Emotiva Story.

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  • MikeC78
    MikeC78 Posts: 2,315
    edited February 2009
    a_mattison wrote: »
    I my world "world-class" referrs to a companies product consistency and quality control and design and a companies ability to compete among the best companies in the world in these areas. When you buy a product from a company that is a world class producer of a product you know with certainty that if Joe-down-the-street bought the same model that you would have the same product performance characteristics.


    A product that has to be sent back 4 times for various quality issues is not world class and does not compete with the big dogs. It's simply an entry level piece that performs decently. Any "value" that a person saw in the performance vs. price of the product is now wasted in time and effort to get the product right.

    That being said... I'm a Product development and marketing manager.... so I say all kinds of things that make my products sound good. That's what this game is all about. What I do dissagree with is EMO's pricing if the performance of their product is as good as everybody says it is. I'd fire the product manager in charge of their pricing for not making the company more money.

    Good insight and I agree...

    However, I'm sure "world class" products even have their own flaws and slip through QC no matter how great it supposively is. Really, electronics can fail at any time. Right?

    One big reason you don't hear to much about them is they don't sell as much "world class":p products as Emotiva because it caters to such a large crowd.

    Also, Emotiva is internet direct only, right? So, they cut out the middle man and having to do great advertising measure to keep the costs down. Just throwing this out there, these are probably the main reasons as to why I believe their prices are so good for what they really are.

    BTW, I could really give two **** about EMO. I don't have any need to protect my purchase since I don't own one. I'm just throwing out my 2 cents, maybe someone can explain better than me?
  • shack
    shack Posts: 11,154
    edited February 2009
    Ricardo wrote:
    Right; not my problem, and the point of the thread is just to share, because I can, because I wanted to. That's all.


    With that kind of attitude I think you need to sell all your gear, give the money to homeless investment bankers and take a charity sabbatical to Las Vegas....and stay there until you repent of your snobbish, elitist, pseudo-audiophile ways.
    "Just because you’re offended doesn’t mean you’re right." - Ricky Gervais

    "For those who believe, no proof is necessary. For those who don't believe, no proof is possible." - Stuart Chase

    "Consistency requires you to be as ignorant today as you were a year ago." - Bernard Berenson
  • heiney9
    heiney9 Posts: 25,013
    edited February 2009
    I'm outta this one......too subjective and only time will tell.

    The only analogy I'll part with is a Porsche owner would probably never consider a Chevy. Read into to that whatever your personal bias allows for.

    Emo provides a product for a certain niche.......I am not part of that niche so no matter how fancy the words are, how much bling they bring, or how many tricks it can perform............it's not my bag. :)

    H9
    "Appreciation of audio is a completely subjective human experience. Measurements can provide a measure of insight, but are no substitute for human judgment. Why are we looking to reduce a subjective experience to objective criteria anyway? The subtleties of music and audio reproduction are for those who appreciate it. Differentiation by numbers is for those who do not".--Nelson Pass Pass Labs XA25 | EE Avant Pre | EE Mini Max Supreme DAC | MIT Shotgun S1 | Pangea AC14SE MKII | Legend L600 | BlueSound Node 3 - Tubes add soul!
  • megasat16
    megasat16 Posts: 3,521
    edited February 2009
    NotaSuv wrote: »
    LOL

    maybe there needs to be a price point before the word "world class" can be used ;)

    I think it's not about using the word. It's about overly using the word. :)

    It has nothing to do with the price of a product. But if you put that word on each and every page of the product you sell, it's a dead giveaway that the company is trying to leeway some of the uneducated customer to it's way. Again, it's nothing wrong for trying to survive in the game but I was saying it's an insult to some. :) That's the only thing I care to say for the EMO story.

    Undoubtedly, there are lot of happy EMO customers and they are all happy with their purchases. After all, what rocks your world is what could probably be called a Reference.
    Trying out Different Audio Cables is a Religious Affair. You don't discuss it with anyone. :redface::biggrin:
  • MikeC78
    MikeC78 Posts: 2,315
    edited February 2009
    heiney9 wrote: »
    I'm outta this one......too subjective and only time will tell.

    The only analogy I'll part with is a Porsche owner would probably never consider a Chevy. Read into to that whatever your personal bias allows for.

