Chrysler and GM Dealerships

Sami

Kex wrote: »

Are they considered European or American at this point?

Open = Vauxhall, so if you consider them and Ford Europe as American then I would consider Volvo and Saab American as well. I'd actually consider all of them, including Ford, European but in todays world it doesn't really matter.

rayslifecycle

Letter from a Dodge Dealer

The Coming Depression
Wednesday, May 20, 2009

letter to the editor

My name is George C. Joseph. I am the sole owner of Sunshine Dodge-Isuzu, a family owned and operated business in Melbourne, Florida. My family bought and paid for this automobile franchise 35 years ago in 1974. I am the second generation to manage this business.

We currently employ 50+ people and before the economic slowdown we employed over 70 local people. We are active in the community and the local chamber of commerce. We deal with several dozen local vendors on a day to day basis and many more during a month. All depend on our business for part of their livelihood. We are financially strong with great respect in the market place and community. We have strong local presence and stability.

I work every day the store is open, nine to ten hours a day. I know most of our customers and all our employees. Sunshine Dodge is my life.

On Thursday, May 14, 2009 I was notified that my Dodge franchise, that we purchased, will be taken away from my family on June 9, 2009 without compensation and given to another dealer at no cost to them. My new vehicle inventory consists of 125 vehicles with a financed balance of 3 million dollars. This inventory becomes impossible to sell with no factory incentives beyond June 9, 2009. Without the Dodge franchise we can no longer sell a new Dodge as “new,” nor will we be able to do any warranty service work. Additionally, my Dodge parts inventory, (approximately $300,000.) is virtually worthless without the ability to perform warranty service. There is no offer from Chrysler to buy back the vehicles or parts inventory.

Our facility was recently totally renovated at Chrysler’s insistence, incurring a multi-million dollar debt in the form of a mortgage at Sun Trust Bank.

HOW IN THE UNITED STATES OF AMERICA CAN THIS HAPPEN?

THIS IS A PRIVATE BUSINESS NOT A GOVERNMENT ENTITY

This is beyond imagination! My business is being stolen from me through NO FAULT OF OUR OWN. We did NOTHING wrong.

This atrocity will most likely force my family into bankruptcy. This will also cause our 50+ employees to be unemployed. How will they provide for their families? This is a total economic disaster.

HOW CAN THIS HAPPEN IN A FREE MARKET ECONOMY IN THE UNITED STATES OF AMERICA?

I beseech your help, and look forward to your reply. Thank you.

Sincerely,

George C. Joseph
President & Owner
Sunshine Dodge-Isuzu

polktiger

That dodge dealer hit on something that very few in this thread mentioned and he should be very pissed. But, hey BHO is just making sure to spread the wealth around like he told Joe the plumber he was going to do.

There are lots of dealers that are that are really getting screwed hard, and its not like they can declare bankrupcy and walk away since they personally guarantee the floorplan notes. In addition they are stuck with a piece of property that is special use and only has value to other dealers (frequently of only the same brand) without demolishing the whole place.

Kex

polktiger wrote: »

... But, hey BHO is just making sure to spread the wealth around like he told Joe the plumber he was going to do. ...

Is there no way that you could keep the politics out of this?

Clarknova makes a compelling post that raises serious issues, and you resort to politics as usual? You should know better ... oh, and Chrysler had serious problems long before BHO, or DCX for that matter.

Knucklehead

Kex wrote: »

Is there no way that you could keep the politics out of this?

Clarknova makes a compelling post that raises serious issues, and you resort to politics as usual? You should know better ... oh, and Chrysler had serious problems long before BHO, or DCX for that matter.

Kex, your kicking butt today!:eek::D

shack

It is either SOME of the dealers shutting down...or ALL of them shutting down. If they go to a liquidation vs a reorganization nobody would be around to sell MOPAR. If Chrysler simply shut the doors the above mentioned dealer is gone anyway. He just got the short straw (so to speak) regardless of how it was drawn. Without the govt. intervention the chances are it would have been a total liquidation. There are some that think that should have been the case. THAT would have been much more painful for all involved.

It sucks for the dealers losing out...but they are not alone.

