Building a pair of Polk Monitor 10's

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Comments

  • willwillywillwilly Posts: 185
    Got it. I''m buying new drivers a
    Remove the Polyswitch, bump the resistor value to 2.5 ohms, and solder the lead across the gap where the Polyswitch used to be.

    I'm buying new drivers and would like to try the 198 tweeter. What MW driver should I ask for...
    Will I am
  • westmassguywestmassguy Posts: 6,721
    The Monitor 7s use the MW6502 4 ohm woofer. The crossover you show in the photo uses the SL2000 Tweeter. The replacement is the RDO-194-1. If you want to use the RDO-198-1, the crossover must be modified. Follow this schematic: https://us.v-cdn.net/5021930/uploads/attachments/4/6/7/2/8/18767.pdf
    Home Theater/2 Channel:
    Front: SDA-2ATL forum.polkaudio.com/discussion/143984/my-2as-finally-finished-almost/p1
    Center: Custom Built forum.polkaudio.com/discussion/150760/my-center-channel-project/p1
    Surrounds & Rears: Custom Built forum.polkaudio.com/discussion/151647/my-surround-project/p1
    Sonicaps, Mills, RDO-194s-198s, Dynamat, Hurricane Nuts, Blackhole5
    Pioneer Elite VSX-72TXV, Carver PM-600, SVS PB2-Plus Subwoofer
    Cables: Speaker: Furez 10/2 with GLS Locking Banana Plugs
    Interconnect: Furez 10/2 with SpeakONs
    ICs: Custom Furez by Douglas Connections
    Den:
    Bose 901 Series II Continentals Restored, Re-Built Equalizer with Elna Silmic IIs, Sonicaps, and Silver Mica Caps
    Carver CT-3 Pre, Carver C-500

    dhsspeakerservice.com/
    Exclusive Distributor of Gimpod's Custom SDA Circuit Boards

    "And keep her under 70, would you, huh? Betty likes a slow ride"
  • willwillywillwilly Posts: 185
    The Monitor 7s use the MW6502 4 ohm woofer. The crossover you show in the photo uses the SL2000 Tweeter. The replacement is the RDO-194-1. If you want to use the RDO-198-1, the crossover must be modified. Follow this schematic: https://us.v-cdn.net/5021930/uploads/attachments/4/6/7/2/8/18767.pdf

    Got it. Thanks
    Will I am
  • willwillywillwilly Posts: 185
    edited May 2016
    Well, the weekend again and I think I can call this project done. I have one last task to recess the tweeters. Up to now I had surface mounted the RDO-194-1 tweeters. This was ok but gave the project an unfinished look.

    The tweeter has a very small lip. I didn't want to recess the entire tweeter but I knew making a recess to fit the lip was going to take a very precise template that I do not have the ability to create.

    ryqkf22ia1r3.jpg

    A very nice forum member (deucekazoo) contacted me and said he could make me a template for the sl2000. He cut out a couple trials, one exactly the same size and another that was slightly larger than the lip. After a couple trials, the template that was just a bit larger worked well.
    0s1292a9b8os.jpg

    3v0gd9fwr8dw.jpg

    Using the router with the prescribed collar and bit, I cut a recess the same thickness as lip, 5/32" or just over 1/8" deep.

    The tweeter was tight but better tight than loose. They turned out great.

    bsbr7vcylzeg.jpg

    So if you are in need of a templet for the SL 2000/RDO 194-1 Tweeter, drop a line to deucekazoo. I'm sure he can fix you up for a fee. I'm putting mine in my template drawer for the next pair of tweeters.
    This was my first DIY speaker project. My initial concept was flawed and I want to thank all the members that guided me to a great pair of speakers. I had one forum member ask what would I do different if I did this again...

    First, I will not do this project again. This was a blast but this took more weekends than I have for a pair of speakers. I have learned a great deal about how speakers function, what makes one speaker better than another, and most importantly what not to do: So let me share some mistakes I made, lessons I learned and what is next.

    First, what is different in my project than the originals.

    The box is made from MDF not particle board.
    The front and back are 1" thickness, the sides 3/4". The originals are 3/4" all around.
    My tweeters are 1" higher than the originals to give room for a horizontal brace above (and below) the drivers for stability.
    The originals have a "baffle/support" that sits between the drivers and runs from the back to the front. I would say this is more for support for the weakest part of the front, but could also separate the drivers. Mine do not have this baffle because I put my crossovers in the wrong location behind the drivers. The original Crossovers are behind the PR.
    I used 1/8" real wood veneer for aesthetics. The originals have a vinyl wrap.

