Additional personnel will be recruited to assist in evacuation procedures as needed." This was not done.

The evacuation plan warned that "if an evacuation order is issued without the mechanisms needed to disseminate the information to the affected persons, then we face the possibility of having large numbers of people either stranded and left to the mercy of a storm, or left in an area impacted by toxic materials." That is precisely what happened because of the mayor's failure.

Instead of evacuating the people, the mayor ordered the refugees to the Superdome and Convention Center without adequate security and no provisions for food, water and sanitary conditions. As a result people died, and there was even rape committed, in these facilities. Mayor Nagin failed in his responsibility to provide public safety and to manage the orderly evacuation of the citizens of New Orleans. Now he wants to blame Gov. Blanco and the Federal Emergency Management Agency. In an emergency the first requirement is for the city's emergency center to be linked to the state emergency operations center. This was not done.

The federal government does not have the authority to intervene in a state emergency without the request of a governor. President Bush declared an emergency prior to Katrina hitting New Orleans, so the only action needed for federal assistance was for Gov. Blanco to request the specific type of assistance she needed. She failed to send a timely request for specific aid.

In addition, unlike the governors of New York, Oklahoma and California in past disasters, Gov. Blanco failed to take charge of the situation and ensure that the state emergency operation facility was in constant contact with Mayor Nagin and FEMA. It is likely that thousands of people died because of the failure of Gov. Blanco to implement the state plan, which mentions the possible need to evacuate up to one million people. The plan clearly gives the governor the authority for declaring an emergency, sending in state resources to the disaster area and requesting necessary federal assistance.

State legislators and governors nationwide need to update their contingency plans and the operation procedures for state emergency centers. Hurricane Katrina had been forecast for days, but that will not always be the case with a disaster (think of terrorist attacks). It must be made clear that the governor and locally elected officials are in charge of the "first response."

I am not attempting to excuse some of the delays in FEMA's response. Congress and the president need to take corrective action there, also. However, if citizens expect FEMA to be a first responder to terrorist attacks or other local emergencies (earthquakes, forest fires, volcanoes), they will be disappointed. The federal government's role is to offer aid upon request.

The Louisiana Legislature should conduct an immediate investigation into the failures of state and local officials to implement the written emergency plans. The tragedy is not over, and real leadership in the state and local government are essential in the months to come. More importantly, the hurricane season is still upon us, and local and state officials must stay focused on the jobs for which they were elected -- and not on the deadly game of passing the emergency buck.

Mr. Williams is president of the Evergreen Freedom Foundation, a free market public policy research organization in Olympia, Wash.

TroyD

excellent read...

BDT

Frank Z

Ouch..that ones gonna leave a mark. Too bad many elections boil down to popularity and not qualifications.

MacLeod

Bottom line though is the the truth rarely matters. The liberal media loves a good witch hunt and they want to lay the blame at W's doorstep. Plus a good witch hunt is good for ratings.

Politicians are even worse. All they desire is a political football to toss around. The Democrats are salivating at the thought of finally having something to hurt Bush and the Republicans are equally salivating at this so some can trash Bush as well so the media will like them and have them on the Sunday shows and others can look tough and "get to the bottom of this".

I seriously doubt any mainstream media organization or politican will ever call into question the mayor's behavior or policies. I hope Im wrong about that though because he's the one screaming the loudest blaming everybody from the President to the nearest Park Ranger for his shortcomings.

brettw22

I know your good ol boy Bush is exempt from any sort of responsibility and all, but the republicans are just as guilty as anyone at manipulating situations in their favor. Both sides do it, and to act like whatever side your on doesn't is moronic at best.

Personally, I don't give a **** what the rules are in who has to ask politely before the other can move. To sit around and not do anything until you receive a phone call asking for help is **** stupid. Sometimes the rules need to be bulldozed over and people need to recognize the inability to act from others and step up in their place to make sure **** gets done. Whether that's Bush or anyone else, I don't care, but while in the middle of the chaos that was going on there, don't give me this "i have to be asked first" ****. I bet thousands of NO's that are no longer with us would certainly appreciate sidestepping protocol to get things handled.

It would be interesting to see if anyone's brought up on criminal negligence in all of this, but I doubt that anyone's THAT willing to accept responsibility for all the avoidable death out there.

Dennis Gardner

brettw22 wrote:

Personally, I don't give a **** what the rules are in who has to ask politely before the other can move. To sit around and not do anything until you receive a phone call asking for help is **** stupid.

It's called states rights and is constitution based. There not simply rules, they are what we live and die by. A Federation has to wait.

Blanco (Gov) hesitated 24 hours and cost her state a number of lives. Nagin was crying out for help, but he was powerless without the state.

brettw22

That's a chicken **** thing if I've ever seen one......

If the constitution is going to prohibit the saving of lives, then it's time to question the constitution. I can understand where this would be a more applicable scenario to an overseas international situation, but when ANYONE is willing to sit and watch people die because they haven't received a phone call, you can bet your **** that you're going to be held responsible for doing nothing.

I'll say it agian.....I don't think the thousands that have dies would have given two **** who stepped up to help.......as long as SOMEONE did...protocol or not.

Frank Z

No Brett it's not chicken ****, its the way things are. The minute the federal government oversteps it's authority there will be even more people screaming about the violation of states rights. You cannot have it both ways.

Dennis Gardner

The Feds job is to save us from ourselves and our poor choices?

