Spearker cables..fact or fiction?

SBrown712

Which coat hangers work better the plain ones or the white ones? I'm guessing the white paint would cause resistance.

I'm thinking about selling my car so I can afford some of those $10k speaker wires. Oh snap, my car isn't worth that much.

Hey Bobt,
One suggestion for you. If you are going to come in and try to stir things up at least learn how to type and/or spell. You might still be wrong but at least you will sound a little more intelligent. I'm just saying.....

janmike

Kind of reminds me of my son at times. Before the food has even hit his mouth he knows he is not going to like it. I just love when he tries it for the first time and says, This is good Dad." My son is 10.

Norm Apter

janmike wrote: »

Kind of reminds me of my son at times. Before the food has even hit his mouth he knows he is not going to like it. I just love when he tries it for the first time and says, This is good Dad." My son is 10.

I like it. Thats parable worthy material there.

metal83

I noticed quite a positive difference when switching from my cheap Walmart wire, to my MIT AVt-2 speaker cables and IC's. No turning back now!

That's it, that's all I wanted to say, carry on.

Ender

Keiko wrote: »

Trust your ears then. Get em' on a pair of MIT's.

I plan to... but it will probably be the last component I would bother upgrading.

CRESCENDOPOWER

Ender wrote: »

I plan to... but it will probably be the last component I would bother upgrading.

I agree Ender! Cables make absolutely no difference, and if you do decide to buy a cable that costs more stick with Monster.

POST#1:p

heiney9

bobt wrote: »

I think a "good" 12 gauge 99% copper wire is going to do the same for you at a desent price!!!!!!!!!!

In my long time experience cables make a HUGE difference. I'm sorry if you don't hear a difference. If you have truly tried several different types cables for a long period of time say over a 6mo to 1yr period and still don't hear a difference then stick with whatever you are comfortable with. If you are just in a state of disbelief and have never spent some quality time with different cables............then kindly STFU, because you don't know what you're talking about .

Seriously, I went from simple 12g zip cord in my office rig. A simple 2 channel rig of modest components to Canare Star Quad, shotgun style and it made a very marked difference in bass response, soundstage depth, clarity and overall better blending. This cable (which I assembled myself) in shotgun style in techflex with cable pants, shrink wrap and banana plugs looks and sounds outstanding. If I have more than $50 in them I'd be surprised.

The main rig has MIT's which are so much better sounding than any cable I've heard to date have taken my listening to a whole new level. You NEED to try these things out for yourself, stop looking at $$$, get yourself educated and have a very open mind.

H9

heiney9

bobt wrote: »

Well glad to think I have no idea about cable NJ...but sorry ..I do.

Do you even have a clue as to what these #5 cables are made from..that cost maga money???.......

Sorry but this is Telco cable used for computers ..it cost 50 cents per foot.
It is a twisted pair..do you know why???
Because they can slam more 0's and 1's down the line, without lossing transmition at high speed.

Basically the point is here......these high end cables..are far over priced for what you getting..and basically made for cheap!!!!!!!

Sounds like you have the whole cable industry figured out. My advice; take the same "cheap" cable that they all use, market your own cables for the 1/2 the price. Sounds like you know everything about cables, pricing structure and marketing..........have at it. Sounds like you even have the complicated engineering down :rolleyes: Let us know how it goes.

H9

Toolfan66

Reading Bobt's comment's = WALMART

Reading H9's comment's = MIT

tonyb

I think Bob is trying to say a cable is a cable mainly because he deals with mass produced cable,telecom at that.Maybe Bob,in that industry,you are correct,but wire has many uses besides telecom and can be altered to sound different.Much the same as a car tire is made of rubber,yet a tire is not a tire now is it??They all come from the same rubber,yet different designs,different processes in makeing that tire change the performance.Here in audio land Bob,much the same applies to cables,and gear.As your gear gets better,the more revealing your speakers get when you move up the chain,the more speaker cables come into play.It's a trial and error journey for most people,Bob,don't close your mind because of one failure to hear a difference.

heiney9

Jeb85 wrote: »

Just out of curiousity has there been any graphs that show how the frequencies compare from a good 12gauge wire vs a MIT Shotgun (or equivalent) of equal gauge of wire?

Has anyone completely figured out how our brains, ears and the auditory system captures, interprets, analyzes, processes, concludes how/what sound is for every human being on the planet?

Until we get all that COMPLETELY figured out...........measurements with electronic equipment (which btw, are very, very unlike our human machine and it's parts and processing capabilities) don't mean a damn thing and are only worth the paper they're printed on.

H9

ben62670

heiney9 wrote: »

Has anyone completely figured out how our brains, ears and the auditory system captures, interprets, analyzes, processes, concludes how/what sound is for every human being on the planet?

Until we get all that COMPLETELY figured out...........measurements with electronic equipment (which btw, are very, very unlike our human machine and it's parts and processing capabilities) don't mean a damn thing and are only worth the paper they're printed on.