    Emo provides a product for a certain niche.......I am not part of that niche so no matter how fancy the words are, how much bling they bring, or how many tricks it can perform............it's not my bag. :)

    H9

    That's cool... I just think car analogies are horrible when it comes to comparing electronics.;) Then again, opinions are like a**holes...
  • comfortablycurt
    comfortablycurt Posts: 6,745
    edited February 2009
    Wow...I wasn't expecting that many answers to my question...lol Thanks guys...that clears up a lot of the things I've been wondering.

    I've basically been in agreement with most of those statements this whole time too. It seems like they offer way to much for way to low of a price, to really make it a quality product. I'm sure they have to cut a lot of corners to meet that price point too. I'm sure it is true that they have a lot of bang for the buck, and for someone that's looking to get into amps, at a low price it probably is great.

    Myself though...I don't think I'm really looking for the best bang for the buck, but rather the best performance without throwing myself in the poor house...lol I don't have any problems buying used equipment, and from what I've seen, I could get something used that would be much nicer. I've looked into some of the Adcoms and Rotels that are all over the used market, and they seem to offer a lot more for the money. Being from a much more reputed company, with a more established name, and a reputation of using much higher quality parts seems like the better plan.

    I definitely see your points about their marketing ploys. When every piece of equipment they sell is "reference quality" something obviously is being over stated. Most companies have their reference lines, which are considered their best offering, not every piece they make is "reference". With all the hype Emo's been getting lately...a lot of people are probably being led into believing that it is a World Class item...when I know damn well without ever hearing one, that it isn't the case. None of the other companies I've looked into throw around the terms "reference" or "world class" anywhere near as much as Emo does.

    Like I said...I'm sure they do offer a lot of bang for the buck, and for someone that wants to buy new, they probably are a very good choice. I won't completely rule Emo out yet...but I think the odds are I'll end up going with something else.

    Thanks again for all the responses.
    The nirvana inducer-
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  • brettw22
    brettw22 Posts: 7,621
    edited February 2009
    EMO is not a company that only produces this particular line and that's it. They are a manufacturer for (if I remember correctly) 5 or 6 different companies. This is basically just their in-house brand that allows them to sell at lower prices with minimal costs (read advertising).

    As a manufacturer, they can get parts for a hell of a lot less than you ever could Ricardo, so it's not unreasonable to believe that they put good stuff in there. If they were selling crap gear and knew it, they sure as hell wouldn't be offering a 5 year warranty for it........not a lot major companies even do that.....
    comment comment comment comment. bitchy.
  • heiney9
    heiney9 Posts: 25,013
    edited February 2009
    brettw22 wrote: »
    As a manufacturer, they can get parts for a hell of a lot less than you ever could Ricardo, so it's not unreasonable to believe that they put good stuff in there. If they were selling crap gear and knew it, they sure as hell wouldn't be offering a 5 year warranty for it........not a lot major companies even do that.....

    Well, I have my wooden spoon out so might as well this give this a good stir.........


    One word BOSE and I say that as to the marketing, not nec the performance of the product.

    P.s So much for my final word, eh :o.

    P.s.s. Lessisnevermore..........you need to make the next RAS meeting and bring your EMO.........perhaps it could change a perception
    "Appreciation of audio is a completely subjective human experience. Measurements can provide a measure of insight, but are no substitute for human judgment. Why are we looking to reduce a subjective experience to objective criteria anyway? The subtleties of music and audio reproduction are for those who appreciate it. Differentiation by numbers is for those who do not".--Nelson Pass Pass Labs XA25 | EE Avant Pre | EE Mini Max Supreme DAC | MIT Shotgun S1 | Pangea AC14SE MKII | Legend L600 | BlueSound Node 3 - Tubes add soul!
  • Ricardo
    Ricardo Posts: 10,636
    edited February 2009
    shack wrote: »
    With that kind of attitude I think you need to sell all your gear, give the money to homeless investment bankers and take a charity sabbatical to Las Vegas....and stay there until you repent of your snobbish, elitist, pseudo-audiophile ways.

    Good idea; I might join Igo while I'm there.
    _________________________________________________
    ***\\\\\........................... My Audio Journey ............................./////***

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  • LessisNevermore
    LessisNevermore Posts: 1,519
    edited February 2009
    Answer - What you like with your own Ears is what a world class to you but may not be for me or others. Making it funs and enjoyable is all that matters. But making more false claims in the AD to attract uneducated shopper is another matter and I consider it Misleading.

