Speaker choices - anyone has any opinion on either of these? BW 800 Diamonds or SF Strads.

tonyb

Joey_V wrote: »

I tried to see if the wife would let me have the speaker hang out of the corner and into the hallway but it was a no.

So now I'm trying to rearrange furniture to see if I can fit the elipsas.

Joey,
If your that cramped for room, only have 12 inches or so for speaker placement, then maybe you have too much furniture in the room ? What speaker will sound good sandwiched like that anyway ?

Joey_V

Skip -

Sit back? Nah. What's sitting back going to do? When you see a good deal, you jump on it. When opportunity knocks, you answer it... and that just doesn't pertain to audio. Waiting for the next opportunity is a waste of time because it may never come along.

The guy's hurting to sell, the market's soft and no one can apparently buy it - so I'll do it for the right price.

You've met me - how am I anxious? Not anxious at all. I just want things to get done. What's the point in sitting back and taking it in for a while? The room isn't going to fix itself and the system isn't going to assemble itself.

Tony -

The room is not cramped at all, the problem is that the wall across the couch is like a 2/3 wall because there's a hallway there to another room. The issue becomes that if I try to center the TV, the speaker hangs out to the left of the TV (and into the hallway) while the right speaker is very well accommodated. I'll send you a pic, I think I still have your email.

WLDock

Joey_V wrote: »

... the problem is that the wall across the couch is like a 2/3 wall because there's a hallway there to another room. The issue becomes that if I try to center the TV, the speaker hangs out to the left of the TV (and into the hallway) while the right speaker is very well accommodated.

Man do I understand what you mean here. There's a house that I really like but it has the same type of challenge. The upstairs living room has the off center 2/3 wall and the downstairs family room is long and narrow with the side openings in the wrong place. As much as I like the house, I don't know how the heck I would lay out each room. To make matters worst, the Mrs. now says that she does not want big speakers in the living room. So the dream of a second two channel system may be in jeopardy.

Challenges, challenges...

Joey_V

WLDock wrote: »

Joey_V wrote: »

... the problem is that the wall across the couch is like a 2/3 wall because there's a hallway there to another room. The issue becomes that if I try to center the TV, the speaker hangs out to the left of the TV (and into the hallway) while the right speaker is very well accommodated.

Man do I understand what you mean here. There's a house that I really like but it has the same type of challenge. The upstairs living room has the off center 2/3 wall and the downstairs family room is long and narrow with the side openings in the wrong place. As much as I like the house, I don't know how the heck I would lay out each room. To make matters worst, the Mrs. now says that she does not want big speakers in the living room. So the dream of a second two channel system may be in jeopardy.

Challenges, challenges...

I hear ya man.... I have rearranged the furniture to be "offset", now I have room for the Elipsas but the room just isn't as well laid out. I'm trying to see if I can live with it.

And just to let everyone else who was following this saga to the 800 Diamonds/1201 Houston... the guy backed out. Says that he could not find an invoice.

That was a deal breaker for me. Unfortunately... so plans must be readjusted. Oh well, would've been a good deal.

WLDock

So what now? Wait and see on the Elipsas? Are you considering the dealer for the Diamonds or waiting for used to show up again?

Have you listened to the Focal Utopia or Legacy Aeris? Thoughts?

I heard the Focal Stella Utopia and the Aeris and thought they were both nice. Like always would love more time...especially the Aeris.

Joey_V

WLD

Dude man... You do know the Stella's are like 90 large right? Lol!

I hear ya Z. If it wasn't meant to be then it wasn't.

One thing I was thinking seriously about was going 802 diamond used for now and then waiting for the next 800 diamond version 3 upgrade to come out in 2016/2017 and buying that. 802 diamond used is much more palatable and would be a smart financial move relative to buying the 800 new.

Ah well, decisions decisions.

Joey_V

And the 800 rarely if ever come to market. I watched audiogon like a hawk. Only 1 pair came on... And I was in the middle of vacation when it popped up. So by the time I got to the guy, given our time zone difference, someone beat me by a few hours. Plus I waffled like an idiot....

So now I'm not going to waffle when I see something legit.

WLDock

Joey_V wrote: »

Dude man... You do know the Stella's are like 90 large right? Lol!

