LSiM 705 have arrived

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Comments

  • Clipdat
    Clipdat Posts: 12,526
    Excuse my ignorance, which graph is for which speaker?
  • shs
    shs Posts: 105
    The top graph is the "bad" left speaker and with a ~250 Hz signal, you can see the harmonics at 500 and 750 Hz are only 20-30 dB down and there is lots of hash at higher frequencies. With the "good" right speaker, bottom, you don't see any obvious harmonics. This was all done with my phone and used to show Polk the nature of the distortions.
    SONY VPL-VW385ES, Da-Lite 92" 0.9 HD progressive 16x9 screen, Apple TV 4K, Oppo UDP 203, Anthem AVM 60, D-Sonic 4000 (800x3, 400x4) for bed layer, 2 Crown XLS 1002 (225x4) for Atmos; Speakers: Polk LSiM 705s, 703 front, 4 702F/X surround, 4 Polk TL3 (Atmos), Velodyne DD15 Subwoofer.
  • Clipdat
    Clipdat Posts: 12,526
    Thanks again for the clarification, I sincerely appreciate it.

    What did that distortion sound like when you were playing music? Was it obvious?
  • shs
    shs Posts: 105
    The answer to your last question is, yes and no. With music, it depends and only happened when there was fairly strong content in the mid-bass frequency range. Also, this type of harmonic distortion is often done on purpose, e.g. “fuzz” with electric guitars, and in the colloquial, sort of sounds like farting. When I first heard it watching TV, I wasn’t sure whether it was part of the soundtrack, e.g intentional fuzz, or a problem with the speaker. However, I was hearing it more than I thought I should, so checked with a frequency sweep, and it was very obvious as distortion when played through the left channel but not the right. The fact that I could stop the distortion by lightly touching the driver’s surround told me that the mid-bass driver was being driven outside its linear range. I snapped an FFT analysis to get some idea as to the magnitude of the distortion, as can be seen above.
    SONY VPL-VW385ES, Da-Lite 92" 0.9 HD progressive 16x9 screen, Apple TV 4K, Oppo UDP 203, Anthem AVM 60, D-Sonic 4000 (800x3, 400x4) for bed layer, 2 Crown XLS 1002 (225x4) for Atmos; Speakers: Polk LSiM 705s, 703 front, 4 702F/X surround, 4 Polk TL3 (Atmos), Velodyne DD15 Subwoofer.
  • halo
    halo Posts: 5,616
    shs wrote: »
    The answer to your last question is, yes and no. With music, it depends and only happened when there was fairly strong content in the mid-bass frequency range. Also, this type of harmonic distortion is often done on purpose, e.g. “fuzz” with electric guitars, and in the colloquial, sort of sounds like farting. When I first heard it watching TV, I wasn’t sure whether it was part of the soundtrack, e.g intentional fuzz, or a problem with the speaker. However, I was hearing it more than I thought I should, so checked with a frequency sweep, and it was very obvious as distortion when played through the left channel but not the right. The fact that I could stop the distortion by lightly touching the driver’s surround told me that the mid-bass driver was being driven outside its linear range. I snapped an FFT analysis to get some idea as to the magnitude of the distortion, as can be seen above.

    Great job on recognizing and diagnosing the issue!

    Now I have to be über diligent when listening for any issues.

    Thank you for posting this information.
    Audio: Polk S15 * Polk S35 * Polk S10 * SVS SB-1000 Pro
    HT: Samsung QN90B * Marantz NR1510 * Panasonic DMP-BDT220 * Roku Ultra LT * APC H10
  • joecoulson
    joecoulson Posts: 4,943
    In my opinion, the mid bass driver (which I have already replaced one in my 705’s) are the weak links of these speakers. Otherwise very stellar.
  • halo
    halo Posts: 5,616
    joecoulson wrote: »
    In my opinion, the mid bass driver (which I have already replaced one in my 705’s) are the weak links of these speakers. Otherwise very stellar.

