Tesla Model III

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  • tonybtonyb Posts: 30,874
    LOL, now that's real science fiction right there Sal. 140 ?? They'd never allow it. You'd have to raise social security to 130, lol. The people that run the planet have this notion that once you are outside of your working years you are no longer any use to the state. Prolonged life doesn't fit into that ideology, your a drain on the system after x amount of years.

    Better chance of us being a multi-planet race, now that I can dig and really is the only option for survival of our species. Except Mars doesn't tickle my fancy as a vacation spot for some reason. Maybe it's just me, I dunno. Much prefer a planet like in Avatar.

    40 billion people ? That means mass amounts of orgy's, no abortions, no birth control, and about 500 years in the making....with time off to do it some more. lol Sounds like fun....sign me up. :)
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  • ken brydsonken brydson Posts: 7,390
    tonyb wrote: »
    EVFrisbee wrote: »
    Well, I'm a debit card kind of guy but i do have one Client that pays in cash.

    TonyB did you see this article?

    http://electrek.co/2016/04/26/automakers-fuel-cell-hydrogen-electric-vehicles/

    Somebody here told me that Hydrogen is going to beat Elelctric cars. Do you still think they are correct?

    tonyb wrote: »

    How many bumper stickers are you up too now?

    I think you already know my feelings on that Sal. Hydrogen is a nice idea, but not practical with no infrastructure either to support it. At least electric has some infrastructure to support it so that's a leg up for them.

    I think they all are nice ideas, hydrogen, electric, solar wind, canned pig farts, you name it. None however have the capacity needed to replace fossil fuels though.

    But....that's how innovation happens and new ideas formed, I get that.

    Unfortunately, globally....we still have a good chunk of the planet that still lives in poverty. The only way for them to rise up out of it is to burn fossil fuels, create jobs and build an economy that's self sustaining. Much the same way we did. If we never used fossil fuels, just bypassed the whole idea and went straight to solar/wind, where would we be today ?

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  • cnh wrote: »
    some of us have facial hair. I used to have a full beard WORSE than Russ's when I was younger, but then it got grey and I went with the goatee! lol

    Embrace the grey my brother.


    I have no use for a sedan but would look at an all wheel drive utility vehicle able to carry full sheets of plywood.
  • SamiSami Posts: 4,662
    I went for a hybrid BMW (between a V12 and V8) and the mileage is great too (almost 7MPG on the first day of driving).
  • SamiSami Posts: 4,662
    nbrowser wrote: »
    I had a feeling I liked you...this just proves it to this gearhead!
    :)

    tkbdbh227rvr.jpg


  • cmy330gocmy330go Posts: 2,303
    edited May 2016
    EVFrisbee wrote: »
    Which ///M has a V10 ?

    M5

    Definitely one of the most bang for the buck cars on the used market right now.

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  • ZLTFULZLTFUL Posts: 4,877
    cmy330go wrote: »
    EVFrisbee wrote: »
    Which ///M has a V10 ?

    E60 M5

    Definitely one of the most bang for the buck cars on the used market right now.

    Fixed it for you. The F10 M5 went to the twin turbo 4.4l V8
    E28 and E34 M5s were traditional BMW I6s.
    E39 went to a 4.9l NA V8

    The S85 V10 is arguably one of the sexiest sounding production sport sedan engines ever made.

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  • SamiSami Posts: 4,662
    edited May 2016
    EVFrisbee wrote: »
    Which ///M has a V10 ?

    M5 and M6. Mine is a E64 M6.

    3s9xcd59m1t2.jpg


  • trjtrj Posts: 323
    @Sami great taste in cars you have. I am a big BMW fan. Had E36 and E46 coupes. Moved to Audi B7 chassis and not so happy. Currently debating on a 6 series or a jaguar XK/XKR. But that V10 you have is a gem of a car.

    I am one of those people who think electric cars have still about 20-30 years to be a common mode of transportation. Tesla sure is going above and beyond with the introduction of Model III. How much success it gets is yet to be seen. All I say is good luck Tesla.
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  • lightman1lightman1 Posts: 10,243
    I drive a six cylinder. 6.7 liter straight six. 5-8 mpg on a good day. I'm killing the dinosaurs again.
  • SamiSami Posts: 4,662
    lightman1 wrote: »
    I drive a six cylinder. 6.7 liter straight six. 5-8 mpg on a good day. I'm killing the dinosaurs again.

