The curse of the Treitz, expanding a networking journey

treitz3

Then what is the advantage? Maybe I'm missing something here, which of course, would not be surprising. I haven't had my morning coffee yet...

Tom

VR3

Essentially the switch wouldn't have a built in power supply, which technically a switch doesn't have a built in power supply anyways so.... I can't really see an advantage myself but I also like to eat crayons.

Dr_Wu

I'd keep looking for a used EtherRegen. Would guess more will be available as the v.2 release gets closer. That said, I'm using the ER stock PS, but I have a 12V/3A TeraDak (intended for a router) that I'm going to try on the ER. If there's significant improvement, I can always get another for the router.

heiney9

Dr_Wu wrote: »

I'd keep looking for a used EtherRegen. Would guess more will be available as the v.2 release gets closer. That said, I'm using the ER stock PS, but I have a 12V/3A TeraDak (intended for a router) that I'm going to try on the ER. If there's significant improvement, I can always get another for the router.

Same here, I just missed a used ER couple days ago. I under bid and he went with the full price offer. I simply asked if he'd include shipping. I was willing to pay the PP fees.

I also talked to a guy in the UK that was selling one, but he wouldn't ship to the US. I can wait for the v2, but it seems it will be a bit different.

I guess we're all competing for the same used v1........lol.

treitz3

https://www.audiogon.com/listings/lisb3ba5-uptone-audio-etherregen-tweaks

FWIW...

Tom

heiney9

I just bought a 2nd linear PS for my modem, am running a linear PS on the router already. This weekend I'm going to upgrade the internals on my Blue Node 3 so I can use a linear PS I was using on my SQB Touch.

The LPS I'm running on the router is a dual output 12V 25w 3A unit, but when I ran both the modem and router the thing got really hot, too hot for my liking. So I just bought a 2nd one the same as the first and I'll run (2) separate units.

H9

heiney9

treitz3 wrote: »

https://www.audiogon.com/listings/lisb3ba5-uptone-audio-etherregen-tweaks

FWIW...

Tom

Thanks Tom, I've been using HiFi Shark, but this one didn't show up....weird.

treitz3

Yeah, Hi-Fi Shark doesn't detect/show new listings for about a day or so. That Velcro can easily be removed but the residue will not be so easy. There is a workaround for that though (unless you want to keep it on there). Get an "Air Freshener" and use it for off label use. It looks just like the picture below.



Let the liquid sit on the unit for about 5 minutes and it will wipe all of the residual residue off. BTW, be forewarned....the EtherREGEN does run very hot. This is normal. Mine averages about 105 degrees and according to the owner of UpTone, the heat generated does not affect the components within the unit. IIRC, DK's ER runs at about the same temp.

When questioned about the high temps and adding a heat sink to prolong the life of the device, the owner of UpTone stated that it was unnecessary but if you feel the need to feel better about it, feel free to waste your money. I tried a heat sink for mine but it didn't help weigh the thing down, so I returned it along with the heat sink pads. I might actually use his Velcro idea but place it on the bottom of the unit to keep it down. He did mention that putting something on top of the ER will make it run even hotter, which may affect it in the long term.

He did mention that the failure rates due to heat were either non-existent or negligible. Something to that effect. He mentioned this on his sponsored forum over at Audiophile Style, way down in the depths of a 2 or 300 page thread. Seeing how some people weigh these things down creating even more heat, I found that to be insightful.

Tom

treitz3

Dr_Wu wrote: »

I'd keep looking for a used EtherRegen. Would guess more will be available as the v.2 release gets closer. That said, I'm using the ER stock PS, but I have a 12V/3A TeraDak (intended for a router) that I'm going to try on the ER. If there's significant improvement, I can always get another for the router.

One thing I have discovered in all of the configurations on my streaming rig is that it is more beneficial to the end result if you put your best equipment at the tail end of the signal (just before the NAP). I can't speak for how it will work in your rig but if your experience mimics mine, there should be an improvement.

Then, of course, there is the argument that a router is a superb noise generating item. So, at the end of the day, it may work better in the current location. Experimenting is the only way to find out. What works for one may not necessarily work with another, especially with all of the configuration, gear and noise variables.

Tom

heiney9

I just bought it at FULL price. I never pay asking, but in this case after having lost one over $25, I figured what the hell!

Thanks for the advice on removing the velcro/glue.

