Best reciever

magellings

Hi all,

Last night I tried out five recievers w/ stereo direct w/ rti10 fronts:

Denon AVR-3808ci $1299
Denon AVR-4308ci $2050
Onkyo TX-SR805 $750
Yamaha RX-V3800 $1274
Pioneer Elite VSX-94TXH

I didn't like the Pioneer Elite, so scratch it. The other four all sounded different. I need some help in deciding which one to get, prices are listed above at sale price from AmericanTv here in Wisconsin.

1) The 4308ci is capable of bi-amping fronts for 2-channel stereo and also retaining a 7.1 surround setup w/out rewiring speaker setup, all others do not allow this, only allow bi-amping/bi-wiring and 5.1 simultaneous setup. Will bi-amping improve sound quality for 2-channel listening? Also has hd-radio. Not sure if these extra features are worth it or not.

2) Note the Onkyo TX-SR875, I didn't try out, offers a feature to bridge the fronts to double the power output. My front rti10s allow max 300watts. Will this provide any sound improvement?

3) I like the price on the Onkyo and am willing to pay the bit extra over shoponkyo.com as is brand new. I noticed Onkyo will not upgrade all hdmi signals to 1080p, but not sure if is a concern as 1080p hdtv should upgrade signal to native 1080p display anyway, albeit video processor may be a bit better in reciever.

Current setup is:

fronts rti10
center csi5
surrounds fxi5
surround backs rti6

4) Anyone have any experience, opinions, suggestions on these four recievers...or know of any features one has over the other that I should seriously consider?

Any advice on these "four" items listed would be greatly appreciated as cannot decide upon these four avrs.

Thanks

ben62670

If you are willing to spend over 2g's on a receiver why not do it right, and get a Pre, and an amp?

magellings

Reason I won't go seperates is no ability to try out a seperates setup in my area w/ my current speakers to see how sounds...knowing how something sounds before paying means a lot to me

Face

I'd avoid Yammy, they're known to be bright.

I second Ben's opinion about separates. As for the Denon, that's a insane amount of money to spend on a receiver.

bluextatic

I would never spend 2k on another receiver, although mine lists for around 1500. I would check out emotiva.com for seperates. They have an awsome return policy. Also you should read the reviews on them. For 2k, you could have a system that would put to shame any of the mentioned receivers.
By the way, I am ordering all emotiva stuff.







Polk RTi 10's, HK AVR 645 and much, much more.

wingnut4772

I am curious to know why you did not like the Pioneer.

rskarvan

I've had a Denon 3801 for a decade now and it still works like brand new.
You can't go wrong with Denon.

jerrymb

Face wrote: »

I'd avoid Yammy, they're known to be bright.

I second Ben's opinion about separates. As for the Denon, that's a insane amount of money to spend on a receiver.[/QUOTE

Yamahas are not bright.Just one of those silly myths.I have a Yamaha and an Onkyo and a Harman Kardon.I've had all 3 hooked up and I cannot hear ANY difference between the 3.They sound identical.

ben62670

magellings wrote: »

Reason I won't go seperates is no ability to try out a seperates setup in my area w/ my current speakers to see how sounds...knowing how something sounds before paying means a lot to me

You are asking our opinions now? I don't own any of the RTi speakers, but for that kinda money nearly any separates are going to blow away a receiver. Think of a receiver as a head unit in a car. I don't care how many watts it says you just are not going to get the performance of an amp. I also second avoid the Yamaha. You didn't list one of the best receivers also... HK.

Ben

chadjessie@hotm

I too think I would look into separates for that kind of money. If you are set on just getting a reciever from your list I think I would lean towards the Onkyo. The 805's are very capable and if I remember right are rated to run 4 ohm as well, a nice feature. (Someone correct me if I am wrong on that.) You will get a lot of performance out of the Onk and you will have the least amount of money into it. By the way I like your speaker set up. That should sound great!

magellings

Does anyone have any answers to questions 1, 2, and 3?

Also, I have a question regarding seperates (a pre and amp). How does the setup work? A pre is the main device for all video/audio inputs? amps for powering the speakers?

With the Onkyo 805 it's a 7.1 channel reciever. How would I go about setting up a 7.1 system with seperates (a pre and amp)? Could I use the Onkyo as a pre?

