"But don't say that the sound is better"

[Deleted User]

I hate this stage of a debate.

gce

Yeah, me too. They start going south and stay that way until they fade away.

BlueFox

soundfreak1 wrote: »

BlueFox wrote: »

Personally, all I want to do is listen to music, not frack with it. I can listen to multiple CDs or playlist songs for hours without moving and with no fatigue. Nor does the source degrade a tiny bit every time I listen to it. Yes, I am lazy when it comes to listening to music, and that is a good thing since it puts me into some zone that I do not want to leave.

This is telling (the above comment) I dont listen to the music as much as I listen to my audio system reproducing music. So "fraking" with it is part of the hobby, a big part, a very enjoyable part. If it was all about the music a transistor radio would be exceptable.

LOL. I fracked with my system to get it to my liking for a few years with a total (list) cost over $100K. Now that it is 'good enough', I can enjoy the music for months without having to frack with it every time I use it. To me, listening to excellent sounding music is the hobby. Constantly messing with the system might be fun for some people, but I have better things to do with my time, such as listening to the music.

The thread title says it all in regard to constantly messing with a source.

[Deleted User]

Dawgfish wrote: »

Cool! Where are you located?

In a galaxy far far away called Australia

[Deleted User]

Here is another interesting article on Digital vs Analogue - audiofi.net/2016/03/digital-vs-analogue-the-civil-war/

nooshinjohn

Just going to add my two cents to this discourse... Music is intended to evoke passions, to stir the soul, to awaken memories and connect the artist with the listener in ways that not even the printed word can. An example of this to me is the "teach the world to sing" commercials that Coca-Cola ran in the late 60's and early 70's. That melody would stay in your head for a lifetime, and you always felt good(and thirsty) every time it played.

Tonight I did a side by side with Norah Jones on SACD and vinyl. The LP is in pristine condition and does not exhibit any rice crispy moments. My digital side is not world class, but no slouch either, and the turntable was able to elicit an emotional connection to the music the digital side could not convey. The performance on vinyl was an enveloping, layered tapestry, with lush details and dramatic flashes that drew you in even deeper as you listened. The SACD copy sounded exceptional as well, but the connection to the performance was just not the same.

Human beings are flawed creatures, and perhaps it is the perfection of 1's and 0's, relentlessly doing what they are told that grates on my hearing. No matter how good it gets, and it can sound very good, digital just lacks the fluidity that I get from vinyl.

[Deleted User]

nooshinjohn wrote: »

Tonight I did a side by side with Norah Jones on SACD and vinyl. The LP is in pristine condition and does not exhibit any rice crispy moments. My digital side is not world class, but no slouch either, and the turntable was able to elicit an emotional connection to the music the digital side could not convey. The performance on vinyl was an enveloping, layered tapestry, with lush details and dramatic flashes that drew you in even deeper as you listened. The SACD copy sounded exceptional as well, but the connection to the performance was just not the same.

Well of course a TriangleArt Reference SE with Walker Precision Motor Drive with ClearAudio Titanium v2 cartridge, Origin Conquerer Mk3c tonearm & Pass Labs Xono twin chassis phono preamplifier is going to sound better than a Pioneer PDD 9MkII SACD Player, lol!

lightman1

Bohdi makes a point, John. You're disqualified. Good day to you, sir.

gudnoyez

Johns got the goods that's all I got to say. WTF you doing up so early Russ your spose to be on vacation sleeping in, unless you were performing the morning ritual, can't says I blame ya being on the road so much carry on.

tonyb

Bodhi wrote: »

Dawgfish wrote: »

Cool! Where are you located?

In a galaxy far far away called Australia

Too many critters that can eat me down under. lol Though here in the U.S., we have Gators ringing doorbells asking if any small pets or children would mind coming to the door. The only thing I have to worry about in the Midwest is rats the size of a Volkswagen, but then that's why we have Tasers.

gce

I have to agree with John on this. Emotional connection is a great way to put it listening to vinyl.

When I re-started my vinyl collection I only had an AVR to hook my TT to. My digital side was also running through the same AVR (Marantz). I also have a copy of Norah Jones "Come Away With Me" on Vinyl and I have it in 192/24 FLAC. The FLAC sounds amazing, very detailed and clean running through my AVR but the vinyl running through the same AVR, to me sounds better. More life like, her vocals are like she's in the room with you. So like John said "turntable was able to elicit an emotional connection to the music the digital side could not convey.

mhardy6647

tonyb wrote: »

Bodhi wrote: »

Dawgfish wrote: »

Cool! Where are you located?

