Why is MIT cables better?

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  • F1nut
    F1nut Posts: 50,572
    edited January 2009
    Phil, knowing what you use, you shouldn't be talking.
    Political Correctness'.........defined

    "A doctrine fostered by a delusional, illogical minority and rabidly promoted by an unscrupulous mainstream media, which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible to pick up a t-u-r-d by the clean end."

    President of Club Polk

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  • pearsall001
    pearsall001 Posts: 5,068
    edited January 2009
    F1nut wrote: »
    Phil, knowing what you use, you shouldn't be talking.

    Jesse, didn't Joe tell you...I sold off all my expensive cables & replaced them all with Monoprice cables. The synergy is to die for & my wallet is still full!! :D :eek:
    "2 Channel & 11.2 HT "Two Channel:Magnepan LRSSchiit Audio Freya S - SS preConsonance Ref 50 - Tube preParasound HALO A21+ 2 channel ampBluesound NODE 2i streameriFi NEO iDSD DAC Oppo BDP-93KEF KC62 sub Home Theater:Full blown 11.2 set up.
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  • janmike
    janmike Posts: 6,146
    edited January 2009
    Polkitup2 wrote: »
    The network boxes, they look like sponge Bob's testicles dangling behind my audio rack :D

    That is one hell of an analogy - worthy of signature placement, but not mine. :D
    Michael ;)
    In the beginning, all knowledge was new!
    NORTH of 60°
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  • Face
    Face Posts: 14,340
    edited January 2009
    Polkitup2 wrote: »
    The network boxes, they look like sponge Bob's testicles dangling behind my audio rack :D

    I know what you mean. :D
    LSiC.jpg



    And is the title of this thread driving anyone else crazy? It's "Why ARE MIT cables better?", not is.
    "He who fights with monsters should look to it that he himself does not become a monster. And when you gaze long into an abyss the abyss also gazes into you." Friedrich Nietzsche
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  • george daniel
    george daniel Posts: 12,096
    edited January 2009
    Okay,, here's one,, currently have T-2 SC's,, what level would ya'll suggest as a reasonable/significant step up? Seriously.
    JC approves....he told me so. (F-1 nut)
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  • MillerLiteScott
    MillerLiteScott Posts: 2,561
    edited January 2009
    Face wrote: »
    I know what you mean. :D
    LSiC.jpg



    And is the title of this thread driving anyone else crazy? It's "Why ARE MIT cables better?", not is.

    Yes it are.
    I like speakers that are bigger than a small refrigerator but smaller than a big refrigerator:D
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  • disneyjoe7
    disneyjoe7 Posts: 11,435
    edited January 2009
    Face wrote: »
    I know what you mean. :D
    LSiC.jpg



    And is the title of this thread driving anyone else crazy? It's "Why ARE MIT cables better?", not is.


    I was trying to figure out why a filter sounded better? Why MIT cable are better? You're right. Sorry, maybe a mod should fix that title :)

    Speakers
    Carver Amazing Fronts
    CS400i Center
    RT800i's Rears
    Sub Paradigm Servo 15

    Electronics
    Conrad Johnson PV-5 pre-amp
    Parasound Halo A23
    Pioneer 84TXSi AVR
    Pioneer 79Avi DVD
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    WMC Win7 32bit HD DVR


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  • F1nut
    F1nut Posts: 50,572
    edited January 2009
    The network boxes are not filters, it has to do with timing. MIT has a bunch of white papers on their site worth a read.
    Political Correctness'.........defined

    "A doctrine fostered by a delusional, illogical minority and rabidly promoted by an unscrupulous mainstream media, which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible to pick up a t-u-r-d by the clean end."

    President of Club Polk

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  • reeltrouble1
    reeltrouble1 Posts: 9,312
    edited January 2009
    disneyjoe7 wrote: »
    Damn Sir, you nailed it. (And yes got what you posted about "Attenuate" I mean "Accentuates")

    I played with all my interconnects I have own or on loan in the house.

    MIT S-3 interconnects

    AudioQuest Diamondbacks

    SignalCable Analog II

    Or Ben's Silver's


    You nailed the silvers I missing bass. I like the highs, mids but...

