I love puppies, do you?

snow

digitalvideo wrote: »

Here we go again with the snotty arrogant attacks here. How do you know what I have or haven't listened to? I have a friend who does own $12k B&K speakers and I found them to be no better than my Polk RTi A9's.

But I like how you phrased it, it was like I said I had a friend who drove me around in his Bugatti Veyron, like owning B&K speakers is only for people like Donald Trump or something.

Interesting to read that your friend that owns these B&K speakers that you have compared to Polk's doesnt even know that there actually B&W Bowers and Wilkins. I think you have M&K Miller and Kreisel confused with B&W Bowers and Wilkins and if you actually have ever listened to B&W 801 nautilus speakers and found the Polk RTi A9's to be as good then your either seriously lacking in the hearing department or your full of BS which is the most likely scenario. From what I can see here you started this thread not to inform us of anything but simply to stir up the crap, some good knowledge has came out of this thread but it wasnt your posts.



REGARDS SNOW

Knucklehead

digitalvideo wrote: »

Here we go again with the snotty arrogant attacks here. How do you know what I have or haven't listened to? I have a friend who does own $12k B&K speakers and I found them to be no better than my Polk RTi A9's.

But I like how you phrased it, it was like I said I had a friend who drove me around in his Bugatti Veyron, like owning B&K speakers is only for people like Donald Trump or something.

I really believe a lot of people on here were toilet trained at gunpoint. For 95% of us its a HOBBY for crying out loud.

unc2701

B&W, dude.

B&K doesn't make speakers.

polkatese

I thought I lost my mind. I own B&K gears, never heard about B&K speakers, thought it was their vintage series.

snow

polkatese wrote: »

I thought I lost my mind. I own B&K gears, never heard about B&K speakers, thought it was their vintage series.

Actually B&K Bruel and Kjaer do make audio products amps premps etc but to the best of my knowledge do not make speakers and certainly no 12k high end line if they do at all.

BTW congrats on becoming a master 5k posts.



REGARDS SNOW

F1nut

digitalvideo wrote: »

Here we go again with the snotty arrogant attacks here. How do you know what I have or haven't listened to? I have a friend who does own $12k B&K speakers and I found them to be no better than my Polk RTi A9's.

In actuality, your thread title and subsequent posts have proven you to have the snotty, arrogant attitude. You started this thread to incite and flame, so don't act surprised or get mad at me or the others who have called you out on it.

And no, I don't believe you have listened to $12k B&K(W) speakers.

But I like how you phrased it, it was like I said I had a friend who drove me around in his Bugatti Veyron, like owning B&K speakers is only for people like Donald Trump or something.

You seem to have a warped sense of reality.

cnh

Polk makes a good speaker. But let's not get carried away. I've heard better. The most recent were the Focal Utopia towers! Pretty D....D good! B&W also spectacular towers! Polk RTIs good value, good sound but not on the same level as the above. And it is partly, but not 'entirely' a question of money spent on materials, engineering, etc. That said there is a law of diminishing returns as you get up higher and higher...there are smaller and smaller improvements that can be 'heard'.

cnh

digitalvideo

I'd like to correct myself, to make sure I wasn't lying I just called my friend to ask him what the name of his speakers are and he said they are B&W speakers and his amp is a B&K Reference 125.7 power amplifier that he wants to replace.

In actuality, your thread title and subsequent posts have proven you to have the snotty, arrogant attitude. You started this thread to incite and flame, so don't act surprised or get mad at me or the others who have called you out on it.

And no, I don't believe you have listened to $12k B&K(W) speakers

Well I can say I don't believe you know what you're talking about and if you think it's so amazing for anyone to come across and listen to B&W speakers I say that says more about you than anything. I guess us low class white trash people here who have Polk's and $40 HDMI cables aren't allowed to post here at the "www.polkaudio.com" website lol

No one has yet to prove that a $400 HDMI cable will give better picture quality over a $40 dollar one and I challenge anyone on here who disagrees with me to buy the $400 dollar one and compare it with a $40-$50 dollar Bluejeans HDMI cable and let us know what you see.

