Bose

bobman1235

Oh, and I almost forgot the part where Bose actively sues anyone who puts out a negative review of their product, so not only do you have no objective way of comparing their stuff to others (they don't allow it to be put side by side with other products, only in its own display), you have no SUBjective way of comparing their stuff because honest reviews are literally not allowed. Awesome.

inspiredsports

bobman1235 wrote: »

. . . you're an insane person . . . Bose would be a fine solution if they cost 400 dollars for a system

Hi Bob,

Yes, I AM an insane person. I have 6K worth of plasma and sound in the living room, 5K worth of plasma and sound in the den and 9K worth of 2 ch sound in my man cave, and I am a LIGHTWEIGHT compared to what many in this forum have spent, but still insane when you look at what you could do with those dollars.

I paid $450 to Sam's Club for a brand-new-in-the-box Bose 321 CD system last year. It's on a 58" Panasonic 1080P Plasma that is angled in a corner with only a 2 foot span of wall on the angle right side. Being angled into a 16 X 24 room leaves about zero options to properly locate 5.1 or 7.1 sound. The 321 satellites were a great solution. Inexpensive and easy to install, they look good and the sound, in my specific installation, is very good.

RutgersFTW

Those 321 systems are really really bad. My cousin bought one when he bought his 55" Sony set last year and it doesn't sound any better than the TV speakers. Harsh highs, muffled dialogue, farty bass - bad bad bad. Expensive and bad. Aiwa shelf system bad.

Here's what I don't get - no matter what Bose tells you, it's a stereo. Here's an experiment - buy a $150 budget Sony, Yamaha, Pioneer, Onkyo, etc receiver and a pair of inexpensive bookshelves like Polk RTi A1s, PSB Alphas, Boston CS26, etc for under $200. If you really want to get depressed, spend $100 on a cheap sub like a PSW10. Now we're at less than $450. Plug in the two speakers to the front speaker jacks, hook up your CD/DVD player, and cry - because this system will sound open, spacious, airy, and dynamic, while the Bose will sound like a couple of 2" paper drivers in a plastic box.

The 321 system isn't a perfect solution for anyone. It doesn't replicate a 5.1 channel system, it's a shoddily built 2.1 system that looks and sounds cheap.

bobman1235

Even if you do like the sound of the Bose, which I suppose is subjective ( though you'd think with all that money invested you'd have some taste) , their dishonest and unethical business practices alone should turn you off.

Upstatemax

People don't like to accept the fact that they threw away money on a crap system...

My father used to LOVE his Bose system, then he came over and heard what Polk and Denon can do for FAR less money... :cool:

A new Lifestyle 48 system is $4,000... I showed my father what he could do with $4,000 if he dumped the Bose idea.

Hawkeye

I don't understand why people have to take it upon themselves to spare the world from Bose. While I am no fan of the the product or the marketing tactics, if somebody likes the way they sound or the way they "fit" in a room, who am I to tell them it is no good?

Some people don't care about response, range, imaging and all of the other adjectives and verbs we use to describe our systems. They want a simple, no fuss system. If I had a living room decorated with fine antiques, I would have a difficult time incorporating my system. A Bose system may make sense for a room like that where I wanted to hear music but not see 8 large black boxes.

To each their own.

Gordon

RutgersFTW

Hawkeye wrote: »

I don't understand why people have to take it upon themselves to spare the world from Bose. While I am no fan of the the product or the marketing tactics, if somebody likes the way they sound or the way they "fit" in a room, who am I to tell them it is no good?

Some people don't care about response, range, imaging and all of the other adjectives and verbs we use to describe our systems. They want a simple, no fuss system. If I had a living room decorated with fine antiques, I would have a difficult time incorporating my system. A Bose system may make sense for a room like that where I wanted to hear music but not see 8 large black boxes.

To each their own.

Gordon

I generally agree with you, but the 3-2-1 is particularly egregious. The Bose bookshelves are relatively inoffensive if not the most nuanced or well-built things going under $300, and even the much maligned Acoustimass systems aren't any worse than many other small sub-sat systems out there (if a little more expensive). The Lifestyle line and, even worse, the 3-2-1 series ARE despicable... Bose charges $1200 for two plastic satellites, a lousy subwoofer, an old-school DVD player, and a low-current amplifier. It's shameful.

