are bridged amps common ground?
Comments
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I DO own several Pro Amps Troy, along with several high end amps too.
And I DO hear differences in amps, WHEN listening to them flat.
However, try this.
Get a pre amp with decent tone controls, and forget your "audiophile conceptions".
Adjust a CD using the tone controls until it sounds it's best.
Then listen.
Then, substitute another amp, adjust tone controls again, then listen ?
You might find that "differences" in amps suddenly disappear ?
That's probably the most ridiculous statement that I've heard in a VERY long time.
BDTI plan for the future. - F1Nut -
I'm mad at Jesse. PM him and ask why (if you don't know already).Proud and loyal citizen of the Digital Domain and Solid State Country!
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Agreed. This thread was a comic book. There are many more "quotes" that could be pointed out, but I have to admit, that's a good one.TroyD wrote:That's probably the most ridiculous statement that I've heard in a VERY long time.
Hope all is well bro'.~ In search of accurate reproduction of music. Real sound is my reference and while perfection may not be attainable? If I chase it, I might just catch excellence. ~ -
DarqueKnight wrote: »I'm mad at Jesse. PM him and ask why (if you don't know already).
Hehe.......Political Correctness'.........defined
"A doctrine fostered by a delusional, illogical minority and rabidly promoted by an unscrupulous mainstream media, which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible to pick up a t-u-r-d by the clean end."
President of Club Polk -
Huummm no more responses so my guess is the pleasant gentleman
from Tampa must have lost his CP privelages. Testing
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Alas, our "daddy", El Padre Loco, has been ex-communicated.Proud and loyal citizen of the Digital Domain and Solid State Country!
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I started this thread asking advice on a simple question. Excellent advice quickly came in and confirmed my own experimentation. There is NO benefit to bridging the 125 watt Parasound amp and using it to drive a single 1.2 TL. It is much better to do the classic bi-amp configuration. So, thanks for your advice (again). Then, for some strange reason, this thread went South (pun intended to the Tampa guy). Nice to know there is an involved moderator. Thanks, whoever you are.
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I think everyone made a point, but why don't you try it and see if you like it.
BTW bridge amps are not common ground, so you will need what ever in that department.
Speakers
Carver Amazing Fronts
CS400i Center
RT800i's Rears
Sub Paradigm Servo 15
Electronics
Conrad Johnson PV-5 pre-amp
Parasound Halo A23
Pioneer 84TXSi AVR
Pioneer 79Avi DVD
Sony CX400 CD changer
Panasonic 42-PX60U Plasma
WMC Win7 32bit HD DVR -
http://www.polkaudio.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=27914&d=1191632749
Is this Londonbarn? Chris Barnhardt? AKA ka7niq? If so, I feel bad for George having to endure such an asshat's presence.~ In search of accurate reproduction of music. Real sound is my reference and while perfection may not be attainable? If I chase it, I might just catch excellence. ~ -
No, that's Mark, aka dorokusai.
I also think that they (barn and specK) are two seperate jerkoffs.
BDTI plan for the future. - F1Nut -
No, neither are jerkoffs.
George is a crackpot, and Mark is a dunderhead.Check your lips at the door woman. Shake your hips like battleships. Yeah, all the white girls trip when I sing at Sunday service. -
Yes more precisely it is capacitive,and inductive reactance that make up the complex impedance of a speaker.Because of this complex impedance that is made up of reactance and resistance you cannot using ohm's law accurately calculate the current requirements as though it were a pure 4 or 8 ohm resistor.
Just to add a little more.
E=IR is for DC voltages only not AC voltages
E=I(impedance) is for any electrical circuit
With a constant voltage the reactive inductance=resistance and the reactive capacitance=infinite resistance or open circuit.
Impedance and Resistance use the same unit, Ohms. -
Peter, you're a little late to the party
Political Correctness'.........defined
"A doctrine fostered by a delusional, illogical minority and rabidly promoted by an unscrupulous mainstream media, which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible to pick up a t-u-r-d by the clean end."