I will say not having used Audiogon in about 7 years, I had to jump through a lot of hoops to make a purchase. I was worried I miss it over all the BS and error messages.

But it worked out.

H9

heiney9

I guess I won't change out the power supply this weekend in the Node 3. I'll wait until after I evaluate the ER. I don't want to change things up too much. It makes it hard to evaluate individual upgrades.

H9

VR3

Congrats! Yes!

rebelsoul

LHY audio sw-8 is the switch I went with
Very good reviews.
High quality 8-ports Network Switch housed in CNC Milled Aluminium Chassis, powered by Ultra-Low-Noise Linear Power Supply, Clock by OCXO (Oven Controlled Crystal Oscillator).

LHY Audio SW-8
Based on Linksys LGS108 8-Port Business Desktop Gigabit Switch, LHY SW-8 is designed for critical audiophiles who seek refinement in Digital Music Streaming.

​

Designed and hand-built by highly skilled electronics crews by LHY Audio

Purpose built for High End Audio System

Engineered by Audiophile for Audiophile

The chassis of SW-8 is milled out of an Aluminium Block. Three(3) compartments spotted within the chassis to segregate the AC mains, DC regulators, and the Ethernet Switch main board.

CNC Milled
Aluminum Block Chassis
High Speed DC Rectifier
High Precision OCXO
Multi-Stage LDO DC Power
Linksys Business Grade
Ethernet Switch
Talema Encapsulated AC Transformer
AC Mains EMI Noise Filter
Engineered
for
Audiophile
Filtered AC Mains stepped down by an Encapsulated Tamale AC Transformer, Rectified DC further Regulated by Multi-stages of Low Drop Out (LDO) Regulators to supply Ultra-Low-Noise (<uV) to the OCXO, low level DC3.3V, DC1.2V for the Ethernet Switch.

​

Replaced built-in crystal of LGS108 with High quality SC-CUT Oven Controlled Crystal Oscillator with ultra low noise PLL circuitry

Unified Aluminium Block Chassis

Multi-Stage LDO DC Power

Filtered AC Mains Power

High Precision OCXO

rebelsoul

treitz3

https://forum.polkaudio.com/discussion/comment/2710434/#Comment_2710434 - Read this and the following post - FWIW

Tom

VR3

For reference Linksys LGS108: 8-Port Business Desktop Gigabit Ethernet Unmanaged Switch, Computer Network, Wired Connection Speed up to 1,000 Mbps (Black, Blue) https://a.co/d/7aHvY79

This is the one I am using with a power supply, I like it because it's very heavy and doesn't move around with the heavy cables
NETGEAR Nighthawk S8000 8-Port Gigabit Smart Managed Plus Gaming Switch (GS808E) - Low Latency for Responsive Streaming, Cool-touch Zinc-alloy Desktop Housing, Fanless for Quiet Operation https://a.co/d/aVxyxNA

stangman67

Let me ask a quick question to use the expertise in this thread.

My networking setup.

Net gear Cm2000 Modem
>Netgear Orbi AC3000 mesh router

Listening room
Netgear Orbi Mesh Satellite
> Lumin U2 mini via AQ Cinammon Ethernet

Where is money best spent here? LPS for the satellite that is feeding the Lumin? Would a LPS for the Router/Modem downstairs even matter given they are on a different circuit m?

Due to cabling constraints, the router and modem cannot be relocated to the listening room without rerunning the cable coax

Not doing this anytime soon but seeing as a lot of folks are doing these upgrades here, might make sense at some point to pick up an affordable LPS

VR3

You need to remove all switching power supplies as that noise enters the stream

treitz3

Hi, Zach. If I was running your system, my first move would be a LPS for the Lumin U2 mini (would need an adapter as well for the DC PC). That's just what I would do.

stangman67 wrote: »

Would a LPS for the Router/Modem downstairs even matter given they are on a different circuit?

In my experience, yes. Everything....literally everything makes a difference. Please do not expect everything to be night and day. These differences (some big) are more of "removing" than adding. I wasn't really expecting anything to make a change at the Modem/Router area (my setup mimics yours with location(s)) I was pleasantly surprised when I added the upgraded items upstream of the router. From the power supplies, to the E cable to the modem.