Why are the people on this thread attacking me about what I said about Monster and AudioQuest are over on the "Monster Lawsuit New York Times" thread basically saying everything I have posted here about some HDMI cable companies ripping people off and being a scam?

digitalvideo

Polk Audio members quotes over on the "Monster Lawsuit Article in (Wall Street Journal_" thread.

shack wrote: »

I will never purchase a single piece of their product...and will take every opportunity to bash this company!

**** MONSTER CABLE PRODUCTS, INC. AND THE **** NOEL LEE!

This is of course...just my opinion. :rolleyes:

SolidSqual: This makes me so mad. Monster has taken product protection to the level of frivolous. Trademark law is my specialty, and it's a necessity for any company with a valuable name; however, it's malpractice when lawyers sue companies whose products aren't even in remotely the same field or are not blatantly using the mark owners name in a way that detriments its value.

I've been discussing some pro bono work with colleagues of mine to help out small companies that have to deal with these jerks. The problem is that creating a pro bono organization to combat these frivolous suits may actually lead to more frivolous suits. Really, the only solid solution is legislative reform.

timlitton: I hate Monster for their bullying tactics. They should face punitive action for all the frivolous lawsuits.

Now on that thread we have shack who seems to feel the need to talk down to people and thinks he's superior in knowledge and tries to correct everyone on every little post and this is exactly what he posted when someone called Monster a "mickey mouse" company so shack goes off on some long rant that the tries his best to be intellectual behind a computer =

The phrase "mickey mouse" is a direct reference to Disney's creation. The catch phrase is attributed to Kate Balliet who was an avid detractor of Walt Disney due to his possible WWII associations. The phrase, whether used with positive or negative connotations is based on the Disney character,

The use of the phrase became widespread in the military during the Vietnam war...again a direct reference to the Disney creation.

WTF! lol
If someone on here were to say: "UP" then for the sake to disagree shack would say: "Well not accordingly, to say up is indicative of saying "DOWN" lol

So it's pointless to try to have a debate here because people on one thread say one thing and the same person says another thing on another thread just to feel they are intellectually superior because they're so insecure with themselves they think every little thing is attacking their knowledge on electronics when it's actually not.

cheddar

cnh wrote: »

Polk makes a good speaker. But let's not get carried away. I've heard better. The most recent were the Focal Utopia towers! Pretty D....D good! B&W also spectacular towers! Polk RTIs good value, good sound but not on the same level as the above. And it is partly, but not 'entirely' a question of money spent on materials, engineering, etc. That said there is a law of diminishing returns as you get up higher and higher...there are smaller and smaller improvements that can be 'heard'.

cnh

You have to understand, just a little over a month ago, digital video was recommending HTiB speakers as the best bang for the buck over klipsch.

http://www.polkaudio.com/forums/showpost.php?p=1008436&postcount=48

A few of us have been helping him build a 7.1 system in his basement from his other threads. And he's obviously started to confuse our recommendations of good value and good bang for the buck with his new uninformed claim that B&Ws sound no better than RTi A9s.

digitalvideo

Here's the challenge to anyone, buy a $400 Monster or AudioQuest or any cable brand of your choosing and compare it to a $40-$50 dollar Bluejeans cable or for that matter a $10 dollar mediabridge cable off Amazon.com and post the actual results, it's very easy to make a simple video and post it on YouTube. (Now shack will most likely feel the need to give us a long rant on something to try to prove something to us whether it be is superior vast intellectual knowledge he Googled off the internet.)

Chedder and I never once singled you out and mentioned your name or personally called you out on this thread.

polkatese

snow wrote: »

Actually B&K Bruel and Kjaer do make audio products amps premps etc but to the best of my knowledge do not make speakers and certainly no 12k high end line if they do at all.

BTW congrats on becoming a master 5k posts.



REGARDS SNOW

Thank you, Snow.

digitalvideo

cheddar wrote: »

You have to understand, just a little over a month ago, digital video was recommending HTiB speakers as the best bang for the buck over klipsch.

http://www.polkaudio.com/forums/showpost.php?p=1008436&postcount=48

A few of us have been helping him build a 7.1 system in his basement from his other threads. And he's obviously started to confuse our recommendations of good value and good bang for the buck with his new uninformed claim that B&Ws sound no better than RTi A9s.