    That was exactly the point I was trying to make. I disagree about the uneducated shopper part. 99% of those people don't research to the point of hearing about ID brands. If it isn't carried at Best Buy or Walmart, it doesn't exist.

    I don't know why Emo advertises all their products as reference quality. You can go to their forums and ask the owner directly. If you approach it tactfully, and respectfully, I'm pretty sure Dan or Lonnie would respond. Obviously, if you approach it with "Who the F*&^ do you think you are?!?", you'd better be wearing a flame suit.....:D
  • brettw22
    brettw22 Posts: 7,621
    edited February 2009
    i would trust a company that charges middle of the line pricing with a good warranty (EMO) before I'd overspend for a minimal warranty (BOSE)..........

    I dont' have their stuff, but I'm at least interested in what it might sound like. While the blue LED's are fun, I'd have them all turned off so they didn't distract, but that's just me.
    comment comment comment comment. bitchy.
  • megasat16
    megasat16 Posts: 3,521
    edited February 2009

    I don't know why Emo advertises all their products as reference quality. You can go to their forums and ask the owner directly. If you approach it tactfully, and respectfully, I'm pretty sure Dan or Lonnie would respond. Obviously, if you approach it with "Who the F*&^ do you think you are?!?", you'd better be wearing a flame suit.....:D

    I don't give a crap about EMO stuff to be frank and no interest in even taking a free sweepstake or whatever. Let alone contacting them and asking them why. No Interest at all. It's their business how they market their stuff and I mind my own. I was just saying the truth and that's there to it. But guess what? That truth from weeks ago has been changed and the word "Reference" seems to have taken out from their web pages when I visited just now. That word only appears on the XPA-1 now. :rolleyes:

    I don't see any disrespect to EMO or their consumer in my previous posts and I don't really care what they **** they think about me. In fact, I always said "EMO seems to be reasonable but it's ultimately the buyer decision" Anyhow, No EMO gears rockin my world. :cool: Besides XPA-1, I doubt any EMO gear could rockin my world, really.
    Trying out Different Audio Cables is a Religious Affair. You don't discuss it with anyone. :redface::biggrin:
  • LessisNevermore
    LessisNevermore Posts: 1,519
    edited February 2009
    heiney9 wrote: »
    P.s.s. Lessisnevermore..........you need to make the next RAS meeting and bring your EMO.........perhaps it could change a perception

    I'm in town until the end of March, so just say the word my friend.
    I'll bring the Guinness.:cool:

    curt, I expect you in attendance also....:D
  • reeltrouble1
    reeltrouble1 Posts: 9,312
    edited February 2009
    Ricardo wrote: »
    Good idea; I might join Igo while I'm there.


    good luck, he was spotted laying naked in the desert stuck fast to a prickly pear catus which looked to be shoved up the one spot the sun nevers shines on.

    Not that I would know anything about it....;)

    This little Emo discussion is beyond me. I get a headache reading those long posts and my AD kicks in. If you love your Emo then let it bivouac in your world, they seem to offer current with compromise to build. mid-line but sure better than no-line.

    RT1
  • shack
    shack Posts: 11,154
    edited February 2009
    I really don't understand what all the fuss is about EMO...

    I mean really...how good can a 6 foot shaggy bird sound in one's rig anyway?

    emu4.jpg
    "Just because you’re offended doesn’t mean you’re right." - Ricky Gervais

    "For those who believe, no proof is necessary. For those who don't believe, no proof is possible." - Stuart Chase

    "Consistency requires you to be as ignorant today as you were a year ago." - Bernard Berenson
  • comfortablycurt
    comfortablycurt Posts: 6,745
    edited February 2009
    heiney9 wrote: »
    Well, I have my wooden spoon out so might as well this give this a good stir.........


    One word BOSE and I say that as to the marketing, not nec the performance of the product.

    P.s So much for my final word, eh :o.

    P.s.s. Lessisnevermore..........you need to make the next RAS meeting and bring your EMO.........perhaps it could change a perception

    Bose was one of the first things that popped into my mind when I started reading some the responses. Not to say they're of complete crap quality like Bose...but they're quite similar in the over-advertising marketing hype crap.

