Is there ANYPLACE left to smoke in peace!!!
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They are buildings open to the public, therefore they aren't private. There's lots of things that you can't do in public already, this is just another. Restaurants have regulation upon regulation they already have to deal with... it's not like you can open a restaurant (or any other business open to the public) and just do whatever the hell you want with it. Removing smoking just hits home with a lot of people because it's taking away something they could recently do. And yes, we in MA know best, so listen up
Wrong, unless you're a Socialist.
You own your home just like a business owner owns his business, unless they've gone public (stock, etc, where a group of shareholders have a say in electing the people who run the company).
They are not public buildings. Just because government has overstepped it's bounds on so many things doesn't make what they're doing right.
Own something sometime and then come back here and tell me that Joe Schmoe and some government airbag should have the right to tell you how to operate it.
Former smoker here. I'm not on some crusade to force others to quit. That should be a choice since it's a legal product. Got a problem with cigarettes? Ban them. Do you ever ask yourself why your "do-gooder" government officials won't go for that? Tax revenue, that's why. Ain't got a damn thing to do with health -- it's all about power and money. -
Whole lotta me, me, me 'round here.
Some of you don't seem to remember Prohibition. Look it up, the Gov't knows what's best for you. Don't think it'll happen again.....you're fooling yourself.
Phil, your comments disappoint me.
Sorry bro, I wasn't looking to dissapoint anyone. It's just that it's some really nasty stuff that I just don't want to be around for health reasons. Believe it or not, I can tolerate it if I'm in a smokers home...after all it is their castle. It just doesn't belong in public spaces where I have no escape route. Nothing like sitting down in a restaurant now & actually smelling the food & not stale smoky air."2 Channel & 11.2 HT "Two Channel:Magnepan LRSSchiit Audio Freya S - SS preConsonance Ref 50 - Tube preParasound HALO A21+ 2 channel ampBluesound NODE 2i streameriFi NEO iDSD DAC Oppo BDP-93KEF KC62 sub Home Theater:Full blown 11.2 set up. -
One of the reasons for the ban is an employee at a bar ect had to breathe that toxic air the whole time they are at work. Unsafe work environment. Banning smoking outdoors doesnt follow that logic. My parents smoke and every time we visit we get sick 2 days later. I guess we arent tough enough to handle it.Main system: Lyngdorf TDAI 2170 w/ Pioneer 42" plazma-> Polk LSiM 703 w/Tivo, Marantz tuner, BRPTT: Nothingham Spacedeck-> Pioneer PL L1000 linear arm-> Soundsmith DL 103R-> SUT->Bottlehead ErosDigital: I3 PC w/ Jriver playing flac -> Sonore Ultrarendu -> Twisted Pair Audio ESS 9028 w/ Mercury IVY Vinyl rips: ESI Juli@24/192-> i3 PC server
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One of the reasons for the ban is an employee at a bar ect had to breathe that toxic air the whole time they are at work. Unsafe work environment. Banning smoking outdoors doesnt follow that logic. My parents smoke and every time we visit we get sick 2 days later. I guess we arent tough enough to handle it.
What did a person get a gob at a bar for if they can't handle the smoke? If you can't handle heat don't work in the kitchen. If your afraid of heights don't be an iron worker....
Open 2 identical bars. One smoking, and one non smoking. Guess which one stays open? I can see stopping it in restaurants, but bars? Private clubs?Please. Please contact me a ben62670 @ yahoo.com. Make sure to include who you are, and you are from Polk so I don't delete your email. Also I am now physically unable to work on any projects. If you need help let these guys know. There are many people who will help if you let them know where you are.
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I don't have a problem with banning smoking in a public (ie govt ) place. However, I think that it's a slippery slope. Restaurants and particularly bars, I think it's going overboard. Let the market decide. If people want nonsmoking bars and restaurants, let them vote with thier wallets.
Again, not a big smoking fan but I sorta agree with Demi, the govt wants to ban smoking everywhere but doesn't want to get it's nose out of the trough of tobacco tax money.....
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It would not bother me if smoking was banned 100%."Just because youre offended doesnt mean youre right." - Ricky Gervais
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Sadly enough, some of the same guys that want to ban tobacco
are all for smoking the other stuff. Go figure!"The legitimate powers of government extend to such acts only as are injurious to others. But it does me no injury for my neighbour to say there are twenty gods, or no god. It neither picks my pocket nor breaks my leg." --Thomas Jefferson -
I believe you should be able to do whatever you want as long as you're not causing harm to someone else. Where Maryland takes the crown for BS regulations in regards to the smoking ban is their enforcement on anti-loitering laws outside of bars. They've been giving out citations to people who stand within 150 ft of a bar who go out for a smoke. In addition, a bar/restaurant owner is not allowed to have even a patio that has any protection around it for patrons who need to go outside to light up.
