Possible power outage for next two days

daddyjt wrote: »

One could be forgiven for calling this criminal incompetence. How many could die, especially if hospitals, nursing homes, dialysis centers, etc. close down? Even with backup generators, those big ones only have enough fuel for 48-72 hours of continual use...

Or folks who depend on oxygen machines in their home.

The conditions in the area today are almost identical to the conditions that caused the “Camp Fire” in Paradise less than a year ago, California’s deadliest ever wildfire.

• Very dry vegetation.
• High, warm winds expected.

In the case of the Camp Fire, the winds were warm and gusty, sometimes approaching 50 mph, which is quite normal for California in the Fall. The winds cause the power lines to sway and touch, so that they become an ignition source.

PG&E warned that they might cut power to Paradise residents just two days before the incident, but ultimately, they did not do so. Eighty-six people died. Nineteen thousand homes and structures were destroyed. A local insurance company ceased to operate, faced with overwhelming claims. The power company declared bankruptcy faced with over $50B in lawsuits.

There had been 0.7” of rain between May and November (compared with the usual 5”) and by mid November, there would usually have been a fall rain event capable of making a fire unlikely, but no such rain event had occurred. The area under the power lines had been cleared, as is usually the case. Not a single official from the Fire Department cited bad clearing as a contributing factor. 60% of such forest areas are managed at the federal level, not at the state or local level.

At 0615, an issue was observed with power transmission. By 0633, before sunrise, the incident in a remote area had been investigated by a PG&E worker and confirmed on site as a fire. By 0800 the fire had reached Paradise.

If the power had been cut in Paradise on November 8, 2018, as PG&E had proposed, 86 people would be alive today.

John, normal people would ask those questions. We aren't dealing with normal.

It's not that they can't fix this issue, it's that they simply won't, or have no will to allocate the funds. I'm just shocked, that they can allocate billions for other B.S. things, but something that effects everyone....nada ?

How do business owners put up with this ? How do homeowners put up with this ? How does anyone in their right mind put up with this ? Is California now a 3rd world country ?

I can understand being without power for 5 days if a hurricane comes through, major earthquake, things beyond our control. But purposely cutting it for 5 days....someone needs to lose a job or 2 over that.

Jstas wrote: »

... since you're blaming the feds 'cause it can't possibly be the management of the state's fault, is too lax...

I did not blame the feds. I simply stated the fact that California has no more authority to manage 60% of the forests in the state than it has authority to manage forests in Utah.

If anything, burying the lines would remove the danger, or the need to cut power, but that increases costs from $500K per mile to $5M per mile. Where does that money come from? Taxes?

My point was that it may seem unreasonable to cut power to prevent fire, but if it has the potential to save 86 lives, then perhaps it is worth it.

nooshinjohn wrote: »

California also sues the Fed in court using bogus environmental regulation that prevent them from doing their part. CA may not have announced a succession from the United States, but everything they do and say demonstrates they want little to do with the rest of the nation, except they will take all money they can get from Uncle Sam...

I personally don’t know a single person in California who wants the state to secede from the Union. It’s not even something that has ever come up in a single conversation, even though California, as the wealthiest state in the Union, is also the largest contributor by far. It also is a net contributor, by far, to the federal budget.

Kex wrote: »

I personally don’t know a single person in California who wants the state to secede from the Union. It’s not even something that has ever come up in a single conversation, even though California, as the wealthiest state in the Union, is also the largest contributor by far. It also is a net contributor, by far, to the federal budget.

I agree... nobody living a day to day life in CA wants to see the state leave the union, but you have to admit the people we elect to represent us in Sacramento seem to march to a different tune than the people they represent. They have taken action in direct opposition to the Federal government on everything from environmental law to immigration, healthcare and a host of other things.

When the voters pass a ballot measure Sacramento does not agree with, the state AG runs to the federal courts to see the will of the people is never followed even though a large majority voted for it. From the top down, this state is run like a banana republic, with only the illusion of everything being OK for the outside world to see.

