Election day.

Options
1235

Comments

  • cfrizz
    cfrizz Posts: 13,415
    edited November 2006
    Options
    ROFLOL!!!:D Ok Mac I can probably go along with this!

    I got worried there for a while since without SS/SSDI picking up the tab, my vegetative brother would be tossed out of the nursing home he resides in since my other brother & I certainly can't afford to pay the cost of it!

    A great many states including MA have put a limit on collecting welfare & it is working wonders!

    It's not just the 30yr olds that have to worry about not collecting SS! I doubt that I will see any of it either & I'm putting as much away as I can into my 401k & mutual funds, cause I'm damn sure not planning on working until age 67!

    MacLeod wrote:
    That would be easy! If I were king the first things I would do would be:

    The National Endowment for the Arts would be the first to go.

    Then the Prescription Drug Program.

    I wouldnt get rid of welfare cause I believe in a safety net but Id put a lifetime limit on it along the lines of 1-2 years.

    These arent entitlements but Id shut down the Department of Education.

    Then privatize airport security again.

    Scrap the bridge to nowhere in Alaska.

    That should free up a few billion dollars that would be much better served in the hands of military familes.

    Then Id eleminate the death tax and the capital gains tax, lower the top marginal rate down to 25% and then start drilling the crap out of Alaska, the Gulf of Mexico and the coast of Kalifornia and fine any business that hires illegal aliens $25,000 a day per alien. Then peace and prosperity would ensue!

    Oh yeah, and I forgot to add, free beer during NASCAR and football and Kate Beckinsale would have to marry me or else Id nuke England! :D
    Marantz AV-7705 PrePro, Classé 5 channel 200wpc Amp, Oppo 103 BluRay, Rotel RCD-1072 CDP, Sony XBR-49X800E TV, Polk S60 Main Speakers, Polk ES30 Center Channel, Polk S15 Surround Speakers SVS SB12-NSD x2
  • krabby5
    krabby5 Posts: 923
    edited November 2006
    Options
    Demiurge wrote:
    Let people save their own money in retirement savings account. There's no reason the government needs their greasy hands on it.

    Do you not see the problem with that statement? Most lower income people wouldn't save...either because of apathy or because they live check to check...

    So what do you suppose we do with those people when they are too old to work?

    I'm more of an independent politically. but in this case so much more money could be put into SS if they just lifted the cap...What's the point of stopping SS deductions once you reach $90k in a given year?
    Pioneer Elite VSX-53, Polk RT800i fronts, Polk CS400i center, FX500i surround, Velodyne sub
  • Demiurge
    Demiurge Posts: 10,874
    edited November 2006
    Options
    I respect your opinion Demi. Thankfully, for my inner joy and contentment, I don't agree with it. Since I have not had the pleasure of your acquaintance, I must rely on your persona projected here. Your rather extreme (no attack, just a personal observation) viewpoint doesn't outwardly seem to bring you much in the way of inner peace. I share the same wish for you, very sincerely, I expressed to James.

    When even one human is diminished, how can it hope to elevate us all?

    Why do you want government to be the arbiters of charity? You know, when I see collection funds around here for the kids of some of our members or just for our members themselves who are having a rough go of things -- I see that as charity in it's purest form. It's honest, admirable, and from the heart.

    Whether you're dumping money into a church collection plate, or donating to some organization in your area -- that's charity by choice, and that's the way charity should always be.

    Taxing people and giving their money to causes, initiatives, and social programs they may or may not support is an egregious abuse of governmental power. Taxes should go to the fundamental basics, such as roads, police & fire, and so on. In other words -- stop filling the pork barrels for special interests with tax payer monies.

    Then you call my stance on taxation extreme...? I don't think the old axiom of "Give a man a fish, you feed him for a day. Teach a man to fish, and he'll eat for life," was ever something considered to be anything less than conventional wisdom.

    It's why welfare didn't work. Didn't matter if your kids were freezing their asses off because you didn't buy them a coat with the government cheese so long as you were sittin' on 22" dubs in the Caddie you couldn't afford. Teaching a person to be responsible is a lot more compassionate than giving them tools (cash) to use improperly, and that the rest of the world has to earn.

