Pioneer being taken private

I realize that most of what anyone here would be interested in vis-a-vis Pioneer was sold to Onkyo a while back, but I just noticed someplace else that the remainder of the company is being bought by a Hong Kong based investment group & delisted.
https://asia.nikkei.com/Business/Business-Deals/Pioneer-to-slide-under-Hong-Kong-fund-s-umbrella-and-delist

source: http://audiokarma.org/forums/index.php?threads/the-final-death-spiral-of-pioneer.849303/

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Comments

  • Tony MTony M Posts: 7,169
    :o :'(
    Most people just listen to music and watch movies. I EXPERIENCE them.
  • mantismantis Posts: 15,195
    I'm not sure what the hell is going on with Pioneer.I'd like to see them make a huge comeback in the TV market as well as the entire line of Elite.
    Dan
    My personal quest is to save to world of bad audio, one thread at a time.
  • Tony MTony M Posts: 7,169
    edited December 2018
    There will be no need for high end wires either. Or any wires at all probably. :/

    Subwoofers...what were they for? they'll ask. :s
    Most people just listen to music and watch movies. I EXPERIENCE them.
  • OleBootOleBoot Posts: 413
    Ten years down the road, all that will be left are soundbars and powered speakers doing streaming audio.


    The rest of us will be old-farts clinging to our antique sound systems.

    Present tense for me.
    I started out with nothing and have most of it left.
  • rpf65rpf65 Posts: 1,940
    Antique?

    I’m too poor to be an antique.

    I’ll have to settle for old.
  • nooshinjohnnooshinjohn Posts: 19,298
    How a bout we call you”vintage”... has a classy-hipster vibe to it, ya dig?
    The Gear... Carver "Statement" Mono-blocks, TriangleArt Reference SE with Pass Labs Xono Phono Preamp, Walker Precision Motor Drive, ClearAudio Goldfinger Diamond v2 cartridge and Origin Conquerer Mk3c tonearm, Polk Audio "Signature" Reference Series 1.2TL with complete mods, Pass Labs X0.2 three chassis preamp, PS Audio PerfectWave DAC MkII, Pioneer Elite SC-65, Oppo UDP-205 4K Blu-ray player, Sony XBR70x850B 4k, Polk audio AB700/800 "in-wall" surrounds.

    Saying that it's "too hard" to pursue your dreams is no different than admitting to yourself that you are too lazy to achieve them.

  • mrlorenmrloren Posts: 1,702
    Hmm, picking are getting slim. we are now down to four mainstream manufactures

    Onkyo/Pioneer
    D&M
    Sony
    Yamaha

    Glad we still have a good choice on speakers. I do miss Advent
    When I was a kid my parents told me to turn it down. Now I'm an adult and my kids tell me to turn it down.

    Family Room:
    Samsung UN60H,
    Denon AVR-X4400H, Emotiva XPA3 GEN3
    Oppo BDP-93,Sony UBP-X800BM, Sony DVP-NS3100ES, WD Live HUB.
    Main: Polk Signature S60
    Center: Polk CSi-A6
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    Bed Room;
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    Working Warehouse;
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    Mini tower PC with 400GB of music
  • F1nutF1nut Posts: 41,034
    I understand it somewhat... take a look at what passes for music these days. A crappy WiFi speaker is good enough for most of it. It took a certain level of talent to create music forty years ago, and a good stereo to reproduce it

    Krap in, krap out these days.

    Nailed it!

    I heard the highlights of this years Grammy nominees the other day. I honestly had not realized how bad music is these days. I could see using it as a very effect method of torture.
    Political Correctness'.........defined

    "A doctrine fostered by a delusional, illogical minority and rabidly promoted by an unscrupulous mainstream media, which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible to pick up a t-u-r-d by the clean end."


  • Tony MTony M Posts: 7,169
    I had a young girl almost spas out when I mentioned her friend shoud listen to our classic rock station for some good music.

