Ford F-150 Lightning Reveal

invalid

This is just like the LEED certification for a new house, we have worked on them it is a joke. They only let you have a certain amount of dumpsters for the scrap and things that go to the dump, so after you use the dumpster allowance all the subcontractors have to haul it to the dump in pickup trucks. Plus most of the houses built are good sized and fancy, which means more scrap and waste. It's just a feel good bragging rights type of thing.

Kex

The market continues to cheer on Ford’s EV ambitions.

• Another 7% added yesterday.
• Traded briefly above $15 this morning.
• Trading volume was 277K vs. 50 day average volume of 70K.

displayname

Wow, a lot happened since the last time I opened this thread.

But here's a video going back to our original topic. Interesting points are "they had to make it better than the has option" and "fastest truck Ford has made"
https://youtu.be/J2npVg9ONFo

Kex

According to that video, the 300 mile EPA rating is with 1,000 lbs in the bed, but without a load, he’s estimating range may be above 450.

Love the Platinum edition seating in his video.

F1nut

From Car and Driver.

Ford is claiming that the range figures for its electric pickup will come in at 230 miles and 300 miles, depending on whether the standard-range (which we estimate can hold 115.0 kWh) or extended-range battery pack (150.0 kWh, same caveat) is beneath the bed. Those are EPA predictions, specifically EPA combined figures, in lightly loaded conditions.

Although the Lightning is aided by the aerodynamic effects of its flat underbody, when running at real highway speeds there's no tricking the air molecules, and a bluff truck is going to suffer. In our highway range testing, which we conduct at a steady 75 mph, we typically see a range number that's about 20 percent below the EPA figure. Using that same bogey, which is probably generous in the case of a full-size pickup, would put the Lightning in the 180-to-240-mile zone for what you might achieve on a road trip.

In a recent towing test with another EV, lugging a 3859-pound boat at 70 mph chopped its range in half compared to a run at the same speed sans trailer. Applying these results to the F-150 means that towing a modest trailer would put the highway range at roughly 100 to 125 miles, depending on the pack. Towing anywhere near the 10,000-pound maximum rating on XLT and Lariat models (with the maximum trailer tow package and extended-range battery) at highway speeds, we believe you'd be hard pressed to exceed double-digit miles. We'd take that bet, in fact.

invalid

F1nut wrote: »

From Car and Driver.

Ford is claiming that the range figures for its electric pickup will come in at 230 miles and 300 miles, depending on whether the standard-range (which we estimate can hold 115.0 kWh) or extended-range battery pack (150.0 kWh, same caveat) is beneath the bed. Those are EPA predictions, specifically EPA combined figures, in lightly loaded conditions.

Although the Lightning is aided by the aerodynamic effects of its flat underbody, when running at real highway speeds there's no tricking the air molecules, and a bluff truck is going to suffer. In our highway range testing, which we conduct at a steady 75 mph, we typically see a range number that's about 20 percent below the EPA figure. Using that same bogey, which is probably generous in the case of a full-size pickup, would put the Lightning in the 180-to-240-mile zone for what you might achieve on a road trip.

In a recent towing test with another EV, lugging a 3859-pound boat at 70 mph chopped its range in half compared to a run at the same speed sans trailer. Applying these results to the F-150 means that towing a modest trailer would put the highway range at roughly 100 to 125 miles, depending on the pack. Towing anywhere near the 10,000-pound maximum rating on XLT and Lariat models (with the maximum trailer tow package and extended-range battery) at highway speeds, we believe you'd be hard pressed to exceed double-digit miles. We'd take that bet, in fact.

Those sound more
like real world figures.

audioluvr

smglbrth wrote: »

Boy are we off to the races on this one! I can't tell who's in first place though...

The problem with the world today is there are too many people and we are all power and fuel glutton's. The only answer is population control and rationing.

Kex

So when your wife tells you that you’re out of milk, you answer that we’re all going to die? 😱

txcoastal1

motorhead43026 wrote: »

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2020/sep/01/kenya-plastic-oil-industry-lobbies-us

This article is a few months old but negations I heard this morning are ongoing and in order for the US to come to a final bilateral trade agreement, Kenya must once again allow us to dump our plastic trash there.

Here, choke on this or no deal.

