cable break in believer

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  • ben62670
    ben62670 Posts: 15,969
    edited October 2010
    This is getting like satellite TV. So many channels and nothing good on.
    Please. Please contact me a ben62670 @ yahoo.com. Make sure to include who you are, and you are from Polk so I don't delete your email. Also I am now physically unable to work on any projects. If you need help let these guys know. There are many people who will help if you let them know where you are.
    Thanks
    Ben
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  • sm88
    sm88 Posts: 353
    edited October 2010
    hearingimpared wrote: »
    :rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes:

    Who died and made you mod?

    Randolph Scott
    Current System:
    Paradigm Signature S2 v2
    Conrad Johnson MF2500
    Wyred4Sound DAC2
    Audioquest Black Mamba II

    For Sale:
    3x Wilson Cub's
    Conrad Johnson MF2500
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  • hearingimpared
    hearingimpared Posts: 21,137
    edited October 2010
    sm88 wrote: »
    Randolph Scott

    Well I see your Randolf Scott and raise you Gary Cooper!!!
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  • DarqueKnight
    DarqueKnight Posts: 6,765
    edited October 2010
    bobman1235 wrote: »
    Huh? You're drawing a weird line between trying to prove something true or false. The burden of proof lays on the person DENYING a claim, not on the person making the claim?

    If I said I could fly, it would be up to you to prove me wrong, otherwise I'm assumed to be right?

    I dont' think any of you should have to prove anything, really; I just don't understand the logic in the above post.

    OK. Fair enough. I hope you are not put off by the length of my reply as I wanted to provide a complete answer to your inquiry.

    Your example is not appropriate because it is well known that humans have no physical capability of flight. No proof is required of a physical impossibility. The same principal applies to me saying that I can drink a 50 gallons of water in five minutes.

    The concept of proof only applies when there is the reasonable expectation of something being true. There is a reasonable expectation that there may be audible sonic changes in a cable after a signal has been passed through it over a period of time. It is equally reasonable that there may be no audible changes after a signal has been passed through it over a period of time.

    In the case of cable burn in, naysayers are challenging a listener's subjective evaluation by saying that science does not support burn in. However, naysayers ARE NOT offereing any scientific theory to support their claims. They just say things like, "I never heard it with my cables, so I don't think you heard it with yours".

    In the case of you being able to fly, A scientist wishing to disprove your claim could demand that you simply levitate before their eyes or that you jump out of a 100 story window. Your refusal to do either would neither prove nor disprove your claim of flight ability. Such "proof" would not be accepted by the scientific community.

    A scientist could disprove your claim of flight ability by demonstrating that you exhibit the physical attributes of a human being, then explaining, in mathematical and scientific terms the physical facilities required for unaided human flight and that human beings lack such facilities. This type of "proof" would be accepted.

    A reasonable, scientific proof, or disproof, of cable burn in would be measuring the molecular properties and physical properties of a new cable prior to and after a period of signal running through it. A part of such testing would also include graphing the signal's parameters (amplitude, noise content, etc.) after it has passed through the new and then seasoned cable.

    Now, if there are no physical or molecular changes in the cable after a period of seasoning and if there are no changes in the signal between it being run through the new and seasoned cable, then we can say that the phenomenon of burn in is not supported by scientific evaluation.

    I would like to now refer you to my results using the Audiodharma Cable Cooker, which is a device that claims to provide accelerated cable break in. The results are posted in this thread:
    Audiodharma Cable Cooker Review

    In my Cable Cooker review, I provided time domain and frequency domain (noise spectrum) oscilloscope plots of several pre and post cooked cables. For the same signal, the time domain plots for the pre and post cooked PS Audio AC-12 power cable, show that ringing noise was significantly reduced in the cooked cable (figures 18 and 19). The noise spectrum plots (figures 20 and 21) show a dramatic reduction in noise amplitude and density for the cooked cable.

    The time domain plots in figures 10 and 11 show a dramatic reduction in ringing noise after my Audioquest Everest speaker cables had been cooked.

    In summary:

    Audioquest has demonstrated that there are changes in the absorption and release of energy by the cable insulation as a signal is run through the cable.

    I demonstrated with time domain and frequency domain measurements that there were improvements in the noise performance of cables processed by the Audiodharma Cable Cooker.

