What amp should i run help please...
Answers
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All speakers don’t sound the same i know this. But when it comes to avr or amps they all sound different ?
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All speakers don’t sound the same i know this. But when it comes to avr or amps they all sound different ?
Everything sounds different, to varying degrees. Tubes, amps, preamps, cables, speakers, everything. Where you place the speakers, how far from the rear wall they are, side walls, all affect imaging and sound. Some things make smaller differences than others but it all adds up.
If you're skeptical of something or others have you believe that a certain thing makes zero difference, instead of listening to them listen for yourself. Buy some good speaker wire, try it out. Live with it a while, if you don't notice a difference sell it.afterburnt wrote: »They didn't speak a word of English, they were from South Carolina.
Village Idiot of Club Polk -
PolkAudioJoJo wrote: »All speakers don’t sound the same i know this. But when it comes to avr or amps they all sound different ?
Everything sounds different, to varying degrees. Tubes, amps, preamps, cables, speakers, everything. Where you place the speakers, how far from the rear wall they are, side walls, all affect imaging and sound. Some things make smaller differences than others but it all adds up.
If you're skeptical of something or others have you believe that a certain thing makes zero difference, instead of listening to them listen for yourself. Buy some good speaker wire, try it out. Live with it a while, if you don't notice a difference sell it.
Not so long ago there was no need to debunk the myriad of myths surrounding the audio (especially high end) industry which was once based on objectivity and the scientific method. When distortion, response and noise were no longer issues even in the most modestly priced hardware, the high end segment had to rely upon **** & bull BS in order to justify its "raison d'etre". Those engaging in this type of activity might well be described as "audio whores" who, rather than educating, instead choose to exploit the underinformed. Well I guess the economy needs its sheep and those taking advantage of them would've made Jordan Belfort proud.
What a load of audio ignorance.Political Correctness'.........defined
"A doctrine fostered by a delusional, illogical minority and rabidly promoted by an unscrupulous mainstream media, which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible to pick up a t-u-r-d by the clean end."
President of Club Polk -
PolkAudioJoJo wrote: »Says the idiot with a tin foil hat.
Thanks, now I can use that to ban you.Political Correctness'.........defined
"A doctrine fostered by a delusional, illogical minority and rabidly promoted by an unscrupulous mainstream media, which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible to pick up a t-u-r-d by the clean end."
President of Club Polk -
Keep digging, makes having you banned all that much easier.Political Correctness'.........defined
"A doctrine fostered by a delusional, illogical minority and rabidly promoted by an unscrupulous mainstream media, which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible to pick up a t-u-r-d by the clean end."
President of Club Polk -
Ah, but I am holier than thou.Political Correctness'.........defined
"A doctrine fostered by a delusional, illogical minority and rabidly promoted by an unscrupulous mainstream media, which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible to pick up a t-u-r-d by the clean end."
President of Club Polk -
Ah, but I am holier than thou.
Bad and Nationwide as well. I knew there was a reason I put this guy on ignore before he had a chance to hit a dozen posts. My advice would be for others to do the same.The Gear... Carver "Statement" Mono-blocks, Mcintosh C2300 Arcam AVR20, Oppo UDP-203 4K Blu-ray player, Sony XBR70x850B 4k, Polk Audio Legend L800 with height modules, L400 Center Channel Polk audio AB800 "in-wall" surrounds. Marantz MM7025 stereo amp. Simaudio Moon 680d DSD
“When once a Republic is corrupted, there is no possibility of remedying any of the growing evils but by removing the corruption and restoring its lost principles; every other correction is either useless or a new evil.”— Thomas Jefferson -
Jesse sleeps during the day...
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PolkAudioJoJo [/quote] I’m still waiting for an answer from F1nut
[/quote]
. Would you stop trolling on this forum. Grow the F up. Just dont reply & move along
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PolkAudioJoJo wrote: »...To suggest that one sounds different from the other means that one or the other is coloring the signal (or even both). The guiding principle of any brand has always been firmly grounded in NO coloration. Coloration is measured as DISTORTION. When an amplifier is spec @ x watts 20-20,000 hz with no more than y% THD, it either performs to that spec or it does not. Pure and simple. If one performs and sounds different than another, either it’s out of spec and needs service or they’re LYING about their performance specs...