Your friends the USA

That's disturbing, and not just about the US it's all western nations. Here I thought my recyclables were shredded, heated etc, and reproduced into other or the same plactic goods.

This also will be an issue withe the waste plastics from the added batteries in the vehicles. Seems to me no one actually wants to get into the reproduction of used plastics.

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2019/jul/17/cambodia-plastic-waste-us-canada-send-back

txcoastal1

Back to real world. Looked at my logs because that's what I do, log my trips. So I lose 32% of my fuel milage towing my 14' trailer@2300lbs w/Ranger Crew@2100lbs with accessories...total weight 4300lbs
With a 3/4 diesel

There is no way to load that F150 w/5k and pull it barely 1/2 of the milage with the extended battery
Leaving you to recharge every couple of hours at the minimum

A 20' boat is even heavier by 50%....

You may call it a truck, but its an EV car that looks like a truck. Short range driver as a utility

Kex

Those are not very heavy loads, nor a very large trailer. My 1994 K1500 could handle those numbers without breaking a sweat (it does have a tow package, including a transmission cooler), but we’ll have to wait until the reviewers get some hands on experience with the Lightning before we know what the capabilities are with a trailer.

I suspect that recharging with a trailer attached is a non-starter for most drivers, until they design bigger charging stations. At a gas station, trucks with trailers typically occupy two pumps, which doesn’t matter much since they can fill in a few minutes. That won’t work for charging where it’s becoming increasingly important to deter owners from occupying the station longer than needed.

For those who rarely tow, or only tow over moderate distances, it shouldn’t matter.

txcoastal1

Kex wrote: »

Those are not very heavy loads, nor a very large trailer. My 1994 K1500 could handle those numbers without breaking a sweat (it does have a tow package, including a transmission cooler), but we’ll have to wait until the reviewers get some hands on experience with the Lightning before we know what the capabilities are with a trailer.

I suspect that recharging with a trailer attached is a non-starter for most drivers, until they design bigger charging stations. At a gas station, trucks with trailers typically occupy two pumps, which doesn’t matter much since they can fill in a few minutes. That won’t work for charging where it’s becoming increasingly important to deter owners from occupying the station longer than needed.

For those who rarely tow, or only tow over moderate distances, it shouldn’t matter.

Drive up the busiest north/ south cooridor in the nation...I-35, not a single visible stop to recharge at a travel center.

Lets go to I-45 same deal. Build the infrastucture first...but not on tax payers dime.

My client for over 20 years who owns the Guiness Book of World Record for largest conveneience store and the most pumps who are already going southeast and east could be the biggest supplier for EV.

I'm in the business with travel centers and been in it for over 20 years...don't try to school me.

Kex

txcoastal1

Kex,
Thank you sir for your acknowledgement, would you like to discuss audio.

F1nut

He never does.

machone

F1nut wrote: »

tonyb wrote: »

Good article on those batteries...

https://www.sciencemag.org/news/2021/05/millions-electric-cars-are-coming-what-happens-all-dead-batteries?utm_campaign=news_daily_2021-05-20&et_rid=402798064&et_cid=3781045

Bottom line, an environmental disaster.

Don't even worry about it bro. What could go wrong?

tonyb

I think another aspect of these types of vehicles nobody mentions or considers is maintenance. Once that warranty runs out, there isn't going to be too many driveway mechanics that can work on these vehicles. Tesla's maintenance, even under warranty is a nightmare, and after ....is almost non existent.

Those 10-15 year old fossil fuel burners were good first cars for first time drivers. A 10 year old Honda Accord, Toyota Camry....perfect college cars. Let them bounce off guard rails in a beater. Best thing too, you could still work on them cheaply for the most part. Not going to be able to do that with EV's....and getting your car worked on at the dealer, well, I don't have to tell anyone how expensive that is.

Kex

There are probably plenty of anectdotal horror stories out there, but for the most part Teslas appear to be cheaper to maintain than ICE vehicles that compete in the same category. As for ICE maintenance, it’s not easy to find good dealers. If you are lucky enough to find a good local mechanic who specializes in your brand of vehicle, that can certainly make ownership a lot more cost effective. Ford maintenance for the Lightning is likely to be different from Tesla’s driveway maintenance model, but maybe that will evolve.