President of Club Polk -
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Shall we continue the amplifier current discussion ?
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polkaudio SRS (rdo194 x 8)
Dodd ELP (separate power supply)
JC 1 blocks ( strapped )
Rega Apollo
MIT (speaker cables) Outlaw (ICs)
polkaudio SDA2(rdo194x4) (front) polkaudio CRS (rdo194x4)(rear) polkaudio 400i (center)
B&K 505
Samsung LCD
VIP 622
HSU STF-2 -
Shall we continue the amplifier current discussion ?
Knock yourself out.......kind of a glutton for punishment. Let it go, would probably be best, but hey you have a new lease on life here thanks to Polk management.
H9"Appreciation of audio is a completely subjective human experience. Measurements can provide a measure of insight, but are no substitute for human judgment. Why are we looking to reduce a subjective experience to objective criteria anyway? The subtleties of music and audio reproduction are for those who appreciate it. Differentiation by numbers is for those who do not".--Nelson Pass Pass Labs XA25 | EE Avant Pre | EE Mini Max Supreme DAC | MIT Shotgun S1 | Pangea AC14SE MKII | Legend L600 | BlueSound Node 3 - Tubes add soul! -
I have been unable to defend myself, but allow me to set the record straight.I started this thread asking advice on a simple question. Excellent advice quickly came in and confirmed my own experimentation. There is NO benefit to bridging the 125 watt Parasound amp and using it to drive a single 1.2 TL. It is much better to do the classic bi-amp configuration. So, thanks for your advice (again). Then, for some strange reason, this thread went South (pun intended to the Tampa guy). Nice to know there is an involved moderator. Thanks, whoever you are.
Yes, you did START this thread.
There have been well over 100 posts in it, yet you haven't posted since post 18 in "your thread".
No one "owns a thread" here BUT Polk Audio, and sometime they take on a life of their own.
This thread "went south" starting with an insult by another poster, who slammed a guys amp because it had fans in it, and was of "pro sound heritage".
It then turned into a heated amplifier current discussion. -
[QUOTE=ka7niq;713244This thread "went south" starting with an insult by another poster, who slammed a guys amp because it had fans in it, and was of "pro sound heritage".
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Nice edit. :rolleyes:Wristwatch--->Crisco -
The reason I edited is because it was someone else who actually started the thread going south with a personal shot at another poster.Nice edit. :rolleyes: -
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I don't post a lot. Nor do I offer false pretense. My main interest is learning from the experience of senior Polksters, H9, DK, F1 and others come to mind. To them (and others) I am thankful. I certainly find the notion of my "owning a thread" to be quite disgusting. Have you heard the term "projection"? Not referring to A/V, of course.
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Yes, so did I.I don't post a lot. Nor do I offer false pretense. My main interest is learning from the experience of senior Polksters, H9, DK, F1 and others come to mind. To them (and others) I am thankful. I certainly find the notion of my "owning a thread" to be quite disgusting. -
OK so we left off with you claiming that by just using ohm's law you can predict the current requirements of a speaker. As I mentioned in a couple of posts that there was more to it than that.Shall we continue the amplifier current discussion ?
Here is a good read about said subject and it may well convince that your formula based approximations will not be accurate.See specifically the right column in the introduction.http://bruce.coppola.name/audio/cableInteractions.pdf
Now lets keep any discussion civil THERE IS no need for flaming.Technical discussions can be fun and educational for all without the BS.Testing
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It is the load that determines the current demands of an amplifier, and IF the load is known, current requirements can be predicted.OK so we left off with you claiming that by just using ohm's law you can predict the current requirements of a speaker. As I mentioned in a couple of posts that there was more to it than that.