    While it is still good to see an American based company actually succeeding right now, especially with our current economy. They have to be cutting corners in certain areas, and really relying on all this market hype.
    I'm in town until the end of March, so just say the word my friend.
    I'll bring the Guinness.:cool:

    curt, I expect you in attendance also....:D

    Oh, I'll be there.;) I'm looking forward to my first RAS meeting very much. I can't wait to go and check out some equipment that will blow my equipment out of the water.
    shack wrote: »
    I really don't understand what all the fuss is about EMO...

    I mean really...how good can a 6 foot shaggy bird sound in one's rig anyway?

    emu4.jpg

    You'd be surprised...I have one of them running on a treadmill, providing all of the power to my system. Never in my life have I heard such clean power...:p:eek:
    The nirvana inducer-
    APC H10 Power Conditioner
    Marantz UD5005 universal player
    Parasound Halo P5 preamp
    Parasound HCA-1200II power amp
    PolkAudio LSi9's/PolkAudio SDA 2A's/PolkAudio Monitor 7A's
    Audioquest Speaker Cables and IC's
  • LessisNevermore
    LessisNevermore Posts: 1,519
    edited February 2009
    You'd be surprised...I have one of them running on a treadmill, providing all of the power to my system. Never in my life have I heard such clean power...:p:eek:

    Surely you've had to cut some corners, it can't be that clean....:p:D
    Unless you've used a Reference Emu.
  • comfortablycurt
    comfortablycurt Posts: 6,745
    edited February 2009
    Surely you've had to cut some corners, it can't be that clean....:p:D
    Unless you've used a Reference Emu.

    Of course, it's a World Class, Reference grade Emu. I have a few extras World Class Reference Grade Emu's laying around too, if you're interested in buying one.;) You will never hear power as clean, as when you have an Emu running on a treadmill. That's a proven fact.:p
    The nirvana inducer-
    APC H10 Power Conditioner
    Marantz UD5005 universal player
    Parasound Halo P5 preamp
    Parasound HCA-1200II power amp
    PolkAudio LSi9's/PolkAudio SDA 2A's/PolkAudio Monitor 7A's
    Audioquest Speaker Cables and IC's
  • Lowell_M
    Lowell_M Posts: 1,660
    edited February 2009
    I'll bring the Guinness.:cool:

    Now that's what I'm talkin about... We could have a taste off between Guinness and my "World Class" "Reference" home brew.
    HT
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  • comfortablycurt
    comfortablycurt Posts: 6,745
    edited February 2009
    a_mattison wrote: »
    Now that's what I'm talkin about... We could have a taste off between Guinness and my "World Class" "Reference" home brew.

    Any takers on some Sierra Nevada? That's one of my new favorites...
    The nirvana inducer-
    APC H10 Power Conditioner
    Marantz UD5005 universal player
    Parasound Halo P5 preamp
    Parasound HCA-1200II power amp
    PolkAudio LSi9's/PolkAudio SDA 2A's/PolkAudio Monitor 7A's
    Audioquest Speaker Cables and IC's
  • timlitton
    timlitton Posts: 289
    edited February 2009
    I've never heard Emotiva so I can't comment to its quality.

    I don't blame them for trying to market their product the best way they can. Is it misleading? I'm not going to judge that. Does it work? Obviously since they've generated a buzz on multiple forums.

    What do you expect them to do? Put out lukewarm ads like this one?

    10a7270e124fc46e88874db26f3a98306g.jpg
    Slowly emerging from the 90's
    Fronts: Polk LSi15's
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  • devani
    devani Posts: 1,497
    edited February 2009
    I will be in Chicago next week for company training....I wish I could join you!!
    Video: LG 55LN5100/Samsung LNT4065F
    Receiver: HK AVR445
    Source: OPPO BDP-93
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  • LessisNevermore
    LessisNevermore Posts: 1,519
    edited February 2009
    timlitton wrote: »
    I've never heard Emotiva so I can't comment to its quality.

    I don't blame them for trying to market their product the best way they can. Is it misleading? I'm not going to judge that. Does it work? Obviously since they've generated a buzz on multiple forums.

    What do you expect them to do? Put out lukewarm ads like this one?