    She almost yelled out...That's old people music! :s


    But I sure still like it! B)
    Most people just listen to music and watch movies. I EXPERIENCE them.
  • DSkipDSkip Posts: 15,349
    Pioneer’s failure has nothing to do with music and everything to do with over saturation of the market with 20 receivers per year and a changing auto market with infotainment centers and extreme integration.

    They didnt adapt properly and are now facing the consequences.
    audiothesis.com/

    Speakers: Harbeth: 30.2, SHL5+; Usher: Be-10, T-515; Rosso Fiorentino: Elba, Pienza, Certaldo, Fiesole, Volterra; Polk: T50, Signature S15, RTA 15tl, RTi12; Sonner Audio Allegro Unum, Legato Unum, Legato Semis, Legato Duo; Emerald Physics CS-2.8; Klipsch KLF-20
    Preamps: Shuguang S200MK, Dayens Ampino, Parasound P5
    Amps: Shuguang S845MK, Dayens Ampino Monoblocks, Parasound A23
    Integrateds: Triode Corporation TRV-88SER, MastersounD: BoX, Dueventi, Compact 845, Evolution 845; North Star Design Blue Diamond
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    Cabling: Wireworld
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  • OleBootOleBoot Posts: 413
    I remember my Dad saying that all he could hear when listening to my music was the drums (well, my system at the time wasn't too good :) ). He was brought up on big band music. I sometimes wonder what I would be in to if I were young.
    I started out with nothing and have most of it left.
  • nooshinjohnnooshinjohn Posts: 19,298
    edited December 2018
    Never said their failure had anything to do with music.... The auto market is adapting to consumer tastes. They have also forced the aftermarket pretty much out of things through full system integration. Even if they tried to adapt, there was little room for them, unless they did like Bose, Meridian, and several other companies by becoming OE providers.

    Pioneer, for whatever reason, chose not to.

    The Gear... Carver "Statement" Mono-blocks, TriangleArt Reference SE with Pass Labs Xono Phono Preamp, Walker Precision Motor Drive, ClearAudio Goldfinger Diamond v2 cartridge and Origin Conquerer Mk3c tonearm, Polk Audio "Signature" Reference Series 1.2TL with complete mods, Pass Labs X0.2 three chassis preamp, PS Audio PerfectWave DAC MkII, Pioneer Elite SC-65, Oppo UDP-205 4K Blu-ray player, Sony XBR70x850B 4k, Polk audio AB700/800 "in-wall" surrounds.

    Saying that it's "too hard" to pursue your dreams is no different than admitting to yourself that you are too lazy to achieve them.

  • DSkipDSkip Posts: 15,349
    I understand it somewhat... take a look at what passes for music these days. A crappy WiFi speaker is good enough for most of it. It took a certain level of talent to create music forty years ago, and a good stereo to reproduce it

    Krap in, krap out these days.

    How does this not insinuate it’s about our ‘crap’ music?
    audiothesis.com/

    Speakers: Harbeth: 30.2, SHL5+; Usher: Be-10, T-515; Rosso Fiorentino: Elba, Pienza, Certaldo, Fiesole, Volterra; Polk: T50, Signature S15, RTA 15tl, RTi12; Sonner Audio Allegro Unum, Legato Unum, Legato Semis, Legato Duo; Emerald Physics CS-2.8; Klipsch KLF-20
    Preamps: Shuguang S200MK, Dayens Ampino, Parasound P5
    Amps: Shuguang S845MK, Dayens Ampino Monoblocks, Parasound A23
    Integrateds: Triode Corporation TRV-88SER, MastersounD: BoX, Dueventi, Compact 845, Evolution 845; North Star Design Blue Diamond
    Sources: AURALiC Aries, Denon HEOS Link, North Star Design: Magnifico, Supremo, Incanto, Intenso, Venti
    Cabling: Wireworld
    TV: Sony XBR-75X940C
  • nooshinjohnnooshinjohn Posts: 19,298
    edited December 2018
    I was speaking to the general decline we have observed in the hobby that is two-channel audio. Most Gen-X'ers and up could care less about spending time with a beer in hand in a dimly lit room while listening to a Hi-Fi rig of any real quality. Rather, they slip on headphones and dive into the latest video game.