    Of all of them I enjoy the MIT S-3's the best hands down. Seems to have it all, Bass, Mids, Highs. The most expensive but the best sounding :(

    The inability of silver to deliver full solid bass fequencies is the metals biggest downfall.

    of course nobody likes their baby called ugly.

    RT1
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  • SEH
    SEH Posts: 91
    edited January 2009
    F1nut wrote: »
    The network boxes are not filters, it has to do with timing. MIT has a bunch of white papers on their site worth a read.

    I didn't find the white papers to be all that informative. Their patents are informative, and describe filters. Can you explain what these network boxes are, if they aren't the devices described in the patents?
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  • F1nut
    F1nut Posts: 50,572
    edited January 2009
    Give them a call, they can explain it better than I can.
    Political Correctness'.........defined

    "A doctrine fostered by a delusional, illogical minority and rabidly promoted by an unscrupulous mainstream media, which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible to pick up a t-u-r-d by the clean end."

    President of Club Polk

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  • Erik Tracy
    Erik Tracy Posts: 4,673
    edited January 2009
    reeltrouble1 wrote: »
    The inability of silver to deliver full solid bass fequencies is the metals biggest downfall.

    of course nobody likes their baby called ugly.

    RT1

    I have read that AQ interconnects get respectable recommendations - but - what is the opinion of their higher end ICs (such as the King Cobra, Columbia, Colorado, Sky) that use copper cable but Silver for the RCA connectors?

    Does having silver, only in the connectors, result in the drawbacks attributed to silver?

    Erik

    H9: If you don't trust what you are hearing, then maybe you need to be less invested in a hobby which all the pleasure comes from listening to music.
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  • polkatese
    polkatese Posts: 6,767
    edited January 2009
    Congrats Keiko. Enjoy your new found sound and details.
    I am sorry, I have no opinion on the matter. I am sure you do. So, don't mind me, I just want to talk audio and pie.
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  • Face
    Face Posts: 14,340
    edited January 2009
    SEH wrote: »
    I didn't find the white papers to be all that informative. Their patents are informative, and describe filters. Can you explain what these network boxes are, if they aren't the devices described in the patents?


    "This is a common misconception. And it’s common because whether anybody wants to admit it or not, a cable is by its very nature a low-pass filter. But the circuitry inside our network boxes does not act to filter out anything. Instead, they “tune up” the portions of the audible bandwidth that are not performing optimally as they pass through the cable. This is what we call Multipole Technology. The long and short of it is that you’ll hear more articulate high frequencies from your Townshend tweeters when you connect them with our interfaces.

    I refer you to our website where you can read more about Multipole Technology: http://www.mitcables.com/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=22&Itemid=43

    You may also wish to read Bruce’s whitepapers and patents. You can do that in the Reference Library of the website.

    Also, check out the recent issue of The Absolute Sound if you’d like to see the inside of one of our cables: http://www.avguide.com/theabsolutesound/

    Best,

    Gavin Fish
    Global Sales Manager, MIT Cables"
    "He who fights with monsters should look to it that he himself does not become a monster. And when you gaze long into an abyss the abyss also gazes into you." Friedrich Nietzsche
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  • SEH
    SEH Posts: 91
    edited January 2009
    Face wrote: »
    "This is a common misconception. And it’s common because whether anybody wants to admit it or not, a cable is by its very nature a low-pass filter. But the circuitry inside our network boxes does not act to filter out anything. Instead, they “tune up” the portions of the audible bandwidth that are not performing optimally as they pass through the cable. "

    If they don't want to call them filters, fine. I don't think a passive device can amplify these portions of the audible bandwidth that are not performing optimally, so if they got perceivably tuned up, something else got tuned out. Most people would call that filtering, even if it was only filtering unwanted noise or something beyond the audible frequency range.
    You may also wish to read Bruce’s whitepapers and patents.

    I did.

    "Audio signal transmission system with noise suppression network" US Patent 4,954,787
    In an audio signal transmission system comprising an interface circuit is connected across the output terminals of an audio signal source or across the input terminals of an audio signal transmission cable coupled to the source. The interface circuit comprises either a discrete capacitance or a distributed capacitance in series with a discrete resistor. The value of the capacitance and the resistance in the interface circuit is chosen such that the time constant of the cable with the interface circuit produces in response to noise a signal having a frequency which is above the audio frequency spectrum but within the passband of the amplifier to which it is coupled.