    So sincerely, spare me the platitude and indignation.
  • Demiurge
    Demiurge Posts: 10,874
    edited November 2006
    Options
    krabby5 wrote:
    Do you not see the problem with that statement? Most lower income people wouldn't save...either because of apathy or because they live check to check...

    So what do you suppose we do with those people when they are too old to work?

    I'm more of an independent politically. but in this case so much more money could be put into SS if they just lifted the cap...What's the point of stopping SS deductions once you reach $90k in a given year?

    That's not how personal retirement accounts work. The money would be automatically deducted from your paycheck and placed into a locked account. I would also assume that it would be a tax free draw at retirement, and that it would be able to be passed on to your family directly at death.

    What the particulars would be I have no clue. I'm just giving you examples since it's not legislation at this point, but merely an idea.

    PRA initiatives have been around forever, and it's about the only option that will work to insure the younger generations will ever see any of the money they've paid in to Social Security.

    I like how we're worried about people who will be too old to work in the next 10-15 years, but not worried about the generations in their mid thirties and younger who won't even get one thin dime of their own money.

    You're going to have to go towards PRAs and then slowly do away with Social Security. It'll be a balancing act for a few generations.
  • F1nut
    F1nut Posts: 50,081
    edited November 2006
    Options
    This seems to fit.........


    While walking down the street one day a US senator is tragically hit by a truck and dies. His soul arrives in heaven and is met by St. Peter at the entrance. "Welcome to heaven," says St. Peter. "Before you settle in, it seems there is a problem. We seldom see a high official around these parts, you see, so we're not sure what to do with you."

    "No problem, just let me in," says the man.

    "Well, I'd like to, but I have orders from higher up. What we'll do is have you spend one day in hell and one in heaven. Then you can choose where to spend eternity."

    "Really, I've made up my mind. I want to be in heaven," says the senator.

    "I'm sorry, but we have our rules."

    And with that, St. Peter escorts him to the elevator and he goes down, down, down to hell. The doors open and he finds himself in the middle of a green golf course. In the distance is a clubhouse and standing in front of it are all his friends and other politicians who had worked with him. Everyone is very happy and in evening dress. They run to greet him, shake his hand, and reminisce about the good times they had while getting rich at the expense of the people. They play a friendly game of golf and then dine on lobster, caviar and champagne. Also present is the devil, who really is a very friendly guy who has a good time dancing and telling jokes. They are having such a good time that before he realizes it, it is time to go. Everyone gives him a hearty farewell and waves while the elevator rises...

    The elevator goes up, up, up and the door reopens on heaven where St. Peter is waiting for him. "Now it's time to visit heaven."

    So, 24 hours pass with the senator joining a group of contented souls moving from cloud to cloud, playing the harp and singing. They have a good time and, before he realizes it, the 24 hours have gone by and St. Peter returns.

    "Well, then, you've spent a day in hell and another in heaven. Now choose your eternity."

    The senator reflects for a minute, then he answers: "Well, I would never have said it before, I mean heaven has been delightful, but I think I would be better off in hell."

    So St. Peter escorts him to the elevator and he goes down, down, down to hell.

    Now the doors of the elevator open and he's in the middle of a barren land covered with waste and garbage. He sees all his friends, dressed in rags, picking up the trash and putting it in black bags as more trash falls from above. The devil comes over to him and puts his arm around his shoulder. "I don't understand," stammers the senator. "Yesterday I was here and there was a golf course and clubhouse, and we ate lobster and caviar, drank champagne, and danced and had a great time. Now there's just a wasteland full of garbage and my friends look miserable. What happened?"

    The devil looks at him, smiles and says, "Yesterday we were campaigning......today you voted."
    Political Correctness'.........defined

    "A doctrine fostered by a delusional, illogical minority and rabidly promoted by an unscrupulous mainstream media, which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible to pick up a t-u-r-d by the clean end."