H9

The world is flat, and if we travel too far we will fall off the planet and surely die. Also there is only 2,200 stars.

hifiaudio

blakeh wrote: »

I'm confused about where all these cables are that you guys keep talking about changing. My system must be better because it doesn't use "interconnects" of any type:



There are two 38 gauge wires that go to the speakers, but everything else is already connected together.



P.S. Would MIT Shotguns help the sound any?

That is freaking funny...:D:D:D:p:p:p
Thank you for the great laugh, god knows this thread needs a good laugh in it somewhere.

renowilliams

I just bought some Rapco 16 Gauge wire a couple months ago to use as my speaker wires for the fronts and everything sounds good. I just ordered a pair of RTI6's for my rears, so I went back to the music store where I bought my existing wire and got another 50 feet of it for 24.95 CND. These wires are used to plug between guitars and amps on stage.

I might be crazy but they seem to work great.

steveinaz

Cables are an electrical component, much like a resistor or capacitor. Different topologies and materials can affect the tonal character of a cable; but 2 things must be true first: 1) Your system has to have the resolution necessary to exploit this change, 2) You have to have the ability to hear the change(s). Now, some cables will show little or no difference when compared, some show a substantial degree of change.

Think of cables as very fine tone controls. Having said all this, a more expensive cable is not necessarily a better cable in your system. Only your ears and particular taste in sound can determine that.

In my experience, one of the biggest changes comes when replacing a generic multi-strand speaker cable. These cables, (in my system) have always sounded "hashy" and lacked good delineation of instruments and performers, especially in the midrange/treble---like a photograph that is out of focus. Now multi-strand cables that have each conductor maintaining it's own insulation along the run---a different story.

Jeb85

Keiko wrote: »

http://www.mitcables.com/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=22&Itemid=43

http://www.mitcables.com/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=76&Itemid=91

This is biased, and has nothing to do with a direct relationship between two similar gauge wire.
I did test some cables when i got mine(Got monster 12 guage speaker wire) just cause MIT cables aren't in the budget right now. We tested (Kef XQ90's driven by 2 Krells, can't remember which one) on the floor and did notice a difference but they only used 16 gauge speaker wire that looked no good, and the MIT cable looked to be about 12 gauge or larger.

F1nut

Jeb, you've failed to grasp what MIT cables are all about.

ben62670

steveinaz wrote: »

Cables are an electrical component, much like a resistor or capacitor....

Funny you mention that. I changed just one resistor in my XO, and it made a very noticeable difference. Same value, different brand, both metal film. Same was true with the caps in my XO. I built one for Jerry and omitted a trim pot with a nice resistor after figuring out the proper value. His sounds better than mine.
A resistor or cap of the same value does the same thing right:rolleyes:

Edit:

SBrown712 wrote: »

Which coat hangers work better the plain ones or the white ones? I'm guessing the white paint would cause resistance.

I'm thinking about selling my car so I can afford some of those $10k speaker wires. Oh snap, my car isn't worth that much.

Hey Bobt,
One suggestion for you. If you are going to come in and try to stir things up at least learn how to type and/or spell. You might still be wrong but at least you will sound a little more intelligent. I'm just saying.....

I found the Purple plastic ones to have the best sound. They are dead quiet with no hiss no matter how high you turn them up.

steveinaz

renowilliams wrote: »

I just bought some Rapco 16 Gauge wire a couple months ago to use as my speaker wires for the fronts and everything sounds good. I just ordered a pair of RTI6's for my rears, so I went back to the music store where I bought my existing wire and got another 50 feet of it for 24.95 CND. These wires are used to plug between guitars and amps on stage.

I might be crazy but they seem to work great.

If you only drive your Camaro and are satisfied with it, you'll never miss anything the Corvette has to offer, no?

renowilliams

steveinaz wrote: »

If you only drive your Camaro and are satisfied with it, you'll never miss anything the Corvette has to offer, no?

I am is open minded as the next guy an am willing to spend some money and experiment. The cables I just bought was an experiment, and without any experience with high end cables, I will defer to others like yourself with repect to how good the MIT cables and interconnects are. That being said, for the price of their top of the line stuff, I better get a free rental of a corvette for at least a week end with the purchase. I guess in the future, I will be reading a lot and checking the threads in here for more info on the subject. In the end I will likely have to settle for something that is between what I bought costs and the MIT cables.

madmax

bobt wrote: »

Basically the point is here......these high end cables..are far over priced for what you getting..and basically made for cheap!!!!!!!

Cool, I guess we can call it a day then.

steveinaz

renowilliams wrote: »

I am is open minded as the next guy an am willing to spend some money and experiment. The cables I just bought was an experiment, and without any experience with high end cables, I will defer to others like yourself with repect to how good the MIT cables and interconnects are. That being said, for the price of their top of the line stuff, I better get a free rental of a corvette for at least a week end with the purchase. I guess in the future, I will be reading a lot and checking the threads in here for more info on the subject. In the end I will likely have to settle for something that is between what I bought costs and the MIT cables.

