Joule pre overhaul...

kharp1 · February 2018

I packed up the Joule and shipped it to Rich Brkich at Signature Sound today with the original intentions of having it looked at and basically doing a checkup on it. Started thinking that was kind of silly considering it is getting close to 20 years old now. So my plans were to spend $2k-$3k in replacing the caps (there's a bunch of them) and and upgrading them to some TOTL caps.

Now I'm wondering if maybe I'd be better off selling it as is (it still sounds great and performs flawlessly) and taking that money plus the 2-3k I was going to spend and maybe buying a new, different pre. I have no idea what that would be, I haven't really been looking around, I wasn't in the market for one.

Or, would the 2-3k investment in upgrading the Joule be the better return on sound investment. And, if so, what caps should I be looking at? I was initially thinking the Mundorf Supreme Evo Silver Gold Oil caps in the power supply section, but, Mr Brkich didn't particularly like the Supreme caps for the power section, instead recommended the Mundorf MTube caps (not familiar with them).

The Duelund's are a little trickier in that some of their caps have odd physical sizes, and, are expensive. Plus, he recommends the cast copper instead of the cast copper silver, stating that the silver takes it too far away from the "sound" of a Joule. If Duelunds are not an option, what other caps would be recommended? And what about that cap makes it a good choice? Anyone? Anyone? Bueller?

nooshinjohn · February 2018

Trade up and go for a Pass Labs XP20

kharp1 · February 2018

And that's very much a possibility. The Joule doesn't offered balanced inputs/outputs, which isn't a big deal currently, but, would like to have any end game piece be truly balanced.

headrott · February 2018

kharp1 wrote: »

And that's very much a possibility. The Joule doesn't offered balanced inputs/outputs, which isn't a big deal currently, but, would like to have any end game piece be truly balanced.

After going with Balanced Audio Technology, I haven't looked back. A balanced system, is exactly that.

I think you have a great idea going fully balanced, IMO.

tonyb · February 2018

kharp1 wrote: »

And that's very much a possibility. The Joule doesn't offered balanced inputs/outputs, which isn't a big deal currently, but, would like to have any end game piece be truly balanced.

Tough call Kerry. To me...an end game piece is about the sound, not the connections. I might look at other brands with similar characteristics if the Joule pleases you. VAC or VTL would be 2 places I'd look. The Cary 05 is nice too but re-tubing that sucker with good NOS tubes can get expensive. Cayin may be worth a look see also, though I've only heard one specific model of theirs but I did like what I heard.

You can also spend 4-5k on a newer pre, and not like it as much as the Joule too. Spending more doesn't guarantee better sound.

I might be more inclined to dig deeper with the guys at Signature sound. Get more of an insight as to what to expect, sound wise, after the upgrades. Maybe they can suggest an upgrade path for you that still mirrors your taste in sound also.

If you stay on the Joule path, I've heard the Joule 300 is an end game piece, though finding one is like looking for a razor is Russ's boom truck.

WagnerRC · February 2018

I believe you made a wise choice.

nooshinjohn · February 2018

tonyb wrote: »

If you stay on the Joule path, I've heard the Joule 300 is an end game piece, though finding one is like looking for a razor is Russ's boom truck.

Admittedly. Russ doesn’t shave too often, but he does tend to cut himself all the time. Last I heard, his truck has so many wasted blades in it he can’t see out the windshield, except through a cardboard tube he uses like a periscope.

tonyb · February 2018

Silly John, you know Russ has no razors....he has the Vet groom him every so often.

My comments on the pre stands.....don't be in such a hurry to send it off, do a little digging to better define the path that best suits you.

maxward · February 2018

Thanks for posting this, @kharp1. That’s a tough decision you have, especially since the Joule is now in transit. The guy who sold mine to me had the LA-300ME in his main system, and it did sound wonderful. However, as Tony said, these are not often on the market and, who knows, the mods you are contemplating might get you most of the way there. I think Rich at Signature Sound will give you some good advice on that question. On the other hand, after watching Paul McGowan’s video on short vs long interconnects/speaker cables, it would be tempting to consider upgrading to a balanced preamp. Good luck.

kharp1 · February 2018

I felt like it needed to go back just to get a once over and thorough checkup. I had been thinking about sending it in for a look see every since I picked it up over a year ago and things worked out where I had a good time period to send it in and give Rich time with it. He's pretty excited to use this as an opportunity to test and possibly offer an upgrade package for the future as these pieces are starting to get nearer the window of cap life.