    I demonstrated to myself that my burned in cables sounded better, whether they were processed the old fashioned way by letting music run through them or by the high tech way with the Cable Cooker.
    Proud and loyal citizen of the Digital Domain and Solid State Country!
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  • cstmar01
    cstmar01 Posts: 4,424
    edited October 2010
    WilliamM2 wrote: »
    I do post in other parts of the forum, who the hell are you to decide who makes a contribution, and who doesn't? Why don't you get over yourself.

    And please, stop whining about others that have a different opinion.

    No William, you see you really don't post a ton in other parts. How can one see this? looking at your post history, and oh low and behold this thread and other topics of such that you will CONSTANTLY post in. Do you really contribute else where, rarely, must of been a slow day finding some other cable or other threads for you to comment on huh?

    But from what you have added here, I can logically conclude, no you are not making a difference at all in what you say and no one is jumping on your bandwagon but more off put with what you say.

    Yes you are trolling, no I don't care about you, or anything you say, if someone needs to get over anyone its yourself and your ego that you're somehow some great holder of knowledge that no one else has seem to grasp and that we are all "dumb" and believe in "fairy tales" while you hold the truth and should look upon you for the answer. Sure, buddy whatever floats your boat.

    And please look in the miror if you are to complain about whining. you guys are wrong, you guys are wasting your money, you believe in a fairy tale. Geezeee a kid begging for candy is more likely to stop before you are.

    really did you just save person X for spending X amount of money on cables? what do you do when you walk into a store and someone buys more expensive IC's, cry? or do you walk up and tell him he's wrong and confront him there about his choices in life? Do this in all aspects?

    Why did you buy the more expensive watch, there cheap one for 15 bucks will tell time just as well, your an idiot...is that pretty much how your life is day to day?
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  • kevhed72
    kevhed72 Posts: 5,055
    edited October 2010
    WilliamM2 wrote: »
    Just recently I've seen posts where someone doesn't like the sound of a new component or speakers, and some clown will come along and ask, what IC's and speaker wire are you using? Or how long has it burned in? It'd be funny, if it weren't so ridiculous.
    attachment.php?attachmentid=52497&d=1287083774
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  • fishbones
    fishbones Posts: 947
    edited October 2010
    Here you guys go! Now you can have a little club get together, wearing matching t-shirts, and talk about how us delusional people have had the wool pulled over our eyes for so many years by 'advertising cable hype', and all the years of actually bothering to experiment with different equipment, personally experiencing things like burn-in, must have made us less knowledgable and experienced somehow.

    nonbeliever.jpg
    ..... ><////(*>
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  • ben62670
    ben62670 Posts: 15,969
    edited October 2010
    I like pie.
    Please. Please contact me a ben62670 @ yahoo.com. Make sure to include who you are, and you are from Polk so I don't delete your email. Also I am now physically unable to work on any projects. If you need help let these guys know. There are many people who will help if you let them know where you are.
    Thanks
    Ben
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  • cnoat
    cnoat Posts: 315
    edited October 2010
    Mmm..pie
    Parasound Avc-1800
    Mains-Rti 12 -Parasound 1500a
    Center-Csi5-Parasound 1000a
    Rears-Rti 8-Parasound 750a
    Sub SVS Ultra Tv 12
    Diamondback and King Cobra IC's
    AQ T4 SC
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  • heiney9
    heiney9 Posts: 25,165
    edited October 2010
    sm88 wrote: »
    The title of this topic is Cable Break In Believer. Yes a large number of people have posted about cable differences, but only because they misread a line about the construction of wire and took off on that tangent. If this were trimmed down to what it was originally about, it perhaps wouldn't be so many pages of arguing. There are plenty of topics about cables being different, and perhaps my use of language is abrasive at times but I only mean to get things back on track rather than going on and on about different types of cables and some sort of contest to determine who is master of their domain.

    If that's the case and want to single out a few posts and cry "off topic" then you discussing off topic posts is off topic based strictly on the the title of the thread :rolleyes:.

    You are becoming a troll yourself.