Oh I very much would recommend Polk RTi A9's over B&W's for movie watching in home entertainment from what I personally heard. Now when it comes to music that is another topic as my home entertainment system is only for tv/sports, movies as I said on every post on other threads regarding my system and what it's for as this HDMI discussion is about HDMI cable prices that could effect tv picture quality. The HDMI discussion is what this thread is about and my claims on what that Crutchfield employee said was true and still no one can post how a $400 dollar HDMI cable from any brand of your choosing can give a better picture than a $40 dollar one or even a $10 dollar one for that matter.

cheddar

digitalvideo wrote: »

Chedder and I never once singled you out and mentioned your name or personally called you out on this thread.

You didn't need to. The inference in your kneejerk response was pretty clear -- you accused me of defending a scam after completely ignoring the actual content of my post...

cheddar wrote: »

Right from their website:

AudioQuest HDMI-3 uses large 6.1% silver conductors (almost five times the silver of normal silver-plate). Skin/Foam/Skin Polyethylene is used to minimize loss caused by insulation, and to insure critical geometry stability.

If their high end cable uses silver and their low end doesn't, then what the rep and what you have tried to repeat here is completely untrue. There are differences beyond the jacket as conductor material is not just a cosmetic difference. Now as I've said, this difference may make no real world difference to most end users. But it completely contradicts what the CSR said and what you are trying to repeat as true, that it's just a jacket cosmetic difference. A more constructive discussion would deal with what silver does or doesn't do for a typical end user.

digitalvideo wrote: »

Are you telling me that a 6.1% silver conductor on the high end HDMI cable that uses Skin/Foam/Skin Polyethylene that costs over $400+ dollars will make a difference over a $40 dollar cable that doesn't have a 6.1% silver conductor but still uses Skin/Foam/Skin Polyethylene is going to make a difference? And is that 6.1% worth $400 dollars more? LOL You got to be kidding me. I can't believe people are so desperate to defend a scam.

comfortablycurt

Digitalvideo-Once again, I don't see A SINGLE PERSON in this thread claiming that using 400 dollar HDMI cables will give you an advantage.

I think everyone is in agreement with you as far as the overpriced HDMI cables. I think the issue here is how you went about bring this to light(as if this has never been discussed here before). Saying that Audioquest is a scam encompasses a slightly broader meaning than "400 dollar HDMI cables are a scam".

digitalvideo

comfortablycurt wrote: »

Digitalvideo-Once again, I don't see A SINGLE PERSON in this thread claiming that using 400 dollar HDMI cables will give you an advantage.

I think everyone is in agreement with you as far as the overpriced HDMI cables. I think the issue here is how you went about bring this to light(as if this has never been discussed here before). Saying that Audioquest is a scam encompasses a slightly broader meaning than "400 dollar HDMI cables are a scam".

I think you keep contradicting yourself, read your first paragraph and read your second paragraph, I'm not insulting you but it's not making any sense, your first paragraph states that people using a $400 cable won't give you an advantage, but your second paragraph you say defend AudioQuest to a degree on it's $400 dollar cables saying it's not a scam. It seems people here want to defend Audioquest but not Monster, there is a double standard on here and AudioQuest gets the nod of satisfaction and Monster gets trampled, but I'm trying to say is both AudioQuest, Monster and all cable companies that sell any HDMI cable over $50 bucks is a scam and should be looked into whether by law or independent groups.

digitalvideo

And I've been getting quite a few PM's from members here who are agreeing with me and saying it's pointless to even try to debate the guardians of this website.

Here's one PM from a Polk member who I promised to keep anonymous:

"Dude, its no use arguing with these **** bags, they are grouped together like piranahs, i know exactly what you meant by the initial thread, fact is Polk AUdio is not a very friendly forum."

comfortablycurt

I think what I meant in that post was entirely clear. The HDMI cables? Yes...they are a scam. They're a business...they're trying to make money. They're are plenty of uninformed idiots out there that are more than willing to spend 400 bucks on an HDMI cable.

Saying that Audioquest as a COMPANY is a scam altogether, that's entirely different. Audioquest builds a very high quality product. As others have said earlier in the thread, differences between digital cables are negligible. All it's doing is transmitting a string of 1's and 0's. As long as it can do that, it's doing it's job.