In a galaxy far far away called Australia

Too many critters that can eat me down under. lol Though here in the U.S., we have Gators ringing doorbells asking if any small pets or children would mind coming to the door. The only thing I have to worry about in the Midwest is rats the size of a Volkswagen, but then that's why we have Tasers.

My wife visited Australia on a birding trip a few years back. After she left, a friend of ours observed wryly, "Did you know that Australia has more poisonous animals than any other place in the world?" It is a good thing that he didn't tell Mrs. H that before she went!

As it happens, Australia is also the home of the cassowary bird -- one of the few, if not the only, bird species known to attack and (more to the point) sometimes kill humans. The males guard the eggs and (I think) the young birds. They're pretty imposing critters. Mrs. H actually had a run in with a cassowary... but, as it turned out, it was a female (the females are relatively docile, or at least, not likely to be lethal.

madmax

nooshinjohn wrote: »

Tonight I did a side by side with Norah Jones on SACD and vinyl.

I would stay away from this type of comparison. Take any number of LP/digital comparisons and it will be a mixed bag of which ones sound the best. I think the better way to do it is live with both formats through hundreds of recordings and decide the overall scale of each format.

F1nut

tonyb wrote: »

Too many critters that can eat me down under.

None of those critters want anything to do with you because you're too old and too tough.

westmassguy

mhardy6647 wrote: »

tonyb wrote: »

Bodhi wrote: »

Dawgfish wrote: »

Cool! Where are you located?

In a galaxy far far away called Australia

Too many critters that can eat me down under. lol Though here in the U.S., we have Gators ringing doorbells asking if any small pets or children would mind coming to the door. The only thing I have to worry about in the Midwest is rats the size of a Volkswagen, but then that's why we have Tasers.

My wife visited Australia on a birding trip a few years back. After she left, a friend of ours observed wryly, "Did you know that Australia has more poisonous animals than any other place in the world?" It is a good thing that he didn't tell Mrs. H that before she went!

As it happens, Australia is also the home of the cassowary bird -- one of the few, if not the only, bird species known to attack and (more to the point) sometimes kill humans. The males guard the eggs and (I think) the young birds. They're pretty imposing critters. Mrs. H actually had a run in with a cassowary... but, as it turned out, it was a female (the females are relatively docile, or at least, not likely to be lethal.

I did a double take, thought @lighman1 changed his hair style

lightman1

My punk rock phase. The only thing my hair does now is jump off my scalp into the bathroom sink.

But my arse is still good for biting, Dave!

westmassguy

LOL, just busting

soundfreak1

That damn thing looks like it has a real attitude.

madmax

This is why we should load our CDs as files and throw away the CDs. http://www.theabsolutesound.com/articles/do-hard-disk-drives-sound-better-than-cd-2/

mhardy6647

westmassguy wrote: »

...
I did a double take, thought @lighman1 shaved off his beard

Fixed that for you ;-)

pumpkinman

Sorry wrong thread

[Deleted User]

gce wrote: »

..So like John said "turntable was able to elicit an emotional connection to the music the digital side could not convey.

It depends of your source

[Deleted User]

madmax wrote: »

This is why we should load our CDs as files and throw away the CDs. http://www.theabsolutesound.com/articles/do-hard-disk-drives-sound-better-than-cd-2/

I do plan to buy a server transport in the future & archive my collection, however I'll still keep most of my cd's as I still like to interact with my media, read the liner notes etc, and for archival purposes.

GospelTruth

Seems like everyone has a differing opinion on this one.

My analogy in the CD vs. Vinyl debate would be akin to Photography. Let’s say you are looking at a tree, a nice healthy maple tree in the middle of summer in the middle of a grassy meadow. What you see with the naked eye is “analog”. Now, you have two methods to “capture” that image. You can use an older method with 35mm film or you could use a newer 24 megapixel digital camera capable of capturing that same image. Each method captures the image. Is one better than the other? Depends on who you ask. Some prefer the method of film and actually like to develop their own pictures in a dark room. They feel it is a more accurate rendition of what they saw. You can blow up the picture without fear of “pixels” showing up at some point in the process. Others may prefer digital photography for its ease of use and for the dynamic range that they can get with new digital sensors that can’t be had with film.

