Expensive !!$$$$$$

marvda1marvda1 Posts: 3,627
edited July 9 in Electronics
Now I see why some of this stuff costs so much.
Amplifiers: MasterSound Compact 845, Ayre v6xe, Consonance Cyber 800,Kinki Studio EX-M1
Preamp: deHavilland Ultraverve 3
Transport/Dac: L.K.S MH-DA004, North Star Design USB dac32, Cayin Venus cd-100i,
Musical Paradise mp-d2 mkI
Speakers: Rosso Fiorentino Volterra
Speaker Cables: Organic Audio Organic 2, Analysis Plus Black Mesh Oval 9,
Cerious Technologies Graphene Extreme
Interconnects: Analysis Plus Solo Crystal Oval, Analysis Plus Copper Oval-In Micro,
Cerious Technologies Graphene Extreme
Power Cables by: Cullen Cables, 6sons Audio, Swiss Cables
«13

Comments

  • verbverb Posts: 7,664
    Love the machining! Those chassis are built like tanks! :smile:
    Basement: Polk SDA SRS, Cary SLP-05 Pre, Enlightened Audio Designs CD Transport, Northstar Designs Excelsio DAC, Silnote Morpheus Ref2 Digital Cable, Marantz SA-14 SACD, McIntosh MC300 Amp, Furman 15PFi Power Conditioner, Pangea Power Cables, Wireworld Oasis 8 RCA IC's, MIT Shotgun S3 IC's, MIT Shotgun S1 Bi-Wire speaker cables
    Office: PC, EAR Acute CD Player, EAR 834L Pre, PASS ACA Monoblocks, Denon UDR-F10 Cassette, Acoustic Technologies Classic FR Speakers, SVS SB12 Plus sub, MIT AVt2 speaker cables, IFI Purifier2, AQ Cinnamon USB cable, Groneberg Quatro Reference IC's
    Spare Room: , Antique Sound Labs Wave AV-8 Monoblocks, Tisbury Mini Passive Pre, Tjoeb 99 tube CD player (modified Marantz CD-38), Analysis Plus Oval 9's, Zu Jumpers, AudioEngine B1 Streamer, Klipsch RB-61 v2, SVS PB1000 sub, Blue Jeans RCA IC's
    Living Room: Peachtree Nova Integrated, Cambridge CXN v2 Streamer, Furman 15PFi Power Conditioner, Polk RT265 In Wall Speakers, Polk DSW Pro 660wi sub
  • steveinazsteveinaz Posts: 19,008
    The Swiss are amazing craftsmen. Been there, twice.
  • ClipdatClipdat Posts: 7,138
    Check out the CH Precision monoblocks in this room at Axpona with the realtime wattage display screens:

    v5kgwhzcian5.jpg

    ciwo56hyftoz.jpg
    "Electronic music is human sound adapting to indulge technology, and for some, it feels like the signature sound of energy. New and abstract sounds over hypnotic rhythms can conjure vast soundscapes for escape, pleasure, and transcendence."
  • Joey_VJoey_V Posts: 7,072
    I still don’t see why they cost so much
    Much of it is mark up
    And a lot of it is priced to keep a certain “air” about them.
    Joey's Gear:
    Current Gear:
    Torus RM15 -> Emm Labs DAC2x and TSDX Transport -> Cary SLP-05 preamp -> Boulder 2060 stereo amp (w/ Audioquest WEL Signature) -> new speakers
    Rotel RA1592 Super Integrated -> Sonus Faber Olympica 3
    Rotel RC1570 preamp -> Rotel RB1582 amp -> Focal Kanta 2

    Old Gear:
    Speakers: BW PM1 (3.5/5), CM10s2 (3.75/5), BW800D3 (5/5), Rockport Aviors (5/5), Sonus Faber Stradivari (5/5), BW 802D2 (4.5/5), Martin Logan Summits (4.25/5), Martin Logan Vantage (4/5), Sonus Faber Cremona Auditor (3.75/5), AV123 Strata Mini (3.5/5), ML Mosaic (3.25/5), Onix Ref1 (3/5), Sonus Faber Concerto (2.75/5), SF Concertino (2.5/5), Axiom M22ti (2/5), Polk LSi9 (3/5), LSi7 (2.9/5)
    Source: Squeezebox 3 -> PS Audio Digital Link III -> Cary 306/200 CDP -> Cary 306 SACD -> EMM LABS DAC2X/TSDX
    Preamplification: Rotel RC1070 -> Rogue Perseus -> Cary SLP98 -> Cary SLP98F1 -> Cary SLP05 (sold and then repurchased)
    Amplification: HK AVR330 -> Rotel RB1070 -> Rotel RB1090 -> Plinius SA102 -> Cary 211FE -> Classe M600 -> Boulder 2060
    Subwoofer: Infinity Entra2 sub -> SVS 25-31PC+ sub
  • WillowWillow Posts: 9,642
    Joey_V wrote: »
    I still don’t see why they cost so much
    Much of it is mark up
    And a lot of it is priced to keep a certain “air” about them.