I will admit I used to think the same way you do.
In fact, I even waltzed into this forum, and made many of the same proclamations that you have, and I also picked a fight with Jesse (F1nut), AND I also made an **** out of myself. Just like you have.
Then I stopped and considered, just for a minute, that maybe I didn't know everything. Then I started listening to the wealth of knowledgeable members here. Then I started listening to my gear - really listening -, and not reading the specs.
That has lead me on a long journey to my current amplifier, a Mark Levinson 331. It’s only rated at 100wpc, and a not so great .5% distortion rating. But I can attest, it completely obliterates any amplifier I have owned - including ones rated at 400wpc at .005% distortion. It’s not about the specs, it’s about the SOUND.
It’s not too late to apologize for your attitude - we’re a forgiving bunch here. Sit back, read, and learn. If you are in this hobby to enjoy great sound from a home audio system, open your mind and allow yourself to at least be swayed. You won’t be sorry.
"Conservative Libertarians love the country, progressive leftists love the government." - Andrew Wilkow
“Human beings are born with different capacities. If they are free, they are not equal. And if they are equal, they are not free.”
― Aleksandr Solzhenitsyn -
PolkAudioJoJo wrote: »...To suggest that one sounds different from the other means that one or the other is coloring the signal (or even both). The guiding principle of any brand has always been firmly grounded in NO coloration. Coloration is measured as DISTORTION. When an amplifier is spec @ x watts 20-20,000 hz with no more than y% THD, it either performs to that spec or it does not. Pure and simple. If one performs and sounds different than another, either it’s out of spec and needs service or they’re LYING about their performance specs...
I will admit I used to think the same way you do.
I used the think the way you do now - whenever I bought new expensive amplifiers - that is until I purchased a device that allows switching between them on the fly. It was humbling, disappointing but immeasurably revealing. Any differences that did/do exist were so minute as to have little to no effect on musical enjoyment.
All the same, I do appreciate well constructed, high quality equipment that is aesthetically pleasing and do not mind paying a premium for those qualities. Resale value value is another important consideration as well. However, audible differences between most electronics is on a negligible order of magnitude far beyond my ears to discern and it is my opinion that the same holds true for the vast majority of the populace -whether they choose to admit it or not.
As always, YMMV.
Main:
McIntosh: MC 2155, MC 2125(x2), MR 80, C 32, MQ 101; Snell J7; Polk: RTiA7, RTiA9;
Pioneer PL-518; A/T 440 MLa; Yamaha CD
Vintage:
McIntosh: MX110Z, MC 2505, MC 240, Thorens TD 145; Shure V15III; Altec 14, Boston T1000; Yamaha CDX 393 CD; Yamaha Cass -
It is my opinion that I would have ended that post after the word discern.
Why not just get a Hello Kitty boombox, disconnect the included speakers, and wire your own up to it? Super cheap and would sound no different than anything else.afterburnt wrote: »They didn't speak a word of English, they were from South Carolina.
Village Idiot of Club Polk -
PolkAudioJoJo wrote: »...To suggest that one sounds different from the other means that one or the other is coloring the signal (or even both). The guiding principle of any brand has always been firmly grounded in NO coloration. Coloration is measured as DISTORTION. When an amplifier is spec @ x watts 20-20,000 hz with no more than y% THD, it either performs to that spec or it does not. Pure and simple. If one performs and sounds different than another, either it’s out of spec and needs service or they’re LYING about their performance specs...
I will admit I used to think the same way you do.
I used the think the way you do now - whenever I bought new expensive amplifiers - that is until I purchased a device that allows switching between them on the fly. It was humbling, disappointing but immeasurably revealing. Any differences that did/do exist were so minute as to have little to no effect on musical enjoyment.
All the same, I do appreciate well constructed, high quality equipment that is aesthetically pleasing and do not mind paying a premium for those qualities. Resale value value is another important consideration as well. However, audible differences between most electronics is on a negligible order of magnitude far beyond my ears to discern and it is my opinion that the same holds true for the vast majority of the populace -whether they choose to admit it or not.