Yeah, crazy right? I was not recommending anything. I was just wondering since you liked the 800 Diamonds sound how you feel about the Utopia house sound or Legacy sound. IMO, they all seem like speakers with a lot of flair on the top end and the bottom (As well as looks) and they all just let it all hang out....but what do I know? I've very limited exposure to the stuff...probably heard more Utopia car audio systems than home, LOL!

Like the 8oo's the Aeris and the Utopia sure are "Pretty." If I were at a higher(Not the highest!) echelon ($30K-$50K+system) of the game, the Aeris is one I would have to really sit down and listen to. Also, the Sony SS-AR1 with the Scan-Speak drivers were giving me something when I heard them....would have to spend a ton of time with that one too. However, then you start reading there is always someone that likes the Scan/SB Acoustics Aerial Acoustics 7T (or something else) over them...and that makes one want to go out and listen...and on and on.........

Man, the "high End" is crazy...some of us may never get there...but there is always hope and small chances to listen to other peoples stuff.

Joey_V

Not a fan of dipole/bipole speakers.... thats my issue.

tonyb

DSkip wrote: »

Joey_V wrote: »

Not a fan of dipole/bipole speakers.... thats my issue.

Yet you love your Martin Logan's?

Obviously not any more though.lol

Joey_V

DSkip wrote: »

Joey_V wrote: »

Not a fan of dipole/bipole speakers.... thats my issue.

Yet you love your Martin Logan's?

That's why I'm moving away from the ML.

Let me rephrase that. I don't *mind* the dipole sound. I just don't think I'm going to go in that direction this time around for my main system.

But I can appreciate a dipole system nonetheless, was still looking and considering another ML for the living room for the future.

marvda1

any thought to any of these?
http://www.vonschweikertaudio.com/#!news/mainPage

Joey_V

Heard VS before.

Joey_V

802 diamonds might be a reality by later today we will see. Gives me elbow room
For the new 800 series when they come out and will allow me room to get the strads if I stumble onto a good deal. I'm ready whenever a strad comes up
For 20. But I'm not paying 30 for a demo pair. I already have a deal for 35 locally from an auth dealer on a new one and I still hesitated to pull the trigger because of the price. Deal is still on the table but I think I will just keep waiting until the right deal pops up on audiogon.

Joey_V

My problem with the elipsa is if I get one then I cannot get the strads.

The guy with the used 802 diamonds is calling me today.

xsmi

OP, I may have missed this, and this is just my curiosity. Have you listened to the bigger SF's? What were your thoughts? Those are my lottery speaker but I was curious what your thoughts were. I'm sorry to high jack the thread. I do know they sound different from the Strads as II never like SF's until I heard the Aida's. And I'd LOVE to get my ears on the new Liliums.

Joey_V

I have heard Strads and Aidas. I did not hear Liliums as of yet. I skipped the Amati Futura because I was aiming for Strads. I've only heard Strads once but it was a significant moment because it was the one time (until I heard the tubes on the 802 Diamonds 6 months later) that I said to myself.... so this is what hifi is supposed to be like.

And it was awesome.

Then my friend over at martinloganowners forum had heard about my escapades with the SF Stradivari and he told me that Paragon dealer was nearby in Ann Arbor, MI. His reaction to the Strads were the same as mine. Tim is my friend and has great ears.

---
Hi Joey. Missed this. I found the Strads very enjoyable. One of the best sounds I have heard. They were in a room that was a bit small so I couldn't let them rip but listening to strings on them was magic. They had this ability that some speakers have to 'move air'. The Maggie's have this - I don't feel the Logan's do. You may have saw that I listened to the Wilson Alexandria XLF in the same session. I liked the Strads better - which Gary was appalled with since he could not see how a 200k speaker would not be better. For my application it was.

As I said the front end was all tube... Ivan moved his back to his tubes... And you have those gorgeous Cary's. that with the detailed esoteric will be magic I think.

I know u have been thru the ringer but the holidays are close and if you are going back to Chicago - go listen to the 20.7 if you can in Evanston . Your room may not accommodate them though. In any case the Strads may indeed be better. I am going to listen to the 20.7 here soon and I will report back.
---

Joey_V

He came back with a repeat session, this time he compared directly the 802 diamonds and the SF Strad. Lucky guy as this is EXTREMELY difficult to do since that's going to be a very rare dealer who will have both in the showroom. I really wanted him to compare the 800 diamonds and the Strads but alas, they had just sold their demo pair and were awaiting delivery of the new pair.