    Further, a good chunk of the music being produced is actually somebody else's tunes being over-dubbed with new words, and oftentimes, they make no effort to disguise it. I won't even get into the obscene language used... stuff that is OK for them to use as lyrics, but if it were said by anyone of a certain viewpoint, they would be removed from the airwaves, loose their contracts or endorsement deals, be fired and anyone within 7 degrees of separation of them would have their lives destroyed.

    Point is, the generation that finds such music appealing doesn't need much to listen to it, and playing it on a rig like many of us have won't help it sound any better.

    This also is not meant to imply that all music today is crap, just that finding quality stuff is much harder than it was before the Beastie Boys and 2Live Crew came along.
    The Gear... Carver "Statement" Mono-blocks, TriangleArt Reference SE with Pass Labs Xono Phono Preamp, Walker Precision Motor Drive, ClearAudio Goldfinger Diamond v2 cartridge and Origin Conquerer Mk3c tonearm, Polk Audio "Signature" Reference Series 1.2TL with complete mods, Pass Labs X0.2 three chassis preamp, PS Audio PerfectWave DAC MkII, Pioneer Elite SC-65, Oppo UDP-205 4K Blu-ray player, Sony XBR70x850B 4k, Polk audio AB700/800 "in-wall" surrounds.

    Saying that it's "too hard" to pursue your dreams is no different than admitting to yourself that you are too lazy to achieve them.

  • BlueFoxBlueFox Posts: 10,477
    Oh I’m not sure today’s music is that bad. For example, I love Nicki Minaj. :)

    rvd33zssn3dh.png
    Bud - Silicon Valley

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    Magico S5 MKII Mcast Rose speakers, SPOD spikes

    Shunyata Triton v3/Typhon QR on source, Denali 2000 (2) on amps
    Shunyata Sigma XLR analog ICs, Sigma speaker cables
    Shunyata Sigma HC (2), Sigma Analog, Sigma Digital, Z Anaconda (3) power cables

    Mapleshade Samson V.3 four shelf solid maple rack, Micropoint brass footers
    Three 20 amp circuits.
  • nooshinjohnnooshinjohn Posts: 19,298
    Your list proves my point. :p ;)
    The Gear... Carver "Statement" Mono-blocks, TriangleArt Reference SE with Pass Labs Xono Phono Preamp, Walker Precision Motor Drive, ClearAudio Goldfinger Diamond v2 cartridge and Origin Conquerer Mk3c tonearm, Polk Audio "Signature" Reference Series 1.2TL with complete mods, Pass Labs X0.2 three chassis preamp, PS Audio PerfectWave DAC MkII, Pioneer Elite SC-65, Oppo UDP-205 4K Blu-ray player, Sony XBR70x850B 4k, Polk audio AB700/800 "in-wall" surrounds.

    Saying that it's "too hard" to pursue your dreams is no different than admitting to yourself that you are too lazy to achieve them.

  • nooshinjohnnooshinjohn Posts: 19,298
    OleBoot wrote: »
    I remember my Dad saying that all he could hear when listening to my music was the drums (well, my system at the time wasn't too good :) ). He was brought up on big band music. I sometimes wonder what I would be in to if I were young.

    When I was young, I was into The Beatles. Today, I have a wide range of music and listen to whatever the mood calls for. Classical to Big Band, to Metal and back to an artist that cannot be named for PC reasons... whatever the mood is and sometimes who I am remembering.
    The Gear... Carver "Statement" Mono-blocks, TriangleArt Reference SE with Pass Labs Xono Phono Preamp, Walker Precision Motor Drive, ClearAudio Goldfinger Diamond v2 cartridge and Origin Conquerer Mk3c tonearm, Polk Audio "Signature" Reference Series 1.2TL with complete mods, Pass Labs X0.2 three chassis preamp, PS Audio PerfectWave DAC MkII, Pioneer Elite SC-65, Oppo UDP-205 4K Blu-ray player, Sony XBR70x850B 4k, Polk audio AB700/800 "in-wall" surrounds.