    Now for the next projects:

    Though these are beautiful, I would not use wood veneer on my next pair of DIY's. Mainly because of cost and effort. I have done it once but I will use a quality textured vinyl wrap on the next pair and concentrate more on the sound than the aesthetics.
    I highly recommend the purchase of new drivers and tweeters. Vintage is nice but you risk ending up with drivers at different stages of degradation. In my case, I have had to replace one MW6503 with a MW6510. It does make a difference. Though one driver did lock up on me due to mishandling, another has a dragging issue and can sound bad at higher volumes. So buy new drivers.
    Don't get creative with the sound batting, you will only diminish the sound. Keep it original.
    If you update the crossovers, understand there is a burn-in period. I was so disappointed when I first heard the speakers but now after 30-40 hours of playing, they are incredible.
    I have also come to the conclusion that Monitor 10's are great speakers but I am looking forward to finishing the 7's. There is a definite opinion that 10's have some flaws. I have a pair of 5's and have always loved them. I compared them to my new Monitor 10's, they are respectable and with a little work, they could be just as good as the 10's
    And lastly: Don't post a picture of your audio system on an audiophile forum. They will rip you a new one...

    So, again, thank you all for your help. I am so very pleased with the results and these speakers are incredible! They sound better than the originals and have become the flagship of my collection. I do plan on making original grills but for now, I'm going to run them naked and free!

    Will i am ;)
    Post edited by willwilly on
    Will I am
  • polrbehrpolrbehr Posts: 2,648
    Impressed the Hell out of me, that's for sure.
    Not just for the build quality, but for the fact that you were intelligent enough to
    recognize that most people are here to help out; there are countless people who have less than 20 posts and are never heard from again because they get all bent out of shape.
    Thanks for sharing your experiences with this build.
    So, are you willing to put forth a little effort or are you happy sitting in your skeptical poo pile?


    http://audiomilitia.proboards.com/
  • mikeyb128mikeyb128 Posts: 2,887
    polrbehr wrote: »
    Impressed the Hell out of me, that's for sure.
    Not just for the build quality, but for the fact that you were intelligent enough to
    recognize that most people are here to help out; there are countless people who have less than 20 posts and are never heard from again because they get all bent out of shape.
    Thanks for sharing your experiences with this build.

    Perfectly described. I've been following this from the start, I have nowhere near the knowledge of other members to comment. You took the guidance and constructive Critisism like a champ, without getting your panties In a knot. Those speakers are gorgeous. Hope you have some spare weekends to enjoy them.
    2 channel:
    Bryston 4B3, Bryston BDA3, Cary SLP05, Shanling CDT1000SE with parts conneXion level 2 mods, Nottingham analogue ace space 294, soundsmith Carmen MKii, Zu DL103 MKii, Ortofon MC 20 MKii, Dynavector XX2 MKii, Rogue Audio Ares, Core power technologies balanced power conditioner, Akiko Corelli power conditioner with Akiko Audio HQ power cable, Nordost heimdall 2, Frey 2, interconnects, speaker and power cables, Focal Electra 1028 BE 2, Auralic Aries Femto, Black diamond racing cones, ingress audio level 1 roller blocks, JL Audio E110 with Auralic subdude, Primacoustics room treatments.
    Theater:
    Focal Aria 926,905,CC900, SVS PB ultra x2. Pioneer Elite SC85, Oppo BDP93, Panamax M5400PM, Minix neox6, Nordost Blue heaven LS power cables.

  • westmassguywestmassguy Posts: 6,721
    Your woodworking skills are excellent. The rest will come in time. I'd re-think the veneer on the 7s. I think you'll find them to be more impressive than the 10s when completed.
    Home Theater/2 Channel:
    Front: SDA-2ATL forum.polkaudio.com/discussion/143984/my-2as-finally-finished-almost/p1
    Center: Custom Built forum.polkaudio.com/discussion/150760/my-center-channel-project/p1
    Surrounds & Rears: Custom Built forum.polkaudio.com/discussion/151647/my-surround-project/p1
    Sonicaps, Mills, RDO-194s-198s, Dynamat, Hurricane Nuts, Blackhole5
    Pioneer Elite VSX-72TXV, Carver PM-600, SVS PB2-Plus Subwoofer
    Cables: Speaker: Furez 10/2 with GLS Locking Banana Plugs
    Interconnect: Furez 10/2 with SpeakONs
    ICs: Custom Furez by Douglas Connections
    Den:
    Bose 901 Series II Continentals Restored, Re-Built Equalizer with Elna Silmic IIs, Sonicaps, and Silver Mica Caps
    Carver CT-3 Pre, Carver C-500

    dhsspeakerservice.com/
    Exclusive Distributor of Gimpod's Custom SDA Circuit Boards

    "And keep her under 70, would you, huh? Betty likes a slow ride"
  • willwillywillwilly Posts: 185
    Your woodworking skills are excellent. The rest will come in time. I'd re-think the veneer on the 7s. I think you'll find them to be more impressive than the 10s when completed.