Love this guy, Tim's a good buddy of mine.

---
Ok joey ---

one more time...one more listen.... here is what i heard in order...

1. Mac line arrays
2. Strads
3. 802Ds

All on Mac gear...

Mac line arrays.... wow.... coherence... dynamics.... big scale (they appear to be around 7' tall??? ... guessing in the 200K range... but very very good...unlike what i thought about the wilson alexandria.... they brought the orchestra to the room for sure....

2. Strads: this time I brought symphony/norah jones for jazz/piano/female vocal/ nickelcreek for very percussive mandolin/vocal/violin/ acoustic guitar... To me... everything was incredible....again.... the symphony had textures.... scale....strings - incredible (my opinion of this speakers wheelhouse)....Air in spades....Presence - th.... ey give you this sense of something (the air...whatever) ...they push air.... I absolutely loved them..... The vocals... Ok - I thought the vocdal on them was going to be a little colored..... NO - crystal clear -- very dimensional... norahs voice sounded in a way where you could see her in the sound proof room with the headphones on with one of those big round mics right up to her voice.... just fantastic.... the percussive quality of Chris 'Thile's mandolin of nickelcreek sounded fantastic... the pluck of the string and the detailed sound .... after it was done my son said .... 'that guy can shred'.... yes he can....

3. 802 Diamonds... the best B&W speaker I have ever heard.... they sounded 'tight'.... but, the strads ate them up in every way.... clarity (which I was surprised at)....low end.... presence.... dimensionality... scale... you can use all of the adjectives....

Now, we did not get to string quartet - which the strads do incredibly well - probably the best i have heard... so, we were not necessarily playing to what I thought were its strengths.... I noticed they like to be played with it cranked up a little .... 30-100watt peaks I am guessing as I looked at the meters....

I have heard these hooked to the G150 all tube ARC / and now the Mac 301 solid state monos..... I didn't expect to be impressed today... but again.. for a second time - I was....

Larry - the owner of Paragon in Ann Arbor wants to move his used Strads - natural walnut -very very nice.... He would like to move them prior to year end.... He said he would give a nice deal on them.... Not sure what that means.... However, if you decide to give him a call --- Please mention - Tim and his son were in there and told you to call.... and maybe you can work something out.... the pair looks pristeen to me.
Thanks - and let me know how it goes .. .Tim
---

Joey_V

xsmi wrote: »

OP, I may have missed this, and this is just my curiosity. Have you listened to the bigger SF's? What were your thoughts? Those are my lottery speaker but I was curious what your thoughts were. I'm sorry to high jack the thread. I do know they sound different from the Strads as II never like SF's until I heard the Aida's. And I'd LOVE to get my ears on the new Liliums.

Which speaker were you referring to btw? Were you referring to Strads, Aidas, or Liliums? Like I said above, I've heard of the 2 of 3.

I gotta say, flat out, as far as I know and as far as I've experience this far in my audio adventures - the best sound I have ever heard were the Strads. But I gotta hear it one more time to be sure that I heard right.

Joey_V

ZLTFUL wrote: »

I think the 802s are a solid transition anyway. While the 800s are the goal, the 802s will give you 9/10s of what you want at a much cheaper price giving you a hold over until you can drop the big coin on the exact deal you want on the end game speakers. Good planning imho.

I agree with you. These 802 Diamonds are end game for many, and when I heard them on tubes a month ago, I basically told myself that this was good enough as it was and I could retire.

tonyb

Famous last words of many Joey lol. Yeah....until the next latest and greatest shows it's face. Order the Strats straight from Italy....have you been in touch with any dealers there ? Shipping may be a bear though.

Joey_V

tonyb wrote: »

Famous last words of many Joey lol. Yeah....until the next latest and greatest shows it's face. Order the Strats straight from Italy....have you been in touch with any dealers there ? Shipping may be a bear though.

Hey TOOOOONY...

Yeah, I have a local dealer here who has already given me a bid on install and delivery of a brand new pair, fully authorized and full warranty, any color I want (red, graphite, walnut) for $35 w/ tax and delivery. That's the absolute best deal I have found and I have called a lot of dealers. SF has a very tight network and Sumiko/Fine Sounds (the distributor) has a very tight noose on all their dealers. Dealers cannot just mail you speakers just because you shop around and call around... they can't do this if there is an SF dealer nearby because this would essentially be cannabilism.