    Hmmm. Design flaw?
    Audio: Polk S15 * Polk S35 * Polk S10 * SVS SB-1000 Pro
    HT: Samsung QN90B * Marantz NR1510 * Panasonic DMP-BDT220 * Roku Ultra LT * APC H10
  • joecoulson
    joecoulson Posts: 4,943
    Not sure. They seem to move more than the subwoofers when driven hard. Could be a design flaw in the power distribution between the drivers but I’m not sure.
  • halo
    halo Posts: 5,616
    Ok. I don’t drive them that hard. Even when I played the soundtrack to Blade Runner 2049 the only drivers visibly moving were the Cassini woofers / subs
    Audio: Polk S15 * Polk S35 * Polk S10 * SVS SB-1000 Pro
    HT: Samsung QN90B * Marantz NR1510 * Panasonic DMP-BDT220 * Roku Ultra LT * APC H10
  • SCompRacer
    SCompRacer Posts: 8,342
    halo wrote: »
    I don’t drive them that hard.

    Crank 'em up to 11..... B)
    Salk SoundScape 8's * Audio Research Reference 3 * Bottlehead Eros Phono * Park's Audio Budgie SUT * Krell KSA-250 * Harmonic Technology Pro 9+ * Signature Series Sonore Music Server w/Deux PS * Roon * Gustard R26 DAC / Singxer SU-6 DDC * Heavy Plinth Lenco L75 Idler Drive * AA MG-1 Linear Air Bearing Arm * AT33PTG/II & Denon 103R * Richard Gray 600S * NHT B-12d subs * GIK Acoustic Treatments * Sennheiser HD650 *
  • DaveHo
    DaveHo Posts: 3,465
    Crossover to the cassinis is too low IMHO. That said, they sound spectacular withn the limits.
  • joecoulson
    joecoulson Posts: 4,943
    DaveHo wrote: »
    Crossover to the cassinis is too low IMHO. That said, they sound spectacular withn the limits.
    I agree
  • halo
    halo Posts: 5,616
    DaveHo wrote: »
    Crossover to the cassinis is too low IMHO. That said, they sound spectacular withn the limits.
    joecoulson wrote: »
    I agree

    Would’ve been nice to know this before I bought them :#
    Audio: Polk S15 * Polk S35 * Polk S10 * SVS SB-1000 Pro
    HT: Samsung QN90B * Marantz NR1510 * Panasonic DMP-BDT220 * Roku Ultra LT * APC H10
  • joecoulson
    joecoulson Posts: 4,943
    Not saying I don’t love them, I do. But even great products have their flaws. You will not regret buying them.
  • DaveHo
    DaveHo Posts: 3,465
    While they are not SPL monsters, you don't need to baby them. I have never bottomed out the mid-woof. That said, when running them full range, the 5 1/4 driver really moves. Play Pink Floyd, Mother & crank it up some. You'll see what I mean.
  • txcoastal1
    txcoastal1 Posts: 13,119
    Agree with Dave ^^^^ above

    Right after the 705's were born and Russman still was a Polk rep we jammed these babies at LSAF for their debut...and you know how we do it at LSAF ;)B)

    From 12watts to 200+ watt amps these babies can play....do a search here on the forum :)
    2-channel: Modwright KWI-200 Integrated, Dynaudio C1-II Signatures
    Desktop rig: LSi7, Polk 110sub, Dayens Ampino amp, W4S DAC/pre, Sonos, JRiver
    Gear on standby: Melody 101 tube pre, Unison Research Simply Italy Integrated
    Gone to new homes: (Matt Polk's)Threshold Stasis SA12e monoblocks, Pass XA30.5 amp, Usher MD2 speakers, Dynaudio C4 platinum speakers, Modwright LS100 (voltz), Simaudio 780D DAC

    erat interfectorem cesar et **** dictatorem dicere a
  • halo
    halo Posts: 5,616
    DaveHo wrote: »
    While they are not SPL monsters, you don't need to baby them. I have never bottomed out the mid-woof. That said, when running them full range, the 5 1/4 driver really moves. Play Pink Floyd, Mother & crank it up some. You'll see what I mean.