    H9
    "Appreciation of audio is a completely subjective human experience. Measurements can provide a measure of insight, but are no substitute for human judgment. Why are we looking to reduce a subjective experience to objective criteria anyway? The subtleties of music and audio reproduction are for those who appreciate it. Differentiation by numbers is for those who do not".--Nelson Pass Pass Labs XA25 | EE Avant Pre | EE Mini Max Supreme DAC | MIT Shotgun S1 | Pangea AC14SE MKII | Legend L600 | BlueSound Node 3 - Tubes add soul!
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  • hearingimpared
    hearingimpared Posts: 21,137
    edited October 2010
    With hair around it!:eek:
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  • reeltrouble1
    reeltrouble1 Posts: 9,312
    edited October 2010
    I believe in Rabbit Holes........

    RT1
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  • WilliamM2
    WilliamM2 Posts: 4,775
    edited October 2010
    cstmar01 wrote: »
    No William, you

    Do you ever post about the topic, or is it only about the other posters? Talk about argumentative.
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  • megasat16
    megasat16 Posts: 3,521
    edited October 2010
    You guys made this thread utterly nonsense and boring.
    Trying out Different Audio Cables is a Religious Affair. You don't discuss it with anyone. :redface::biggrin:
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  • acmf74
    acmf74 Posts: 936
    edited October 2010
    megasat16 wrote: »
    You guys made this thread utterly nonsense and boring.


    true...yet I couldn't stop reading
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  • ben62670
    ben62670 Posts: 15,969
    edited October 2010
    ////////////////\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\
    Please. Please contact me a ben62670 @ yahoo.com. Make sure to include who you are, and you are from Polk so I don't delete your email. Also I am now physically unable to work on any projects. If you need help let these guys know. There are many people who will help if you let them know where you are.
    Thanks
    Ben
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  • RuSsMaN
    RuSsMaN Posts: 17,987
    edited October 2010
    Wow. Almost 3 bills in on this one.
    Check your lips at the door woman. Shake your hips like battleships. Yeah, all the white girls trip when I sing at Sunday service.
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  • DarqueKnight
    DarqueKnight Posts: 6,765
    edited October 2010
    DarqueKnight wrote: »
    The noise spectrum plots (figures 20 and 21) show a dramatic reduction in noise amplitude and density for the cooked cable.

    I meant to say:

    The noise spectrum plots (figures 20 and 21) do not show a dramatic reduction in noise amplitude and density for the cooked cable.[/quote]

    OK. Carry on.:)
    Proud and loyal citizen of the Digital Domain and Solid State Country!
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  • madmax
    madmax Posts: 12,434
    edited October 2010
    Did you guys know that after a cable is broken in if you move it around such as wrapping it up to ship then it needs to be burned in again?
    Vinyl, the final frontier...

    Avantgarde horns, 300b tubes, thats the kinda crap I want... :D
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  • steveinaz
    steveinaz Posts: 19,538
    edited October 2010
    Is a cable more pliable after break-in?
    Source: Bluesound Node 2i - Preamp/DAC: Benchmark DAC2 DX - Amp: Parasound Halo A21 - Speakers: MartinLogan Motion 60XTi - Shop Rig: Yamaha A-S501 Integrated - Shop Spkrs: Elac Debut 2.0 B5.2
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  • sm88
    sm88 Posts: 353
    edited October 2010
    steveinaz wrote: »
    Is a cable more pliable after break-in?

    The supporting scientific evidence suggests so. Consult the widely published VHS on the matter

    breakin2.jpg
    Current System:
    Paradigm Signature S2 v2
    Conrad Johnson MF2500
    Wyred4Sound DAC2
    Audioquest Black Mamba II

    For Sale:
    3x Wilson Cub's
    Conrad Johnson MF2500
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  • steveinaz
    steveinaz Posts: 19,538
    edited October 2010
    damn, we'd watch anything in the 80's.
    Source: Bluesound Node 2i - Preamp/DAC: Benchmark DAC2 DX - Amp: Parasound Halo A21 - Speakers: MartinLogan Motion 60XTi - Shop Rig: Yamaha A-S501 Integrated - Shop Spkrs: Elac Debut 2.0 B5.2
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  • ohskigod
    ohskigod Posts: 6,502
    edited October 2010
    sm88 wrote: »
    The supporting scientific evidence suggests so. Consult the widely published VHS on the matter

    breakin2.jpg


    good job, if you can bust balls and make people laugh, thats much better. That was actually funny..LOL
    Living Room 2 Channel -
    Schiit SYS Passive Pre. Jolida CD player. Songbird streamer. California Audio Labs Sigma II DAC, DIY 300as1/a1 Ice modules Class D amp. LSi15 with MM842 woofer upgrade, Nordost Blue Heaven and Unity interconnects.