According to the article that F1 put out, there are limitations on vinyl from the original source material due to the actual physical media. Doesn’t mean it doesn’t sound good and that some prefer that sound. I like a record now and then. It’s not only the sound, but the whole experience that I find enjoying. It brings me back to a time in my life that doesn’t really exist in today’s world. Heck, even a cassette at times sounds good on my Nak, but it’s also the experience that I enjoy along with the sound.

Let’s compare a CD to digital photography. Is it analog? No. Does it give an excellent rendition of what was seen (provided it’s a good sensor)? I think so and some might contend if the megapixel count is high enough, it is better than film without the grain. And there is that item of film grain. Some like it, some don’t. An image without film grain may appear to “clean” for some. They like film grain in an image. Even in some movies film grain is added to the digital image to make movies appear more like film. I actually like film grain in a movie because it is more "movie like" to me. Now, when an image is digital you can do all kinds of things to it. You can apply HDR to images to give them a look. Some like the results, others don’t. I would say applying HDR to a digital image is like compressing dynamic range on a CD to make it louder. Maybe a bad analogy, but it’s the best I can offer. Again, some don’t care for HDR and some like it. I’m not a fan of compressed dynamic range on a CD for the sake of loudness. Another topic, but as the article stated, there can be good things and bad things with recordings and how they are manipulated.

Regardless of the medium, there are differing opinions on what people like and don’t. I like CDs and digital files for the most part. I’ve sat down and listened to a CD, record and cassette of the same recording hearing different things in all of them. I still prefer CD, but I can see why others like vinyl. Enjoy the music no matter what medium you prefer!

gce

For all you digital guys, go to HDTracks today only and get 25% off all Black Sabbath. Use code HDVIPSABBATH. This vinyl guy did! It's 24/96 and sounds good.

motorstereo

It's amazing to me that vinyl seems to the favored format. I bought into the vinyl is better myself after doing lots of research years ago. But it didn't change the fact for me that most any yardsale 5 disc spinner will out do my properly set up all clearaudio vinyl rig. It doesn't mean that I can't enjoy vinyl but when it's time to listen to music the cover gets put down on the tt and my Mac cd player gets turned on.

With 1000wpc Mac mono's on tap my 1.2tl's can and do become very dynamic. Vinyl just does not have the dynamics and low distortion which makes the music sound "alive" to me or anyone else that I've had over for a good listen.

I'm not bashing vinyl as I also have a cassette collection that I will listen to occasionally on my lesser rigs. But vinyl is what is imo.... it was the best we had till cd's came along

pongshi

Vinyl..then CD...back to vinyl. I am a music guy first and foremost. Some records sound better than the CD and vice versa. Where vinyl has it in spades is the level of involvement in the musical experience. The process...pulling the cleaning the record and stylus, and setting things in motion. Grabbing the album cover and sleeve, looking at the art work, production, lyrics, etc. while listening. It is just amazing and just not the same with a CD.

Whatever you like is okay by me. What I do regret is that the musical experience for many has become a lone ranger ordeal. I remember the days of getting friends together to listen to new albums and going to others houses and passing around the album cover and listening to the music.

Now everyone is on their iphone or some other electrical device with a set of ear buds.
I think part of the reason for the mini vinyl revival is because older folks are nostalgic and want to reconnect with the musical experience from yesteryear. I also think younger folks are also starting to realize how cool this experience is as well.

steveinaz

madmax wrote: »

This is why we should load our CDs as files and throw away the CDs. http://www.theabsolutesound.com/articles/do-hard-disk-drives-sound-better-than-cd-2/

A couple years ago I made the same observations and people thought I was off my nut. My "theory" was either reduced jitter, or removing the optical reading portion of the process present in cd players.

cfrizz

I get my emotional involvement from the music itself, not the format it comes in.

People get the same way with books. Some don't consider ebooks as real books. So long as the content is the same, I don't care about the format.

Actually I do, reading ebooks allow me to adjust the font size and carry my entire library over 1300 books on my phone. Same with my music collection.

I have two of the things I love to do with me at all times. It doesn't get better than that!

soundfreak1

Cfritzz is that an eskie???