MIT's are more than I'm willing to pay, FWIW. Not that they are not worth it, I'm sure they are a wonderful cable--I just can't justify their expense in my rig. As with anything, there is a point of diminishing returns.

sucks2beme

Is a lot of cable overpriced? Damn straight! Do cables make a difference?
Damn straight! Money alone does not make a better cable.
Nor does your cable sound as good on my system. Cables have different
properties. Thus different sounds. A bright cable on a bright system =
yuk, etc. Just like a good preamp may not sound good in all systems.
And a lot of places have the big guys custom make big lots of
bulk wire to their specs. Of course a lot also just use cheap off the shelf
cable and put a little techflex on them. That's why there was a
cable swap program here for a while. Do your homework or you're
going to get burned when it comes to cables. That's why many here
buy used, and trade them around until they get their sound. I had a pair
of Monster Z3's with some Monster IC's that did nothing in my system.
I then swapped to AQ stuff, then Kimber. The Kimber is what did it for me.
And anyone who wants a graphic demo that only the deaf wouldn't
notice, try the stock VS. Cardas cable on my Senn 650 headphones.

cnh

This has been a very informative discussion by default. Now I'm off to check out the I/Cs I'll be needing for my Adcom-555.

A thank you to all, doubt I'll be using cat5 braided cables though...you know I haven't even seen that on the moderately prices speaker wiring that you can actually see through?

cnh

BigMac

I started my audio journey not to long ago and had the preconceived notion that I knew what I was doing and looking for. HOLY CRAP WAS I WRONG!! I started out by doing some research on audio gear in my price range. After I thought I had enough information to make an informed decision I hastily ran out and bought anything that I had read about. Well, needless to say, for all the reading I did I must admit I was humbled once I had all the equipment hooked up and started listening. I wont go into this and that and why; it's just that my ears told me different from what I had read. I had no real starting point for "quality sound" so anything more than a HTIB sounded pretty good.

I have tried so many different types of speaker wire (all under $500.00 and quite a few were borrowed) my head was beginning to spin. I started with what I thought was good wire (I bought into the overly hyped Monster trap). The biggest change was when I went from the Monster brand to a good ofc 14 gauge wire from a local electronics store. I thought I had won the lottery for sure as my system never sounded so sweet. Next I tried another brand of wire and the sound improved again and this continuous switching of speaker wire started. I am VERY happy with the speaker wire I have now and I am going to be keeping it for quite some time.

The MOST important thing I have learned through this short but informative journey is that it's what sounds best to YOU and the synergy of your system as a whole. Saying there is NO difference in wire or electronics is just closed minded imo. The more I learn through trial and error the more I appreciate the fact that I am happy now with the sound I have and don't need to keep looking unless I change my equipment; then the whole process starts over. I have seen so many of the "gurus" say that they wish they still had this setup or that setup and now they regret selling it. Like the old saying goes, "If it's not broke don't fix it". If you are lucky enough to stumble upon gear that gives you that "magical" sound you are after then keep it and start a second system and use that as your test bed. A new audio journey will begin and when it starts to drive you mad at the end of the day your magical system can calm the beast.

LuSh

BIGMAC,

It took me nearly 5 years to figure out what you've already figured out. Listening is a better approach then reading. Sadly most of the stuff on the internet is just re-packaged garbage somebody else has read and agreed with from another forum...

...the internet is a great place to keep myths alive. Ever get a response from somebody about a brand or product only later to find out that he's never heard brand X and only 'heard about it' or 'has a friend with the same setup'?

The same applies here. A person ventures on the internet, usually stumbles upon a heated forum debate about cables. This particular forum (usually AV/Home Theater related) has many posters supporting the idea cables of all kinds can have no proven impact on sound. The one or two people that question this claim are usually quashed early with various links to Roger Russell's site or asked to prove their results by the infamous DBX test. The double blind test is the holy grail to the cable naysayers as it's quick out from the one thing they don't have. EXPERIENCE. In my experience most people on the net spend more time on forums rather then listening. I can't count how many times a person comes into a forum puts on a flame suit and try's to convince people that they're right and they've come to save the world.

The problem is that they usually have only listened and experienced only a small handful of what audio has to offer. The comparison is usually entirely based on price. The person usually has a single experience he is basing everything on or sometimes nothing. Usually the argument centers around I tried it once and didn't hear a thing prove me wrong, I'm right.

Needless to say it's narrow minded...

Bob...if you have experienced any time with a cable designer you're opinions would likely change. Cable designers are crack pots...but their work is usually that of passion.

treitz3

LuSh wrote: »

Listening is a better approach then reading.

You sir, have earned 4 notches in my respect book. Bravo!!!

TECHNOKID

Ender wrote: »

Ya know, I've never been one to trust performance reports from biased sources... (Just being the scientific Devil's Advocate )

Yep! As the question popped I was expecting someone to gladly provide an answer wit the company marketting performance report... well guess what it did! I guess that is where people get educated :rolleyes:

TECHNOKID

TOOLFORLIFEFAN wrote: »

Reading Bobt's comment's = WALMART

Reading H9's comment's = MIT

Believe me there is something in between your 2 extremes and its called ( = ) common sense

Ender

Fiction! Spearker cables don't exist!!!