    Diesel Cummins?
  • trjtrj Posts: 323
    EVFrisbee wrote: »
    There are a bunch of people that think that 2023 will be the start of the next Oil crash.

    2022 is guesstimated to be the year that batteries become so cheap to make that Electric Car prices will fall below Gas Car prices. That is said to be the trigger that will create the next Oil Crash.

    Bloomberg.com has written up articles on this.

    Cost of the Batteries per KW is key. Right now the estimated cost for the Chevy Bolt is $145 per KW and for the Model 3 they claim it'll be $133

    Those prices are much lower than what the experts predicted.

    Getting the price down to $95 per KW is key.

    When the LEAF came out the price was $800+ per KW and now it's $229 per KW

    Makes a huge difference.

    dlw6h0xmhr3n.jpg

    Battery cost alone is not the question. The supporting infrastructure is yet to be built. For now electric car will be a supplementary mode of transportation. A daily driver that gets charged while being parked at night in one's garage or a designated place. One cant expect to make road trips on an electric car without extensive planning on where to stop and how long to charge the batteries. Then comes the service department. It will be a while till the mechanic/service technicians are competent and available everywhere. Hence my guess, 20-30 years for electric cars to be mainstream.
    I would love to have a daily driver electric car and have a thundering supercharged V8s for the nice days. :smile:
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  • lightman1lightman1 Posts: 10,243
    Sami wrote: »
    lightman1 wrote: »
    I drive a six cylinder. 6.7 liter straight six. 5-8 mpg on a good day. I'm killing the dinosaurs again.

    Diesel Cummins?

    ;)
  • mhardy6647mhardy6647 Posts: 21,250
    edited May 2016
    naah.
  • My biggest problem with battery powered vehicles has always been the dirty nature of the battery production. I thought the idea of building a battery plant in Nevada was pure genius. The groundwater in that part of Nevada is already contaminated beyond hope so Tesla will get a free pass for any long term problems.

    I have worked with electric boats for over 25 years so have followed battery evolution every step of the way hoping for the big breakthrough. Recent studies from MIT and A&M do not hold much hope for the long term viability of lithium chemistry batteries for heavy vehicles. (Heavy being defined as anything over one ton)

    Without major taxpayer backing your $95.00 per kw number is not going to happen building lithium based batteries in Nevada. Weight is another factor

    I am on board with the idea of alternative propulsion systems and feel we have a responsibility to be better custodians of the planet so while we might not agree on the current iteration of the electric car we do agree in principal.



  • trjtrj Posts: 323
    EVFrisbee wrote: »
    I have to disagree with you. I have 50+ friends with EV's that go to work everyday with their EV's some do have to charge at work and some do not need to.

    As per Road Trips. you can take a Tesla Model X or S right now and drive cross country and every 250 miles you can stop and charge up on the Totally Free SuperChargers.

    In 30 minutes they give you 170 miles of range. If you pull in empty it may take 45 mins.

    That means if you drive 80MPH then you'll need to stop every 3 hours. The GPS in the car tells you where to go. There is less and less planning involved.

    Maybe you are 19 years old but every since I passed 45 I need to pee every 3 hours, works perfectly fine, Stop, Charge, Pee, Get a sandwich, do some Social Networking and take off for another 3 hours of driving.

    I know guys who go with 100 Tesla's at a time, cross country!

    Currently Tesla has 221 Service Centers in the World and by the time the Model 3 comes out they will have 440.

    Service is not a problem.

    Sal
    No, I am not 19 nor 45. There is nothing about age in this equation. With your theory/explanation all senior citizens should be leaving their buicks and driving tesla or nissan leaf because their pee time and charging time is synchronized. If someone needs to pee, they need to pee whether he/she is 19 or 45 or whether they need to charge their car or not.

    It doesnt matter if someone does a cross county on a tesla model s, people do cross country on a bicycle. Much cheaper than an electric car and greener too. Does it make bicycle traveling a better choice than in an electric car?


    You are looking at the advantages and I am looking at shortcomings.
    My point is, 221(or 440) service stations are no where near how many gas stations and service stations are present for internal combustion engine.

