Speaker choices - anyone has any opinion on either of these? BW 800 Diamonds or SF Strads.

polkfarmboy

I think the BW 800 are one of the best looking speakers ever made.

Joey_V

polkfarmboy wrote: »

I think the BW 800 are one of the best looking speakers ever made.

I agree with you 100%. I was thinking of having them build a custom color for me... blue or white. But black just looks sinister.

Joey_V

DSkip wrote: »

Nola may be up your alley. They are open baffle with sealed bass modules.

We are just shooting in the wind, but that's all we can do. I think right now, sf is out and b&w is the one to beat.

Regarding SF Strad vs BW800 Diamonds - one thing about the Strads that favor my situation is the 93db sensitivity. Easier to drive with my 211 FE. But I'm not going to favor a particular speaker because of the amplification. I can always change to more powerful amps later.

Heard about Nolas... can't get over the look. But I hear they are supposedly fantastic sounding.

What I really want to hear are Kharmas and Martens.... but unfortunately, the cost is a little much and to move up their line, you gotta shell out some serious dough.

Joey_V

DSkip wrote: »

I know these are love/hate speakers, but what about MBL? I'm trying to think of others that might best the Summit at its own game.

There's an MBL for sale in Chicago through audiogon - 24K. Right there with the 800 diamonds. I am trying to set up an audition.

Others have told me they are great speakers - might be true in the right room I think. Not sure how an omnidirectional speaker might fare in a smaller room like mine.

Btw, I'll let you in a little secret - the Summits' weakness is in the lower midrange and mid bass to upper bass. You can hear everything as in it resolves in great detail and micro detail and it is fantastically coherent, however, I noticed as I moved up the budget and heard more and more state of the art speakers... the Summits have something missing. Call it the "you are there feeling" or the fact that something just sounds like a facsimile...

I describe it best as you can hear it but you can't feel it.

That's why I'm moving on. BW 800 diamonds may not sound as "natural" as the Summits, but they wipe the floor with just how involving they are on tubes.

Joey_V

DSkip wrote: »

Here is the Usher Be-10. At $17k, I don't know how they compare to the rest of the marketplace, but they do utilize the Diamond tweeter. The midwoofers are supposed to be a beryllium composite, which bumps up their cost quite a bit.

Is that their top of the line speaker?

Btw, Dskip, I appreciate you trying to help me out. I like your ideas.

Joey_V

Holy crap man.. the BE10 is like 6900 on audiogon. That's a bargain.

Joey_V

Now I'm thinking of buying a pair of BE10 for the family room... why do they have to weight 450 lb for the pair.... dang it.

tonyb

Heck of a price for a damn fine speaker, 7k seems almost too good to be true.

Joey, here's a review from the 'gon, comparing the BE's to the 802d's which is another of your contenders. Note the associated gear though.

Joey_V

7K is peanuts for a speaker that gorgeous. But man, 450 lbs? That's going to take team to take upstairs. Same as the BW, but I get delivery on those per the dealer. I guess I can stick it in the 1st floor family room..... but didn't really want to get such a heavy secondary speaker. Hard to mobilize and it's going to be a pain when I move to a bigger house.

What you guys think about the SF Elipsa SE? Similar to Strads but a lower price point. Only 100 lbs each and I can move them easily. There's a good pair on sale on audiogon for $12000... would probably have to get approval from the wife on that purchase in addition to the BW 800 diamond, but if I go for the 802 Diamond, I can get that Elipsa without much pushback from the boss.

Such a gorgeous speaker... would be fantastic as a buddy to a BW Diamond.

Joey_V

DSkip wrote: »

Might just be me, but moving a speaker is the least of my concerns unless you plan to move regularly. Upstairs is a pain, but with two guys helping, it shouldn't bee too bad.

Yeah I hear ya.

Another issue I have is the big boy 800 Diamonds will be in the media, I don't have enough room in the family for something as massive as the Usher BE10, so it'd have to go into the game room upstairs. Those things are stored in crates, and I just won't have the space to store the 800 diamond (or 802) boxes + a set of heavy crates of the BE10. We don't have no basements here in Dallas like we did in Chicago.

Plan of move date is 5 years so it's going to happen and having to have piano movers several times for speakers of that magnitude is painful. Not only do I have to deal with one set for the media room, but another set for the game. Not to mention all this furniture my wife has collected, we're screwed. LOL.

I'm going to get detailed specs on this guy and look at reviews. I think there's an Usher dealer in Chicago and so I can probably swing by next month.

I'm going to get some measurements on the footprint of these Usher BE10 and see if they can fit in the family room.

Oh, and I forgot, because these will have to be in the family room - the wife will have to approve the look. Atleast we can get them in walnut and that looks gorgeous in it of itself.

Joey_V

tonyb wrote: »

Heck of a price for a damn fine speaker, 7k seems almost too good to be true.

Joey, here's a review from the 'gon, comparing the BE's to the 802d's which is another of your contenders. Note the associated gear though.