I just can't get my head wrapped around $35 when I saw it on audiogon for $20. Retail is $45 and every dealer I talk to is 10% off plus tax.. so essentially... $45. If I have it shipped out, they have to be very careful not to step on anyone's toes but $40 shipped. $35 was the best I found. I found them on higherfi, but they are grey market.

[Deleted User]

Joey,

So how did today's 802 deal go? I will be heading to H-Town tomorrow when the weather clears, hopefully around noon. Just to be clear, you are no longer pursuing the deal in H-town right? I may contact the seller and drop by on a whim.

Also, there is a guy by me that owns YG's big dog among many others. He also happens to be a dealer in the high end. Let me know if you want contact.

Anyhow, who did you find as a local dealer for the SF? I will probably visit and see what else is available.

Thanks,

Halen

brianle

I love the Dynaudio c4

[Deleted User]

Brian,

I could only imagine how the C4 sounds, I have listened to txcoastal bookies and was very impressed. I am more interested (at ths point) in small enclosures with big enclosure sound. With that said, killer mids and airy highs. Plus, I am looking for different setups for my bedrooms. The Dyn's are very high on the list.

Halen

Joey_V

You just gotta be very careful about those big big speakers like the C4 and other similar speakers. Once you buy them, you better commit.

And that's my biggest issue... I just can't commit.

Halen -

The 802 deal is ongoing, I was doing research on the guy and I talked to my banker about whether a bank wire is safe or not compared to paypal and if I had any recourse if the deal went south. I missed the seller's call at 5pm and called him back at 9pm but he was still at work.. I think he's a gen mgr at one of the Benz dealerships. So I guess if the deal goes south, I know where to find him. Plus, Sean (aka Zero on here) called me and I couldn't resist picking up the phone to chat with that crazy fool... lost track of time for an hour there.

I have 2 deals on the works. 802 diamonds and Sonus Faber Guarneri Mementos. If I pick up both, I will be set and wait for the next 800 diamonds or for the right Strads to pop up on audiogon. I have eliminated the Elipsa SE from contention mainly because they are too wide to plop anywhere but the main stereo room and the Elipsa SE will eliminate any possibility for a Strad in this house. And partially because the guy has an inflated sense of what they are worth and we could not come to an agreement.

Btw Halen - I don't think the Htown guy will have you stop by... he seems to be very busy and probably is because he runs a big business down there. If he finds it too difficult to get me an invoice and a box, then that's his loss not mine.

Joey_V

Btw, Halen, if you buy those 800 diamonds down there and bring it to your place, I will seriously bow to your deal making abilities. I wasn't able to close but if you are, you sir are a boss.

Also, I will be the first to volunteer to come by and help you unload them.

[Deleted User]

What the... Is all this white stuff outside.

Halen

brianle

The c4 are tall but not heavier than 802 or Elipsa

tonyb

Joey_V wrote: »

tonyb wrote: »

Famous last words of many Joey lol. Yeah....until the next latest and greatest shows it's face. Order the Strats straight from Italy....have you been in touch with any dealers there ? Shipping may be a bear though.

Hey TOOOOONY...

Yeah, I have a local dealer here who has already given me a bid on install and delivery of a brand new pair, fully authorized and full warranty, any color I want (red, graphite, walnut) for $35 w/ tax and delivery. That's the absolute best deal I have found and I have called a lot of dealers. SF has a very tight network and Sumiko/Fine Sounds (the distributor) has a very tight noose on all their dealers. Dealers cannot just mail you speakers just because you shop around and call around... they can't do this if there is an SF dealer nearby because this would essentially be cannabilism.

I just can't get my head wrapped around $35 when I saw it on audiogon for $20. Retail is $45 and every dealer I talk to is 10% off plus tax.. so essentially... $45. If I have it shipped out, they have to be very careful not to step on anyone's toes but $40 shipped. $35 was the best I found. I found them on higherfi, but they are grey market.

Joey.
This guy just sold some for around 24k. He's a dealer in Italy. Maybe drop him a line with your interest and see what kind of deal you can make.
http://app.audiogon.com/listings/full-range-sonus-faber-stradivari-homage-new-open-box-2015-02-02-speakers-40125-bologna-emilia-romagna