    Lets take a 7 hour road trip for an example. Internal Combustion cars will take 10 minutes to fuel up, within that time you can pee, get a sandwitch or anything. If you are driving a fully charged electric car and stopping every 3 hours and charge for 30 minutes(1 hour because you stop two times in this trip). So, instead of spending 7 hours and 10 minutes, you spend 8 hours. So, 50 extra minutes of the trip you are spending immobile. If its a really beautiful location facing a mountain or lake, I can relate enjoying my time while I wait for the batteries to charge but its not the case all the time.
    What about traffic jams/construction detours? When sitting idle, you are still discharging the batteries with the AC, radio, lights etc. Even on petrol powered cars, I get an uneasy feeling of running out of gas if I have to take a detour.
    What about the charging stations being out of your way? You take a detour from your route, that adds up time too.
    What about lining up for a place in the charging station? You wait for another guy to finish charging.
    The fast charging stations will degrade the batteries, so there is another additional cost down the line.

    I am not against electric cars at all, there is tremendous amount of torque available at any given time, its cleaner than fossil fuel. No doubt it is the future. In fact, I test drove a model S two years ago and almost bought it, but held off because of the limited infrastructure and high cost. For 85k out of the door cost on a 90D, the cost was just not justifiable. I live 1.5 miles from a tesla service center, and still I am not comfortable to buy an electric car as my solo mode of transportation. Hopefully Model III brings in the change sooner than my guess of 20 years.
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  • EndersShadowEndersShadow Posts: 16,493
    edited May 2016
    Until I can buy something big to tote the family, that lets me recharge FAST and not need to stop frequently to recharge and doenst cost an arm and a leg its a dead tech.

    GREAT for those folks who work close to home, play close to home, rarely travel. I totally get the tech, and understand the cost savings but again until the range is MUCH MORE and the recharge takes less time its just not going to hit mainstream.

    At least a hybrid has a gas tank you can use for a longer trip so it extends the range.

    But TBH if I have my kids with me on a road trip, I don't want that trip to take ANY LONGER than necessary. Stopping for 45 mins every couple hours will turn a bad trip already into an even longer one.

    Then the other issue is weight. A battery weighs a lot more and the farther you want to go, the more battery's you need, which means your heavier, which means you need more batteries to pull the added weight.............

    Its got a place but until the efficiency is up on them and you can get the equivalent of a SUV/MiniVan with ALMOST the same range and features and cost that doesnt take forever to recharge, its not going to hit mainstream.

    I think the perfect trade off for it is hybrids as you can still extend the range outside what the battery has to offer if you drain it. That to me is the kicker with those.

    I'm sure you will argue with me on this Sal and I'm not interested in that, but that is my perspective.
    "....not everything that can be counted counts, and not everything that counts can be counted." William Bruce Cameron, Informal Sociology: A Casual Introduction to Sociological Thinking (1963)
  • lightman1lightman1 Posts: 10,243
    Why did the chicken cross the road?


    He didn't...... Made it just over half way and got hit by a Tesla! Didn't hear the damn thing coming!



    Saftey first.
  • mrbironmrbiron Posts: 4,963
    So driving non stop, peeing out the window, from boston to San Francisco (based on full 45 minute charge) takes 49.5 hours. To do it in a tesla, you almost add another 1/2 day on top. Nobody (except the one guy that we've been reading about since the leaf thread) is taking a Tesla across the country so we need to stop using that as an example.

    Now to do the same trip in a gas guzzler with an average 350 mile range, will net you 40-50 minutes of lost time at the pump.

    I feel like we've been down the agenda road before........

    Let people buy the car because they want it as oppose to people SHOULD buy the car because they are stupid otherwise nonsense.
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  • EndersShadowEndersShadow Posts: 16,493
    lightman1 wrote: »
    Why did the chicken cross the road?


    He didn't...... Made it just over half way and got hit by a Tesla! Didn't hear the damn thing coming!



    Saftey first.