There is a 6 month old Circuit City building down the street sitting empty. What about the developer who built that building? Or the bank that financed it? There is no lease income, little chance of getting a tenant and less of a chance it will be sold.

For example I am providing financing for one of my customers to buy an office building for $1,300,000. The bank that financed it is owed $2,400,000. It cost $2,900,000 to build and appraised for $3,100,000 less than 2 years ago. My customer's offer is the ONLY ONE the building has had in over a year. The guys that built it are now bankrupt, the bank is writing off over a million dollars. Lots of people are losing money. It is what is happening all over.

Someone (actually lots of people) will lose money with Chrysler no matter what happens. Stockholders, lenders, employees, suppliers, dealers and on and on and on. The bottom line question is...will it survive in some form and some lose out...or will just disolve and everyone lose?

VR3

127,000 miles - Ford is running perfect.

Just thought I would add to this thread.

Kex

Vr3MxStyler2k3 wrote: »

127,000 miles - Ford is running perfect.

Just thought I would add to this thread.

I'll add some more: 1994 K1500 Silverado (it was a trim level back then, not a separate model), 190,000 miles, still tows a horse trailer and gear weighing about 6,000lbs over the infamous car-killer radiator blowing grapevine (I-5 North exiting L.A. area, for those that are wondering). Original transmission and powertrain, except the water pump. Other things, such as the a/c and power steering have needed replacement, but only after 100,000 (I forget when).

Muzi Chevrolet in Boston suks big time, though, IMO, but that's another story.

None of that's got anything to do with Chrysler dealerships, however.

Hillbilly61

I'll add one:

2002 Dodge Ram 1500 4WD crew cab with a 4.7 L. 149K miles. $800 of repair parts(steering column - which is inexcusable in my book and a drive shaft universal joint). The rest were just wear out items (brakes, tires, etc). I'm still on the original lights and exhaust. It is probably good for another 75K miles. (Gas mileage sucks though).

I'm even higher in miles with my Ford Escape and have fewer $ in repairs. Foreign ones have always cost me much more for similar miles driven. I am not a U.S. or domestic fanboy, but buy by the best deal to be had when in "car buy" mode. I always buy brand new and run them out. So far, experience tells me that domestic (save, Chevy/GM, I just do not like them) gives the nod as domestic as being the lowest cost to own/maintain/repair.

I'm currently trying out a Kia SUV, bought brand new during November 2008. 'will report experiences in a few years

polktiger

Kex wrote: »

Is there no way that you could keep the politics out of this?

No. The entire bankrupcy of Chrysler and the potential bankruptcy of GM are both highly political issues as the Obama adminitration is pretty much running the the show for Chrysler and is heavily involved for GM. To ignore the influence of politics picking the winners and losers here is short sighted.

engtaz

Tags are pot shot at people that should be single shot deals or left to PM's not tags. Tags should carry names of posters.

venomclan

This economic disaster was in the works for the last 30 years. Across all political parties and levels of government. At the end of the day, it is called accountability and greed. None of the former and too much of the latter.
Venom

Hillbilly61

I test drove and got a phenominal offer from a soon to be disenfranchised Mopar dealer today. The offer was so good that I had to restrain myself from starting the deal consumation process on the spot. (I never do a deal on initial offering). Internet offers are coming in from other local dealers who will not lose their franchise. Very good ones, as they are feeling the pinch of the GM and Mopar dealer cut backs.

This is creating a true buyers market out there. I suspect that Toyota and Honda isn't going to do well this next quarter with their over priced offings.

venomclan

Hillbilly61 wrote: »

This is creating a true buyers market out there. I suspect that Toyota and Honda isn't going to do well this next quarter with their over priced offings.

Put Ford on that list also.

shack

Hillbilly61 wrote:

This is creating a true buyers market out there. I suspect that Toyota and Honda isn't going to do well this next quarter with their over priced offings.

venomclan wrote:

Put Ford on that list also.

Of course it will have an effect on their US sales, but the three mentioned here have pretty good global sales so a temporary US downturn (probably not much worse what they have experienced recently) won't devestate them.

I think there will be an initial bump as the dealers liqidate...but I'm not sure how long it will last. I think it will slow down quickly when the closing dealer's inventory gets low (they may also wholesale to the surviving dealers) and there will be fewer "good" choices and a wary consumer decides whether or not they trust GM or Chrysler to survive.