Extended warranties can also be bought from Tesla while the existing warranty is still in effect, or shortly thereafter, extending coverage to eight years.

invalid

If EV's do go mainstream the government will eventually have to tax charging of the batteries, otherwise no road tax.

pitdogg2

invalid wrote: »

If EV's do go mainstream the government will eventually have to tax charging of the batteries, otherwise no road tax.

Here in Illinois they do tax you for road use. But not near enough. So not only do ICE vehicles pay a lot for plates we also get gouged at the pump in road taxes. I know I sure in the he LL pay more per year in road taxes than the EV folks. Honestly I think they should be charged by mileage in some fashion or by charging since they are not paying at the pump.

https://electrek.co/2019/06/03/illinois-ridiculous-ev-fee/

motorhead43026

Here is your maintenance schedule for a Tesla. Where is the nightmare part?

Cabin air filter: The filter should be changed every two years or every three years if it’s a High-Efficiency Particulate Air (HEPA) filter.
Tire rotation: Tesla recommends rotating the tires and balancing the alignment every 10,000 to 12,000 miles.
Brake fluid test: Tesla owners should have the brake fluid tested every two years and replaced as needed.
Air conditioning service: Tesla recommends servicing the air conditioning every two to six years, depending on the model.
Winter care: Drivers in cold-weather regions should clean and lubricate their car’s brake calipers every 12 months or 12,500 miles.

invalid

The energy companies in my area already raised their rates to help pay for charging stations and infrastructure for EV's. There is more than one way to subsidize this fiasco than just government handouts.

jeremymarcinko

Maybe someone will design trailers with additional batteries underneath, which will provide more range when hauling.

VR3

The thought that a new, better, more energy efficient technology would need a trailer full of batteries to match the range of a diesel engine just makes chuckle

jeremymarcinko

VR3 wrote: »

The thought that a new, better, more energy efficient technology would need a trailer full of batteries to match the range of a diesel engine just makes chuckle

Well why stop at just batteries. Might as well add four additional motors on the tandem axle model to provide assistance up slopes and regeneration down slopes. Now one can haul a Komatsu with the F-150 Lightening 🙂

txcoastal1

jeremymarcinko wrote: »

Maybe someone will design trailers with additional batteries underneath, which will provide more range when hauling.

txcoastal1

jeremymarcinko wrote: »

VR3 wrote: »

The thought that a new, better, more energy efficient technology would need a trailer full of batteries to match the range of a diesel engine just makes chuckle

Well why stop at just batteries. Might as well add four additional motors on the tandem axle model to provide assistance up slopes and regeneration down slopes. Now one can haul a Komatsu with the F-150 Lightening 🙂

So you're hoping that your trailer will push your truck to the next charging station when it runs out of juice?

charley96

Kex wrote: »

There are probably plenty of anectdotal horror stories out there, but for the most part Teslas appear to be cheaper to maintain than ICE vehicles that compete in the same category. As for ICE maintenance, it’s not easy to find good dealers. If you are lucky enough to find a good local mechanic who specializes in your brand of vehicle, that can certainly make ownership a lot more cost effective. Ford maintenance for the Lightning is likely to be different from Tesla’s driveway maintenance model, but maybe that will evolve.

Extended warranties can also be bought from Tesla while the existing warranty is still in effect, or shortly thereafter, extending coverage to eight years.

Glad I didn't buy an extended warranty on my 14 Lexus. Factory warranty expired in 18 and to this day I wouldn't have used it.

txcoastal1

Again reality as we had guests today enjoying some sun, and BBQ. 2 of families and guest couples owned 1 EV and 1 ICE each of their households. So in conversation, not debate we discussed the pro's and cons, why both in each party/each couple didn't have EV's.

I heard the the best explanation from one of the wives who drives an EV and she comapred it to my audio craze vs others (ear buds vs speakers thing). She said "It's a lifestyle product. It will fit in some lives and not others", but her and the other couple both agreed that it not a revolutionary product and will/should not completely replace ICE intil other products non-electric evolve. One of the husbands said he would likely load his wifes EV on his trailer when the next hurricane comes in to haul it out even though it's an EVSUV.

Like I said, I like the balance, but please don't claim it's the end all revolutionary vehicle.

motorhead43026

Has anyone here said or even alluded to EV’s being the end all revolutionary vehicle, I missed it if so.