    Well thats because earlier in the day the chicken was "egging" him on... so the Tesla decided not to stop because he was tired of being called a "chicken"
    "....not everything that can be counted counts, and not everything that counts can be counted." William Bruce Cameron, Informal Sociology: A Casual Introduction to Sociological Thinking (1963)
  • mhardy6647mhardy6647 Posts: 21,250
    mrbiron wrote: »
    So driving non stop, peeing out the window, from boston to San Francisco (based on full 45 minute charge) takes 49.5 hours. To do it in a tesla, you almost add another 1/2 day on top. Nobody (except the one guy that we've been reading about since the leaf thread) is taking a Tesla across the country so we need to stop using that as an example.

    Now to do the same trip in a gas guzzler with an average 350 mile range, will net you 40-50 minutes of lost time at the pump.

    I feel like we've been down the agenda road before........

    Let people buy the car because they want it as oppose to people SHOULD buy the car because they are stupid otherwise nonsense.

    Free tip for fast cross-country trips: Depends. Less aerodynamic impact than the window method.

    You're welcome.
  • mhardy6647mhardy6647 Posts: 21,250
    ;-)
  • mrbironmrbiron Posts: 4,963
    ;)
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  • littlewoodboatslittlewoodboats Posts: 791
    edited May 2016
    http://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2014-03-14/teslas-in-california-help-bring-dirty-rain-to-china

    I would have to disagree with the second part of your following comment. Battery productions impact on the environment is well known and has been well known for decades.

    Honestly I never researched the effect of Lithium Ion production on the environment.
    And if you research it now nobody really knows, it seems to be all speculation.


    I am not trying to rain on your parade here Sal and think you have nothing but good intentions but there is nothing green about battery production. Tesla's plans for Nevada are to do the final stages of production in the US while leaving other countries to deal with the toxic stages of the process.

    I get why you like an electric car and think they make sense for many drivers. If I was doing the same type driving you were I would not be opposed to an electric or hydrogen fuel cell car. Sitting side by side in traffic the electric is the cleaner car.

    When the Prius first started hitting Toyota dealers several consumer magazines put the five year carbon foot print about equal to the Hummer H3. Manufacturing has always been the dirtiest part of an autos carbon foot print.

    Recycling of the batteries should go a long way to help clean up the process.

    Post edited by littlewoodboats on
  • EVFrisbee wrote: »
    I'm sure you will argue with me on this Sal and I'm not interested in that, but that is my perspective.

    Not at all, Everyone has their own opinion and that's the way it should be.

    All I care about is how fast I can get into my Model 3.

    Sal



    ABC news ran an article quoting Elon Musk stating full production should be underway sometime in the latter part of 2017.

    Tesla is missing out not building a modular chassis vehicle. A vehicle the size of the smaller of the Ford van models could use the same chassis as a comfy four passenger commuter. This model style was once done as an entry into a MIT design competetion as a hydrogen fuel cell vehicle called a surf board chassis.
  • ZLTFULZLTFUL Posts: 4,877
    "Some people find it easier to be conceited rather than correct."

    "Unwad those panties and have a good time man. We're all here to help each other, no matter how it might appear." DSkip
  • EndersShadowEndersShadow Posts: 16,493
    I'm sure the leftover products are MUCH better for the environment than coal mining, much less toxic and once the battery's are spent they are easy to dispose of.....

    LOL
    "....not everything that can be counted counts, and not everything that counts can be counted." William Bruce Cameron, Informal Sociology: A Casual Introduction to Sociological Thinking (1963)
  • Dennis GardnerDennis Gardner Posts: 4,795
    Lets build a toxic factory in a lake bed.......what could go wrong with that?
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  • tonybtonyb Posts: 30,874
    It's not about the environment. If it was, they'd be pushing the one source of energy that leaves zero carbon footprint....Nuclear. How many new nuclear plants have been built ?

    Even if 10 million people bought Tesla's to be good stewards of the planet, the only thing that does is make you feel good about yourself. Your certainly not saving any Turtles 5,000 miles away and no Polar Bear will sleep better knowing your driving a Tesla or any other electric vehicle.

    It's a nice niche market for the few who's lifestyle it will fit snugly into. 10 YEARS, 20-30 years down the road, the big gas producing car manufacturers will still be in business, Tesla would have sold out to Chik fil-a by then, and the sea levels will be roughly the same while the planet may even get cooler......and all this hubbub will be about zilch.
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  • mrbironmrbiron Posts: 4,963
    The one on the right looks hot, I'd drive that!
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