    President of Club Polk

  • hearingimpared
    hearingimpared Posts: 21,137
    edited November 2006
    Options
    TroyD wrote:
    I'm not saying that it's not deserved nor anything of the sort. What I AM saying is that defense spending is almost a quarter of what we send out in the form of entitlement spending. Semantic issues aside; the facts remain.

    Entitlement isn't a negative term but it is what it is.

    BDT

    Troy are you saying entitlement as in I paid into social security insurance for 35 years so I am now entitled to be paid back the disability and retirment insurance that I paid into the program? If that is the definition of entitlement then I agree with you there. The problem is that people look at collecting a check from the Social Security Administration as bum or lazy thing to do.
  • hearingimpared
    hearingimpared Posts: 21,137
    edited November 2006
    Options
    cfrizz wrote:
    ROFLOL!!!:D Ok Mac I can probably go along with this!

    I got worried there for a while since without SS/SSDI picking up the tab, my vegetative brother would be tossed out of the nursing home he resides in since my other brother & I certainly can't afford to pay the cost of it!

    A great many states including MA have put a limit on collecting welfare & it is working wonders!

    It's not just the 30yr olds that have to worry about not collecting SS! I doubt that I will see any of it either & I'm putting as much away as I can into my 401k & mutual funds, cause I'm damn sure not planning on working until age 67!

    Don't forget to buy and keep up private short and long term disability insurance. If you don't and you become disabled you can have as many 401ks or mutual funds as you can get and if you have to wait soley for Social Securtiy Disability, the chances are you are going to go through all your saving, 401ks, pensions, mutuals etc. I described to you in another thread what happened to me.
  • George Grand
    George Grand Posts: 12,258
    edited November 2006
    Options
    Hearingimpaired,

    I've been badmouthing Filthy since 1979 when I first moved down here to South Jersey, and actually went there and saw what a dive the place is. I've only been ON THIS FORUM for 7 years. I'll stop badmouthing the place when it stops providing me with great material. I don't see that happening anytime soon.

    I'm sure you and your family are right people. I'm sure there's at least 8 or 9 other families within the city limits that I could say the same thing about. Do you know any of them?
  • TroyD
    TroyD Posts: 13,077
    edited November 2006
    Options
    Troy are you saying entitlement as in I paid into social security insurance for 35 years so I am now entitled to be paid back the disability and retirment insurance that I paid into the program? If that is the definition of entitlement then I agree with you there. The problem is that people look at collecting a check from the Social Security Administration as bum or lazy thing to do.

    Entitlement spending....the gov't cuts a check to you or on your behalf. Medicare/Medicaid...any number of subsidies. Again, I'm not arguing the merits (I have nothing against SS nor am I saying that it's a handout).

    Again, what I am saying is these programs amount to almost 4x what defense spending is. The POINT is, if you want to talk about what is breaking the bank, it isn't the war.


    BDT
    I plan for the future. - F1Nut
  • hearingimpared
    hearingimpared Posts: 21,137
    edited November 2006
    Options
    Hearingimpaired,

    I've been badmouthing Filthy since 1979 when I first moved down here to South Jersey, and actually went there and saw what a dive the place is. I've only been ON THIS FORUM for 7 years. I'll stop badmouthing the place when it stops providing me with great material. I don't see that happening anytime soon.

    I'm sure you and your family are right people. I'm sure there's at least 8 or 9 other families within the city limits that I could say the same thing about. Do you know any of them?

    Ha Ha Ha George. There are much more than 8 or 9 that I know of.:D
  • hearingimpared
    hearingimpared Posts: 21,137
    edited November 2006
    Options
    TroyD wrote:
    Entitlement spending....the gov't cuts a check to you or on your behalf. Medicare/Medicaid...any number of subsidies. Again, I'm not arguing the merits (I have nothing against SS nor am I saying that it's a handout).

    Again, what I am saying is these programs amount to almost 4x what defense spending is. The POINT is, if you want to talk about what is breaking the bank, it isn't the war.