    Thank you all for the comments. It's been a long but very enjoyable road.

    Westmassguy, I want to especially thank you. Your advise has been concise, polite and extremely helpful. I'm now listening to studio recordings of Chopin with the Yamaha Natural Sound Receiver and just the new 10's. Oh My! I'm hooked. I'm almost through all my favorite CD'S and I can't help but grin and try to find ways to make my listen experience even better. In time...

    The 7 boxes are already made just like the 10's so I will eventually have those to compare. I think they will be even better with an updated crossover, and new components.

    sohixa13w9d6.jpg

    All they lack is about 20 hours of sanding, finishing, and about $400 worth of parts. I'll post the build when I can get to the project. Maybe in the fall. I'm starting to accumulate the parts, spreading out the costs... I may want you to build my crossovers!

    I still have four Dayton classic paper drivers and tweeters. I think I'm going to use those for some bookshelf speakers an give them out as gifts. That's where I'll use the vinyl.

    Thanks again and I'll be around.
    Will I am
  • willwillywillwilly Posts: 185
    I have to admit one major improvement, setting the tweeters not only made the install look professional, but the bass came alive. I must have had air leaks which is very likely since I didn't use a seal until I made the final recessed installation.

    I'm close to getting rid of the equalizer. I'm not far from neutral on all frequencies, still adding a little bass and reducing the mids. These tweeters are awesome. I look forward to RDO-198's in the sevens.
    Will I am
  • heiney9heiney9 Posts: 24,148
    The RD0 tweeters are a huge improvement over the SLxxx series. Not many manufacturers support products 20-30 years old but Polk R & D'd those to improve them while still making them electrically equivalent.

    Enjoy

    H9
    "Appreciation of audio is a completely subjective human experience. Measurements can provide a measure of insight, but are no substitute for human judgment. Why are we looking to reduce a subjective experience to objective criteria anyway? The subtleties of music and audio reproduction are for those who appreciate it. Differentiation by numbers is for those who do not".--Nelson Pass

    Pass Aleph 30 | EE Avant Pre | EE Mini Max Plus DAC | MIT Shotgun S3 | MIT Z P/C's | updated SDA 1C| SQ Box Touch/Welbourne Labs P/S- Tubes add soul!
  • NightfallNightfall Posts: 9,297
    edited May 2016
    willwilly wrote: »
    I'm close to getting rid of the equalizer. I'm not far from neutral on all frequencies, still adding a little bass and reducing the mids.

    Awesome. I hear the Blackhole 5 mod helps reduce the shouty midrange at louder volumes.
    afterburnt wrote: »
    They didn't speak a word of English, they were from South Carolina.

    Village Idiot of Club Polk
  • leftwinger57leftwinger57 Posts: 2,918
    Will, I have no idea how those sound but the wood working looks fantastic and flawless. Over at AK a similar project was proposed ,this time JBL studio monitors and to be mass produced. This guy had no idea what he was getting into and to a man shot him down w/o mercy. Here you weathered the verbal storm, changed and perfected your design features and took some advice along the way. Most all here say SDAs can not be reproduced w/o any monetary returns and not worth the effort. Here you take the monitor line and looks like did the M 10s some justice. What needs to be done if you even care is to meter and do an a-b blind test w/ stock originals and see which bests out. I never heard 10s but do own '78 M7s w/ x-overs redone by Dave. Did you finally tally up what that set cost you with not even counting your labor or sweat equity ?
    2chl- Adcom GFA- 555-Onkyo P-3150v pre/amp- JVC-QL-A200 tt- Denon 1940 ci cdp- Adcom GFS-6 -Modded '87 SDA 2Bs - Dynamat Ext.- BH-5- X-Overs VR-3, RDO-194 tweeters, Larry's Rings, Speakon/Neutrik I/C- Cherry stain tops Advent Maestros,Ohm model E

    H/T- Toshiba au40" flat- Yamaha RX- V665 avr- YSD-11 Dock- I-Pod- Klipsch #400HD Speaker set-