    Performed this "test" with no major cone movement visible. This is probably because I live in an apartment & the "loudest" listening levels I get to here aren't very loud (perhaps by forum standards?). lol.
    Audio: Polk S15 * Polk S35 * Polk S10 * SVS SB-1000 Pro
    HT: Samsung QN90B * Marantz NR1510 * Panasonic DMP-BDT220 * Roku Ultra LT * APC H10
  • shs
    shs Posts: 105
    edited August 2018
    The 705s certainly play loud enough for my purposes, and I live in a large house some distance from the neighbors with a dedicated home theater. Let's see if my signature block now has info. Tried several times, but no luck.
    SONY VPL-VW385ES, Da-Lite 92" 0.9 HD progressive 16x9 screen, Apple TV 4K, Oppo UDP 203, Anthem AVM 60, D-Sonic 4000 (800x3, 400x4) for bed layer, 2 Crown XLS 1002 (225x4) for Atmos; Speakers: Polk LSiM 705s, 703 front, 4 702F/X surround, 4 Polk TL3 (Atmos), Velodyne DD15 Subwoofer.
  • jayu969
    jayu969 Posts: 112
    Nice reviews...considering getting a pair of 705's myself.
  • mhardy6647
    mhardy6647 Posts: 32,874
    lightman1 wrote: »
    Manticore wrote: »
    lightman1 wrote: »
    Manticore wrote: »
    lightman1 wrote: »
    I don't have a home....

    Yeah but is any of your equipment located close by? :)

    Where you at?

    I was just funnin with you since you seem to have equipment in many,many states. B)
    Southern NH, about an hour S SE of @mhardy6647

    You're in luck.... There is a big amplifier of mine floating around near you. Call Doc.

    It is true, but the amplifier in question is still in rehab.
    We wanted it to go to rehab, and we said, yes, yes, yes.
  • verb
    verb Posts: 10,176
    halo wrote: »
    F1nut wrote: »
    Victor, if you call Conrad-Johnson they will tell you that Steve McCormack is no longer there.........just saying ya know.

    Yes, I caught that thread. ;)

    Thankfully, SMC is up and running in California!

    That Conrad Johnson amp @verb has looks like a beast

    Hey Vic just caught this. Yes it is! I've got it paired with the VTL pre and SRS's with new tweeters. Still breaking em in, but so far sounds fantastic! Was playing the new Bill Idol album rather loud last night and the CJ didn't break a sweat! :smile:
    Basement: Polk SDA SRS 1.2tl's, Cary SLP-05 Pre with ultimate upgrade,McIntosh MCD301 CD/SACD player, Northstar Designs Excelsio DAC, Cambridge 851N streamer, McIntosh MC300 Amp, Silnote Morpheus Ref2, Series2 Digital Cables, Silnote Morpheus Ref2 Series2 XLR's, Furman 15PFi Power Conditioner, Pangea Power Cables, MIT Shotgun S3 IC's, MIT Shotgun S1 Bi-Wire speaker cables
    Office: PC, EAR Acute CD Player, EAR 834L Pre, Northstar Designs Intenso DAC, Antique Sound Labs AV8 Monoblocks, Denon UDR-F10 Cassette, Acoustic Technologies Classic FR Speakers, SVS SB12 Plus sub, MIT AVt2 speaker cables, IFI Purifier2, AQ Cinnamon USB cable, Groneberg Quatro Reference IC's
    Spare Room: Dayens Ampino Integrated Amp, Tjoeb 99 tube CD player (modified Marantz CD-38), Analysis Plus Oval 9's, Zu Jumpers, AudioEngine B1 Streamer, Klipsch RB-61 v2, SVS PB1000 sub, Blue Jeans RCA IC's, Shunyata Hydra 8 Power Conditioner
    Living Room: Peachtree Nova Integrated, Cambridge CXN v2 Streamer, Rotel RCD-1072 CD player, Furman 15PFi Power Conditioner, Polk RT265 In Wall Speakers, Polk DSW Pro 660wi sub
    Garage #1: Cambridge Audio 640A Integrated Amp, Project Box-E BT Streamer, Polk Tsi200 Bookies, Douglas Speaker Cables, Shunyata Power Conditioner
    Garage #2: Cambridge Audio EVO150 Integrated Amplifier, Polk L200's, Analysis Plus Silver Oval 2 Speaker Cables, IC's TBD.
  • sponger
    sponger Posts: 325
    Just out of curiosity...why did you sell them?
    Denon X7200WA
    LSiM 705 703 704c
    Denon DP 400
    Yamaha CDC 775
  • halo
    halo Posts: 5,616
    sponger wrote: »
    Just out of curiosity...why did you sell them?