    BDT

    I'm sure that Medicare is a federal program but I thought Medcaid (welfare) were state sponsored programs. I totally agree with you, billions for defense, not one red cent for tribute.
  • shack
    shack Posts: 11,154
    edited November 2006
    Options
    krabby5 wrote:
    I'm more of an independent politically. but in this case so much more money could be put into SS if they just lifted the cap...What's the point of stopping SS deductions once you reach $90k in a given year?

    The benefits are capped so the contributions are capped. If (as many believe) the SS benefits are due because of the fact that we all are contributing, why should the guy who averaged making $90,000 get as much in SS as the guy who made $180,000 and paid double (or 4 times if he was self employed) in SS taxes? If that is the case they might as well lump it all in the general income tax and pay SS out of those funds...it would save a lot in administration costs.

    For all those who believe that income taxes exist to pay for the necessary services...they don't. They came into existance and still are a method of redistributing wealth..social engineering (as Troy pointed out the majority of the federal expenditure is in transfer payments). I'm tired of people telling me that since I have been successful, I should be more than happy to pay all of these taxes and should be willing to pay more. By the time I pay federal income taxes, SS taxes, medicare taxes, state taxes, sales taxes, gas taxes, real estate taxes, capital gains taxes, entertainment taxes, etc...almost 45% of every dollar I make goes to taxes. And quite frankly, I'm tired of it.
    "Just because you’re offended doesn’t mean you’re right." - Ricky Gervais

    "For those who believe, no proof is necessary. For those who don't believe, no proof is possible." - Stuart Chase

    "Consistency requires you to be as ignorant today as you were a year ago." - Bernard Berenson
  • ND13
    ND13 Posts: 7,601
    edited November 2006
    Options
    shack wrote:

    By the time I pay federal income taxes, SS taxes, medicare taxes, state taxes, sales taxes, gas taxes, real estate taxes, capital gains taxes, entertainment taxes, etc...almost 45% of every dollar I make goes to taxes. And quite frankly, I'm tired of it.

    Same here and more than likely, by the time I'm old enough to draw SSI, it'll be all gone....if they don't revamp it and soon.
    "SOME PEOPLE CALL ME MAURICE,
    CAUSE I SPEAK OF THE POMPITIOUS OF LOVE"
  • cfrizz
    cfrizz Posts: 13,415
    edited November 2006
    Options
    Shack, Do you think you are alone in this? Anyone that works is in the same boat! According to my Quicken program the biggest expense I pay out each year is also to taxes! The difference is that if you make more money, even after taxes you will still have enough left over to comfortably pay the rest of your bills & still be comfortable. Whereas someone like me is one disaster away from being in deep trouble!

    Most times my total expenses for the month & my income are at the same level!

    shack wrote:
    By the time I pay federal income taxes, SS taxes, medicare taxes, state taxes, sales taxes, gas taxes, real estate taxes, capital gains taxes, entertainment taxes, etc...almost 45% of every dollar I make goes to taxes. And quite frankly, I'm tired of it.
    Marantz AV-7705 PrePro, Classé 5 channel 200wpc Amp, Oppo 103 BluRay, Rotel RCD-1072 CDP, Sony XBR-49X800E TV, Polk S60 Main Speakers, Polk ES30 Center Channel, Polk S15 Surround Speakers SVS SB12-NSD x2
  • tommyboy
    tommyboy Posts: 1,414
    edited November 2006
    Options
    shack wrote:
    By the time I pay federal income taxes, SS taxes, medicare taxes, state taxes, sales taxes, gas taxes, real estate taxes, capital gains taxes, entertainment taxes, etc...almost 45% of every dollar I make goes to taxes. And quite frankly, I'm tired of it.

    shack, how is your nice, expensive stereo system, is it still doing alright?

    Well I do agree that a lot of poor people are poor just because they are plain lazy, but that shouldn't mean that other poor people who work very hard don't get anything... Believe or not, there are people out there that from birth, were dirt poor... and didn't have the opportunity that some guys like you did to go to a good school and get a high paying job. I don't have much money, but I'm thankfull that I have a chance to go to school and now studying engineering. If I actually get a good job and have nice things(like you guys;) ), I won't have a problem giving money to some poor people who work very hard and need it...