Hawkeye

RutgersFTW wrote: »

I generally agree with you, but the 3-2-1 is particularly egregious. The Bose bookshelves are relatively inoffensive if not the most nuanced or well-built things going under $300, and even the much maligned Acoustimass systems aren't any worse than many other small sub-sat systems out there (if a little more expensive). The Lifestyle line and, even worse, the 3-2-1 series ARE despicable... Bose charges $1200 for two plastic satellites, a lousy subwoofer, an old-school DVD player, and a low-current amplifier. It's shameful.

You won't get an argument out of me over the 3-2-1 thing. It was the worst thing I had ever heard. A guy from work bought one and asked me to come over and help him hook it up and "hear" it. He was very happy and excited that he finally had a Bose system. He asked me what I thought and being polite I asked him what HE thought of it. I could take it for about one half hour before I had to leave and come home and get a dose of real music. He has heard my gear and mentioned that there was something missing in my system. I did not have the heart to tell him I am missing the big holes in frequencies his system has. He is still enjoying it for the past year and has no intention of changing.

Gordon

Fongolio

As amusing as this dual topic thread is I thought this may be of interest to one or two people.

Forum Rules
1) Stick to the topic of the forum. This way information is easily categorized to make it easy for new members to access. Threads or posts that do not contain relevant information will be removed.

2) The discussion of politics and religion is not allowed on this forum.

3) Pornography and violent images or discussions are not allowed on this forum. This includes posts about weapons or explosives.

4) No fighting. Personal attacks, trouble making, inappropriate language, or any threatening or offensive behavior will not be tolerated.

VERY IMPORTANT...

If you have a problem with another member's comments in a posted thread, DO NOT respond with any further comments that will aggravate the situation. Members have two options of recourse....


Email the moderators, directing them to the individual and thread that the problem occurs in.
Resolve the problem between both of you via PERSONAL email.
Reacting to a hostile post with more hostility puts YOU in jeopardy, and risks your account from being deleted. To be objective and fair about situations where forum members are attacking each other, BOTH members' accounts will be removed from our forum (and no, we don't care who started it).



5) No spam. Any member soliciting spam will be removed.

6) Do not brand bash. We're all in this together. Discuss what you like and dislike. But don't bash someone or something because you don't like it.
7) Be respectful of new members. If it was only you and me on this forum, we'd have no fun and the whole industry would collapse. Fact is, home theater is an exploding industry. More and more people all the time are discovering the joys of DVD and audiophile music. Welcome the newbies. For they will encourage industry growth, which will result in better prices and better equipment for all us heathens.

8) Trolling - members who make a conscious effort to inflame or irritate others will be removed.

9) Forum rules & guidelines are not up for debate. This is not a democracy, but rather a private forum owned by Polk Audio. Anyone openly debating the rules we have set in place will be removed.

shack

Fongolio wrote: »

As amusing as this dual topic thread is I thought this may be of interest to one or two people.

Forum Rules
1) Stick to the topic of the forum. This way information is easily categorized to make it easy for new members to access. Threads or posts that do not contain relevant information will be removed.

2) The discussion of politics and religion is not allowed on this forum.

3) Pornography and violent images or discussions are not allowed on this forum. This includes posts about weapons or explosives.

4) No fighting. Personal attacks, trouble making, inappropriate language, or any threatening or offensive behavior will not be tolerated.

VERY IMPORTANT...

If you have a problem with another member's comments in a posted thread, DO NOT respond with any further comments that will aggravate the situation. Members have two options of recourse....


Email the moderators, directing them to the individual and thread that the problem occurs in.
Resolve the problem between both of you via PERSONAL email.
Reacting to a hostile post with more hostility puts YOU in jeopardy, and risks your account from being deleted. To be objective and fair about situations where forum members are attacking each other, BOTH members' accounts will be removed from our forum (and no, we don't care who started it).



5) No spam. Any member soliciting spam will be removed.

6) Do not brand bash. We're all in this together. Discuss what you like and dislike. But don't bash someone or something because you don't like it.
7) Be respectful of new members. If it was only you and me on this forum, we'd have no fun and the whole industry would collapse. Fact is, home theater is an exploding industry. More and more people all the time are discovering the joys of DVD and audiophile music. Welcome the newbies. For they will encourage industry growth, which will result in better prices and better equipment for all us heathens.

8) Trolling - members who make a conscious effort to inflame or irritate others will be removed.