As always, YMMV.
Interesting point of view. It does however raise the question of why you own so much McIntosh gear. At those prices, I’d think you would have abandon them after the first one, with little to no discernible difference to say, a Crown pro amp...?"Conservative Libertarians love the country, progressive leftists love the government." - Andrew Wilkow
“Human beings are born with different capacities. If they are free, they are not equal. And if they are equal, they are not free.”
― Aleksandr Solzhenitsyn -
PolkAudioJoJo wrote: »...To suggest that one sounds different from the other means that one or the other is coloring the signal (or even both). The guiding principle of any brand has always been firmly grounded in NO coloration. Coloration is measured as DISTORTION. When an amplifier is spec @ x watts 20-20,000 hz with no more than y% THD, it either performs to that spec or it does not. Pure and simple. If one performs and sounds different than another, either it’s out of spec and needs service or they’re LYING about their performance specs...
I will admit I used to think the same way you do.
I used the think the way you do now - whenever I bought new expensive amplifiers - that is until I purchased a device that allows switching between them on the fly. It was humbling, disappointing but immeasurably revealing. Any differences that did/do exist were so minute as to have little to no effect on musical enjoyment.
All the same, I do appreciate well constructed, high quality equipment that is aesthetically pleasing and do not mind paying a premium for those qualities. Resale value value is another important consideration as well. However, audible differences between most electronics is on a negligible order of magnitude far beyond my ears to discern and it is my opinion that the same holds true for the vast majority of the populace -whether they choose to admit it or not.
As always, YMMV.
You do realize that rapid switch between components is absolutely the wrong way to evaluate audio gear, right?Political Correctness'.........defined
"A doctrine fostered by a delusional, illogical minority and rabidly promoted by an unscrupulous mainstream media, which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible to pick up a t-u-r-d by the clean end."
President of Club Polk -
I never new there was a sound cult out there. This **** is interesting
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a sound cult -- as in opinions outside of the mainstream in terms of hifi reproduction?
... you have no idea...
DSC_5909 (2) by Mark Hardy, on Flickr
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PolkAudioJoJo wrote: »...To suggest that one sounds different from the other means that one or the other is coloring the signal (or even both). The guiding principle of any brand has always been firmly grounded in NO coloration. Coloration is measured as DISTORTION. When an amplifier is spec @ x watts 20-20,000 hz with no more than y% THD, it either performs to that spec or it does not. Pure and simple. If one performs and sounds different than another, either it’s out of spec and needs service or they’re LYING about their performance specs...
I will admit I used to think the same way you do.
I used the think the way you do now - whenever I bought new expensive amplifiers - that is until I purchased a device that allows switching between them on the fly. It was humbling, disappointing but immeasurably revealing. Any differences that did/do exist were so minute as to have little to no effect on musical enjoyment.
All the same, I do appreciate well constructed, high quality equipment that is aesthetically pleasing and do not mind paying a premium for those qualities. Resale value value is another important consideration as well. However, audible differences between most electronics is on a negligible order of magnitude far beyond my ears to discern and it is my opinion that the same holds true for the vast majority of the populace -whether they choose to admit it or not.
As always, YMMV.
You do realize that rapid switch between components is absolutely the wrong way to evaluate audio gear, right?
In my book that is the only way to do it with any chance of making meaningful comparisons. This view is also shared by many of the foremost authorities on the subject.
Main:
McIntosh: MC 2155, MC 2125(x2), MR 80, C 32, MQ 101; Snell J7; Polk: RTiA7, RTiA9;
Pioneer PL-518; A/T 440 MLa; Yamaha CD
Vintage:
McIntosh: MX110Z, MC 2505, MC 240, Thorens TD 145; Shure V15III; Altec 14, Boston T1000; Yamaha CDX 393 CD; Yamaha Cass -
PolkAudioJoJo wrote: »...To suggest that one sounds different from the other means that one or the other is coloring the signal (or even both). The guiding principle of any brand has always been firmly grounded in NO coloration. Coloration is measured as DISTORTION. When an amplifier is spec @ x watts 20-20,000 hz with no more than y% THD, it either performs to that spec or it does not. Pure and simple. If one performs and sounds different than another, either it’s out of spec and needs service or they’re LYING about their performance specs...