I didn't like the Pioneer because it was too overwhelming to me. After listening to it for a while during the trial I felt like it was uncomfortable listening to it as my ears started to get annoyed. Possibly it's the pioneer/polk speaker combination, not sure. But I realized I would not want to listen to music w/ the Pioneer for a long period of time as sound was a bit overwhelming.

Of the recievers above, sounds like the Denon 3808 or Onkyo are the two best. The Denon 4308 too expensive and should consider seperates instead.

Face

The Onkyo would make a fine preamp. Just pick up 7 interconnect cables and a separate amp and you're set.

ben62670

magellings wrote: »

Does anyone have any answers to questions 1, 2, and 3?

Also, I have a question regarding seperates (a pre and amp). How does the setup work? A pre is the main device for all video/audio inputs? amps for powering the speakers?

With the Onkyo 805 it's a 7.1 channel reciever. How would I go about setting up a 7.1 system with seperates (a pre and amp)? Could I use the Onkyo as a pre?

I didn't like the Pioneer because it was too overwhelming to me. After listening to it for a while during the trial I felt like it was uncomfortable listening to it as my ears started to get annoyed. Possibly it's the pioneer/polk speaker combination, not sure. But I realized I would not want to listen to music w/ the Pioneer for a long period of time as sound was a bit overwhelming.

Of the recievers above, sounds like the Denon 3808 or Onkyo are the two best. The Denon 4308 too expensive and should consider seperates instead.

?1 1,2, and 3 No
?2 yes a Pre is just like a receiver, but no amplifaction
?3 Yes you could use you Onkyo as a Pre if it has PreOuts

chadjessie@hotm

Face wrote: »

The Onkyo would make a fine preamp. Just pick up 7 interconnect cables and a separate amp and you're set.

This is very simple to do. Getting the Onkyo gives you a good place to start. You can use it to power your setup from the start if you don't want or aren't able to get a seperate amp right away. Then if you decide you want an amp (the sound will be much better) it can be used as the preamp through the preouts. The money you didn't spend going this route can be used toward your amp and for that money you should be able to find a nice used multi channel amp. Good luck.

tcwong

Please consider Marantz SR7002 or SR8002 at that price range

hockeyboy

Simple. Marantz.

DeusExa

Nothing can even touch the 805 at the price - it's kinda hard to find a AVR well under $1k than supports up to THX Ultra2/can run at 4 ohms fairly well/have burr brown DACs/current driven...

magellings

If I used the Onkyo as a preamp, then I'd need to buy either:

1) a 7.1 multi-channel amp for 7.1 setup?
2) or multiple amps?

Any specific multi-channel amps anyone recommends so I could achieve a 7.1 setup?

Also, will bi-amping, bi-wiring, or bridging my fronts provide any better sound? These avrs support one or more of these features.

chadjessie@hotm

Yeah, you could look for a 7 channel amp - these can be a bit pricey, but sometimes much more simple to just have one amp. Multiple amps will work just as well. As far as amps some decent used ones such as Adcom, Parasound, Rotel, B & K would all work really well. You can look for these in 2,3,5,7 channel offerings and see what you prefer for the price. Can't help you much with the bi-amping and bi-wiring questions - have never gotten into it.

DeusExa

You could just get a 2-channel amp to power your fronts, and use the 805 for the rears/center.

No offense, but you don't have the LSis XD, so you don't need crazy equipment - yet!

dcacc

Also: You can get the Onkyo 805 for $699 through Vann's right now. I just bought it from them through Amazon using a couple coupons Amazon sent me. Paid $649 total including shipping.

Now I just have to wait until next Monday. It's killing me.

polkseller

Onkyo and Pioneer Elite makes good receiver...

I really dont know why you didnt like the Vsx-94... pionneer is the best combination of power, details and musicality.

Strengths:
Marantz= musicality, sound balance

Denon: microdynamics, too neutral, boring sound, but huge soundstage

Pioneer: good soundstage, good microdynamics, good musicality, extended audio features, my choice

Onkyo 805: never listened to it, but I listened to integra amps that I didnt like them, sound is congested

Harman Kardon: Good soundstage, good details, low volume sound quality, amazing rear speaker surround effect/power. No useless DSP modes, My 2nd choice.

mantis

The pioneer Elite is the best out of the bunch in my opnion. Denons are very flat and don't have good dynamics. Onkyo is as bright or worse then Yamaha, I'd say they are worse. Yamaha like Onkyo is very bright and terrible with Polk speakers.