    That seems to be a filter.

    "Method & apparatus for reducing attenuation & phase shift" US Patent 5,123,052
    In an audio signal transmission system having a source of audio signals and a load coupled thereto by means of a first and second transmission line, a discrete capacitor is coupled in parallel with one or both of the transmission lines. The magnitude of the capacitor is as large as stable operation of the amplifier to which it is connected will permit.

    That seems to be a filter.

    "Audio signal transmission line with low-pass filter (series or parallel inductance)" US Patent 5,142,252
    An audio signal transmission line comprising an additional inductance inserted in series with the line and/or coupled in parallel therewith near the load end of the line for providing a low pass filter which overcomes parasitic and dielectric capacitance of the line so as to reduce audio frequency noise generated in the line by low level and low frequency audio signals. The magnitude of the inductance used may vary widely, e.g. from 20 microhenries to 1 millihenry, depending on the length of the line and the space available.

    That seems to be a filter.

    Is there something wrong with a filter? The brick obviously changes the sound of the cable to something we prefer. I'm not sure how else they would change the sound, other than the methods of filtering described in the patents.
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  • F1nut
    F1nut Posts: 50,572
    edited January 2009
    Yeah Mike, that's what I was talking about, thanks for posting that info from MIT.

    SEH, it may be splitting hairs, so call them filters or whatever. The bottom line, as you stated, is something we prefer.
    Political Correctness'.........defined

    "A doctrine fostered by a delusional, illogical minority and rabidly promoted by an unscrupulous mainstream media, which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible to pick up a t-u-r-d by the clean end."

    President of Club Polk

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  • disneyjoe7
    disneyjoe7 Posts: 11,435
    edited January 2009
    I got to think they are filters more then anything else. Which drive me nuts not fully understanding why they sound better, but just to see a lot of fluff about them. IMHO

    Not that I found them enjoyable very nice sounding and worth a coin or so. I will own some, some day.

    Speakers
    Carver Amazing Fronts
    CS400i Center
    RT800i's Rears
    Sub Paradigm Servo 15

    Electronics
    Conrad Johnson PV-5 pre-amp
    Parasound Halo A23
    Pioneer 84TXSi AVR
    Pioneer 79Avi DVD
    Sony CX400 CD changer
    Panasonic 42-PX60U Plasma
    WMC Win7 32bit HD DVR


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  • F1nut
    F1nut Posts: 50,572
    edited January 2009
    Why does this bother you so? I mean, do you understand why one tube sounds better than another or why one amp sounds better when they have the same specs? No, I know you don't, so simply roll with the flow, buy some and be happy.
    Political Correctness'.........defined

    "A doctrine fostered by a delusional, illogical minority and rabidly promoted by an unscrupulous mainstream media, which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible to pick up a t-u-r-d by the clean end."

    President of Club Polk

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  • disneyjoe7
    disneyjoe7 Posts: 11,435
    edited January 2009
    F1nut wrote: »
    Why does this bother you so? I mean, do you understand why one tube sounds better than another or why one amp sounds better when they have the same specs? No, I know you don't, so simply roll with the flow, buy some and be happy.


    Yes I have an idea why tubes or tube vs. tube sound better. I'm a complete geek look here... www.dvrblackbox.com built it for people. People love it designed PCB, microchip code (needed to learn it from scratch) built a web page (learned that from scratch or my own perhaps a little help here or there) Everything is mine, may have been placed here for a geek need or two who knows.


    It's not my writing skills that's for sure. Maybe for what I can fix, I can fix it because I understand something. ;)

    Speakers
    Carver Amazing Fronts
    CS400i Center
    RT800i's Rears
    Sub Paradigm Servo 15

    Electronics
    Conrad Johnson PV-5 pre-amp
    Parasound Halo A23
    Pioneer 84TXSi AVR
    Pioneer 79Avi DVD
    Sony CX400 CD changer
    Panasonic 42-PX60U Plasma
    WMC Win7 32bit HD DVR