Hillbilly61

shack wrote: »

Of course it will have an effect on their US sales, but the three mentioned here have pretty good global sales so a temporary US downturn (probably not much worse what they have experienced recently) won't devestate them.

I think there will be an initial bump as the dealers liqidate...but I'm not sure how long it will last. I think it will slow down quickly when the closing dealer's inventory gets low (they may also wholesale to the surviving dealers) and there will be fewer "good" choices and a wary consumer decides whether or not they trust GM or Chrysler to survive.

I agree with you that any sort of liquidation/massive inventory reduction affects the USA market only. All in all, it will serve to raise USA prices over the long run. This morning I just signed a deal to garner a Mopar product for 48% off of sticker!!!!!!

The irony is that it was with a dealer that wasn't going to lose their francise. My wife and I were going to the distressed dealer to close their uber deal for a similarly equipped vehicle, which was about 35% off sticker. We bought the morning paper and there was a "come on" ad from another dealer. We stopped in right at opening, ready to walk out and close on the similar vehicle from the distressed dealer if that stock specific vehicle wasn't there.

Sure enough it wasn't. We got the same offer on an alternate vehicle of same make/model that is within $700 (list price) of options the distressed seller was going to sell for 35% off sticker. Instead, we got 48% off sticker ... which amounts to a further $4700 discount (for $700 less in options).

Sami

Hillbilly61 wrote: »

We got the same offer on an alternate vehicle of same make/model that is within $700 (list price) of options the distressed seller was going to sell for 35% off sticker. Instead, we got 48% off sticker!

More details, please!

I might go and buy a new truck, if the price is right.

AudioGenics

hope it gets better real soon. I like to drive.

Hillbilly61

OK, here's what's going on:

Mopar is officially offering $2000 straight up, $1,000 owner and $500 miltary rebates for a purchase. I don't qualify for the miltary rebates. Research did show that Mopar has a bunch of lease rebates underway too. $3,000 +. I wasn't looking at them very closely, as I am buying. NOTE: These stated values are specifically for the model I'm buying.

The freakin' dealers are adding them all up and applying to a total buy discount!!!! I don't know how this specifically works, except that I watched one sales rep repeat the lease numbers as he was adding things up. I later on confirmed that the quoted numbers were a buy, not lease price. Yep, a "buy" price.

Then the dealers also seem to have sweetheart deals with certain local banks. More discounts if you finance through them. It all adds up to 35% - 48% off!!!!!! We were done dickering in under 10 minutes.

I do not know how all of the above is working for the dealer (and it is not really my business nor concern), nor understand the % spread between one dealer to the next. I do know what the bottom line is for me ... and it is very good!

John30_30

polktiger wrote: »

No. The entire bankrupcy of Chrysler and the potential bankruptcy of GM are both highly political issues as the Obama adminitration is pretty much running the the show for Chrysler and is heavily involved for GM. To ignore the influence of politics picking the winners and losers here is short sighted.

They're running the show because otherwise the show would be over and anarchy and mayhem would be today's headline.

The only difference between now and the Great Depression is that the numbnuts who hollared "No Socialistic bailout" go their wish then. As a result of the American Stock Market Crash and the stand-offishness of the Hoover administration, the European markets all went into a depression, and the bad situation in Germany got intolerable, which in turn, etc, etc, blah-blah.

Yes, you could make a good thesis case that WW II was the indirect result of the U.S. Congress saying "no bailout" in 1930. Read some history.

dpowell

clarknova_666 wrote: »

Letter from a Dodge Dealer

The Coming Depression
Wednesday, May 20, 2009

letter to the editor

My name is George C. Joseph.

Heard this on the radio today. Americans should be P!SSED. Elections have consequences.

dpowell

clarknova_666 wrote: »

Letter from a Dodge Dealer

The Coming Depression
Wednesday, May 20, 2009

letter to the editor

My name is George C. Joseph.