    Saying that it's "too hard" to pursue your dreams is no different than admitting to yourself that you are too lazy to achieve them.

  • tonybtonyb Posts: 30,573
    edited December 2018
    I might agree with John on this one. Not that there isn't good artists today making some great music, with great vocals, and recorded well, they just never seem to get the recognition that main stream artists do.

    Why is that ?

    Various reasons, people don't appreciate good music as much today as they did yesterday. People listen differently today, on a wider variety of gear too that doesn't particularly benefit well recorded material.

    If you go to any audio show, your not going to hear the top 20 off the charts today. Most of that music isn't recorded for the type of gear they are selling. Now if it was a car audio show, then you may hear most of your radio favorites of the day.

    It used to be said, that music represents the times we live in. If music today appears to be a convoluted mess to you, then maybe that is just a representation of the times we live in.

    Music is suppose to move you, emotionally, and physically at times. It's a reminder of times in your life, good bad and ugly. That's how we make that connection. Our parents related to the music of their times because of the emotional connection, the reminder of things in their life. So when our music of the 60s-80s came along, they had no emotional connection to it. We older folks here, have no emotional connection to todays music. So it's not that todays music is all bad, it just holds no emotional connection for us. This also works in reverse too. People today, have no emotional connection to our music of the past, so it's harder for them to relate to and appreciate.

    The music of today, good bad or ugly, will have an emotional connection down the road for those who grew up with it. Somewhere along that journey, they'll learn to appreciate music in the same way we have done and seek out well recorded music of all genres, from all time periods.
    HT SYSTEM-2 channel
    Sony 850c 4k
    Pioneer elite vhx 21
    Sony 4k BRP
    SVS SB-2000
    Dynaudio Audience 72
    Polk FX500 surrounds
    Cary xciter dac
    Cullen modded Sonos
    Joule la-100 pre
    B&k Ref 4420 amp

    Cables-
    Acoustic zen Satori speaker cables
    Acoustic zen Matrix 2 IC's
    Analysis plus crystal oval ic's
    Wireworld eclipse 7 ic's
    Audio metallurgy ga-o digital cable

    Kitchen

    Sonos zp90
    B&k 1430
    Tad 803 speakers
  • tonybtonyb Posts: 30,573
    I hope, Pioneer comes back with a vengeance. Make some higher end stuff, with a vintage flair to it.

    In the other thread about the Hagel Rost, I'm reminded of todays needs for connectivity in an all-in-one product. Pioneer may do well to take notes from Hagel.
    HT SYSTEM-2 channel
    Sony 850c 4k
    Pioneer elite vhx 21
    Sony 4k BRP
    SVS SB-2000
    Dynaudio Audience 72
    Polk FX500 surrounds
    Cary xciter dac
    Cullen modded Sonos
    Joule la-100 pre
    B&k Ref 4420 amp

    Cables-
    Acoustic zen Satori speaker cables
    Acoustic zen Matrix 2 IC's
    Analysis plus crystal oval ic's
    Wireworld eclipse 7 ic's
    Audio metallurgy ga-o digital cable

    Kitchen

    Sonos zp90
    B&k 1430
    Tad 803 speakers
  • There is gobs of fine music being written and produced today. I use NPR during the day as my background and I am always discovering new stuff, good stuff.
    2 channel: Anthem 225 Integrated amp; Parasound Ztuner; TechnicsTT SL1350; Vincent PHO-8 phono pre; Marantz CD6005 spinner; Polk Signature S60's with ZU Audio IBIS jumpers; Cables: ZU Mission IC's, LAT International SC, ZU Mission power cords, all into a PS Audio Dectet Power center.

    All TV's sound enhanced by Polk Magnfi Mini's.

    Other; SDA2BTL's, M10 series II, M7C's, Hafler XL600 amp, RB-980BX, Parasound HCA-1500 amp , P5 preamp, all in storage. All speakers have had crossover rebuilds, resulting in a small fortune invested in Sonicaps, and tweeter upgrades.

