Let's Talk About Power Conditioners

jflail2
jflail2 Posts: 2,868
Now that the system is running like a champ with my new amp, I'm curious about power conditioners. Currently using a Monster HTS1600 and feel like I need to step up my game a little bit. Looking to keep it at/under $400 if possible, but what are you guys currently using and what should I take into account when choosing one? Nearly pulled the trigger on a Panamax MR5100, but figured I'd poll the masses first prior to taking the plunge.

Thanks!
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Comments

  • VR3
    VR3 Posts: 27,937
    Tried power conditioners on multiple of occasions and have always sold them/returned them. Dynamics life sucker in my experience.
    - Not Tom ::::::: Any system can play Diana Krall. Only the best can play Limp Bizkit.
  • honestaquarian
    honestaquarian Posts: 3,186
    Monster Power is one of those love or hate brands amongst audiophiles. I happen to love them. I’d recommend getting your hands on an AVS-2000. It’s rather large and very heavy, because it’s essentially a variac. They don’t make them anymore and you can find plenty for sale on eBay. It’s a voltage stabilizer and your power center plugs into it. I have one in each of my systems and did notice a positive change when I got each one.
  • nooshinjohn
    nooshinjohn Posts: 24,981
    edited May 2019
    I would steer well clear of Monster anything.... Bad experience with one of their better conditioners and complete lack of support from them when it failed due to the backup battery being defective.
    The Gear... Carver "Statement" Mono-blocks, Mcintosh C2300 Arcam AVR20, Oppo UDP-203 4K Blu-ray player, Sony XBR70x850B 4k, Polk Audio Legend L800 with height modules, L400 Center Channel Polk audio AB800 "in-wall" surrounds. Marantz MM7025 stereo amp. Simaudio Moon 680d DSD

    “When once a Republic is corrupted, there is no possibility of remedying any of the growing evils but by removing the corruption and restoring its lost principles; every other correction is either useless or a new evil.”— Thomas Jefferson
  • codycatalist
    codycatalist Posts: 2,662
    "I've been conditioned my brother, even my conditioning has been conditioned"

    Just a dude doing dude-ly things

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  • jflail2
    jflail2 Posts: 2,868
    I would steer well clear of Monster anything.... Bad experience with one of their better conditioners and complete lack of support from them when it failed due to the backup battery being defective.

    Well that doesn't sound good. What did you replace it with?
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  • verb
    verb Posts: 10,176
    edited May 2019
    I have a Furman Elite 15PFI, bought right here on this forum. Used marked can be had under 4 hundie easily.

    However, used ones have risk. Unless you trust the seller, which is implicit here on CP, you may be getting one with issues, or worse. So be cautious.
    Basement: Polk SDA SRS 1.2tl's, Cary SLP-05 Pre with ultimate upgrade,McIntosh MCD301 CD/SACD player, Northstar Designs Excelsio DAC, Cambridge 851N streamer, McIntosh MC300 Amp, Silnote Morpheus Ref2, Series2 Digital Cables, Silnote Morpheus Ref2 Series2 XLR's, Furman 15PFi Power Conditioner, Pangea Power Cables, MIT Shotgun S3 IC's, MIT Shotgun S1 Bi-Wire speaker cables
    Office: PC, EAR Acute CD Player, EAR 834L Pre, Northstar Designs Intenso DAC, Antique Sound Labs AV8 Monoblocks, Denon UDR-F10 Cassette, Acoustic Technologies Classic FR Speakers, SVS SB12 Plus sub, MIT AVt2 speaker cables, IFI Purifier2, AQ Cinnamon USB cable, Groneberg Quatro Reference IC's
    Spare Room: Dayens Ampino Integrated Amp, Tjoeb 99 tube CD player (modified Marantz CD-38), Analysis Plus Oval 9's, Zu Jumpers, AudioEngine B1 Streamer, Klipsch RB-61 v2, SVS PB1000 sub, Blue Jeans RCA IC's, Shunyata Hydra 8 Power Conditioner
    Living Room: Peachtree Nova Integrated, Cambridge CXN v2 Streamer, Rotel RCD-1072 CD player, Furman 15PFi Power Conditioner, Polk RT265 In Wall Speakers, Polk DSW Pro 660wi sub
    Garage #1: Cambridge Audio 640A Integrated Amp, Project Box-E BT Streamer, Polk Tsi200 Bookies, Douglas Speaker Cables, Shunyata Power Conditioner
    Garage #2: Cambridge Audio EVO150 Integrated Amplifier, Polk L200's, Analysis Plus Silver Oval 2 Speaker Cables, IC's TBD.
  • Mikey081057
    Mikey081057 Posts: 7,127
    I have some Panamax stuff and it seems to be fine. never had any issues. I would like to not have anything but living in the lightning capital of the world Lee Cty Florida you need to have protection. I also have a surge protector on my electrical meter as stage I protection. My lightning detector has been beeping all day. I have a PS Audio

    https://www.psaudio.com/products/dectet-power-center/

    On my 2 channel which you can find used.
    My New Year's resolution is 3840 × 2160