In my system (each system/setup/configuration is different), I found it better to concentrate the best gear at the tail end of the system, right before the NAP and leave/utilize the worst gear towards the front end. With that said, I was surprised at what the Shunyata Alpha (filtered E cable) did in between the modem and the router, so my opinion may change over time, as I upgrade the front end even more. I just don't think at this point that there is room for improvement....although I have thought that before and was corrected after a change.

stangman67 wrote: »

Due to cabling constraints, the router and modem cannot be relocated to the listening room without rerunning the cable coax

No worries there. I have the same restraints as you. Turns out that you and I have what they call a natural "moat", if you will. Auralic actually suggests that you configure the streamer this way, as it breaks the hardwired contact and all of the noise that is carried along with it. If your signal is strong and you aren't sending packets back and forth, then there is no issue. Don't ever feel that you are missing out just because you aren't hardwired. Trust me when I say that I'm not missing a thing. That and my signal is crystal clear...as evidenced by what I hear and what the system is capable of now. I am not bottle necked at all due to not having a hardwired connection.

Let me throw this out there for all who are wondering....

When it comes to changes in your streaming network, with every upgrade, you will not hear a significant difference. Some upgrades are subtle but distinguishable. Others, like the Muon or the Shunyata cables are undeniably for the better on all aspects (especially that Muon....Holy smokes Batman!).

Most of the time, I noticed a slightly higher volume level, more "air", sharper imaging, better depth/height/3D imaging and less digital artifacts. The more you work on your streaming setup, the better these aspects all get. At some point you will just sit down and listen and ask yourself, "Why didn't I do this sooner"? It just sounds great.

The less digital noise you have, the more you combat latency, the more noise is rejected/isolated and the purer the signal gets - this will allow to to turn the volume up well beyond what you were previously able to do. And I do mean well beyond. You'll know it when you hear it (or in this case,when you DON'T hear it). One other added note.....the lower registers become unfathomably clear with incredible texture.

Please don't expect that just because you bought an E cable or a LPS that the system will all of a sudden sound phenomenal. It's a cumulative effect.

Tom

treitz3

Dr_Wu wrote: »

I'd keep looking for a used EtherRegen.

https://audiophilestyle.com/classifieds/item/2535-etherregen-with-ultracap-lps-12/

Here ya' go. Buy two, sell one. Don't ask me what an Ultracap LPS is though. Not familiar with them but they couldn't hurt, especially over a Wal-Wart PS.

Tom

heiney9

Ultracap LPS is their linear power supply if one doesn't want to use the power supply supplied with the ER.

H9

treitz3

"Their" LPS, as in UpTone?

Tom

heiney9

treitz3 wrote: »

"Their" LPS, as in UpTone?

Tom

Yes, one was discontinued for an upgraded version.

They had 3 now 2.

https://uptoneaudio.com/products/ultracap-lps-1

https://uptoneaudio.com/products/ultracap-lps-1-2

H9

treitz3

Thanks, H9. I did not know this.

Okay, fellas, I can't find the thread to where the discussion was going with how all of this makes sense...Dan (@Mantis) was on the thread and could not understand how all of this stuff works.

Here is a link to a post offered up over at the WBF that explains what we are hearing better than I could even begin to explain it. https://www.whatsbestforum.com/threads/what-ethernet-cables-are-members-using.27353/post-860422

(Posts #418-420)

Tom

heiney9

https://forum.polkaudio.com/discussion/197730/etherregens-a-discussion-about-them-and-what-it-is-they-do/p1

There's this one. Is there another here at the Polk forum?

H9

treitz3

That's the thread I thought of. I looked at that one and a couple of others but could not find it.

Oh well, hopefully Dan will run across this thread and click on the link. That's some great information that explains things much better than I could......and in a more concise way than if you were to research it yourself, which is what I exhaustively ended up doing.

Tom

audioluvr

This all is reminding me of cryptocurrency. The more you talk about it, the higher the price gets.

erniejade

So for testing, I took the EtherREGEN out of the chain and going directly from my deco 6e with a sbooser power supplu, to the Innuos zen mk3 using Qobuz for music. Soundstage collapsed, everything sounds further away and, i can definitely hear the clarity difference. After about 30 minutes, i had to put it back in. I then took the RAL Ethernet back out and put the Supra back in. That lasted a whole 10 minutes and put the RAL back in. Brad might be slow but makes a very good ethernet cable. His usb cable is also fantastic.

erniejade

I forgot to mention, I still need to check out that muon pro. That has been on my mind to test.

treitz3

If that does to your system what it did to Trey's and mine? You are gonna LOVE that thing!

Tom