    Bdrm- Nikko 6065 receiver- JBL -G-200s--Pioneer 305 headphones--Sony CE375-5 disc
  • westmassguywestmassguy Posts: 6,721
    You're welcome. Enjoy those puppies.
    Home Theater/2 Channel:
    Front: SDA-2ATL forum.polkaudio.com/discussion/143984/my-2as-finally-finished-almost/p1
    Center: Custom Built forum.polkaudio.com/discussion/150760/my-center-channel-project/p1
    Surrounds & Rears: Custom Built forum.polkaudio.com/discussion/151647/my-surround-project/p1
    Sonicaps, Mills, RDO-194s-198s, Dynamat, Hurricane Nuts, Blackhole5
    Pioneer Elite VSX-72TXV, Carver PM-600, SVS PB2-Plus Subwoofer
    Cables: Speaker: Furez 10/2 with GLS Locking Banana Plugs
    Interconnect: Furez 10/2 with SpeakONs
    ICs: Custom Furez by Douglas Connections
    Den:
    Bose 901 Series II Continentals Restored, Re-Built Equalizer with Elna Silmic IIs, Sonicaps, and Silver Mica Caps
    Carver CT-3 Pre, Carver C-500

    dhsspeakerservice.com/
    Exclusive Distributor of Gimpod's Custom SDA Circuit Boards

    "And keep her under 70, would you, huh? Betty likes a slow ride"
  • willwillywillwilly Posts: 185
    Did you finally tally up what that set cost you with not even counting your labor or sweat equity ?

    MDF, veneer, crossovers, drivers, tweeters... $615. But probably more like $750 for all new drivers...

    I would love to do a side by side blind test with an original. If anyone would like to donate a pair, I certainly will not object to thoroughly testing.
    Will I am
  • pkquatpkquat Posts: 719
    DSkip wrote: »
    Will, you've been exceptional through this process and I commend you. You are a rarity in these parts and it's been a real joy watching this come to fruition.

    Very well said. I'd nominate this thread to become an announcement or sticky. There is lots of good information, answers to common questions, and good feedback from @willwilly. The speakers do look amazing, "a most excellent job." I do hope you veneer the M7's, possibly in something exotic. The 7's hold a special place in many polk and non polk fans. But its not my money, so I know how that goes. If you wrap them, I'd still vote for something stunning, but not too crazy.
    willwilly wrote: »
    I'm close to getting rid of the equalizer. I'm not far from neutral on all frequencies, still adding a little bass and reducing the mids. These tweeters are awesome. I look forward to RDO-198's in the sevens.

    I'd hate to take you down the rabbit hole, but if you can find a decent set of separates, or mostly a good separate amp, I think you will be amazed at the bass difference it makes. Sometimes the bass doesn't seem much louder per se, but it has much more impact and all the music is more detailed. As I mentioned previously, you start hearing things you may never have noticed before. It becomes even easier to isolate different sounds.

    Most of all, I'm glad things are turning out well, and you're seeing the fruits of your labor and the advice. Thank you for the thread. :)

  • K_MK_M Posts: 1,617
    edited May 2016
    F1nut wrote: »
    I see some good advice, mixed in with a lot of tired generalizations, and unless they are sitting in your garage listening with you, very doubtful to even guess as to what you are hearing there.

    Doubtful for you maybe. Don't speak for the rest of us.

    Please KEEP me on Ignore, as you said you had done in a previous post.
    Unless your motive is to simply bicker with select posters for unknown reasons.

    I have done the same with you, now keep to what you said, PLEASE


    Lsi15, Lsi9, LsiC,Rta11t,M5jr+,M4, SDA SRS 2.3TL, Rti6....Still listing stuff, a work in progress.
    B+W-Sold
    Electro Voice EV-SIX
    Infinity-Sold
    Advent-Now gone
    Yamaha A-S801
    Yamaha RX-V377
    Yamaha RX-A860
    Yamaha RX-A3060
    Harman Kardon Hk-350i
    Harman Kardon Hk-........
    Harman Kardon PM-665
    Harman Kardon HK-775
    Pioneer.......Stereo Receiver

  • F1nutF1nut Posts: 45,054
    Please KEEP me on Ignore, as you said you had done in a previous post.
    Unless your motive is to simply bicker with select posters for unknown reasons.

    I changed my mind as I could not let you run around here dishing out misinformation any longer.

    Deal with it or not, I don't care.

    Political Correctness'.........defined

    "A doctrine fostered by a delusional, illogical minority and rabidly promoted by an unscrupulous mainstream media, which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible to pick up a t-u-r-d by the clean end."