Here is a good read about said subject and it may well convince that your formula based approximations will not be accurate.See specifically the right column in the introduction.http://bruce.coppola.name/audio/cableInteractions.pdf
Now lets keep any discussion civil THERE IS no need for flaming.Technical discussions can be fun and educational for all without the BS.
Of course a speaker is not a perfect resistor.
The PDF file you provided clearly shows the reference to Dr Matti Otala work.
I take exception to the part that says an 8 ohm load drops to 1.2 ohms because of dynamic resistance.
Maybe in a poorly designed crossover, or speaker with significant reactance.
And WHAT amp will drive 1 ohm anyway, not many ?
There will always be speakers ONLY certain amps will drive.
But the majority of speakers are 4 or 8 ohms, and do not always require some welding machine to drive them.
I think it safe to say that some speakers sound better with monster, high current amps, and some do not.
Some feel that all things being equal, a smaller amp can often sound better then a big one, as long as it can properly drive the speaker in question.
High Current amps have their place, and some speakers really do need them, but most do not.
The LOAD is the boss, and it determines the current demands of any amp.
If 6 amps is all that is called for by the load, and one amp can deliver 25 amps, and one deliver 100, all that is going to be passed is 6 amps of current.
That is all that is being asked for.
Any more, on this speaker, is a waste of money. -
...................Check your lips at the door woman. Shake your hips like battleships. Yeah, all the white girls trip when I sing at Sunday service.
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Good reply.;)
Yes the problem is determining the actualload of some speakers.A standard impedance measurement may not tell the whole story.It is the load that determines the current demands of an amplifier, and IF the load is known, current requirements can be predicted.
Of course a speaker is not a perfect resistor.
Agreed and many designers at least with their budget models try to make their speakers easy loads for amps as they will likely be mated with low powered AVR's etc.But the majority of speakers are 4 or 8 ohms, and do not always require some welding machine to drive them.
Certainly.Some feel that all things being equal, a smaller amp can often sound better then a big one, as long as it can properly drive the speaker in question.
Yes ,this is the point that was trying to be delivered but you seemed to be saying previously that hi current amps where overkill and not necessary.High Current amps have their place, and some speakers really do need them,
Keep in mind that in general amplifiers that have high current capability have been designed with a lot care in other performance aspects that may also improve its sound quality.For instance the power supplies are usually overdesigned with large transformers and big filter caps.Having large amounts of storage in the filter caps means the amp can better deal with heavy bass transients etc. even if the speaker is a nominal 8 ohms.The LOAD is the boss, and it determines the current demands of any amp.
If 6 amps is all that is called for by the load, and one amp can deliver 25 amps, and one deliver 100, all that is going to be passed is 6 amps of current.
That is all that is being asked for.
Any more, on this speaker, is a waste of money.Testing
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I'm your huckleberry.Political Correctness'.........defined
"A doctrine fostered by a delusional, illogical minority and rabidly promoted by an unscrupulous mainstream media, which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible to pick up a t-u-r-d by the clean end."
President of Club Polk -
I think we are pretty much in agreement that high current amps DO have their place on some speakers.
And, I MAY have said or implied they didn't too, which is in error.
That is wrong, and I have been wrong before.
I once had a Bedini 200/200, a monster of an amp.
Weighed about 90 lbs.
I had some speakers from Canada called Perkins, a 2 way with the tweeter mounted on a spring.
They had zero bass, and i could not re sell em, so in the closet they went.
When I got the Bedini 200/200 I had B&W 802 F's.
I fried a tweeter one night on the 802's.
The next day, in desperation, I pulled the Perkins out of the closet.
Suprise Suprise, the big Bedini gave em bass.
I was TOLD the Perkins were a 4 ohm load, but they were revealed to dip down below 2 ohms!
My Hafler didn't like to go there, but the big Bedini got 'turned loose' by the Perkins 2 ohm load.
Many consider some big Krells bright.
I think the Krells have real power supplies that do not sag.
A sagging power supply can cause an amp to roll off, or sound loose in the bass.