BTW, listening to the Roger Hedgecock radio show on the way home today, he had a list of the campaign contributions from this dealership over the last decade.....all to republicans. He also had a list of all Dodge dealers in the USA being shutdown in this fashion. All had political contributions to Republicans. BO is a smart guy. The biggest sources of campaign contributions for Republicans were the Wallstree guys and 2nd the car dealerships. He is turning off the 2010 and beyond election cycle RNO funding sources through his economic recovery plan.

tonyb

dpowell wrote: »

BTW, listening to the Roger Hedgecock radio show on the way home today, he had a list of the campaign contributions from this dealership over the last decade.....all to republicans. He also had a list of all Dodge dealers in the USA being shutdown in this fashion. All had political contributions to Republicans. BO is a smart guy. The biggest sources of campaign contributions for Republicans were the Wallstree guys and 2nd the car dealerships. He is turning off the 2010 and beyond election cycle RNO funding sources through his economic recovery plan.

Interesting....if it's true.Did Roger site someone who dug this up or was he just blowing smoke ?

dpowell

tonyb wrote: »

Interesting....if it's true.Did Roger site someone who dug this up or was he just blowing smoke ?

I've been listening to him for several years. He's not prone to making stuff up. I'd like to see it for myself as well. Maybe he'll post it on his website. He did say that he'd like to see the campaign contributions list for all of the dealerships that are being allowed to survive. He suggested that their gifts might favor the DEMs but didn't state it as fact as he didn't have that list.

sucks2beme

Please take the red/blue crap somewhere esle. This is Not a political forum.

Sami

So where do I find out which dealers are closing? I have a few Chrysler/Dodge dealers advertising 40% off so I might just as well go do some browsing. I don't really need a new vehicle but if I find a good deal on a truck, might as well.

polktiger

John30_30 wrote: »

They're running the show because otherwise the show would be over and anarchy and mayhem would be today's headline.

The only difference between now and the Great Depression is that the numbnuts who hollared "No Socialistic bailout" go their wish then. As a result of the American Stock Market Crash and the stand-offishness of the Hoover administration, the European markets all went into a depression, and the bad situation in Germany got intolerable, which in turn, etc, etc, blah-blah.

Yes, you could make a good thesis case that WW II was the indirect result of the U.S. Congress saying "no bailout" in 1930. Read some history.

Actually, if you took your own condescending advice and "read some history" you would know that there are many differences between now and the Great Depression. In addition you could make a good thesis case that our current situation is a result of policies started with the New Deal and progressed as a part of the Great Society.

Hillbilly61

Sami wrote: »

So where do I find out which dealers are closing? I have a few Chrysler/Dodge dealers advertising 40% off so I might just as well go do some browsing. I don't really need a new vehicle but if I find a good deal on a truck, might as well.

Here's an excellent link: http://graphicsweb.wsj.com/php/CARDEALERS0905.html

sucks2beme wrote: »

Please take the red/blue crap somewhere esle. This is Not a political forum.

+1 suck2beme!

Hillbilly61

Hi all,

To update you (and further jack my own thread wondering about what these closings are going to really accomplish), I have my brand new Jeep Liberty parked out in the driveway. Details on the deal was asked for ... I held back on certain detail for fear that something would fall through ... call it superstition.

Here's what I got: A base model Jeep Liberty with option group 28B and a paint upcharge. The sticker was $26,390. The settled price was $13,600. 52%off sticker. The deals are to be had right now. The vehicle had 44 miles and was obviously one of the dealer's early deliveries (delivery charge was $695, current charge is $740).

As previously posted, I have had my best long term success with U.S. autos and I run vehicles out. Never buy a used vehicle from me. For those who care to disagree (and I respect that), it is offered that you cannot find a foreign made vehicle for $13,600 that is reliable for 175,000 miles or more at that price.

This is a buyer market! (Still would not own a GM product besides of their full sized pickup truck - my opinion/belief.). Of ironies, the Mopar dealer I bought the vehicle from is not one going to lose their francise. It greatly undersold the soon to be disenfranchised dealer that I was going to be buying from. You follow the best deal when settled on a particular vehicle.

tonyb

Pretty soon we won't be able to talk about anything,given that the government has it's hands in auto's,banks,insurance,healthcare,unions,food,medicine,taxes,welfare,houseing,education,Kinda hard to leave politics out,when it's becomming more involved in every aspect of our lives.