    Political memes posted as fact and accepted as fact, are sign language of the ignorant, for the ignorant

    tonyb said " but even socialists can do a good thing here and there

    Social media makes dumb people dumber and smart people dumb then dumber.
  • mdaudioguymdaudioguy Posts: 4,873
    It seems like popular music and the stuff audiophiles* listen to have always (or often) been different things. The AOR/classic rock genre, while popular, did not often make it into the realm of popular music. There wasn't even a Grammy category for rock albums until 1995.

    * I hate this term, but can't think of a better one at the moment.
    7.1 - polk RTi10 x 3 (LCR) : FXi3 x 2 : RTi4 x 4 : Sunfire SDS-12 : Yamaha Aventage RX-A2040 : Adcom GFA-7500 : Squeezebox Touch : DIRECTV : Roku SE : Panasonic PT-AX200U PJ @ 120"
    5.1 - Definitive Technology ProMonitor 800 x 4 : ProCenter 1000 : Klipsch Sub-10 : Pioneer Elite SC-91: DIRECTV : LG OLED55B6P : Roku Premiere+
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  • nooshinjohnnooshinjohn Posts: 19,298
    If I had an emotional connection to that, at my age I would be on my way to jail... 15 will get you 20.
    The Gear... Carver "Statement" Mono-blocks, TriangleArt Reference SE with Pass Labs Xono Phono Preamp, Walker Precision Motor Drive, ClearAudio Goldfinger Diamond v2 cartridge and Origin Conquerer Mk3c tonearm, Polk Audio "Signature" Reference Series 1.2TL with complete mods, Pass Labs X0.2 three chassis preamp, PS Audio PerfectWave DAC MkII, Pioneer Elite SC-65, Oppo UDP-205 4K Blu-ray player, Sony XBR70x850B 4k, Polk audio AB700/800 "in-wall" surrounds.

    Saying that it's "too hard" to pursue your dreams is no different than admitting to yourself that you are too lazy to achieve them.

  • halohalo Posts: 4,748
    If I had an emotional connection to that, at my age I would be on my way to jail... 15 will get you 20.

    She's an adult at 25 my friend. Ariana Grande. Perfectly legal :)
  • ClipdatClipdat Posts: 5,686
    Ariana Who?

    Give me a singer that can actually, you know, sing.

    MI0004328114.jpg?partner=allrovi.com
    • "Electronic music is human sound adapting to indulge technology, and for some, it feels like the signature sound of energy. New and abstract sounds over hypnotic rhythms can conjure vast soundscapes for escape, pleasure, and transcendence."
  • Danny TseDanny Tse Posts: 5,226
    mrloren wrote: »
    Hmm, picking are getting slim. we are now down to four mainstream manufactures

    Onkyo/Pioneer
    D&M
    Sony
    Yamaha

    Glad we still have a good choice on speakers. I do miss Advent

    You forgot:

    Samsung/Harman Int'l
    Technics (Panasonic)

    But, in general, you are correct.

  • GlennDogGlennDog Posts: 1,698
    Ten years down the road, all that will be left are soundbars and powered speakers doing streaming audio.


    The rest of us will be old-farts clinging to our antique sound systems.

    omniscient, for sure . . . and I'm very much ok with that!
    Power Rogue M180 monos & Adcom GFA 5802
    PS Audio PerfectWave Power Plant 10
    Rears Salk SuperCharged Surrounds
    DAC North Star Design Supremo
    Source PSA PWT & Oppo 205
    Pre/Pro Integra DHC 40.1
    LCD Samsung LN46B750
    Mains Salk HT2-TL
    Pre Cary SLP-98 F1
    Center Salk HT2C
    Wires MIT S3.3
    PSA PC AC-12
  • Tony MTony M Posts: 7,169
    Ten years down the road, all that will be left are soundbars and powered speakers doing streaming audio.


    The rest of us will be old-farts clinging to our antique sound systems.

    And debating the ol which wires/cables are better than Monster wire. :D
    Most people just listen to music and watch movies. I EXPERIENCE them.
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