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  • nooshinjohn
    nooshinjohn Posts: 24,981
    jflail2 wrote: »
    I would steer well clear of Monster anything.... Bad experience with one of their better conditioners and complete lack of support from them when it failed due to the backup battery being defective.

    Well that doesn't sound good. What did you replace it with?

    Right now, just a power strip, but I am looking at PS Audio...
    The Gear... Carver "Statement" Mono-blocks, Mcintosh C2300 Arcam AVR20, Oppo UDP-203 4K Blu-ray player, Sony XBR70x850B 4k, Polk Audio Legend L800 with height modules, L400 Center Channel Polk audio AB800 "in-wall" surrounds. Marantz MM7025 stereo amp. Simaudio Moon 680d DSD

    “When once a Republic is corrupted, there is no possibility of remedying any of the growing evils but by removing the corruption and restoring its lost principles; every other correction is either useless or a new evil.”— Thomas Jefferson
  • F1nut
    F1nut Posts: 49,666
    jflail2 wrote: »
    Now that the system is running like a champ with my new amp, I'm curious about power conditioners. Currently using a Monster HTS1600 and feel like I need to step up my game a little bit. Looking to keep it at/under $400 if possible, but what are you guys currently using and what should I take into account when choosing one? Nearly pulled the trigger on a Panamax MR5100, but figured I'd poll the masses first prior to taking the plunge.

    Thanks!

    Is this for your amp or the rest of the gear?
    Political Correctness'.........defined

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  • pitdogg2
    pitdogg2 Posts: 24,420
    I picked up a used Hydra8 from @DSkip and yes it did make a difference. I was using a older Monster power/surge strip. I however never plugged in my amps to the Monster but have on the Hydra8. Now if @erniejade would mail the paperwork that went with it I forgot to grab from him at Axpona I might know more about it.
    :D
  • verb
    verb Posts: 10,176
    pitdogg2 wrote: »
    I picked up a used Hydra8 from @DSkip and yes it did make a difference. I was using a older Monster power/surge strip. I however never plugged in my amps to the Monster but have on the Hydra8. Now if @erniejade would mail the paperwork that went with it I forgot to grab from him at Axpona I might know more about it.
    :D

    You're the rascal that snagged it! I was looking at that baby! Nice grab Ivan! :smile:
    Basement: Polk SDA SRS 1.2tl's, Cary SLP-05 Pre with ultimate upgrade,McIntosh MCD301 CD/SACD player, Northstar Designs Excelsio DAC, Cambridge 851N streamer, McIntosh MC300 Amp, Silnote Morpheus Ref2, Series2 Digital Cables, Silnote Morpheus Ref2 Series2 XLR's, Furman 15PFi Power Conditioner, Pangea Power Cables, MIT Shotgun S3 IC's, MIT Shotgun S1 Bi-Wire speaker cables
    Office: PC, EAR Acute CD Player, EAR 834L Pre, Northstar Designs Intenso DAC, Antique Sound Labs AV8 Monoblocks, Denon UDR-F10 Cassette, Acoustic Technologies Classic FR Speakers, SVS SB12 Plus sub, MIT AVt2 speaker cables, IFI Purifier2, AQ Cinnamon USB cable, Groneberg Quatro Reference IC's
    Spare Room: Dayens Ampino Integrated Amp, Tjoeb 99 tube CD player (modified Marantz CD-38), Analysis Plus Oval 9's, Zu Jumpers, AudioEngine B1 Streamer, Klipsch RB-61 v2, SVS PB1000 sub, Blue Jeans RCA IC's, Shunyata Hydra 8 Power Conditioner
    Living Room: Peachtree Nova Integrated, Cambridge CXN v2 Streamer, Rotel RCD-1072 CD player, Furman 15PFi Power Conditioner, Polk RT265 In Wall Speakers, Polk DSW Pro 660wi sub
    Garage #1: Cambridge Audio 640A Integrated Amp, Project Box-E BT Streamer, Polk Tsi200 Bookies, Douglas Speaker Cables, Shunyata Power Conditioner
    Garage #2: Cambridge Audio EVO150 Integrated Amplifier, Polk L200's, Analysis Plus Silver Oval 2 Speaker Cables, IC's TBD.
  • motorstereo
    motorstereo Posts: 2,034
    I received an emi measuring device earlier today and I've been having fun measuring all my power conditioners and my circuits as well. My findings thus far...... my monster 3500 is getting listed on craigslist tomorrow and won't be going to anyone I know, PS audio noise harvesters do actually work to some extent. Belkin conditioners do surprisingly well and my new 83lb Furman 20I reference conditioner all but completely stops emi.
    My advice for a conditioner for $400 would be to keep saving unless you get a smoking deal on an excellent quality used one.
  • verb
    verb Posts: 10,176
    I received an emi measuring device earlier today and I've been having fun measuring all my power conditioners and my circuits as well. My findings thus far...... my monster 3500 is getting listed on craigslist tomorrow and won't be going to anyone I know, PS audio noise harvesters do actually work to some extent. Belkin conditioners do surprisingly well and my new 83lb Furman 20I reference conditioner all but completely stops emi.
    My advice for a conditioner for $400 would be to keep saving unless you get a smoking deal on an excellent quality used one.