I will admit I used to think the same way you do.
I used the think the way you do now - whenever I bought new expensive amplifiers - that is until I purchased a device that allows switching between them on the fly. It was humbling, disappointing but immeasurably revealing. Any differences that did/do exist were so minute as to have little to no effect on musical enjoyment.
All the same, I do appreciate well constructed, high quality equipment that is aesthetically pleasing and do not mind paying a premium for those qualities. Resale value value is another important consideration as well. However, audible differences between most electronics is on a negligible order of magnitude far beyond my ears to discern and it is my opinion that the same holds true for the vast majority of the populace -whether they choose to admit it or not.
As always, YMMV.
Interesting point of view. It does however raise the question of why you own so much McIntosh gear. At those prices, I’d think you would have abandon them after the first one, with little to no discernible difference to say, a Crown pro amp...?
First, because pre-owned Mc in good nick is one of the best investments as far as home electronics goes.
Secondly, its product support is second to none with one of the foremost Mc restoration/repair specialists that happens to be located within a relatively short driving distance from my location. This is a major convenience for vintage repairs.
Third is for deep personal reasons dating back many decades.
Last but by no means least, is the sound quality which I find immensely satisfying which seems to bring out the best of whatever speakers it's being used with.
Main:
McIntosh: MC 2155, MC 2125(x2), MR 80, C 32, MQ 101; Snell J7; Polk: RTiA7, RTiA9;
Pioneer PL-518; A/T 440 MLa; Yamaha CD
Vintage:
McIntosh: MX110Z, MC 2505, MC 240, Thorens TD 145; Shure V15III; Altec 14, Boston T1000; Yamaha CDX 393 CD; Yamaha Cass -
PolkAudioJoJo wrote: »...To suggest that one sounds different from the other means that one or the other is coloring the signal (or even both). The guiding principle of any brand has always been firmly grounded in NO coloration. Coloration is measured as DISTORTION. When an amplifier is spec @ x watts 20-20,000 hz with no more than y% THD, it either performs to that spec or it does not. Pure and simple. If one performs and sounds different than another, either it’s out of spec and needs service or they’re LYING about their performance specs...
I will admit I used to think the same way you do.
I used the think the way you do now - whenever I bought new expensive amplifiers - that is until I purchased a device that allows switching between them on the fly. It was humbling, disappointing but immeasurably revealing. Any differences that did/do exist were so minute as to have little to no effect on musical enjoyment.
All the same, I do appreciate well constructed, high quality equipment that is aesthetically pleasing and do not mind paying a premium for those qualities. Resale value value is another important consideration as well. However, audible differences between most electronics is on a negligible order of magnitude far beyond my ears to discern and it is my opinion that the same holds true for the vast majority of the populace -whether they choose to admit it or not.
As always, YMMV.
You do realize that rapid switch between components is absolutely the wrong way to evaluate audio gear, right?
In my book that is the only way to do it with any chance of making meaningful comparisons. This view is also shared by many of the foremost authorities on the subject.
No, that view is not shared by anyone other than the ignorant and/or the habitual naysayer.Political Correctness'.........defined
"A doctrine fostered by a delusional, illogical minority and rabidly promoted by an unscrupulous mainstream media, which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible to pick up a t-u-r-d by the clean end."
President of Club Polk -
Last but by no means least, is the sound quality which I find immensely satisfying which seems to bring out the best of whatever speakers it's being used with.
But you stated earlier,I used the think the way you do now - whenever I bought new expensive amplifiers - that is until I purchased a device that allows switching between them on the fly. It was humbling, disappointing but immeasurably revealing. Any differences that did/do exist were so minute as to have little to no effect on musical enjoyment.
So, you either think that all amps sound like a Mac or you just stepped on your tail.
Political Correctness'.........defined
"A doctrine fostered by a delusional, illogical minority and rabidly promoted by an unscrupulous mainstream media, which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible to pick up a t-u-r-d by the clean end."
President of Club Polk -
Last but by no means least, is the sound quality which I find immensely satisfying which seems to bring out the best of whatever speakers it's being used with.