Wheres the link to the review bro?

tonyb

Joey_V wrote: »

tonyb wrote: »

Heck of a price for a damn fine speaker, 7k seems almost too good to be true.

Joey, here's a review from the 'gon, comparing the BE's to the 802d's which is another of your contenders. Note the associated gear though.

Wheres the link to the review bro?

Holly molly, am I an idiot. Forgot the darn link....wonder how I get threw the day sometimes. Sorry pal....

http://forum.audiogon.com/cgi-bin/frr.pl?rspkr&1152466924&&&/Usher-BE-10-Speaker

polkfarmboy

I would just stay on the journey to one big speaker upgrade and dont stray from the path. On the other hand those Ushers might be something that saves you 12k as you might fall in love?Those Ushers seem fantastic and the shipping crates weigh a ton, it could be a pain for storage as you would have to dismantle them and store the wood someplace.

Joey I think your opinions on the Logans are spot on, that somethings not right. I have always stayed away from any ML's with built in powered woofers like the Vantage, Summit because no matter how good the gear your stuck with those ice amp modules for the bass.

When ever I have introduced class D ice modules into my Martin Logan speakers the result is that I would rather to my rti8 through the same amps, its not good. Now when I have high power tubes going through the system even with a solid state pre they sound amazing. I get that big meaty analog bass rush and feel the wave of the sound just traveling towards me. In those listening sessions with tubes running a digital source I find that nothings missing.

Maybe a pair of Spire should be on your list, thats what I am always interested in when they show up. I think you will miss the logans when they are out the door so best to buy a backup pair on the cheap for your fix that you will need.

Joey_V

DSkip wrote: »

Interesting article. The Ushers really like tubes, which is why I'm drawn to their 8 ohm offerings like the 6311, Mini X, MD1, 8571, and Be-10. The Accuphase amps are likely SS, and I definitely wouldn't pair Nordost cables with Ushers or B&W's.

Note that the review compares the Be tweeter to the B&W one - the new Be-10 has the DMD tweeter, which is supposed to be a big upgrade over the Be. I haven't had a chance to compare the two, but I am enjoying the DMD in the Mini X quite a bit. The one in the review has the Be from what I can tell. If you bought those, you could consider getting the DMD tweeters as a drop-in upgrade.


Joey, if you - or anyone else for that matter - decide to go with new Usher products, PM me.

Thanks skip... Will keep u posted if I go
Ushers.

Joey_V

Heard Montis but not previous spires. To me, they sounded nothing new since I'm very familiar with the Summits.

Would I like a pair inhouse? Sure. But not as the primary system. To me, there are better speakers... But I still have love for some
Logans.

My goal?

3 systems.

1. Main system - prob 800 diamond
2. Gameroom - elipsa se or strad
3. Family room - logans or magico mini 2

polkfarmboy wrote: »

I would just stay on the journey to one big speaker upgrade and dont stray from the path. On the other hand those Ushers might be something that saves you 12k as you might fall in love?Those Ushers seem fantastic and the shipping crates weigh a ton, it could be a pain for storage as you would have to dismantle them and store the wood someplace.

Joey I think your opinions on the Logans are spot on, that somethings not right. I have always stayed away from any ML's with built in powered woofers like the Vantage, Summit because no matter how good the gear your stuck with those ice amp modules for the bass.

When ever I have introduced class D ice modules into my Martin Logan speakers the result is that I would rather to my rti8 through the same amps, its not good. Now when I have high power tubes going through the system even with a solid state pre they sound amazing. I get that big meaty analog bass rush and feel the wave of the sound just traveling towards me. In those listening sessions with tubes running a digital source I find that nothings missing.

Maybe a pair of Spire should be on your list, thats what I am always interested in when they show up. I think you will miss the logans when they are out the door so best to buy a backup pair on the cheap for your fix that you will need.

tonyb

I dunno Joey, something about "gameroom" and SF Strats that just don't sound right. lol

Joey_V

tonyb wrote: »

I dunno Joey, something about "gameroom" and SF Strats that just don't sound right. lol

Lol... yeah... but it does sound bada$$.

brianle

Look wise, the Elipsa SE look impressive

Joey_V

brianle wrote: »

Look wise, the Elipsa SE look impressive

Yeah I know especially the graphite finish.

Montoya

Go with the Sonus Faber speaker. I got a set of Olympica III and they smoke my buddys 804d he was so disappointed he sold them on audiogon. lol Better wider and deeper sound stage more dynamic impact better resolution fit and finish is beyond B&W just everything was better in both of our opinion.

Joey_V

Montoya wrote: »

Go with the Sonus Faber speaker. I got a set of Olympica III and they smoke my buddys 804d he was so disappointed he sold them on audiogon. lol Better wider and deeper sound stage more dynamic impact better resolution fit and finish is beyond B&W just everything was better in both of our opinion.