We all choose to live in states and cities for certain reasons. I think those in La. may need to rethink their choice. FEMA simply isn't a "first responder".

I agree that any loss of life is tragic no matter who is responsible. As I see it from the beginning, it still lands on:

Citizens, local, state, the feds. I don't think I would want it any other way.

BTW, I do believe women and children first just like I am sure you do.



I'm done with this.

brettw22

Wow.......I can't believe this.........

I GUARAN-DAMN-TEE you that not a single person drowning gives a **** if anyone in the governors office got their little feelings hurt because someone recognized something urgent and moved on it from over their head.

It makes me sick how the humanity of this world seems to be so disposable......

danger boy

Ok. hold on a damn minute. I LIVED THRU MT. SAINT HELENS. and i can tell you.. there were rescue helicopters in the air in 6 hours! YES, 6 HOURS! After the eruption. Not days.

OK, blame the liberal media AGAIN! it's an easy thing to do.. it's a mostly an uneducated unproven theory. and the liberal media is a easy target. THe media doesn't make legislation, the media just reports what our elected officials have screwed up. Don't blame the media for the lack of response to this or any event. The media does not create events of natural disaster or conflicts of war. Period.

El President Bush did NOT mention anything about hurricane Katrina for two days after the hurricane ended. I work for a news organization.. and we record all news conferences by the president. For two days following hurricane Katrina.. he was only concerned with the war in Iraq. That my friends is not the fault of the so called liberal media.

Really, in the end. what will this terrible tragedy be remembered for? The slow response by our elected officials... whether they be city, county, state, or federal. It all comes down to the slow response by those we elected to help us thru a time, should something like this ever happen.

PolkThug

....

Mike682

PolkThug wrote:

....

"that's beautiful...what is that, velvet??"

PolkThug

More scumbags...
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/10624175/

cam5860

That's goes to show you what kind of people they are and how they think rob and steal. They ain't getting a **** penny from me.

aaharvel

PolkThug wrote:

More scumbags...
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/10624175/

you beat me to it.

aaharvel

aaharvel wrote:

you beat me to it.

The Red Cross is not a bad organization, even though a few of their employees are ****. It was the Red Cross that discovered all of this, not someone from the outside.

Tour2ma

Exactly...

Besides the Red Crossers were pikers... not even in the same league.
http://start.earthlink.net/article/top?guid=20051228/43b21bd0_3ca6_1552620051228750186593

DarqueKnight

Katrina Evacuee Walked 85 Miles To Safety

BATON ROUGE — While tens of thousands of Hurricane Katrina survivors were in New Orleans waiting for help, George Stewart, an ex-Marine, said he set out on his own.

Before Katrina slammed New Orleans, his wife, Joyce, 55, and her sister Jennifer Larche, 54, fled the storm. But Stewart, 57, who waited until he could wait no more, walked from New Orleans to Baton Rouge — approximately 85 miles — on La. Highway 61 South, better known as Airline Highway.

"I had rode out storms before, but you couldn't ride this boy out," he said. "I put left in front of right and thank God I made it," Stewart said. "I had to make it, it wasn't no option. My instinct kicked in from military experience. It told me when you're in enemy territory, you keep moving until you feel safe."

During his military days in Vietnam, Stewart was equipped with gear camouflaged to throw off the enemy. But Hurricane Katrina had him wearing a different uniform. He weathered the storm wearing a pair of wind pants, a scruffy T-shirt and cross-training sneakers loaded with multiple pairs of socks.

"I didn't feel safe there," Stewart said. "It had too many people to die out there. If it wasn't for my military experience, I wouldn't have made it."

He said he walked through knee-deep filthy water as he left his home in the 7th Ward. All he had was $15, the clothes on his back and a backpack with a similar ensemble of what he was wearing.

Along the way he said he picked up three rides, shaving off only about 20 miles of his journey. He said a good Samaritan gave him one ride and he received the other two from police officers.

Two days later, he was at Southern University.

When he arrived, Stewart, a Southern alumnus, sought help from an old professor, Dr. Raymond Lockett, chair of the history department.

"He looked like he was tired because he was sleeping on the streets," Lockett said. "He didn't know where he was staying. He thought he was going to be staying on the streets."

Stewart had friends in Shreveport, so Lockett took him to the bus station, but routes were canceled. Then they tried getting a flight out of Metro Airport, but tickets were at least $500 and as high as $650. Furthermore, he would have to fly all the way to Atlanta and then back to Shreveport.

After Lockett made a few calls, Stewart was welcomed at the Wesley Methodist Center near campus.

As he sat at the center, the reality of the storm's devastation brought tears to Stewart's eyes.

"This has shook me more than Vietnam," he said. "Because my family's close to this thing. In 'Nam, it was just me."

More than 30 years later, Stewart is alone again. But he hopes not for long. He wants to find his wife and sister-in-law. As far as he knows, they could both be as close as Baton Rouge or as far as Atlanta.

Stewart does not want to make anything of his journey. He said, right now his biggest need is money.

"One hundred dollars can carry me for a month," he said. "I eat once a day, military style."

nebborjk

^^^That's one tough SOB. I don't know if I would have tried that and he's got nearly 30 years on me. I hope he found his wife and duaghter.

george daniel

After reading that,it kinda' put things in perspective,man, I hope he finds/found his family safe. It just reminds me of how fortunate and blessed I am.

ohskigod

Hardcore!!!! I respect the hell out of that guy. I hope he found his family as well

PolkThug

And the hits just keep on coming.
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/11193135/