    President of Club Polk

  • codycatalistcodycatalist Posts: 2,675
    willwilly wrote: »
    And lastly: Don't post a picture of your audio system on an audiophile forum. They will rip you a new one...
    Will i am ;)

    With your EQs turned up all the way in every frequency that can happen haha! I am VERY impressed with your project and how it turned out. I'm sure you will be a very good fit around these parts.
    Just a dude doing dude-ly things

    "Temptation is the manifestation of desire which equals necessity." - Mikey081057
    " I have always had a champange taste with a beer budget" - Rick88
    "Just because the thread is getting views don't mean much .. I like a good train wreck doesn't mean i want to be in one..." - pitdogg2
    "Those that don't know, don't know that they don't know." - heiney9
    "Audiophiles are the male equivalent of cat ladies." - Audiokarma Member
  • willwillywillwilly Posts: 185
    https://g.co/kgs/srJG3

    Sunday Morning listening on M10's. Wow.
    Will I am
  • Gunther16Gunther16 Posts: 245
    One small question, while you were building these fabulous cabinets did you also seal them internally? You mentioned air leaks somewhere in a past post. PS they look fantastic, great work. Enjoy the fruits of your labor.
  • willwillywillwilly Posts: 185
    Nothing other than all the joints are glued with biscuits. The only air leak I had was the tweeter before recessing.
    Will I am
  • willwillywillwilly Posts: 185
    edited May 2016
    When playing around with a rescued pair of 5's, I have to admit the lobing issue from side by side drivers is evident to me now. The tens sound much better but the "imaging", using this word lightly since I'm just starting to recognize what it is, is muttled compared to the fives.

    I look forward to my sevens.

    33qt4iilu9db.jpg


    Will I am
  • willwillywillwilly Posts: 185
    edited May 2016
    Conclusion:

    I have had a wonderful time with this project. It has inspired more ideas and other possibilities.

    My initial idea was to build a nice pair of speakers I fell in love with many years ago. A familiar story.

    I have played all my music through these twice. I have hit my favorites many times more. I have compared them with other Monitors: Played with sub woofers, surrounds, receivers, equalizer...

    After all that, I am very comfortable knowing I recognized a good pair of speakers in the day. I compared everything to them, never owning a pair.

    But,

    What I have learned, Monitor 10's are great speakers, the speakers you roll out for the 4th of July patio party, Barn dances or Church socials. Great for the shop, Jazz, Piano, Classical, Pop, ROCK, They will project! I have mine with a vintage Polk sub, A simple integrated 100w receiver in a high ceiling shop, Perfect for rock'n while you're drin... working.

    But I've been ruined forever. Ruined like the day a friend made concentrate on the laugh track most sitcoms use, letting you know when to laugh.

    Imagining is lost in 10's, it's there but nothing like single driver Monitors. They would be fine in the living room but for real sit down, good listening speakers, I can do better but stay Vintage.

    Live and learn. On to 7's

    Will I am
  • willwillywillwilly Posts: 185
    Still going strong!
    Will I am
  • BlueBirdMusicBlueBirdMusic Registered User Posts: 1,275
    Will I am,
    Thanks for bumping this thread. I had not seen it previously, and so I binged on it this morning. Thoroughly enjoyed all of it. Your speakers are fantastic!

    Learning from the experience of others is perhaps the most difficult thing to accept and accomplish. You succeeded 100%.

    Harry here,
    in Marietta GA,
    If the telephone doesn't ring ......... it's me
    Harry / Marietta Georgia
  • BlueBirdMusicBlueBirdMusic Registered User Posts: 1,275
    Will,
    I saw these Monitor 10B's on Craigslist Atlanta this morning. They have original boxes and the stands. I don't remember your talking about stands for your "masterpieces".

    https://atlanta.craigslist.org/atl/ele/5982191957.html

    zkspps1k8aeb.jpg


    If the telephone doesn't ring ......... it's me
    Harry / Marietta Georgia
  • willwillywillwilly Posts: 185
    I have yet to make stands since my speakers are mounted in my shop about head level. A relatively simple build that I plan on doing for my M7 set in the house, now my favorite speakers...
    Will I am
  • willwillywillwilly Posts: 185
    That seems like a decent deal. A good base for upgraded X-overs, new tweeters...
    Will I am
  • VR3VR3 Posts: 23,972
    This was an excellent build! :)
    - Not Tom

    "No, that's silly talk. Dude, you can't possibly be this audio dumb so quit the act." - Doro
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