Analog cables are entirely different though. They are not a scam.

I guess I'm just failing to see where I contradicted myself.

As I said, saying that Audioquest as a COMPANY is a scam, is a LOT different than saying their 400 dollar HDMI cables are a scam. You could have worded the subject a bit differently.

Monster Cables, on the other hand, are a scam.

F1nut

digitalvideo wrote: »

I'd like to correct myself, to make sure I wasn't lying I just called my friend to ask him what the name of his speakers are and he said they are B&W speakers and his amp is a B&K Reference 125.7 power amplifier that he wants to replace.

Interesting that you name the model of the amp, but not the model of the speaker. And no, I still don't believe you.

Well I can say I don't believe you know what you're talking about and if you think it's so amazing for anyone to come across and listen to B&W speakers I say that says more about you than anything. I guess us low class white trash people here who have Polk's and $40 HDMI cables aren't allowed to post here at the "www.polkaudio.com" website lol

Like I said, "You seem to have a warped sense of reality."

No one has yet to prove that a $400 HDMI cable will give better picture quality over a $40 dollar one and I challenge anyone on here who disagrees with me to buy the $400 dollar one and compare it with a $40-$50 dollar Bluejeans HDMI cable and let us know what you see.

Since you are the one in doubt, how about you compare the cables yourself as that is the only way that you will know for sure.

Why are the people on this thread attacking me about what I said about Monster and AudioQuest are over on the "Monster Lawsuit New York Times" thread basically saying everything I have posted here about some HDMI cable companies ripping people off and being a scam?

You are making an apples vs oranges comparision between the two threads. I'll spell it out for you since your reading comprehension seems a bit lacking. One thread has to do with the business practice of Monster suing other companies for using the name, "Monster." The other (your thread) has to do with the quality/cost value of one of their actual products. It's really not that difficult for most of us to understand that one thread has absolutely nothing to do with the other.

shack

I take full credit for my post and statement about Monster Cable Products, Inc. and Noel Lee because of the well documented abuse of the legal system and their predatory actions against small business owners. What they are doing is unethical IMO. It never was, never has been or never will be about the product.

By the same token if what the OP states about AudioQuest and Crutchfield are true then I would be firmly against them as well. My personal experience tells me that is not the case...and therefor my defense of these companies. No more...no less.

digitalvideo

comfortablycurt wrote: »

I think what I meant in that post was entirely clear. The HDMI cables? Yes...they are a scam. They're a business...they're trying to make money. They're are plenty of uninformed idiots out there that are more than willing to spend 400 bucks on an HDMI cable.

Saying that Audioquest as a COMPANY is a scam altogether, that's entirely different. Audioquest builds a very high quality product. As others have said earlier in the thread, differences between digital cables are negligible. All it's doing is transmitting a string of 1's and 0's. As long as it can do that, it's doing it's job.

Analog cables are entirely different though. They are not a scam.

I guess I'm just failing to see where I contradicted myself.

As I said, saying that Audioquest as a COMPANY is a scam, is a LOT different than saying their 400 dollar HDMI cables are a scam. You could have worded the subject a bit differently.

Monster Cables, on the other hand, are a scam.

I never said "ALL" AudioQuest cables are a scam, this thread is dedicated specifically to HDMI cables and companies that have specifically HDMI cables in their lineup that they sell for over $40 to $50 bucks.

For all I know AudioQuest's and Monster's speaker cables and sub cables could be the best in the world. But any company that has HDMI cables in it's lineup that sells them for over $40-$50 bucks is scamming people and has a nice little scam going, it's like Hedge funds in the stock market, you have to becareful for the ponsy schemes. As mantis and others pointed out and I have said as well that speaker cables are different than HDMI cables. Quality speaker cables actually do matter.

F1nut

digitalvideo wrote: »

And I've been getting quite a few PM's from members here who are agreeing with me and saying it's pointless to even try to debate the guardians of this website.

Here's one PM from a Polk member who I promised to keep anonymous:

"Dude, its no use arguing with these **** bags, they are grouped together like piranahs, i know exactly what you meant by the initial thread, fact is Polk AUdio is not a very friendly forum."