    And right now, where I'm working at very low paying job, they take almost 25%(and that doesn't include sales tax and gas taxes that you included)... And believe me, that probably hurts me more than 45 hurts you...

    now I'm under the impression that you make a very decent wage, sorry if im wrong:)
    AVR: H/K AVR240
    Fronts: Monitor 50s
    Center: CSI3
    surrounds: R15s
    Sub:Velodyne DPS10
    Dvd/Cd: Samsung HD upconverter (for now)
    TV: 50" Sammy Plasma
    game hardware: 360 and gcn.
    Gamertag: kovster27
  • hearingimpared
    hearingimpared Posts: 21,137
    edited November 2006
    Options
    tommyboy wrote:
    shack, how is your nice, expensive stereo system, is it still doing alright?

    Well I do agree that a lot of poor people are poor just because they are plain lazy, but that shouldn't mean that other poor people who work very hard don't get anything... Believe or not, there are people out there that from birth, were dirt poor... and didn't have the opportunity that some guys like you did to go to a good school and get a high paying job. I don't have much money, but I'm thankfull that I have a chance to go to school and now studying engineering. If I actually get a good job and have nice things(like you guys;) ), I won't have a problem giving money to some poor people who work very hard and need it...

    And right now, where I'm working at very low paying job, they take almost 25%(and that doesn't include sales tax and gas taxes that you included)... And believe me, that probably hurts me more than 45 hurts you...

    now I'm under the impression that you make a very decent wage, sorry if im wrong:)


    This sounds like socialism to me. My tax bracket the last five years I was working was upwards of the 40 percentile close to 50 and would have been higher had I not had to pay a good accountant to keep me out of that percentile. The IRS allows us to make legitamate deductions and that is what I paid the accountant to help me with. I don't see why 40 to 50 percent of my salary doesn't hurt anymore or less than your 25%.

    I worked since I was 14 years old and made a lot of money over the years. I worked three jobs after I graduated high school so I could pay for the technical school I was attending at the time. I could go on and on here about my work history. I totally disagree that any of the taxes I paid should have been to pay for someone else's hardships or situation. During the years I worked, I voluntarily contributed a percentage of my earnings (and still do out of my social security disability check) to charity but that is my choice, I wasn't and am not being forced to do so.

    I'm now relying on social security disablility ONLY. The reason for this because I made a poor decision to drop my long & short term disability insurance while I was still working. If I would have kept the insurance I would not be relying fully on what I paid into social security.

    I take full responsibility for that poor decision. I am not looking for someone else to bail me out with their tax money. Personal responsibility is what I think is lacking in this country and that is why we are forced to pay for welfare and other social entitlement programs. I don't see social security as one of those because I paid into it to protect myself. I thank God now that I was forced to pay it because of the poor decision that I made. . . the key words here are poor decisions THAT I MADE. NO ONE other than me should be responsible for that poor decision.
  • cfrizz
    cfrizz Posts: 13,415
    edited November 2006
    Options
    Joe, at the time you made the decision, you had NO way of knowing that it was a poor one since I doubt you had any idea that you would end up on SSDI!

    We can't really know the future, all we can do is plan for it & have backup plans in an emergency. If we are smart enough to think about it.
    Marantz AV-7705 PrePro, Classé 5 channel 200wpc Amp, Oppo 103 BluRay, Rotel RCD-1072 CDP, Sony XBR-49X800E TV, Polk S60 Main Speakers, Polk ES30 Center Channel, Polk S15 Surround Speakers SVS SB12-NSD x2
  • hearingimpared
    hearingimpared Posts: 21,137
    edited November 2006
    Options
    cfrizz wrote:
    Joe, at the time you made the decision, you had NO way of knowing that it was a poor one since I doubt you had any idea that you would end up on SSDI!

    We can't really know the future, all we can do is plan for it & have backup plans in an emergency. If we are smart enough to think about it.