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Banning smoking from restaurants i can maybe understand, but bars.... you got to be kidding me. I don't smoke and really never had(i did for about a month in high school and said screw it), and I'm also the person who hates coming home from a bar smelling like smoke. But I understand that this is a bar, A place where people come from a hard days work to have a good time. Its also a private business, and the owner should choose if there is smoking or not. You are not going to get lung cancer by going to a bar every once in a while and if you are really worried you are, you really shouldn't be going to a bar in the first place.AVR: H/K AVR240
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Why would you want to smoke in the first place? There's really NO good reason to, especially when you consider the consequences.
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People do lots of things we don't all understand. Just because you don't get it or it's bad for you doesn't mean it should be outlawed.If you will it, dude, it is no dream.
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fact of the matter is, it's proven fact that second hand smoke has serious health hazzards to others. there is a 2 edge sword as to why things have come to this.
a)smokers, on occasion, can be rude with the smoke. believe me, if there was a non smoking bar, at least one douschemonkey would light up and not give a crap and you smokers know it (if not more). it would never work. If I had a dollar for every time I had to tell a smoker to stop smoking in an area designated as not smoking, I'd be rich. while smokers complied with my request because I'm a 300+ lb gorilla, I have seen them to tell others to go eff themselves while standing under a non smoking sign puffing away.
b) (and this is a big one) bar and restaraunt owners could have invested a bit on smoke control. if they did, this **** would have never hapenned. having a seperate smoking area would have been good. and would some smokeeaters and ventilation have killed anyone? I can take some smoke, I lived with 2 parents that smoked, but when I walk into a bar or club and cant tell if its smokers haze or the f^&king building is on fire, then mr business owner is a jackwad....plain and simple.
apparently, due to human nature, things werent done the right and reasonable way. Therefore, if we figure a person's right to not die of lung cancer through no volition of his own FAR outwieghs someone's right to smoke without walking out a door to do so (and god forbid putting on a jacket and not whine like spoiled schoolgirl) we have smoking bans.
oh, and by the by, if people actually want to smoke despite paying RIDICULOUS taxes to do so, then its the smokers fault.....not the government. When your addicted to something, people will always exploit you. Drugs? your a drug dealers ****. Smoke? the government will bang you without the courtesy of a reach around. Twinkies and Ho Ho's? your either a slave to excersize or immobility (or both..lol
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good...it's a disgusting habit that affects other people...not just the smoker.
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As much as I can't stand smoking on a personal level, I think they went overboard when they included bars in the mix. I mean since the first bar opened its doors you knew there was going to be certain things inside....booze...smoking...and people looking to get laid
There is NO reason they cant have smoking ok bars ( Where employee's sign that they are aware this is a smoking allowed enviroment and any negatives associated with smoking hazards are up front and accepted by the employee )...as well as non-smoking bars.
Both types of bars would be well stocked with paying customers...so WTF is the problem with having both available ?
Here in CA , where the hammer has probably fallen the hardest....the hundreds of Indian Casino's are exempt....people are smoking away...thing is the ventilation systems are are so damn good its never that bad ( The casinos realize they need to keep both smokers and non-smokers happy...so they pay for and install good vent systems )The first rule of Fight Club is you don't talk about Fight Club -
a)smokers, on occasion, can be rude with the smoke. believe me, if there was a non smoking bar, at least one douschemonkey would light up and not give a crap and you smokers know it (if not more). it would never work. If I had a dollar for every time I had to tell a smoker to stop smoking in an area designated as not smoking, I'd be rich. while smokers complied with my request because I'm a 300+ lb gorilla, I have seen them to tell others to go eff themselves while standing under a non smoking sign puffing away.
Thats what bouncers are for.....when I was a bouncer smoking was still ok in bars here in CA...but that would be one of their responsibilities nowadays.
Since most regular bars dont have bouncers ( Mine was a strip club ) ...that could be one of the requirements of a non-smoking establishment...a non-smoking enforcer...that is what a bouncer does, throw **** out . You light up in a non-smoking bar...you are an instant ****..out you go.The first rule of Fight Club is you don't talk about Fight Club -
Lou, that was an absolutely outstanding HILARIOUS post!!!! Thank you!Marantz AV-7705 PrePro, Classé 5 channel 200wpc Amp, Oppo 103 BluRay, Rotel RCD-1072 CDP, Sony XBR-49X800E TV, Polk S60 Main Speakers, Polk ES30 Center Channel, Polk S15 Surround Speakers SVS SB12-NSD x2
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Is it all about PC culture ? not so sure this time. IMHO it's more about business owners being terrified by frivolous lawsuit.