But you stated earlier,I used the think the way you do now - whenever I bought new expensive amplifiers - that is until I purchased a device that allows switching between them on the fly. It was humbling, disappointing but immeasurably revealing. Any differences that did/do exist were so minute as to have little to no effect on musical enjoyment.
So, you either think that all amps sound like a Mac or you just stepped on your tail.
You beat me to it -"Conservative Libertarians love the country, progressive leftists love the government." - Andrew Wilkow
“Human beings are born with different capacities. If they are free, they are not equal. And if they are equal, they are not free.”
― Aleksandr Solzhenitsyn -
Last but by no means least, is the sound quality which I find immensely satisfying which seems to bring out the best of whatever speakers it's being used with.
But you stated earlier,I used the think the way you do now - whenever I bought new expensive amplifiers - that is until I purchased a device that allows switching between them on the fly. It was humbling, disappointing but immeasurably revealing. Any differences that did/do exist were so minute as to have little to no effect on musical enjoyment.
So, you either think that all amps sound like a Mac or you just stepped on your tail.
You beat me to it -
I know, right! It never fails, give'em enough rope and they hang themselves every time. Amusing to say the least.Political Correctness'.........defined
"A doctrine fostered by a delusional, illogical minority and rabidly promoted by an unscrupulous mainstream media, which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible to pick up a t-u-r-d by the clean end."
President of Club Polk -
PolkAudioJoJo wrote: »...To suggest that one sounds different from the other means that one or the other is coloring the signal (or even both). The guiding principle of any brand has always been firmly grounded in NO coloration. Coloration is measured as DISTORTION. When an amplifier is spec @ x watts 20-20,000 hz with no more than y% THD, it either performs to that spec or it does not. Pure and simple. If one performs and sounds different than another, either it’s out of spec and needs service or they’re LYING about their performance specs...
I will admit I used to think the same way you do.
In fact, I even waltzed into this forum, and made many of the same proclamations that you have, and I also picked a fight with Jesse (F1nut), AND I also made an **** out of myself. Just like you have.
Then I stopped and considered, just for a minute, that maybe I didn't know everything. Then I started listening to the wealth of knowledgeable members here. Then I started listening to my gear - really listening -, and not reading the specs.
That has lead me on a long journey to my current amplifier, a Mark Levinson 331. It’s only rated at 100wpc, and a not so great .5% distortion rating. But I can attest, it completely obliterates any amplifier I have owned - including ones rated at 400wpc at .005% distortion. It’s not about the specs, it’s about the SOUND.
It’s not too late to apologize for your attitude - we’re a forgiving bunch here. Sit back, read, and learn. If you are in this hobby to enjoy great sound from a home audio system, open your mind and allow yourself to at least be swayed. You won’t be sorry.
I feel your journey @daddyjt! One difference, I admitted I didn't know anything! With that, comes a whole bunch of humility. Listen and learn, was my modus operandi, for quite a while.