9) Forum rules & guidelines are not up for debate. This is not a democracy, but rather a private forum owned by Polk Audio. Anyone openly debating the rules we have set in place will be removed.

Who made you a thread monitor?

Besides...Bose and Monster are exempt from those rules.

steveinaz

What ever sounds best to you, is the best for you. This stuff is not a competition, it's about selecting components that satisfy what you expect from the musical experience.

I had a set of 901 VI's for nearly 14 years, and found them very satisfying with a big room and plenty of amplification. Over priced? probably, but since I got them for $799/pr w/EQ and stands (Army PX) I didn't feel cheated in the least. I still look at the 901 from time to time. Are they the last word in articulation? Not even close to it, but I happen to like the Bose "flavor" and truth be told, I don't give a damn what anyone else thinks about it.

Cornbread

I have a pair of Bose 201 Series II bookshelf speakers. They are the old school ones that were actually made with MDF. I also own/owned a dozen other bookshelf speakers throughout the years. The Bose have highs but they are harsh and they definitely have no lows. The other thing they lack is imaging. Even the cheapest of speakers offer better imaging than the 201's. Instrument placement is near impossible and vocals sound like they are coming from a giant head instead of pin-pointed in the center of the soundstage. I have A/B'd them directly with everything from Radio Shack Lineaums, to Polk Monitor 5 Jr's, to Axiom M3 v2's. In every instance they lose big. They are fine for casual background music (which just about any speaker is) but for serious listening they are overpriced junk.

Fongolio

shack wrote: »

Who made you a thread monitor?

Besides...Bose and Monster are exempt from those rules.

Self-appointed. For life.

shack

Fongolio wrote:

Self-appointed. For life.

As were Saddam Hussein, Charles Taylor, "Baby Doc" Duvalier, Idi Amin, Mobutu...to name a few.

Fongolio

shack wrote: »

As were Saddam Hussein, Charles Taylor, "Baby Doc" Duvalier, Idi Amin, Mobutu...to name a few.

An astute observation indeed.
Consider me the Last Threadpoliceman of Scotland

dkg999

The sound of a Bose system can be greatly improved by using the proper cables.

treitz3

6) Do not brand bash. We're all in this together. Discuss what you like and dislike. But don't bash someone or something because you don't like it.
Ok, I dislike Bose. Every product I have heard from them, period. I'm not bashing them and I am staying within the forum guidelines. My observations include a high amount of distortion, omitted frequencies and an overall sound that makes me want to gracefully leave the room. It is my opinion that your hard earned money can be spent more wisely with just a little bit of research and I'm not alone with that opinion.

What I do like is accurate sound reproduction. Bose does not offer this, so I must move on. The only product that has gotten positive reviews lately on this forum and others are the noise canceling headphones. With that product, I have not heard them so I cannot comment other than that.

inspiredsports

OK !!!! I'm convinced !!!

I'm tossing the 321 (not even listing it for resale because you naysayers have convinced me it is so bad). Hopefully, it's not so crappy that those who raid our trash every Tuesday night are repulsed and leave it for the actual trash haulers to recover (I gave them gift certificates to Lowe's for the holidays).

I'm moving my 1.2's to the front, my SDA SRS 2's (sans interconnect) to the rear, LSi to center. My Carvers and preamp are coming along for the ride. (I'll leave my SDA 2B TL's in the man cave with my NAD stuff). The 1.2 on the right will only protrude a couple of feet out into the foyer, exposing its back side and wiring to the entrance door and side-lites. It will only partially block a couple of feet of access to the coat closet and the landing to the upstairs stairway, but I'll have SOUND.

I'll only have to remove 3 seats from the 6 place leather sectional (making it a sofa) to accommodate the 2's (so I'm down to 2 leather sofas and 2 leather recliners in the room).

But at least I didn't COMPROMISE. If you have anything less in your media room, YOU did! :D

Hmmm . . . I'm having trouble getting guests into the house through the front door, and not enough seats for all, and it's hard to get to the upstairs bedrooms. I wonder if the 321 wasn't an appropriate niche product after all ??

bobman1235

Hawkeye wrote: »

I don't understand why people have to take it upon themselves to spare the world from Bose. While I am no fan of the the product or the marketing tactics, if somebody likes the way they sound or the way they "fit" in a room, who am I to tell them it is no good?