It's just sad that you have to resort to posting a PRIVATE message in an attempt to somehow make yourself look better and at the same time imply that Club Polk is not a friendly place. Nothing could be further from the truth. However, if that is the way you and the folks that PM'd you feel, I'd suggest that you may be more comfortable with more like minded folks such as those at AH where all amps sound the same and cable doesn't matter.

digitalvideo

F1nut wrote: »

Interesting that you name the model of the amp, but not the model of the speaker. And no, I still don't believe you.




Like I said, "You seem to have a warped sense of reality."



Since you are the one in doubt, how about you compare the cables yourself as that is the only way that you will know for sure.





You are making an apples vs oranges comparision between the two threads. I'll spell it out for you since your reading comprehension seems a bit lacking. One thread has to do with the business practice of Monster suing other companies for using the name, "Monster." The other (your thread) has to do with the quality/cost value of one of their actual products. It's really not that difficult for most of us to understand that one thread has absolutely nothing to do with the other.

Your quick short responses to my posts now show you are desperate and for once can't even articulate any thought once some "newbie" on here stands up to the very arrogant guardians on here.

I just called back my friend again after you wanted to know the specific models of his speakers and he said they are B&W Nautilus 803 Signature that he paid close to $6000 a pair for, he said today you couldn't probably get them for $5000 or below.

digitalvideo

Let me correct myself, he said "today you COULD probably get them for $5000 or below."

comfortablycurt

digitalvideo wrote: »

I never said "ALL" AudioQuest cables are a scam, this thread is dedicated specifically to HDMI cables and companies that have specifically HDMI cables in their lineup that they sell for over $40 to $50 bucks.

For all I know AudioQuest's and Monster's speaker cables and sub cables could be the best in the world. But any company that has HDMI cables in it's lineup that sells them for over $40-$50 bucks is scamming people and has a nice little scam going, it's like Hedge funds in the stock market, you have to becareful for the ponsy schemes. As mantis and others pointed out and I have said as well that speaker cables are different than HDMI cables. Quality speaker cables actually do matter.

The title of your thread is "Crutchfield admits Monster/Audioquest are scams". This makes the supposed topic of HDMI cables pretty unclear, and makes it sounds as if you're saying that ALL cables are a scam.

Perhaps a more appropriate title would have been "Crutchfield admits Monster/Audioquest high priced HDMI cables are a scam".

Once again, everyone is agreeing with you on the subject of HDMI cables. I'm really not sure what the argument here is.

If you're that concerned about it, do your own comparison. I doubt that the CSR from Crutchfield you spoke with is the end all of knowledge about audio equipment. I have trouble believing that he'd recommend buying a cheaper product. That's what his job is.

Like I said before, there are plenty of idiots out there willing to spend 400 bucks on an HDMI cable. If they want to buy them, how does it affect us? If they think there's an improvement, whether that improvement is imaginary or real, then it was worth their money. If they think it's better, then it is.

F1nut

digitalvideo wrote: »

Your quick short responses to my posts now show you are desperate and for once can't even articulate any thought once some "newbie" on here stands up to the very arrogant guardians on here.

Thanks for the laugh. However, the fact remains that I articulate my point in a few words better than you can in multiple paragraphs.

I just called back my friend again after you wanted to know the specific models of his speakers and he said they are B&W Nautilus 803 Signature that he paid close to $6000 a pair for, he said today you couldn't probably get them for $5000 or below.

I didn't want to know, I just found it interesting that you didn't name the model as you have done with every other item you posted. Lends to credibility.

Have a nice day.

mantis

cheddar wrote: »

As a person who did not post in the first 13 and from the very first of my posts tried to redirect this discussion back to the actual differences in silver content in audioquest's hdmi cable, let me just say that I think a cable discussion that is actually about cable differences (or not as real world application results may be) should not degenerate into a discussion of scams and conspiracies supposedly uncovered by an otherwise reputable company like crutchfield.

I would really like to know from mantis what he thinks the benefits of a silver conductor are for analog and digital, if any, especially for a long cable run of maybe 100ft to another room, for instance. But not in the charged atmosphere that digital video purposely created at the very first original post of this thread.