-"Hey I was in your store ten years ago and inhaled second hand smoke, while being pregnant,
now my son likes to dress like a woman! you mutated my eggs you ****! I'm gonna sue your **** for two million!"
having recently switched teams (so to speak) I couldn't care less about the smoke ban,
but I believe, that on that subject, today's society rewrote the book on hypocrisy.
Personally? I really do wish all big Tobacco goes belly up. soon. however, because it ain't gonna happen anytime soon and remembering that smokers are ... well ... people,
I can't see the harm in designating well ventilated smoking areas, in restaurants and bars."If the global crisis continues, by the end of the year Only two Banks will be operational, the Blood Bank and the Sperm Bank. Then these 2 banks will merge and it will be called 'The Bloody **** Bank'" -
It's comforting to know that at least a few people know how to think rationally and not selfishly. Well said carpenter.If you will it, dude, it is no dream.
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pearsall001 wrote: »Sorry bro, I wasn't looking to dissapoint anyone. It's just that it's some really nasty stuff that I just don't want to be around for health reasons. Believe it or not, I can tolerate it if I'm in a smokers home...after all it is their castle. It just doesn't belong in public spaces where I have no escape route. Nothing like sitting down in a restaurant now & actually smelling the food & not stale smoky air.
You shouldn't have to come on here and apologize, your entitled to your opinion on here just like everyone else......Testing
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Again, wanting to maintain one's good health is NOT being selfish. Once your health is gone, are you going to make me all better from something that could have been prevented in the first place? I don't think so.
Smoke travels. the designated smoking areas that they tried DON'T WORK! The bar/restaurant owners are not going to spend the money to make their establishments smoke free so the only way to solve the problem is to ban smoking.
You want to drink & smoke, do it at home. You want to eat dinner out, no problem, when your done, pay up, get out & light up! No one is stopping you from smoking, they are simply saying you can't do it where you can pollute everyone elses lungs!bobman1235 wrote: »It's comforting to know that at least a few people know how to think rationally and not selfishly. Well said carpenter.Marantz AV-7705 PrePro, Classé 5 channel 200wpc Amp, Oppo 103 BluRay, Rotel RCD-1072 CDP, Sony XBR-49X800E TV, Polk S60 Main Speakers, Polk ES30 Center Channel, Polk S15 Surround Speakers SVS SB12-NSD x2 -
I personally don't smoke, and as I've said, I enjoy smoke-free bars despite being opposed to the law that created them. If I, like you, had allergies I would avoid places that allowed it. If I was that worried about my health from second-hand smoke in private establishments I would avoid those establishments. If all restaurants allowed it and it bothered you, don't go out to eat. If there were enough people like you, the restaurants would change their policies. If there weren't enough people like you, YOU'RE IN THE MINORITY.
You've got it in your head that you're entitled to go into these places, but you are not. You choose to. Just like those owners chose to put up their money and open up their restaurants and bars, you choose to walk into them. I think everyone's fine with not allowing smoking in actual public buildings that you don't have a choice in entering - courthouses, hospitals, police stations, etc.
What if I were a smoker and had a party at my house. It was an awesome party, you didn't want to miss it, but most of the people there were smokers so it would be a smoky party, and that would bother you. You'd not go, right? Should it be illegal for me to allow smoking in my apartment when I'm having a party, even if everyone entering knows what they're getting into?If you will it, dude, it is no dream. -
bobman1235 wrote: »I personally don't smoke, and as I've said, I enjoy smoke-free bars despite being opposed to the law that created them. If I, like you, had allergies I would avoid places that allowed it. If I was that worried about my health from second-hand smoke in private establishments I would avoid those establishments. If all restaurants allowed it and it bothered you, don't go out to eat. If there were enough people like you, the restaurants would change their policies. If there weren't enough people like you, YOU'RE IN THE MINORITY.
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you're keeping in your head that smoking is merely an inconvenience. it isnt. if I come into your favorite restaraunt and crack you in the skull, you'd complain (as well you should). if my response was "hey, if you dont like it, don't come back" how would you take it? probably not well.
me cracking you in the skull is illegal, as it should be. why? because it harms you physically and we normally...as a society...frown on things that cause a certain amount of hard to others. second hand smoke does that, plain and simple.
I take exception to being called selfish because i dont want to inhale poison into my lungs. call me a selfish ****, but I am a fan of oxygen/air in general.Living Room 2 Channel -
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I don't mean to offend, you're certainly entitled to your viewpoint, I just strongly disagree.