I didn't realize it was a bad thing to try to help my fellow man not get ripped off. If a friend of yours said they were going to go buy a $90 HDMI Monster Cable from Best Buy, you wouldn't say "um, don't do that, you can get one for ten dollars that's just fine."? You'd just assume if they like it, eff em, who cares if they waste their money?

zombie boy 2000

The undead will feast whenever Bose or Monster is mentioned around here. Sorry everyone's up your ****. Some speak from experience. Some are simply parrots. Please feel free to talk anything and everything audio. Hell... I don't even have a rig at the present moment, so I would be more than happy to take a 3-2-1 on loan.

obieone

Can someone 'pause' this thread. I need to go get some popcorn:D

inspiredsports

bobman1235 wrote: »

I didn't realize it was a bad thing to try to help my fellow man not get ripped off. If a friend of yours said they were going to go buy a $90 HDMI Monster Cable from Best Buy, you wouldn't say "um, don't do that, you can get one for ten dollars that's just fine."? You'd just assume if they like it, eff em, who cares if they waste their money?

It would be wise to share with them what you LIKE about your $10 cable, not what you don't about the MC.

steveinaz

The thing is, speakers are such a subjective thing to start with--it's like arguing religion. Buy what sounds right to you. It's that simple.

zombie boy 2000

Zero wrote: »

Yet at the end of the day - everyone's gotta have an outlet - and someone's gotta be the punching bag.

I prefer hobos and carnies when I feel like bringing out ol' Thunder and Lightning. Good to hear from you Sean.

inspiredsports

steveinaz wrote: »

The thing is, speakers are such a subjective thing to start with--it's like arguing religion. Buy what sounds right to you. It's that simple.

I think the conclusion every listener reaches about every component in his/her system is subjective. Heck, we spend hours discussing the differences of tiny pieces and parts of components like identically valued capacitors and resistors in a particular crossover or DAC mod. And yes, speakers wires are the biggie!

I think the value of this forum is the honest sharing of ideas and opinions so readers can hear why people made choices they did, but not in a "holier-than-though" bashing fashion. Some make compromises because that is a reality of life, and sharing the reasons for those compromises helps other make cost/value decisions.

shack

Bose still sucks. IMO!

inspiredsports

shack wrote: »

Bose still . . .

Hey Shack,

You've been around a while. What components do you like for a $1,200-$1,300 5.1 system?

George Grand

I believe that Ray-Ban provides a high quality product. Whether or not they are high priced in this day and age I'm not qualified to say. Every pair of RB's in-house are older than 95% of the members here, and I didn't pay jack for any of them. My military issue bi-focals are rapidly becoming my favorites in both clear and dark lenses.

I also have a background in eyeglasses. Perhaps not a degree in lensology or anything like that, but right around 1972 I was grinding lenses for Brookhaven Opticians in Smithtown, Long Island. One of only two jobs I've ever been "dismissed" from in fact. I still have a lot of stuff that I ground for myself back then including RB style teardrops. I also had a monocle that I ordered for myself, but gave it away to a one-eyed navigator not long ago.

Polkitup2

I still cringe everytime I walk into my local Best Buy, they have this round monstrosity consisting of about 5 bose dual cubes hanging from the ceiling pumping out awful sound at high volume.

Upstatemax

George Grand wrote: »

I believe that Ray-Ban provides a high quality product. Whether or not they are high priced in this day and age I'm not qualified to say. Every pair of RB's in-house are older than 95% of the members here, and I didn't pay jack for any of them. My military issue bi-focals are rapidly becoming my favorites in both clear and dark lenses.

I also have a background in eyeglasses. Perhaps not a degree in lensology or anything like that, but right around 1972 I was grinding lenses for Brookhaven Opticians in Smithtown, Long Island. One of only two jobs I've ever been "dismissed" from in fact. I still have a lot of stuff that I ground for myself back then including RB style teardrops. I also had a monocle that I ordered for myself, but gave it away to a one-eyed navigator not long ago.

Again, 70's & 80's Ray-Bans are in a different class than current Ray-Bans...

Think of it this way, how would you feel if Bose purchased Polk Audio and started to change how Polk was run... Started to put cheap paper drivers and foam surrounds in speakers... Started to use cheap thin plastics instead of real wood, MDF, cheap crappy crossovers... Then they also turn around and raise the price on the speakers.

That is what Luxottica has done to Ray-Ban... This is what Luxottica does to EVERY brand it buys.