    Pretty much goes for almost everything out there
    2Ch- B&W 703, SVS PB10 NSD, Marantz NR1607, Parasound 1500a, Pro-Ject Debut Carbon (Yellow) with Acrylic platter, Pro-Ject phono pre, MIT AVT 2 speaker cables, MIT AVT 1 and AVT 2 ICs, XLO Jumpers, Signal Dig Coax, Signal Cable Magic Power Cables x3, Samsung 55JS7000, Harmony 1100, Sony BDP-S6200, Marantz DV-4200 (as Transport), Cambridge Audio DAC Magic100, Monster 3600MKII, Android Mi Box3 and Apple TV. - Pool /Gazebo Yamaha RX-A1010, Polk Patio 25x4, Rotel RDV 1045 (as CDP) MIT AVT3 ICs - Work - Spotify Premium or Neutron App to my FiiO Kunlun into my Grado SR125e

  • VR3VR3 Posts: 23,430
    Way to many gizzy wizzies in that thing
    - Not Tom

    Vr3Mods.com ///// Version3Audio.com

    "No, that's silly talk. Dude, you can't possibly be this audio dumb so quit the act." - Doro
  • Joey_VJoey_V Posts: 7,072
    Willow wrote: »
    Joey_V wrote: »
    I still don’t see why they cost so much
    Much of it is mark up
    And a lot of it is priced to keep a certain “air” about them.

    Pretty much goes for almost everything out there

    To a point, but I believe audiophile products in particular are priced to meet expectation rather than the materials or engineering itself.
    Joey's Gear:
    Current Gear:
    Torus RM15 -> Emm Labs DAC2x and TSDX Transport -> Cary SLP-05 preamp -> Boulder 2060 stereo amp (w/ Audioquest WEL Signature) -> new speakers
    Rotel RA1592 Super Integrated -> Sonus Faber Olympica 3
    Rotel RC1570 preamp -> Rotel RB1582 amp -> Focal Kanta 2

    Old Gear:
    Speakers: BW PM1 (3.5/5), CM10s2 (3.75/5), BW800D3 (5/5), Rockport Aviors (5/5), Sonus Faber Stradivari (5/5), BW 802D2 (4.5/5), Martin Logan Summits (4.25/5), Martin Logan Vantage (4/5), Sonus Faber Cremona Auditor (3.75/5), AV123 Strata Mini (3.5/5), ML Mosaic (3.25/5), Onix Ref1 (3/5), Sonus Faber Concerto (2.75/5), SF Concertino (2.5/5), Axiom M22ti (2/5), Polk LSi9 (3/5), LSi7 (2.9/5)
    Source: Squeezebox 3 -> PS Audio Digital Link III -> Cary 306/200 CDP -> Cary 306 SACD -> EMM LABS DAC2X/TSDX
    Preamplification: Rotel RC1070 -> Rogue Perseus -> Cary SLP98 -> Cary SLP98F1 -> Cary SLP05 (sold and then repurchased)
    Amplification: HK AVR330 -> Rotel RB1070 -> Rotel RB1090 -> Plinius SA102 -> Cary 211FE -> Classe M600 -> Boulder 2060
    Subwoofer: Infinity Entra2 sub -> SVS 25-31PC+ sub
  • DSkipDSkip Posts: 16,121
    Joey_V wrote: »
    Willow wrote: »
    Joey_V wrote: »
    I still don’t see why they cost so much
    Much of it is mark up
    And a lot of it is priced to keep a certain “air” about them.

    Pretty much goes for almost everything out there

    To a point, but I believe audiophile products in particular are priced to meet expectation rather than the materials or engineering itself.