Your system but this is my opnion on all of them. I have Installed all of the above and this is how I formed my opnion. I owned Yamaha and Denon with Rt speakers and found the above to hold true. I also owned a Pioneer elite receiver with rt speakers and found it to sound the best. The 94 in my opnion is the best under 1600.00 receiver on the market. It's awesome.

Dan

Willow

If I had to do it all over again it would be seperates.That's not to say I won't in the future. I am alos surprised you didn't try HK.

I really like the HK/Polk combo. I am using my HK as a pre

ben62670

Willow wrote: »

If I had to do it all over again it would be seperates.That's not to say I won't in the future. I am alos surprised you didn't try HK.

I really like the HK/Polk combo. I am using my HK as a pre

I miss mine.

jdhdiggs

Well, seeing as if you are fairly patient and frugal, you can get the 805 for $600 shipped to your door, I would guess that, plus an amp would be the best bet.

BTW: Since the 805 sound good driving the LSi's by itself, I'd agree with Mantis that it might be a bit too forward and bright on the RTi's.

Willow

ben62670 wrote: »

I miss mine.

what are you using now?

I love the sound of them, coupled with my Marantz monoblocks, not wonder my Rti8s don't sound bright.

shimey013

I have the ONK 705 connected to my RTi8's and there is nothing bright about it...its sounds absolutely amazing...But no matter what I say or anyone else says, go out, and test drive them....I love my onk 705, dont have any complaints, still have yet to see this brightness everyone talks about

magellings

polkseller wrote: »

Onkyo and Pioneer Elite makes good receiver...

I really dont know why you didnt like the Vsx-94... pionneer is the best combination of power, details and musicality.

Marantz= musicality

Denon: microdynamics, too neutral, boring sound but huge soundstage

Pioneer: good soundstage, good microdynamics, good musicality, my choice

Onkyo 805: never listened to it, but I listened to integra amps that I didnt like

Could someone better describe what all this means: soundstage, microdynamics, musicality? I think keeping these items in mind while doing a second trial of these recievers will help. Soundstage I'm guessing means how well the sound fills the room during two-channel listening. If that's the case I did notice the Denon and Yamaha filled the room better than the Onkyo, but the Onkyo was more relaxing to me and better crystal clear bass response.

...regarding the pioneer again, I think it just sounded too powerful, a bit overwhelming and not as relaxing to me. I prefered the more relaxing sound the other recievers had.

magellings

mantis wrote: »

The pioneer Elite is the best out of the bunch in my opnion. Denons are very flat and don't have good dynamics. Onkyo is as bright or worse then Yamaha, I'd say they are worse. Yamaha like Onkyo is very bright and terrible with Polk speakers.

Your system but this is my opnion on all of them. I have Installed all of the above and this is how I formed my opnion. I owned Yamaha and Denon with Rt speakers and found the above to hold true. I also owned a Pioneer elite receiver with rt speakers and found it to sound the best. The 94 in my opnion is the best under 1600.00 receiver on the market. It's awesome.

Dan

What does "bright" mean?

ben62670

Willow wrote: »

what are you using now?

I love the sound of them, coupled with my Marantz monoblocks, not wonder my Rti8s don't sound bright.

Well I started with a Yamaha, then went to an Adcom GTP-555, then the HK. Then I started getting silly with amps (3000+watts rms home theater) got the Outlaw 990. Yami is fine for home theater on the cheap. Adcom except for the GFP750 is to grainy, but an awesome punch. The HK was nice, and smooth yet detailed as a pre, and a receiver. Good bass, but not the punch of the Adcom(nothing had the punch of the Adcom). Outlaw 990 Has balanced outputs, and a phono stage. Nice, but not worth almost 3 times the price of an HK. The tuner on the Outlaw sucks compared to the HK. HK remote kinda sucked. BTW my HK was an AVR-235. One of the "weakest" HK's made. It was much much better for music than my Yamaha or Adcom ever was.