    You are right Cathy.

    I don't think that I should rely on a stranger's taxes to bail me out of not having a good backup plan. I'm in a strong close knit Italian family. We believe in family first, individual second. After I went through all of my 401ks, pensions, sale of my house, investments and bank accounts waiting for a social security disability decision, members of my family kicked in to help keep me afloat. I have since paid them all back the money and support they kicked in even though most of them told me not to worry about paying them back.

    This is what we were taught by our grandparents and parents because they were not able to rely on the government handouts when they first came to this county. So they taught us personal responsibility and the importance of sticking together as a family.

    I know you do whatever you can to help your brother out because you learned good family values.
  • jdhdiggs
    jdhdiggs Posts: 4,305
    edited November 2006
    Options
    Yup, the fact that I donate an average of ~6 hours a week to charities (Habitat and a church run soup kitchen) and voluntarily give more than 10% of my income to charities that I find worthy really means I'm a money grubbing moron and lack compassion for my fellow man. TRUE COMPASSION is VOLUNTARY, not forced. Don't try and play it off as anything else.

    What I don't like is other people FORCING me or anyone else to give up my money and giving it to people that should not need it. I would much rather have my money going to drill wells in South America or to start a chicken co-op in Africa rather than some unwed/single mother who can't keep her legs shut or some "artist" who refuses to get a real job to pay the rent. What is compassionate about forcibly taking something from someone?

    Blaming it on the elderly and poor? Who do you think votes nearly 100% for candidates for candidates that have a socialist agenda?

    As for the poor doing menial jobs, unless they are truly mentally challenged, they should not be working as a janitor at McDonalds for 45 years @ minimum wage. Supply and demand... If they would have put the time in as a child or through hard work as an adult, they would be able to support themselves. If the supply dried up, those jobs wages would increase. If we are that concerned, lets raise minimum wage to $20/hr and see what happens. Fixed income seniors? It was their decision through choices they made in their lives that put them in that situation.

    There are some that do need government support (mentally ill, physically disabled, short term job loss, etc...), but that number is FAR lower than what the US is providing for. Capable people should not need the support in this country. Why not do job training and cut off the money train when the person is capable of providing for themselves?

    Let's take the compassion argument a different direction, if I need a kidney and you have a healthy one and the govenment took the kidney from you and gave it to me. Would that be compassionate? I'd say that it isn't. Now if you willingly did it, that would be compassionate.

    In the end, what the government is doing is theft disguised as charity.

    As for the Saudi people, a stable and DEMOCRATIC Iraq is EXACTLY what the people want. The Saudi government just wants it to be stable. Revolutionary ideal? Might want to do a little research on the country:
    http://www.progress.org/2005/fold391.htm
    http://www.cdhr.info/

    I would have thought that the wisdom of time would teach you not to judge too quickly.
    Well, quite obviously James, no one is going to slander you with the label "compassionate conservative". That's fine and you are absolutely entitled to your views. The vitriol leaves me, personally, a bit cold. I pay huge amounts of tax, dressed in all manner of guises. Do I like it. No. But, I don't want to live in a country where people live and die on the streets--regardless of what circumstance brought them there. Pointing a finger at the elderly and poor is misguided, to put it mildly. Many of those fixed income seniors designed, built, maintained, and supported with their tax burdens the societal infrastructure you, me, and millions of others used as a vehicle for our success. Low income wage earners, many below anyone's estimate of a poverty level, do nobel work daily that makes our society comfortable and affordable. They should be honored, not vilified and despised.

    My wish for you is long life, great happiness, and success on your terms whatever they may be. I also wish you the wisdom that comes with age and the compassion I trust will follow.



    Do you really suppose they seek the same goal as we, democracy and freedom for the citizens of Iraq? That would be a revolutionary ideal for the Saudis, would it not?
    There is no genuine justice in any scheme of feeding and coddling the loafer whose only ponderable energies are devoted wholly to reproduction. Nine-tenths of the rights he bellows for are really privileges and he does nothing to deserve them. We not only acquired a vast population of morons, we have inculcated all morons, old or young, with the doctrine that the decent and industrious people of the country are bound to support them for all time.-Menkin
  • jdhdiggs
    jdhdiggs Posts: 4,305
    edited November 2006
    Options
    You are right Cathy.