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  • Mike21
    Mike21 Posts: 252
    edited January 2009
    I have a pair of Music Hose (not the second generation 750s) which I believe were the first speaker cables produced by MIT - probaly '84 or '85. Thay do not have black boxes. On my Dali Icon 6s the Hose sound better than my Audience Au24s. But, the Au sounds better with my Polk M50s. Go figure. :rolleyes:
    Mike21
    ____________________________________________
    Home Theater 32"LG LCD; Comcast; 7.1 Onkyo 805; Fronts: Polk M50s; Center: Polk CS2; Sides: Polk M40s; Rear: B&W LM1s; Subs: (2) Sony 12" x 100w; Samsung 1500BDP; Toshiba A-2 HD-DVDP.
    PC stereo: Viper custom PC: Windows XP; ASIO4ALL; JRiver Jukebox> Pop Pulse USB to S/PDIF conv> Monarchy DIP > Musiland MD10 DAC > Parasound 2100 pre> Aragon 4004 MKII amp> Dali Ikon6 towers; Sunfire True Sub; PSA Duet, Ultimate outlet and Noise Harvestors.
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  • metal83
    metal83 Posts: 1,219
    edited January 2009
    So i got some AVt-2 speaker interfaces, and some AVt-2 IC's, 1.5 pairs of each. I ordered them from Greg (inspiredsports) this past Thursday afternoon and received them this morning, wow that's some fast shipping!

    I haven't hooked them up yet, but i will be doing that later today hopefully. Considering these cables are replacing the Walmart 16ga cable i have, and i currently have no IC's, i'd say this is quite an upgrade for me, especially for my first set of nice cables and IC's.

    I'm very excited! :D
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  • danz1906
    danz1906 Posts: 5,144
    edited January 2009
    metal83 wrote: »
    So i got some AVt-2 speaker interfaces, and some AVt-2 IC's, 1.5 pairs of each. I ordered them from Greg (inspiredsports) this past Thursday afternoon and received them this morning, wow that's some fast shipping!

    I haven't hooked them up yet, but i will be doing that later today hopefully. Considering these cables are replacing the Walmart 16ga cable i have, and i currently have no IC's, i'd say this is quite an upgrade for me, especially for my first set of nice cables and IC's.

    I'm very excited! :D

    You should hear a big difference:D:D:D
    Linn AV5140 fronts
    Linn AV5120 Center
    Linn AV5140 Rears
    M&K MX-70 Sub for Music
    Odyssey Mono-Blocs
    SVS Ultra-13 Gloss Black:D
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  • metal83
    metal83 Posts: 1,219
    edited January 2009
    I hope so! lol :D
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  • reeltrouble1
    reeltrouble1 Posts: 9,312
    edited February 2009
    disneyjoe7 wrote: »
    Maybe for what I can fix, I can fix it because I understand something. ;)


    I believe I have heard this expressed in somewhat different terms.

    Things will always break so they can be fixed, keep reaching for the unreachable star.

    I just put a new set of MIT S-1 cables into the rig, immediate result is more defined clairity of the bass.

    RT1
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  • Ricardo
    Ricardo Posts: 10,636
    edited February 2009
    reeltrouble1 wrote: »
    I just put a new set of MIT S-1 cables into the rig, immediate result is more defined clairity of the bass.

    RT1

    Really. My experience (with S3) is that they sound like crap when new. So I'm thinking when they break in you're in for a real treat.
    _________________________________________________
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  • reeltrouble1
    reeltrouble1 Posts: 9,312
    edited February 2009
    Yes Ricardo that has been my experience as well with the S-3, I am sure the S-1 will get better with some time too.

    RT1
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  • Polkitup2
    Polkitup2 Posts: 1,622
    edited February 2009
    Ok MIT effectionatos, I've had the S3 IC's for a few weeks and did some A/B stuff with my AQ Cables and the MITs won, so the question is... Is the biggest MIT bang with the ICs or the speaker cables?
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  • Face
    Face Posts: 14,340
    edited February 2009
    I found MIT's a little bass shy out of the box, so I'm glad you're seeing an improvement already.

    As for biggest bang for the buck, I found the I/C's made the biggest improvement, but the speaker cables are still worth the investment due to the further improvement in imaging, coherence, etc...
    "He who fights with monsters should look to it that he himself does not become a monster. And when you gaze long into an abyss the abyss also gazes into you." Friedrich Nietzsche
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  • reeltrouble1
    reeltrouble1 Posts: 9,312
    edited February 2009
    Polkit,

    I would go with the connects first if you cannot do both at once.

    RT1
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