    They were not a good fit for the rest of my setup. I preferred the sound of the Signature S60 speakers > that of the LSiM 705 speakers in my listening environment & on my gear.

    I have since sold the Signature S60 speakers and I am now using Usher CP-6311 floorstanding speakers.

    I hope that helps you. If you have any more questions, don't hesitate to ask.
    Audio: Polk S15 * Polk S35 * Polk S10 * SVS SB-1000 Pro
    HT: Samsung QN90B * Marantz NR1510 * Panasonic DMP-BDT220 * Roku Ultra LT * APC H10
  • sponger
    sponger Posts: 325
    That really is helpful. As a happy S15 owner, I can understand the appreciation for the Sig series.
    Denon X7200WA
    LSiM 705 703 704c
    Denon DP 400
    Yamaha CDC 775
  • vavan
    vavan Posts: 24
    shs wrote: »
    The top graph is the "bad" left speaker and with a ~250 Hz signal, you can see the harmonics at 500 and 750 Hz are only 20-30 dB down and there is lots of hash at higher frequencies. With the "good" right speaker, bottom, you don't see any obvious harmonics. This was all done with my phone and used to show Polk the nature of the distortions.

    What was the app used to get these graphs?
    Parasound Halo Integrated, Pioneer SC-LX 901, Oppo-205, Revel F208 + Heco Aurora Center 30 + Heco Victa Prime 202
  • shs
    shs Posts: 105
    Those graphs were made with SignalScope on my iPhone.
    SONY VPL-VW385ES, Da-Lite 92" 0.9 HD progressive 16x9 screen, Apple TV 4K, Oppo UDP 203, Anthem AVM 60, D-Sonic 4000 (800x3, 400x4) for bed layer, 2 Crown XLS 1002 (225x4) for Atmos; Speakers: Polk LSiM 705s, 703 front, 4 702F/X surround, 4 Polk TL3 (Atmos), Velodyne DD15 Subwoofer.
  • vavan
    vavan Posts: 24
    shs wrote: »
    Those graphs were made with SignalScope on my iPhone.
    I have neither iphone nor that app but wonder how would it look captured with say free rew app and standalone mic...
    Parasound Halo Integrated, Pioneer SC-LX 901, Oppo-205, Revel F208 + Heco Aurora Center 30 + Heco Victa Prime 202
  • shs
    shs Posts: 105
    That should be fine. I was not using REW at the time and love it now. Before I was using a sweep on a test CD and SignalScope as the RTA. In my case the distortion happened only during a fairly specific frequency range and I would have to pause SignalScope and save the image when I started to see the distortion. I would think that the RTA function of REW would work fine for capturing this sort of thing.
    SONY VPL-VW385ES, Da-Lite 92" 0.9 HD progressive 16x9 screen, Apple TV 4K, Oppo UDP 203, Anthem AVM 60, D-Sonic 4000 (800x3, 400x4) for bed layer, 2 Crown XLS 1002 (225x4) for Atmos; Speakers: Polk LSiM 705s, 703 front, 4 702F/X surround, 4 Polk TL3 (Atmos), Velodyne DD15 Subwoofer.
  • vavan
    vavan Posts: 24
    I only bought umik few days ago and really inexperienced in Rew at all so would have to figure out how to use rta
    Parasound Halo Integrated, Pioneer SC-LX 901, Oppo-205, Revel F208 + Heco Aurora Center 30 + Heco Victa Prime 202
  • shs
    shs Posts: 105
    I you have not already, there is lots of help in the REW page on the AVS Forum.
    SONY VPL-VW385ES, Da-Lite 92" 0.9 HD progressive 16x9 screen, Apple TV 4K, Oppo UDP 203, Anthem AVM 60, D-Sonic 4000 (800x3, 400x4) for bed layer, 2 Crown XLS 1002 (225x4) for Atmos; Speakers: Polk LSiM 705s, 703 front, 4 702F/X surround, 4 Polk TL3 (Atmos), Velodyne DD15 Subwoofer.