    I don't think that I should rely on a stranger's taxes to bail me out of not having a good backup plan. I'm in a strong close knit Italian family. We believe in family first, individual second. After I went through all of my 401ks, pensions, sale of my house, investments and bank accounts waiting for a social security disability decision, members of my family kicked in to help keep me afloat. I have since paid them all back the money and support they kicked in even though most of them told me not to worry about paying them back.

    This is what we were taught by our grandparents and parents because they were not able to rely on the government handouts when they first came to this county. So they taught us personal responsibility and the importance of sticking together as a family.

    I know you do whatever you can to help your brother out because you learned good family values.

    Exactly! I agree 100%. Personal and family responsibility is something severly lacking in our society.
    There is no genuine justice in any scheme of feeding and coddling the loafer whose only ponderable energies are devoted wholly to reproduction. Nine-tenths of the rights he bellows for are really privileges and he does nothing to deserve them. We not only acquired a vast population of morons, we have inculcated all morons, old or young, with the doctrine that the decent and industrious people of the country are bound to support them for all time.-Menkin
  • mrbigbluelight
    mrbigbluelight Posts: 9,441
    edited November 2006
    Options
    A wise man once said, "What do you have that you were not given".

    He was right.
    Sal Palooza
  • shack
    shack Posts: 11,154
    edited November 2006
    Options
    Tommyboy - I resent your comment about my "nice, expensive stereo system", . You have no idea what I paid for my gear or how much it is even worth.

    Your overall tone of the post makes it sound like I somehow was more fortunate than you and other poor people. What makes you think I was anything but poor when I started out? My parents came from hardworking farmers and laborers. I started working when I was 15. Went to college (A STATE university). Started at the bottom when I got out and I have worked my **** off for almost 30 years. NOTHING has ever been given to me. I took risks, did without, invested wisely, give generously and have been very successful. I MADE my own breaks. How about you?
    "Just because you’re offended doesn’t mean you’re right." - Ricky Gervais

    "For those who believe, no proof is necessary. For those who don't believe, no proof is possible." - Stuart Chase

    "Consistency requires you to be as ignorant today as you were a year ago." - Bernard Berenson
  • shack
    shack Posts: 11,154
    edited November 2006
    Options
    And for all of you who want to tell me that as a low wage earner how hard it is to get by....Don't waste your time. Been there...done that. When we got married my wife and I thought getting a take out pizza or going to McDonalds was A big deal. We both worked 2 jobs. I had no idea how we were going to be able to afford the child that was on the way. I earned a promotion that gave us the money to afford formula, diaper and daycare. We worked our way up...I don't need a lecture!
    "Just because you’re offended doesn’t mean you’re right." - Ricky Gervais

    "For those who believe, no proof is necessary. For those who don't believe, no proof is possible." - Stuart Chase

    "Consistency requires you to be as ignorant today as you were a year ago." - Bernard Berenson
  • George Grand
    George Grand Posts: 12,258
    edited November 2006
    Options
    Well, you're going to get one. You think it's wise to throw away your money on vinyl now? I'm not selling you any more.


    It's a joke Steve. Laugh.

    I didn't get to address one of your questions directed towards Troy and I earlier. We were a big part of the first Gulf War (my squadron), and I got to miss Stephie's first Christmas cause of the sandbox. Got to mess around with Kosovo too. When Iraq II kicked off there were a few deployments to Spain, The Azores, and Oman. We didn't have to spend inordinate amounts of time in the sand, because we are one of the few units left with "E" model engines, which the Air Force felt was a logistical nightmare to supply. Almost everybody else flying tankers has "R" model engines. It did suck though to get poor Tiffany out of the intensive care unit at Cooper Medical Center after she spent 9 days there, while we lived next door at The Ronald McDonald House, only to deploy to The Azores the very next day. Guys like Troy take it in the shorts real bad when it comes to long term deployments to less than desirable places. In addition to just being there, he's got that whole Wendi/George thing to deal with in his head.
  • hearingimpared
    hearingimpared Posts: 21,137
    edited November 2006
    Options
    Shack & diggs,

    Don't you love the people who assume that if you have your own business, it was given to you and you didn't have to work your balls off for it. . . or the ones who think because you may have some nice things that it was given to you that you didn't earn it?????

