Sda srs 1.2 (tl?) in central NJ

hearingimpared

I still think having the right speaker so close to the wall is causing some of your perception problems.

xoaphexox

hearingimpared wrote: »

I still think having the right speaker so close to the wall is causing some of your perception problems.

Wouldn't I be experiencing the same issue with the line array drivers then? This is only happening with the surround array drivers. I appreciate your insight and I will get these in to an appropriate room as soon as my budget allows

hearingimpared

xoaphexox wrote: »

Wouldn't I be experiencing the same issue with the line array drivers then? This is only happening with the surround array drivers. I appreciate your insight and I will get these in to an appropriate room as soon as my budget allows

Not necessarily. The dimensional arrays require the 3' space between the wall and the speakers. The line arrays work in a completely different way.

xoaphexox

hearingimpared wrote: »

Not necessarily. The dimensional arrays require the 3' space between the wall and the speakers. The line arrays work in a completely different way.

Hmm... I will move the right speaker out from the wall a bit then so it has a lot of breathing room on the right hand side and see if it's surround effect diminishes to the level of the left speaker.

concealer404

hearingimpared wrote: »

Not necessarily. The dimensional arrays require the 3' space between the wall and the speakers. The line arrays work in a completely different way.

That may be, but if he's putting his ears right next to the dimensional arrays, he should be hearing equal output from either speaker, i would imagine.

From what he's describing, i think he's got his ear close enough that it's "intercepting" the sound before it even gets a chance to reflect.

I'm with him that he's got a problem with the speaker. WHAT it is, i have no idea, unfortunately. I'm not all up on SDA.

xoaphexox

I've been thinking, it was mentioned previously that the 3rd tweeter from the top does the lions share of SPL, is this the same case with the 6.5" drivers in the surround array? If so, maybe I only have one bad driver and it is in the left channel, and just happens to be the speaker that does the lions share of SPL in the array... I really appreciate everyone's help.

xoaphexox

Okay, tonight I pulled all four surround array drivers in the left channel and they all tested OK with 3.2 ohms resistance out of circuit. I also pulled the crossover and it physically looked great - no cooked parts. I will mess with room positioning and a different amp next...

xoaphexox

Lasareath wrote: »

Also, why are you playing music in mono?

Step 4 of the "System Check-Out" chapter of the instruction manual says to put your source in mono and pan back and forth to test the surround effect. It also says to walk close to each speaker to make sure they are working.

It was during this step that I realized something seems wrong with my left channel.

I will try your advice and play some music through them, thanks!

DarqueKnight

You should check to make sure that all the drivers and tweeters in both speakers are connected with correct polarity. The tweeters use different sized connectors for the + and - terminals, so it is unlikely they are switched. However, I have seen cases where someone replaced a SL3000 tweeter with a SL2000 (which has same size terminals).

Each of the 6-1/2" drivers should have a red dot indicating the + terminal.

In addition to checking polarity of the individual tweeters and drivers, you should also check to see that you have the correct tweeters and drivers. All of the tweeters should be SL3000 type, the dimensional drivers should be MW6511 type and the stereo drivers should be MW6503 type. There should be labels on the backs of each tweeter and driver indicating the type.

SL3000 tweeters are difficult to acquire. Sometimes owners would replace a blown SL3000 with an SL2000. Likewise, the 6511 dimensional drivers were in short supply for a long time and would sometimes get replaced with a different driver. Sometimes a blown 6511 would be replaced with a different driver and would also be wired with incorrect polarity.

Wiring diagrams for the 1.2TL's can be found here.

xoaphexox

Thanks for the tip - it's going to be a looong night

hearingimpared

Ray, he used a homemade SDA interconnect where he had continuity between the pins and the blade. I think that is the whole crux of his problem.

DarqueKnight

xoaphexox wrote: »

Thanks for the tip - it's going to be a looong night

Welcome to the world of SDA's.:)

hearingimpared wrote: »

Ray, he used a homemade SDA interconnect where he had continuity between the pins and the blade. I think that is the whole crux of his problem.

The blade terminal is connected to the negative binding post. Connecting the blade terminals of each speaker together should be just like connecting the negative binding post terminals together which should be just like connecting the negative outputs of the amp together which should be no problem...assuming nothing is wired incorrectly inside the speakers.

hearingimpared

DarqueKnight wrote: »

Welcome to the world of SDA's.:)



The blade terminal is connected to the negative binding post. Connecting the blade terminals of each speaker together should be just like connecting the negative binding post terminals together which should be just like connecting the negative outputs of the amp together which should be no problem...assuming nothing is wired incorrectly inside the speakers.

Yes, but if it is a non-common ground amp that can't be strapped you are in for a world of hurt.

xoaphexox

hearingimpared wrote: »

Yes, but if it is a non-common ground amp that can't be strapped you are in for a world of hurt.

True, luckily(?) none of the amps I own are non-common ground.

DarqueKnight

Yeah, I didn't think that was the case since you didn't mention any smoke, sparks and fire.;)

xoaphexox

Placed my Sonicraft order for $255.11. Very helpful, they suggested I replace the polyswitch altogether with a .5 ohm mills resistor and are making custom 13.5uF caps for me. They also suggested I run two Mills in parallel since the one resistance value on the xover is not manufactured.

I am excited to put this to bed and hear these speakers.