However, I did manage to, not necessarily pick a fight, but get spanked, by @F1nut nut, IIRC! Ah, tough love! But love nonetheless! Basement: Polk SDA SRS 1.2tl's, Cary SLP-05 Pre with ultimate upgrade,McIntosh MCD301 CD/SACD player, Northstar Designs Excelsio DAC, Cambridge 851N streamer, McIntosh MC300 Amp, Silnote Morpheus Ref2, Series2 Digital Cables, Silnote Morpheus Ref2 Series2 XLR's, Furman 15PFi Power Conditioner, Pangea Power Cables, MIT Shotgun S3 IC's, MIT Shotgun S1 Bi-Wire speaker cables
Office: PC, EAR Acute CD Player, EAR 834L Pre, Northstar Designs Intenso DAC, Antique Sound Labs AV8 Monoblocks, Denon UDR-F10 Cassette, Acoustic Technologies Classic FR Speakers, SVS SB12 Plus sub, MIT AVt2 speaker cables, IFI Purifier2, AQ Cinnamon USB cable, Groneberg Quatro Reference IC's
Spare Room: Dayens Ampino Integrated Amp, Tjoeb 99 tube CD player (modified Marantz CD-38), Analysis Plus Oval 9's, Zu Jumpers, AudioEngine B1 Streamer, Klipsch RB-61 v2, SVS PB1000 sub, Blue Jeans RCA IC's, Shunyata Hydra 8 Power Conditioner
Living Room: Peachtree Nova Integrated, Cambridge CXN v2 Streamer, Rotel RCD-1072 CD player, Furman 15PFi Power Conditioner, Polk RT265 In Wall Speakers, Polk DSW Pro 660wi sub
Garage #1: Cambridge Audio 640A Integrated Amp, Project Box-E BT Streamer, Polk Tsi200 Bookies, Douglas Speaker Cables, Shunyata Power Conditioner
Garage #2: Cambridge Audio EVO150 Integrated Amplifier, Polk L200's, Analysis Plus Silver Oval 2 Speaker Cables, IC's TBD. -
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Basement: Polk SDA SRS 1.2tl's, Cary SLP-05 Pre with ultimate upgrade,McIntosh MCD301 CD/SACD player, Northstar Designs Excelsio DAC, Cambridge 851N streamer, McIntosh MC300 Amp, Silnote Morpheus Ref2, Series2 Digital Cables, Silnote Morpheus Ref2 Series2 XLR's, Furman 15PFi Power Conditioner, Pangea Power Cables, MIT Shotgun S3 IC's, MIT Shotgun S1 Bi-Wire speaker cables
Office: PC, EAR Acute CD Player, EAR 834L Pre, Northstar Designs Intenso DAC, Antique Sound Labs AV8 Monoblocks, Denon UDR-F10 Cassette, Acoustic Technologies Classic FR Speakers, SVS SB12 Plus sub, MIT AVt2 speaker cables, IFI Purifier2, AQ Cinnamon USB cable, Groneberg Quatro Reference IC's
Spare Room: Dayens Ampino Integrated Amp, Tjoeb 99 tube CD player (modified Marantz CD-38), Analysis Plus Oval 9's, Zu Jumpers, AudioEngine B1 Streamer, Klipsch RB-61 v2, SVS PB1000 sub, Blue Jeans RCA IC's, Shunyata Hydra 8 Power Conditioner
Living Room: Peachtree Nova Integrated, Cambridge CXN v2 Streamer, Rotel RCD-1072 CD player, Furman 15PFi Power Conditioner, Polk RT265 In Wall Speakers, Polk DSW Pro 660wi sub
Garage #1: Cambridge Audio 640A Integrated Amp, Project Box-E BT Streamer, Polk Tsi200 Bookies, Douglas Speaker Cables, Shunyata Power Conditioner
Garage #2: Cambridge Audio EVO150 Integrated Amplifier, Polk L200's, Analysis Plus Silver Oval 2 Speaker Cables, IC's TBD. -
mahrdy6647 did i hurt your feeling by saying sound cult ?
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accuracy + self-awareness = Why we love Dave.
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mahrdy6647 did i hurt your feeling by saying sound cult ?
I am sure he is inconsolable at the moment.
Speaking of "inconsolable"......
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Last but by no means least, is the sound quality which I find immensely satisfying which seems to bring out the best of whatever speakers it's being used with.
But you stated earlier,I used the think the way you do now - whenever I bought new expensive amplifiers - that is until I purchased a device that allows switching between them on the fly. It was humbling, disappointing but immeasurably revealing. Any differences that did/do exist were so minute as to have little to no effect on musical enjoyment.
So, you either think that all amps sound like a Mac or you just stepped on your tail.
"Seems to bring the best" should have been self-explanatory as it was never intended to be declaration of fact in the absolute.
I have also never labored under the delusion that equally satisfying results cannot be obtained with non-McIntosh electronics.Main:
McIntosh: MC 2155, MC 2125(x2), MR 80, C 32, MQ 101; Snell J7; Polk: RTiA7, RTiA9;
Pioneer PL-518; A/T 440 MLa; Yamaha CD
Vintage:
McIntosh: MX110Z, MC 2505, MC 240, Thorens TD 145; Shure V15III; Altec 14, Boston T1000; Yamaha CDX 393 CD; Yamaha Cass