Let's see, here are his claims in the OP:

1. Crutchfield admits Monster/Audioquest are scams

based on a customer service rep saying the following,

2. There are no internal differences in any of audioquest's hdmi cables, "'The $400 cable is just a prettier cable on the outside, you're paying for outside cosmetics.' AudioQuest has four HDMI cables in it's HDMI lineup and they are all the same, it's a complete scam and rip off."

I didn't use the word BS before or was rude in any way to digital video in my posts, eventhough he accused me of being a desperate defender of audioquest for pointing out the obvious inconsistencies in his original post. But since silver content is much different than a simple cosmetic difference, pretty much the entire original post when talking about audioquest was something that comes out of the back side of a cow. The original post derailed this thread because both DV's title of the thread and what the crutchfield CSR was reported as saying are misleading and untrue. That some members called it BS may have been a little poor form in some people's opinion, ok. But the original post did prove to be false just the same and directly led to this train wreck.

The only advantage of using silver in a HDMI cable is to send the signal long runs. It's a faster transmission and suppose to be able to retain signal longer. if you are using short cables, there is no need for any of this mess.
Analog cables and speaker wire sound very different with Silver content. Audioquest uses Silver in there higher end cables and they sound fantastic. DH labs uses silver in there speaker wire and it's one of my all time favorite wires. I keep reinstalling it back into my system and love the way it responses. Silver is a better conductor then copper but it's more expensive.

Guys this thread turned useless. All I see is a bunch of people arguing over nothing. For those who know anything about Audioquest, you already know if they are a scam or not. This guy can say anything he wants.
As far as Monster cable goes, we al know there business practice and is the very reason as a forum we choose not to use there products. It's a shame as they make some pretty good products but me personally don't want anything to do with there company. I used to really like Monstercable.

So HDMI , please learn about the technology before you run your mouth in here. It gets really old reading threads about people who have no idea what they are taking about.

I'm all for learning about things and asking questions. But to come in here and argue with everyone, and everyone arguing back is completely pointless. I really don't have anything to add to this thread other then please stop posting on it. If I was a Moderator in here, I would lock this up right now. I don't see anything going anywhere, I don't see anyone making any progress with anything. So stop wasting your time.

Dan

davidk0512

All this has prompted me to ask a question that is somewhat related. I bought a 1080p LCD TV and a Panasonic BD55 Bluray player back in November at the big store that's no longer in business. When I asked the sales guy about HDMI cable, he said that if I had good quality component video cables and good audio ICs, he recommended saving the money and going analog between the multi-channel output and inputs, he said that the sound quality would be better and video just as good if not better. That is what I did, but I am curious if this is true. I am happy with what I've got, so I don't really see a need to spend $40 just to hear it for myself.

cheddar

mantis wrote: »

The only advantage of using silver in a HDMI cable is to send the signal long runs. It's a faster transmission and suppose to be able to retain signal longer. if you are using short cables, there is no need for any of this mess.
Analog cables and speaker wire sound very different with Silver content. Audioquest uses Silver in there higher end cables and they sound fantastic. DH labs uses silver in there speaker wire and it's one of my all time favorite wires. I keep reinstalling it back into my system and love the way it responses. Silver is a better conductor then copper but it's more expensive.

Dan,

Thanks for the response. I recently planned a run of hdmi cable from one side of a room, up to the attic, and back down to the other side of the room. And the length of the run ballooned out pretty quickly. I think that you can get silver in an HDMI cable much cheaper than $400 from the discount vendors. At what point do you think a copper run might start to degrade a signal and a silver cable might start to have a benefit? If you don't mind me trying to slip one more question in...

WilliamM2

davidk0512 wrote: »

All this has prompted me to ask a question that is somewhat related. I bought a 1080p LCD TV and a Panasonic BD55 Bluray player back in November at the big store that's no longer in business. When I asked the sales guy about HDMI cable, he said that if I had good quality component video cables and good audio ICs, he recommended saving the money and going analog between the multi-channel output and inputs, he said that the sound quality would be better and video just as good if not better. That is what I did, but I am curious if this is true. I am happy with what I've got, so I don't really see a need to spend $40 just to hear it for myself.

Well you can't get any of the new audio codecs over HDMI, you also can't upscale SD-DVD's over component. And Blu-Ray disks will only send 1080i over component, no 1080p.

Sounds like he was mis-informed about HDMI.