Loud music is damaging to the ears, a legitimate health risk; should all concerts and clubs be required to be under 90 dB?
Pretty much everything sold at McDonalds, barring a salad with no dressing, is bad for you (arguably worse for you than smoking, considering heart disease kills more people than cancer every year), should they have to close their doors forever? Or should people just choose not to go?
And honestly, in your example, if there were a restaurant where it was advertised that when you walked in you'd get punched in the face, would ANYONE go? No, it would go out of business in a week! (or turn into an S&M bar).If you will it, dude, it is no dream. -
I hope that during my lifetime there is a national ban on smoking in any indoor place open to the public. I would also like to see OSHA reopen it's case on air quality in the workplace."Just because youre offended doesnt mean youre right." - Ricky Gervais
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"Consistency requires you to be as ignorant today as you were a year ago." - Bernard Berenson -
And you also seem to have it in your head that smokers are in the majority, which they are not by a long shot.
Smokers are the minority, restaurants wouldn't change their policies for any number of reasons, and laws were changed to accomodate.
Regardless of what you say, a restaurant is open to the public and therefore held to certain standards of responsibility. They can't just do whatever the hell they want because they are a private business. It's unsafe to allow smoking - period.Speakers: Polk LSi15
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Obviously it doesn't matter what I say; almost every state in the nation has a law that bans smoking in these places. My "side" lost the argument, so you can rest happy in the fact that you won and I'm just trying to make people see things in a different light. No matter what I say or what you say the laws are there so don't get all pissy with me.If you will it, dude, it is no dream.
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bobman1235 wrote: »I don't mean to offend, you're certainly entitled to your viewpoint, I just strongly disagree.
no offense at all brotha, the skull cracking was just for example purposes, hope you didnt read anything else into it..LOLbobman1235 wrote: »Loud music is damaging to the ears, a legitimate health risk; should all concerts and clubs be required to be under 90 dB?
no, because the loud music itself is the service all would expect at a concert and a dance club, whereas the smokey haze and miner's lung isn't the primary reason for everyone to go to a restaraunt and barbobman1235 wrote: »Pretty much everything sold at McDonalds, barring a salad with no dressing, is bad for you (arguably worse for you than smoking, considering heart disease kills more people than cancer every year), should they have to close their doors forever? Or should people just choose not to go?
I knew someone was going here. me eating McDonald's hurts me. I am not cramming chicken mcnuggets down anyone's throat against there will (kinda harkes to the skull cracking argument eh). Also, McDonald's food is the primary reason for people to go into McDonald's which nullifies the argument in the same manner as the concert argumentbobman1235 wrote: »And honestly, in your example, if there were a restaurant where it was advertised that when you walked in you'd get punched in the face, would ANYONE go? No, it would go out of business in a week! (or turn into an S&M bar).
valid point, from the standpoint of what I used as an example in my last post. however, if cracking skulls werent ilegal, it would happen ALOT more in many bars and clubsLiving Room 2 Channel -
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Hah, I can't believe it. I am right in line with bobman on this one. To say that there should be NO smoking facilities is just as assinine as saying everywhere should be smoker friendly.
There is talk of even banning smoking in CIGAR STORES in some states. I'm sorry, but there has to be a line drawn somewhere. If the owner chooses to provide a smoking environment, and the patrons are there (in the cigar store case) specifically to smoke, should our govt really have the ability to ban this outright? I'd know going in that there will be smoking, and if it bothers me I just wouldn't go in the 1st place...
I can understand banning it in restaurants without a completely separate smoking section, but to ban it everywhere carte blanche is a bit overboard. I guess big brother does know what's best for all of us though.....2007 Club Polk Football Pool Champ
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In this particular case he does and there is over 50 yrs of medical proof to back him up!
Be my guest & kill yourself, but you shouldn't be allowed to take anyone else with you & little by little you wont be allowed to.Marantz AV-7705 PrePro, Classé 5 channel 200wpc Amp, Oppo 103 BluRay, Rotel RCD-1072 CDP, Sony XBR-49X800E TV, Polk S60 Main Speakers, Polk ES30 Center Channel, Polk S15 Surround Speakers SVS SB12-NSD x2 -
Big Brother (aka federal and state government) is not trying to protect smokers from their own actions...but trying to protect others from the smokers actions. It is a legitimate and reasonable use of federal and state powers IMO."Just because youre offended doesnt mean youre right." - Ricky Gervais
"For those who believe, no proof is necessary. For those who don't believe, no proof is possible." - Stuart Chase
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