Best Of

Re: R2R dac vs. Delta Sigma type dac

Wait... They make dacs that are not R2r?

I've never heard the budget units but delta sigma sounds like wallpaper in comparison to a r2r dac. Hard to listen to delta sigma afrer having quality R2r at the helm.

VR3

3 ·

Re: What's your limit on Speakers?

Emlyn wrote: »

The most I've ever spent on a pair of speakers was $3K for a pair of Polk L800s and I don't imagine spending more than that. The next biggest spend was on a new pair of Magnepan 1.7i speakers which are an incredible deal until one considers that the equipment needed to get the best out of them can be expensive!

I'm actually going in the opposite direction with speakers. I've been spending LESS on speakers as I've gotten older as my goals have changed. For example, I got a pair of Polk R100s recently because that was what met my requirements for use in a home gym.

I have a pair of Wharfedale Lintons that I paid $1200 a pair for with the stands and have them in a smallish den. I could get a pair of Wharfedale Dovedales for $7500 to replace them. But, the Lintons have about 90 percent of the performance of the Dovedales and they fit the room better so I have no reason to spend that much for an incremental upgrade. Anyway, I really dig the smooth retro sound from the Lintons.

It's also possible to get great sound from modestly priced bookshelf speakers these days like the Polk Reserve line.

But, if someone has the disposable income to spend $20K on a new pair of speakers I'd encourage them to also spend the money necessary to buy the rest of the system's gear to make them perform as intended. That could easily be an additional $20K to $30K. Buying speakers isn't the end of the expenditure on an audio system.

I find in many ways we are in the same boat. The most I have ever spent on speakers new was $4k. My new speakers I just purchased was a Pair of Bookshelf speakers for my office only costing $850 retail and my new speakers in the family room, the floor level was under $4000 which is what I was easily willing to spend years ago.

I just so happen to luck out and also get amazing sounding speakers in both cases. I also went for form factor ( decor ) friendly this time whereas in the past , that would be the last factor in deciding on new speakers.

mantis

1 ·

Re: Post a picture.....any picture...part deux...

While driving east on I-80, few things are as depressing as seeing the ‘Lincoln, Nebraska: 500 miles’ sign in eastern Wyoming.

maxward

3 ·

Re: What's your limit on Speakers?

No cap. However, I think one needs to have an idea of the overall system cost and match components to fit in that budget without anything being too lopsided. Used, used, used. Purchasing speakers new is a game for those with deep pockets and not many hobbies (or fools, possibly some crossover). That is, unless you have a wholesale connection that essentially avoids a majority of depreciation.

billbillw

2 ·

Re: R2R dac vs. Delta Sigma type dac

billbillw wrote: »

I think Trey is perhaps a bit harsh on the Delta Sigmas.

We shall differ on this statement. Having had an Auralic Vega G2 and a TOTL Marantz SA-7S1 CDP that both utilized the Delta Sigma (neither of which were slackers or anywhere near the low end of the totem pole), going from that to two different R2R DAC's made me realize that the DS was a bottleneck to my listening enjoyment. I honestly had no idea what Trey was talking about when he mentioned coming over to my place and mentioning that it sounded like musical wallpaper.

As soon as I heard an R2R DAC in my rig, I knew what direction I was going to go with. Now, both of the aforementioned are out of the rig and I have 2 R2R DAC's. One for the Esoteric transport and/or the Memory Player and the other for streaming. Long story short, I knew as soon as I heard the first R2R in my rig what Trey was talking about.

Yes, Delta Sigma can sound good. It kept me content for many years and I had no issues with it at all. But it was brought to my attention that the filtering was holding me back. Admittedly, I was stubborn about it, but all it took was about 2 seconds of listening to an R2R to where my ears perked up and I exclaimed (rather loudly), "WOW!". There were two witnesses of this forum who can attest to the very moment that happened.

I'll put it to you this way...I will never again own anything that utilizes a Delta Sigma DAC. When you know, you know. All one has to do is Google or use Chat GPT and ask this question, if they re interested in the "technical aspects" of why >>> Does a Delta Sigma DAC introduce noise that needs to be filtered?

I could care less about the technical aspects, honestly. All I care about is the end result as to what hits my ears.

H9, I have not heard your unit at all, nor have even heard of it. But based upon my observations between the two, and given your appreciation (and articulation thereof) for the finer details, along with your specific gear? I think you will be in hog heaven. If you aren't? Return it within your window of return, save a tad bit more and get you a really great R2R DAC.

The only downside to an R2R DAC is that it will not do extreme high resolution conversions. That said, I don't miss them, as the attributes far outweigh what I am missing.

Tom

treitz3

2 ·

Re: What's your limit on Speakers?

I find this topic is interesting as it highlights what is cost to a person.

There are types of gear that you can purchase and it loses value, maintains or appreciates.

My willingness to spend money depends on those factors.

I would spend alot more on something that is near fully depreciated versus 1k on something that would depeeciate 75%

While spending hypothetically let's say 5k is more up front that money could conceivably be recalled at a later date versus dissapearing in certain situations. Just my 2 cents.

These guys spending 60k on speakers worth 25k 5 years later is... Insane to me! Absolutely bonkers

VR3

4 ·

Re: Veri Fi SnubWay......don't listen to music, experience it!

I made sure to place my order for my own SnubWay before my trial was done, to limit the amount of time one would be out of my system.

Shortly after, also added the Main Stream to my system.

Excellent upgrades.

Upstatemax

2 ·

Re: R2R dac vs. Delta Sigma type dac

I'll keep it simple. Less "air", more realism and low level detail with the R2R.
I went from the Teac UD301 to a Denafrips Ares II. That's a similar jump in age between yours. The Teac had a pair of BurrBrown PCM1795 Delta Sigma DACs. At first, I didn't hear a huge difference, but within an hour or two, I started hearing more detail in the R2R, especially low level stuff like a bump in the equipment during recording, or string noises, bass guitar fingering, etc. Some of those things were partially veiled by the Delta Sigma. Overall, it had a more natural and less digital feel. There is a bit of roll-off in the highs with the R2R which I don't think can be avoided to the the mathematical limits of the circuit (bits/frequency). That is probably the cause of feeling a bit less air.
I still use a Delta Sigma on my desktop rig and that uses a much newer Rohm (German) DAC chip. I haven't compared that in my main system with the Denafrips, but I will probably do that soon.

billbillw

1 ·