One epic disaster away from a complete meltdown, and if that ever hits California, you can bet the rest of the nation won't be too happy about having to step in and fix it.

I don't blame the power company for turning off the power and limiting their liability. One of their power lines blew down in a storm last year. And they get sued for 12 billion dollars forcing them into bankruptcy.

This wasn't an intentional act. Trees fall over and power lines go down everywhere. But only in California do the courts give these insane judgments against the "evil" power companies. And the residents were all applauding. Let them stew on reality now.

I've talked to people that moved here (Colorado) from California. See a lot of California license plates too. Hey, let's everyone move to Colorado and wreck their housing market and traffic too.

nooshinjohn wrote: »

tonyb wrote: »

Ok then, if the current power company is that frickin' bad, why are you still using them ? Nobody else available to supply power for the state ?

I mean, it's not rocket science here, if they're doing such a horrible job, get rid of them or make them improve by regulations set onto them. Having power lines on the ground....is just unacceptable.

...and California needs to get their heads out of their rear ends and allow the forests to be cleaned up a bit. Again, it isn't rocket science on why that needs to be done.

California hasn’t allowed any new infrastructure to be built(power plants, refineries, etc) in the last 50 years... in fact, government has forced many that exist to shut down through regulations and stopped others from being built through red tape and endless environmental lawsuits. Now, if they need to take a refinery down for maintenance, gas prices spike to absurd levels overnight.

Bottom line isn’t there is no backup plan here. CA is a house of cards waiting for the next disaster....

John, do you have future plans to leave the state or are you there for the long haul?

https://www.coloradovirtuallibrary.org/resource-sharing/state-pubs-blog/whos-moving-into-and-out-of-colorado/

A lot of Californians and Texans moving here.

According to a new report from the State Demography Office, “each year between 2011 and 2016 between 235,000 and 250,000 people moved into Colorado, and between 160,000 and 190,000 people moved out of Colorado.” That means our state’s population grows by about 60,000 to 75,000 people per year.

The states that have the largest numbers of people moving to Colorado are California, Arizona, Texas, Florida, and Illinois, followed by New York, Virginia, North Carolina, Georgia, Missouri, and New Mexico. Arkansas, West Virginia, Vermont, and Maine had the fewest migrants into Colorado.

pitdogg2 wrote: »

Can you even bury high voltage power lines on those huge tower's ?

Kex wrote: »

Apparently, it’s still under discussion for high risk areas, but who knows if it’s really feasible.

I don't think you can. I saw a video of how they repair the high voltage wires while they are still live. A helicopter flies someone to the wires but before he can touch it he has to waive a long metal wand (attached to the helicopter) to equalize the charge. When they did a yard long spark shot out for a while before it was safe.

And this was from an ungrounded helicopter. Imagine if it was underground next to earth. You would need a 20 ft wide tunnel with the wires insulated so they were exactly in the center. And you would need more than one.

At least it is a good thing they don't have earthquakes in California.

Nightfall wrote: »

I've talked to people that moved here (Colorado) from California. See a lot of California license plates too. Hey, let's everyone move to Colorado and wreck their housing market and traffic too.

Lots of Californias moving here to AZ in troves as well. Same with Austin TX.

nooshinjohn wrote: »

This Californian may be moving back to Minnesota by this time next year...

Hopefully cashing in on your home value increase when you leave. The more sought after areas have gone up 100% from 2009. $1M will buy a lot of house in Minnesota, and just imagine never having to take I-405 to get somewhere! 😉

Kex wrote: »

nooshinjohn wrote: »

This Californian may be moving back to Minnesota by this time next year...

Hopefully cashing in on your home value increase when you leave. The more sought after areas have gone up 100% from 2009. $1M will buy a lot of house in Minnesota, and just imagine never having to take I-405 to get somewhere! 😉

Where in CA do you live brother?