    Interesting my man! I would be very interested if you created a thread on this subject! Need to learn! :smile:
    Basement: Polk SDA SRS 1.2tl's, Cary SLP-05 Pre with ultimate upgrade,McIntosh MCD301 CD/SACD player, Northstar Designs Excelsio DAC, Cambridge 851N streamer, McIntosh MC300 Amp, Silnote Morpheus Ref2, Series2 Digital Cables, Silnote Morpheus Ref2 Series2 XLR's, Furman 15PFi Power Conditioner, Pangea Power Cables, MIT Shotgun S3 IC's, MIT Shotgun S1 Bi-Wire speaker cables
    Office: PC, EAR Acute CD Player, EAR 834L Pre, Northstar Designs Intenso DAC, Antique Sound Labs AV8 Monoblocks, Denon UDR-F10 Cassette, Acoustic Technologies Classic FR Speakers, SVS SB12 Plus sub, MIT AVt2 speaker cables, IFI Purifier2, AQ Cinnamon USB cable, Groneberg Quatro Reference IC's
    Spare Room: Dayens Ampino Integrated Amp, Tjoeb 99 tube CD player (modified Marantz CD-38), Analysis Plus Oval 9's, Zu Jumpers, AudioEngine B1 Streamer, Klipsch RB-61 v2, SVS PB1000 sub, Blue Jeans RCA IC's, Shunyata Hydra 8 Power Conditioner
    Living Room: Peachtree Nova Integrated, Cambridge CXN v2 Streamer, Rotel RCD-1072 CD player, Furman 15PFi Power Conditioner, Polk RT265 In Wall Speakers, Polk DSW Pro 660wi sub
    Garage #1: Cambridge Audio 640A Integrated Amp, Project Box-E BT Streamer, Polk Tsi200 Bookies, Douglas Speaker Cables, Shunyata Power Conditioner
    Garage #2: Cambridge Audio EVO150 Integrated Amplifier, Polk L200's, Analysis Plus Silver Oval 2 Speaker Cables, IC's TBD.
  • rpf65
    rpf65 Posts: 2,127
    Depends on your gear. Better gear deserves better conditioning.

    Also depends on what you want to protect. A subwoofer or two, I would use this:

    https://www.amazon.com/SurgeX-SA-20-Standalone-Surge-Eliminator/dp/B00ZPQQMZQ

    Might use it for an amp if I were in an area prone to lightning strikes.

    Currently using a Panamax m4300, because I never had one in my system before, and didn’t know if there would be a benefit. Cleaned up noise that I didn’t know was there. There were a few times that it went into protection mode before the clocks even had time to start flashing. Live close to the end of service on this particular transmission grid, so it works.