I'd better take my shoes off or my socks will blow right through them!!!

nikolas812

Awesome.

Git-r-Done!




Nik

xoaphexox

2 Mills MRA-12 0.5 ohm
2 Mills MRA-12 2.7 ohms
2 Mills MRA-12 7.5 ohms
2 Mills MRA-12 15 ohms
2 Mills MRA-12 20 ohms
2 Mills MRA-12 22 ohms
2 Mills MRA-12 27 ohms
2 Sonicap 0.22uF 200VDC (Gen. II)
6 Sonicap 12uF 200VDC
2 Sonicap 13.5uF 200VDC (custom)
2 Sonicap 27uF 200VDC

Here is the list for those interested.

nikolas812

Thanks!







Nik

DarqueKnight

xoaphexox wrote: »

Placed my Sonicraft order for $255.11. Very helpful, they suggested I replace the polyswitch altogether with a .5 ohm mills resistor and are making custom 13.5uF caps for me. They also suggested I run two Mills in parallel since the one resistance value on the xover is not manufactured.

The stock ceramic metallic resistors are 10% tolerance parts. The 11.5 ohm and 22.5 ohm resistors can be replaced with Mills 12 ohm and 22 ohm resistors and still be within the tolerance range of the original parts.

If you are not heavy handed with the volume control, the polyswitch can be replaced with a copper jumper wire.

xoaphexox

DarqueKnight wrote: »

The stock ceramic metallic resistors are 10% tolerance parts. The 11.5 ohm and 22.5 ohm resistors can be replaced with Mills 12 ohm and 22 ohm resistors and still be within the tolerance range of the original parts.

If you are not heavy handed with the volume control, the polyswitch can be replaced with a copper jumper wire.

That is good information to know. I provided Soniccraft with the xover schematic and they made the suggestions so I just trusted their expert opinion. It sounds from your comments like I may have saved about $7... ohh well...

(edit) to clarify, Jeff at Sonicraft did say that replacing the 22.5 with a 22 was fine where it was in the circuit but mentioned the 11.5 was more critical and as such should be replaced with parallel 20 and 27 ohm resistors.

Hamatym

xoaphexox,
I have a set of 1.2 TL's and had the exact same tweeter problem. I know your issue may be way different, but I found out that mine was effected by my DBX IEQ-31. I had the range set for +/- 6db with my smaller speakers, but these big boys liked the +/- 12db. Everything came alive once I hit that button, and to think I thought I had a bad tweeter. In the end everything woke up when I made the change. It may or may not help, but that was my experience.

Thanks,
Dan

xoaphexox

Well today I switched from 14 gauge to 12 gauge wires as well as switching the amp to a Mitsubishi DA-A10DC which has twice the damping factor of the Sansui I was using (100) and 1/20 of the THD (.005%). It is also dual mono construction but common ground (I tested continuity between negative terminals of both speaker posts).

The issue I have been discussing is still there.

My xover parts arrive this week and I will be pulling apart the cabinets to confirm polarity as well. I will let everyone know what happens!

F1nut

Hamatym wrote: »

xoaphexox,
I have a set of 1.2 TL's and had the exact same tweeter problem. I know your issue may be way different, but I found out that mine was effected by my DBX IEQ-31. I had the range set for +/- 6db with my smaller speakers, but these big boys liked the +/- 12db. Everything came alive once I hit that button, and to think I thought I had a bad tweeter. In the end everything woke up when I made the change. It may or may not help, but that was my experience.

Thanks,
Dan

If you need to boost the treble that much...hell, at all, you've got other issues and/or hearing loss.

xoaphexox

Recapped the left channel tonight. Easy as pie and I think it sounds great! I measured all my resistors and they were all within original tolerance. I replaced the polyswitch with a .5 ohm mills. Removed both mica bypass caps (replaced one with solid core copper wire). I will do the right xover tomorrow.

I hate to say the issue with the surround effect has not changed but the left channel sounds pretty darn good right now so I don't feel too bad. Once I recap the right one tomorrow if the effect isn't 'normal' I will pull the drivers and check polarity of them all although I really have no reason to believe they were altered in any way - everything in these is stock and the seals in the four drivers I already pulled was very tight as if from the factory.

NJPOLKER

Xo did it because it's the right thing to do. You didn't do it because you didn't pay attention. So, go stand in the corner.

F1nut

Lasareath wrote: »

Why did you do that?, I just jump it with a piece of wire.

My ears came to the conclusion that they sound better when the original resistance of the polyswitch (.5 ohms) is retained as it is quite audible. Therefore, I recommend replacing the polyswitch with a resisitor.

megasat16

NJPOLKER wrote: »

Xo did it because it's the right thing to do. You didn't do it because you didn't pay attention. So, go stand in the corner.

Lasareath wrote: »

You better watch how you speak to me or I'll drive to your house and smack you around and then sit on you!

Errr...A Lot of Polkie Love, I say!

Big Dawg

I'm glad these found a good home. I'm sure that you'll figure out the problem and be thrilled.

xoaphexox

By golly, I think I found the issue!!

When I removed the right channel crossover to recap it this morning I realized the stuffing had fallen out downwards from behind the right channel stereo dimensional array.

This has got to be the reason why the effect is so much more pronounced in one channel....

I will know for sure in about 2 hours once I finish the xover and pull it back up.

Here are comparison shots of my left and right channels. What do you experts think?