Would have to disagree with you on the olympica III. Long story short the dealer for olympicas and diamonds initially preferred olympicas only to find that they do not scale with upstreams as well as diamonds meaning they are easier to get to sound good but more difficult to get to sound great. Took half of my upstreams to the dealer and set it up and compared the O3 against the 802 diamonds which are similarly priced at approx 14k a pair (by the way the 804 diamond is only 7500 which my brother has a pair) and the 802 diamond smoked it on every song we demoed back to front and front to back. So much so that we had an audience in the back of the demo room and at the end of MY audition for the speakers, the dealer was a convert himself and told me that there was no song where the o3 did anything better than the 802 diamond. And that the 802 diamond sounded far better on higher end gear and far less than a facsimile of the song and more like the event.

We then hooked both back up to mid end Mcintosh gear and we agreed that the o3 cut the delta between the 2 speakers significantly and at times sounded better than the 802 diamond.

The o3 and 802 diamonds were set up on the same wall in the same room with the exact same electronics and cabling. The demo and comparison was done back to back on the same songs.

On the other hand, Elipsas and Strads are on a different league to the O3 which makes the comparison to the diamonds much more difficult.

Montoya

The SF just sound like music should sound demo them if possible and I promise you will hear what I am talking about the B&W is a great speaker but let your ear be the final judge. I spent almost 8 months researching and demoing as much as I could before finally making my purchase I traveled to Austin, Dallas and a few other places from Houston just to get my ears on different speakers. To me I spent a good amount of money and wanted to make sure I got the best for my dollar I'm happy it was time well spent. It can't be stressed enough to get your ears to determine your final purchase if possible.

Joey_V

Montoya wrote: »

The SF just sound like music should sound demo them if possible and I promise you will hear what I am talking about the B&W is a great speaker but let your ear be the final judge. I spent almost 8 months researching and demoing as much as I could before finally making my purchase I traveled to Austin, Dallas and a few other places from Houston just to get my ears on different speakers. To me I spent a good amount of money and wanted to make sure I got the best for my dollar I'm happy it was time well spent. It can't be stressed enough to get your ears to determine your final purchase if possible.

Montoya wrote: »

The SF just sound like music should sound demo them if possible and I promise you will hear what I am talking about the B&W is a great speaker but let your ear be the final judge. I spent almost 8 months researching and demoing as much as I could before finally making my purchase I traveled to Austin, Dallas and a few other places from Houston just to get my ears on different speakers. To me I spent a good amount of money and wanted to make sure I got the best for my dollar I'm happy it was time well spent. It can't be stressed enough to get your ears to determine your final purchase if possible.

Agreed 100%. Your ears are the final judges. None of us hear the same nor are our preferences the same.

My opinion was that while I will agree that SF sound like music, Diamonds with hi end tube gear sound like the actual event. Diamonds on hi end gear sounded like I was there while the o3 on the same gear sounded similar to when they were on mid end gear and while yes the o3 sounded good, they honestly felt like I was still listening to a pair of speakers - though good speakers.

But there's a difference in my experience between Serblin's creations and Paolo Tezzons current SF line up. Not particularly a fan of the new sound as are a few others. After serblin died, it's just not been the same.

That's why I'm looking closely at the prior creations such as the Strad. Otherwise I'd be very heavily interested in the current Amati Futura or the Lilliums. Although I don't think I can afford the Lilliums given their absurd pricing.

Joey_V

double post sorry

erniejade

In this price range your looking at, what about the legacy aeris?

Joey_V

Have not looked at legacy just yet. no where to demo nearby that I'm aware.

Edit:

Just checked out the website, Aeris looks to be popular model based on the reviews. They also have this "V" that might be too big.

factorz

Have you looked at any of the smaller boutique speaker makers? I own a pair of Vapor Audio speakers and love them. I've also had the chance to hear their Nimbus which is more in your price range and was really impressed. Also the new Salk Exotica sounded really good at Axpona last year. Just my .02

WLDock

factorz wrote: »

Also the new Salk Exotica sounded really good at Axpona last year. Just my .02

Wow, after reading through all three pages I had the same thought. For $20K one could have a set of the Exotica 3's and a set of the SoundScape 8's to roll back and forth (Only about 130lbs each). Would give one options in terms of sound.

I think the OP Joey might be from Chicago? did you check out the Salk speakers at AXPONA? Thoughts?

ZLTFUL

Joey, if Salk is a consideration, I can reach out to my buddy and find out what speakers Jim is bringing with him when he is here in Iowa in late March...may be able to get you an up close and personal demo with some of his stuff.

Joey_V

Hey Fellas -

No longer in Chicago. I'm in Dallas. It's a barren landscape when it comes to audio. Nowhere near the plethora in Chicago. I don't think I'd be able to make it to the Salk fest.... I come back to Chicago first week of april for my baby's 1st birthday, I will be headed to listen to the MBL and the Strads again at that time. No one I know in Chicago has Focal Utopias, so I can't listen to that.