    When I bought it, I only had about 1500 worth of gear, counting TV, plugged into it. Have considerably more expensive gear now, and the Panamax is 7 years old, so probably time to research and upgrade in the near future.
  • motorstereo
    motorstereo Posts: 2,034
    verb wrote: »
    Interesting my man! I would be very interested if you created a thread on this subject! Need to learn! :smile:

    I'm still in the learning stage but here's a few other tidbits I've learned today. I've found that the higher current outlets have less emi which surprised me. I've also found that coiling cords doesn't increase emi which again surprised me. Led dimmer switches are atrociously noisy. And dedicated lines with multi-strand wiring has moved way up my list of importance. Next is to start testing cords. If someone is into this hobby at all this is a must have and fun learning tool.
  • BlueFox
    BlueFox Posts: 15,251
    Shunyata. No contest.
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  • indyhawg
    indyhawg Posts: 1,633
    I use a Panamax I bought right here on the forum. It has served me well.
  • verb
    verb Posts: 10,176
    BlueFox wrote: »
    Shunyata. No contest.

    Always loved the Denali's! A tad bit over budget, however! :smile:
    c54jxm3k9rkz.png
    Basement: Polk SDA SRS 1.2tl's, Cary SLP-05 Pre with ultimate upgrade,McIntosh MCD301 CD/SACD player, Northstar Designs Excelsio DAC, Cambridge 851N streamer, McIntosh MC300 Amp, Silnote Morpheus Ref2, Series2 Digital Cables, Silnote Morpheus Ref2 Series2 XLR's, Furman 15PFi Power Conditioner, Pangea Power Cables, MIT Shotgun S3 IC's, MIT Shotgun S1 Bi-Wire speaker cables
    Office: PC, EAR Acute CD Player, EAR 834L Pre, Northstar Designs Intenso DAC, Antique Sound Labs AV8 Monoblocks, Denon UDR-F10 Cassette, Acoustic Technologies Classic FR Speakers, SVS SB12 Plus sub, MIT AVt2 speaker cables, IFI Purifier2, AQ Cinnamon USB cable, Groneberg Quatro Reference IC's
    Spare Room: Dayens Ampino Integrated Amp, Tjoeb 99 tube CD player (modified Marantz CD-38), Analysis Plus Oval 9's, Zu Jumpers, AudioEngine B1 Streamer, Klipsch RB-61 v2, SVS PB1000 sub, Blue Jeans RCA IC's, Shunyata Hydra 8 Power Conditioner
    Living Room: Peachtree Nova Integrated, Cambridge CXN v2 Streamer, Rotel RCD-1072 CD player, Furman 15PFi Power Conditioner, Polk RT265 In Wall Speakers, Polk DSW Pro 660wi sub
    Garage #1: Cambridge Audio 640A Integrated Amp, Project Box-E BT Streamer, Polk Tsi200 Bookies, Douglas Speaker Cables, Shunyata Power Conditioner
    Garage #2: Cambridge Audio EVO150 Integrated Amplifier, Polk L200's, Analysis Plus Silver Oval 2 Speaker Cables, IC's TBD.
  • dromunds
    dromunds Posts: 9,960
    I just dropped in to see what condition my power conditioner was in
  • verb
    verb Posts: 10,176
    Nice review Joe! That Niagara sure is a beauty! End game piece too! :smile:
    Basement: Polk SDA SRS 1.2tl's, Cary SLP-05 Pre with ultimate upgrade,McIntosh MCD301 CD/SACD player, Northstar Designs Excelsio DAC, Cambridge 851N streamer, McIntosh MC300 Amp, Silnote Morpheus Ref2, Series2 Digital Cables, Silnote Morpheus Ref2 Series2 XLR's, Furman 15PFi Power Conditioner, Pangea Power Cables, MIT Shotgun S3 IC's, MIT Shotgun S1 Bi-Wire speaker cables
    Office: PC, EAR Acute CD Player, EAR 834L Pre, Northstar Designs Intenso DAC, Antique Sound Labs AV8 Monoblocks, Denon UDR-F10 Cassette, Acoustic Technologies Classic FR Speakers, SVS SB12 Plus sub, MIT AVt2 speaker cables, IFI Purifier2, AQ Cinnamon USB cable, Groneberg Quatro Reference IC's
    Spare Room: Dayens Ampino Integrated Amp, Tjoeb 99 tube CD player (modified Marantz CD-38), Analysis Plus Oval 9's, Zu Jumpers, AudioEngine B1 Streamer, Klipsch RB-61 v2, SVS PB1000 sub, Blue Jeans RCA IC's, Shunyata Hydra 8 Power Conditioner
    Living Room: Peachtree Nova Integrated, Cambridge CXN v2 Streamer, Rotel RCD-1072 CD player, Furman 15PFi Power Conditioner, Polk RT265 In Wall Speakers, Polk DSW Pro 660wi sub
    Garage #1: Cambridge Audio 640A Integrated Amp, Project Box-E BT Streamer, Polk Tsi200 Bookies, Douglas Speaker Cables, Shunyata Power Conditioner
    Garage #2: Cambridge Audio EVO150 Integrated Amplifier, Polk L200's, Analysis Plus Silver Oval 2 Speaker Cables, IC's TBD.
  • motorstereo
    motorstereo Posts: 2,034
    Thanks for the well written review Joe and it sounds like you've got a great unit and you're hooked on quality power conditioning to. I can also echo your sentiments about spending that much on power conditioning as I was apprehensive in my situation as well to say the least.
    I see you like your Linn mono's running through it. I'm wondering how much current they draw? Reason I ask is twice I've tried running my Mac mono's though my 80amp reserve current Furman and I found I prefer them on their own 20 amp circuits from the wall both times. Perhaps the 3rd time will be a charm? I'm also thinking I'm somewhat prejudiced in thinking the pc may inhibit dynamics even though that's more than likely not the case with so much reserve current.
  • joecoulson
    joecoulson Posts: 4,943
    I actually have PS Audio M700 mono’s on it now. They are class D so maybe they pull differently than the Mac gear ( currentl draw)
    I will test the theory of enough current with the SVS when I finally settle on a power cable.
  • jflail2
    jflail2 Posts: 2,868
    Lots of good feedback here, thanks gents. A few follow up tid bits:

    1.) Gear currently connected includes a 65" 4K tv, denon receiver, PS4, home theater PC, amp, and Rti 10's and CSi3 connected to the amp. I was torn on the amp being connected directly to the wall or not as I'd prefer it be protected, but am under the impression it would do better connected directly to the wall.

    2.) Yes, the Niagra and Denali both sound nice, but both are well beyond my price range. Heck of a review on that Denali though Joe; great insight.

    3.) Based on the consensus here, I'm going to avoid Monster going forward. Right now it's sounding like I'd want to go new, and Panamax is the best brand bang for my buck. Looks like I could get a Furman Elite for $5-600 and a good Panamax for about $4-450. Leaning towards the Panamax unless there's a material fan base for the Furman Elite.
    2007 Club Polk Football Pool Champ

    2010 Club Polk Fantasy Football Champ

    2011 Club Polk Football Pool Champ


    "It's like a koala bear crapped a rainbow in my brain!"
  • scubalab
    scubalab Posts: 3,101
    joecoulson wrote: »
    I started a home theater build out about 14 years ago and picked up a Monster HTS2600 MKii (that consequently went to someone on here in a Karma).

    Joe, I was the winner of that karma! Thanks again!! Although I did not notice any audible differences when I added the Monster to the setup, I do sleep better at night knowing my modest 2-channel rig (Vincent integrated, Yamaha CDP, Lounge Audio LCR phono pre, and Audio Technica LP-120 TT) is protected from surges. I'm not a fan or supporter of Monster stuff, but it's definitely a well-built piece of equipment and does what I need it to do.

    I use a Panamax M5300-PM PC in our home theater. Everything but my amps run through it. It's a nice power conditioner and is hard to beat for the price (usually around $400). Again, I don't notice any audible improvements with it, but it does stabilize the voltage and prevent surges.
  • joecoulson
    joecoulson Posts: 4,943
    That’s right scuba! Forgot it was you :)
    Yes the surges for our connected equipment is probably paramount to this whole conversation. Lord knows I don’t want to have an insurance claim for my rig. They would hang up on me.
  • Polkitup2
    Polkitup2 Posts: 1,618
    Just received an Audioquest 1200 today. Nice looking unit that will work well for my current and future placement needs. I'll post some comments after the recommended 2 week break in period.

    hpdadtljzafa.jpg

  • joecoulson
    joecoulson Posts: 4,943
    Congrats Bro!!!
  • joecoulson
    joecoulson Posts: 4,943
    So I took a shot at the Monsoon 2m cable and it arrives tomorrow. Will update here on the difference the sub makes when connected to the Niagara for music and then movies.
  • Clipdat
    Clipdat Posts: 12,526
    edited May 2019
    What considerations prompted you to choose the AQ Monsoon over Amazon Basics?