    It sounds to me like they feel so entitled to what everyone else has, that it should just be given to them even though everybody else worked their balls off for their entires lives. Jeeezzzz my first real job out of tech school in the corporate world paid me $8,000 per year, three days on, three days off, 12 hour shifts (7 to 7), five weeks of days, five weeks of nights. I worked that schedule for two 1/2 years before I got promoted.

    I worked my way up from there and did very, very well, because I was taught a great work ethic by my father and the other men in my family. God forbide I should give myself and my family nice expensive things that I can afford and not be forced to give what I have to some one who doesn't want to work. I feel the same way as you about the mentally ill, or disabled not just because I became disabled myself but because I have a heart and a conscience. Hell I do volunteer work two days a week for people more disabled than me. I do that because I can't afford to give to charity like I used to and I would do more if my disability permitted it.

    People who feel entitled to yours and mine money make me physically ill!!!
  • shack
    shack Posts: 11,154
    edited November 2006
    Options
    Well, you're going to get one. You think it's wise to throw away your money on vinyl now? I'm not selling you any more.

    It's a joke Steve. Laugh.

    No it's not wise. For a little work I can browse the goodwill stores or yard sales and find them much cheaper. The only reason I'm buying the stuff is so you can donate the funds. (that and the fact I KNOW they will be in primo condition).

    I'm AM laughing....:D

    I did not remember you mentioning whether you had been there or not. It's good to know where you perspective comes from and I'm glad you came through it all.
    "Just because you’re offended doesn’t mean you’re right." - Ricky Gervais

    "For those who believe, no proof is necessary. For those who don't believe, no proof is possible." - Stuart Chase

    "Consistency requires you to be as ignorant today as you were a year ago." - Bernard Berenson
  • George Grand
    George Grand Posts: 12,258
    edited November 2006
    Options
    Big wet kiss Steve.
  • DarqueKnight
    DarqueKnight Posts: 6,765
    edited November 2006
    Options
    A wise man once said, "What do you have that you were not given".

    He was right.

    Here are a couple of very important things I have that I was not given:

    1. Good work ethic.
    2. Good character.

    My parents set great examples and gave me a good start in life, but ultimately, what I did with the opportunities offered to me was largely dependent on #1 and #2 above. I can think of lots of people who were given every parental and material advantage in life, but because of a lack of #1 and #2, turned out to be miserable failures in life.
    Proud and loyal citizen of the Digital Domain and Solid State Country!
  • shack
    shack Posts: 11,154
    edited November 2006
    Options
    I've been a janitor (twice) cleaning up other peoples stuff. I've loaded and driven trucks. I've worked construction and retail sales to get through school. When I came out of college I didn't start in a managment training program, I started at the bottom of the ladder and in fact have done just about every job in my industry so I would always know what every person that works for me and with me does. Like hearingimpared, I started out about $8,000 per year working long hours with no perks. The second job and night school working on post graduate classes meant I didn't have time to spend all that money on frivolous stuff.

    I didn't realize growing up in the lap of luxury was so hard....
    "Just because you’re offended doesn’t mean you’re right." - Ricky Gervais

    "For those who believe, no proof is necessary. For those who don't believe, no proof is possible." - Stuart Chase

    "Consistency requires you to be as ignorant today as you were a year ago." - Bernard Berenson
  • hearingimpared
    hearingimpared Posts: 21,137
    edited November 2006
    Options
    shack wrote:
    I didn't realize growing up in the lap of luxury was so hard....

    WAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA! Right on Shack!