@tonyb the connections are not the main priority, however, all things being equal, I would like to have balanced capabilities though I realize just having the "connections" doesn't mean true balanced topography. The Joule will never achieve that by design, but, that doesn't mean it's not a really good piece now, and, can probably achieve an even greater level with newer, better caps and resistors, an, maybe some better internal wiring.

RIch has stated he wants to get it in and give it a going over and run some tests before we start talking about what can go where and what it will do. If we can reach a quality to price point that I can live with I'm going to have the work done and see what kind of improvement it made.

maxward · February 2018

Thank you. Keep us informed about what you and Rich decide to do. It will be interesting to hear about the results.

tonyb · February 2018

maxward wrote: »

Thank you. Keep us informed about what you and Rich decide to do. It will be interesting to hear about the results.

Ditto.....

WagnerRC · February 2018

This one is on Rich's bench. not mine

kharp1 · February 2018

Geez, those are some monster caps back there!

kharp1 · February 2018

I guess I'm just more secure than you

pitdogg2 · February 2018

Very nice

vcwatkins · February 2018

I'll be very interested to hear what Rich has to say about upgrade paths. Nothing is certain, but I can't see ever letting go of my Joule. And I might be willing to invest a bit more in it if it makes a material improvement. For now, though, I'm very happily married to this thing.

maxward · February 2018

Me, too. At the time, when I inserted the J-E into the system it made the single biggest improvement in sound quality in my stereo. My wife remarked about it from a couple of rooms away. The caps on that LA-300 are a big part of its $12k list price.

F1nut · February 2018

kharp1 wrote: »

I packed up the Joule and shipped it to Rich Brkich at Signature Sound today with the original intentions of having it looked at and basically doing a checkup on it. Started thinking that was kind of silly considering it is getting close to 20 years old now. So my plans were to spend $2k-$3k in replacing the caps (there's a bunch of them) and and upgrading them to some TOTL caps.

Now I'm wondering if maybe I'd be better off selling it as is (it still sounds great and performs flawlessly) and taking that money plus the 2-3k I was going to spend and maybe buying a new, different pre. I have no idea what that would be, I haven't really been looking around, I wasn't in the market for one.

Or, would the 2-3k investment in upgrading the Joule be the better return on sound investment. And, if so, what caps should I be looking at? I was initially thinking the Mundorf Supreme Evo Silver Gold Oil caps in the power supply section, but, Mr Brkich didn't particularly like the Supreme caps for the power section, instead recommended the Mundorf MTube caps (not familiar with them).

The Duelund's are a little trickier in that some of their caps have odd physical sizes, and, are expensive. Plus, he recommends the cast copper instead of the cast copper silver, stating that the silver takes it too far away from the "sound" of a Joule. If Duelunds are not an option, what other caps would be recommended? And what about that cap makes it a good choice? Anyone? Anyone? Bueller?

Mundorf MTube caps are excellent.

GlennDog · February 2018

Yoda has spoken . . . Do Not disregard the advice

kharp1 · February 2018

GlennDog wrote: »

Yoda has spoken . . . Do Not disregard the advice

I humbly accept it with great reverence. Was hoping he would offer his opinion.

tonyb · February 2018

That LA-300 is a beaut.

maxward · March 2018

Any news regarding the upgrade? My tech guy has told me that it’s time to recap my J-E, so I’m looking forward to what you and Rich end up choosing for capacitors.

kharp1 · March 2018

Haven't heard back yet. Feel like an expecting dad.

maxward · March 2018

I can imagine. I’ll keep checking here. Good luck.

tonyb · March 2018

kharp1 wrote: »

Haven't heard back yet. Feel like an expecting dad.

Ya gonna hand out cigars when you get her back ? If so, I have a few requests.

tonyb · March 2018

DSkip wrote: »

I think Kerry has something else or two that might mandate cigars over the Joule.

Amen Skip, dude is on a role. The boy can move faster than Usain Bolt when he wants to.

kharp1 · March 2018

I can't afford cigars, I'm freakin BROKE! I was happy with the ipod and headphones. How did I get so deep in this hole? I'm so ashamed I don't even recognize myself anymore!

dromunds · March 2018

When ya recognize yerself again I’ll take a Cuban!

verb · March 2018

Cigars? I'm in!

GlennDog · March 2018

kharp1 wrote: »

I can't afford cigars, I'm freakin BROKE!

This is good news For Me!
Maybe I can get dibs on some of this FS merchandise!

Joule pre overhaul...

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