    Upstairs 2 Channel Rig -
    Prometheus Ref. TVC passive pre, SAE A-205 Amp, Wiim pro streamer and Topping E50 DAC, California Audio Labs DX1 CD player, Von Schweikert VR3.5 speakers.

    Studio Rig - Scarlett 18i20(Gen3) DAW, Mac Mini, Aiyma A07 Max (BridgedX2), Totem Mites
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  • heiney9
    heiney9 Posts: 25,165
    edited October 2010
    Anytime you don't take yourself or this hobby or this internet board too seriously, that's a good thing. A little humor injected in now and then is a good thing.

    H9
    "Appreciation of audio is a completely subjective human experience. Measurements can provide a measure of insight, but are no substitute for human judgment. Why are we looking to reduce a subjective experience to objective criteria anyway? The subtleties of music and audio reproduction are for those who appreciate it. Differentiation by numbers is for those who do not".--Nelson Pass Pass Labs XA25 | EE Avant Pre | EE Mini Max Supreme DAC | MIT Shotgun S1 | Pangea AC14SE MKII | Legend L600 | BlueSound Node 3 - Tubes add soul!
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  • headrott
    headrott Posts: 5,496
    edited October 2010
    WilliamM2 wrote: »
    I'm curious why other's continue to cling to beliefs that have been disproven time and time again. And why they try to push them as fact.

    Because to people who can hear the difference it is fact. To those who cannot it will never be fact. Simple logic isn't it? You should be able to agree with that, no?

    Greg
    Relayer-Big-O-Poster.jpg
    Taken from a recent Audioholics reply regarding "Club Polk" and Polk speakers:
    "I'm yet to hear a Polk speaker that merits more than a sentence and 60 seconds discussion." :\
    My response is: If you need 60 seconds to respond in one sentence, you probably should't be evaluating Polk speakers.....

    "Green leaves reveal the heart spoken Khatru"- Jon Anderson

    "Have A Little Faith! And Everything You'll Face, Will Jump From Out Right On Into Place! Yeah! Take A Little Time! And Everything You'll Find, Will Move From Gloom Right On Into Shine!"- Arthur Lee
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  • WilliamM2
    WilliamM2 Posts: 4,775
    edited October 2010
    headrott wrote: »
    Because to people who can hear the difference it is fact. To those who cannot it will never be fact. Simple logic isn't it? You should be able to agree with that, no?

    Greg

    So if someone believes that the future can be told by tarot card reading, then it's a fact? Everything has two truth's, one for those who believe, and one for those that don't? That's not logic, sorry.
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  • fishbones
    fishbones Posts: 947
    edited October 2010
    I just want to thank the mods for giving us a very useable feature....ignore list. My first time using it and it is trully a pleasure.

    Thanks! :D
    ..... ><////(*>
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  • cokewithvanilla
    cokewithvanilla Posts: 1,777
    edited October 2010
    WilliamM2 wrote: »
    So if someone believes that the future can be told by tarot card reading, then it's a fact? Everything has two truth's, one for those who believe, and one for those that don't? That's not logic, sorry.

    I thought that kind of thinking only worked in religion and politics.
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  • WilliamM2
    WilliamM2 Posts: 4,775
    edited October 2010
    cokewithvanilla wrote: »
    I thought that kind of thinking only worked in religion and politics.

    Apparently cables are a religion. It must be accepted on faith, and never questioned.
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  • jimmydep
    jimmydep Posts: 1,305
    edited October 2010
    WilliamM2 wrote: »
    I'm curious why other's continue to cling to beliefs that have been disproven time and time again. And why they try to push them as fact.

    Lets talk about facts:

    Fact...to me cables do make a difference.

    Fact...to me burn-in of electronic equipment and cables is real.

    Fact....to me my speakers sound much better being powered with an amp rather than an AVR.

    Fact...To me room treatments do affect sound quality.

    Fact...I could care less if anyone agrees with me.

    Fact...I would much rather spend quality time with my family rather than post in this thread.

    That's the fact Jack......according to me.
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