    Now that's reference quality satire.:D:D

    Who's up for racing into a Bose store and punching the salesmen?
  • heiney9
    heiney9 Posts: 25,013
    edited February 2009
    timlitton.............that's some funny ****:D:D
    "Appreciation of audio is a completely subjective human experience. Measurements can provide a measure of insight, but are no substitute for human judgment. Why are we looking to reduce a subjective experience to objective criteria anyway? The subtleties of music and audio reproduction are for those who appreciate it. Differentiation by numbers is for those who do not".--Nelson Pass Pass Labs XA25 | EE Avant Pre | EE Mini Max Supreme DAC | MIT Shotgun S1 | Pangea AC14SE MKII | Legend L600 | BlueSound Node 3 - Tubes add soul!
  • dkg999
    dkg999 Posts: 5,647
    edited February 2009
    timlitton - you're going to fit in well here! That's some good stuff there!
    DKG999
    HT System: LSi9, LSiCx2, LSiFX, LSi7, SVS 20-39 PC+, B&K 507.s2 AVR, B&K Ref 125.2, Tripplite LCR-2400, Cambridge 650BD, Signal Cable PC/SC, BJC IC, Samsung 55" LED

    Music System: Magnepan 1.6QR, SVS SB12+, ARC pre, Parasound HCA1500 vertically bi-amped, Jolida CDP, Pro-Ject RM5.1SE TT, Pro-Ject TubeBox SE phono pre, SBT, PS Audio DLIII DAC
  • megasat16
    megasat16 Posts: 3,521
    edited February 2009
    timlitton wrote: »
    I've never heard Emotiva so I can't comment to its quality.

    I don't blame them for trying to market their product the best way they can. Is it misleading? I'm not going to judge that. Does it work? Obviously since they've generated a buzz on multiple forums.

    What do you expect them to do? Put out lukewarm ads like this one?

    10a7270e124fc46e88874db26f3a98306g.jpg

    Dammmm....This is what I am talking about EMO Baby!

    Tim - THIS IS AWESOME! I laugh out so loud I think my neighbor calls 911. :eek:
    Trying out Different Audio Cables is a Religious Affair. You don't discuss it with anyone. :redface::biggrin:
  • reeltrouble1
    reeltrouble1 Posts: 9,312
    edited February 2009
    it certainly does warm the cockles of my crotch to see some new members who actually get what this place is about without the cheesy/whine of the whambulance ride.

    I just gotta waaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa on that one.

    You Emo guys better get your armor on and protect your house or forever be left standing in the corner resting your neck playing with yourself.

    RT1
  • Ricardo
    Ricardo Posts: 10,636
    edited February 2009
    timlitton, that right there deserves a standing ovation. Funny stuff!
    _________________________________________________
    ***\\\\\........................... My Audio Journey ............................./////***

    2008 & 2010 Football Pool WINNER
    SOPA
    Thank God for different opinions. Imagine the world if we all wanted the same woman
  • steveinaz
    steveinaz Posts: 19,521
    edited February 2009
    I'm hearing alot of speculation, and very little personal experience. Maybe the jury should wait for some evidence?
    Source: Bluesound Node 2i - Preamp/DAC: Benchmark DAC2 DX - Amp: Parasound Halo A21 - Speakers: MartinLogan Motion 60XTi - Shop Rig: Yamaha A-S501 Integrated - Shop Spkrs: Elac Debut 2.0 B5.2
  • heiney9
    heiney9 Posts: 25,013
    edited February 2009
    steveinaz wrote: »
    I'm hearing alot of speculation, and very little personal experience. Maybe the jury should wait for some evidence?

    Rationality has no place in audio.......don't you know that Steve :p:D If it did we would all own affordable like sounding HTiB type systems
    "Appreciation of audio is a completely subjective human experience. Measurements can provide a measure of insight, but are no substitute for human judgment. Why are we looking to reduce a subjective experience to objective criteria anyway? The subtleties of music and audio reproduction are for those who appreciate it. Differentiation by numbers is for those who do not".--Nelson Pass Pass Labs XA25 | EE Avant Pre | EE Mini Max Supreme DAC | MIT Shotgun S1 | Pangea AC14SE MKII | Legend L600 | BlueSound Node 3 - Tubes add soul!