    I disagree.
  • heiney9heiney9 Posts: 24,112
    edited July 10
    R & D costs a lot these days. As an example Nelson Pass will sit a tweak a design for months even a year by listening, testing, tweaking, listening, more listening and tweaking....that time has got to be worth something especially if it's a higher end piece that might only sell 1000 units or less over it's life span.

    Superb materials have become very expensive as well, cases, heat sinks, precision design and machining of products...…..all have a hefty price compared to run of the mill mass produced stuff.

    Perhaps not on the level of a handcrafted Ferrari, but somewhere in the middle.....

    H9

    P.S. As high end gear goes, his is pretty reasonably priced comparatively.
    "Appreciation of audio is a completely subjective human experience. Measurements can provide a measure of insight, but are no substitute for human judgment. Why are we looking to reduce a subjective experience to objective criteria anyway? The subtleties of music and audio reproduction are for those who appreciate it. Differentiation by numbers is for those who do not".--Nelson Pass

    Pass Aleph 30 | EE Avant Pre | EE Mini Max Plus DAC | MIT Shotgun S3 | MIT Z P/C's | updated SDA 1C| SQ Box Touch/Welbourne Labs P/S- Tubes add soul!
  • Joey_VJoey_V Posts: 7,072
    edited July 11
    DSkip wrote: »
    Joey_V wrote: »
    Willow wrote: »
    Joey_V wrote: »
    I still don’t see why they cost so much
    Much of it is mark up
    And a lot of it is priced to keep a certain “air” about them.

    Pretty much goes for almost everything out there

    To a point, but I believe audiophile products in particular are priced to meet expectation rather than the materials or engineering itself.

    I disagree.

    Cable prices
    Rack prices - an HRS MX is $20,000?
    What about high end amplifiers. Is there really a reason a D Agostino Relentless is $300,000?

    It’s well known that audio manufacturers cater their pricing to a perceived value from a certain crowd. They know pricing a product at $100,000 looks better to say their big customers in China for example.
    Joey's Gear:
    Current Gear:
    Torus RM15 -> Emm Labs DAC2x and TSDX Transport -> Cary SLP-05 preamp -> Boulder 2060 stereo amp (w/ Audioquest WEL Signature) -> new speakers
    Rotel RA1592 Super Integrated -> Sonus Faber Olympica 3
    Rotel RC1570 preamp -> Rotel RB1582 amp -> Focal Kanta 2

    Old Gear:
    Speakers: BW PM1 (3.5/5), CM10s2 (3.75/5), BW800D3 (5/5), Rockport Aviors (5/5), Sonus Faber Stradivari (5/5), BW 802D2 (4.5/5), Martin Logan Summits (4.25/5), Martin Logan Vantage (4/5), Sonus Faber Cremona Auditor (3.75/5), AV123 Strata Mini (3.5/5), ML Mosaic (3.25/5), Onix Ref1 (3/5), Sonus Faber Concerto (2.75/5), SF Concertino (2.5/5), Axiom M22ti (2/5), Polk LSi9 (3/5), LSi7 (2.9/5)
    Source: Squeezebox 3 -> PS Audio Digital Link III -> Cary 306/200 CDP -> Cary 306 SACD -> EMM LABS DAC2X/TSDX
    Preamplification: Rotel RC1070 -> Rogue Perseus -> Cary SLP98 -> Cary SLP98F1 -> Cary SLP05 (sold and then repurchased)
    Amplification: HK AVR330 -> Rotel RB1070 -> Rotel RB1090 -> Plinius SA102 -> Cary 211FE -> Classe M600 -> Boulder 2060
    Subwoofer: Infinity Entra2 sub -> SVS 25-31PC+ sub
  • DSkipDSkip Posts: 16,121
    No. They build to the price point. There are always outliers but the value in those products is there. You think there is less markup on midfi? There isn’t.

    In the case of special edition or top tier products there is probably more profit on paper but less margin after R&D.
  • marvda1marvda1 Posts: 3,627
    besides r&d look at all the machinery and buildings they had to purchase and upfront cash to purchase inventory in bulk to get prices down. employee wages, utilities, duty fees, distributor markups. and least not forget economy of scale, they are not selling sony quantities.
    Amplifiers: MasterSound Compact 845, Ayre v6xe, Consonance Cyber 800,Kinki Studio EX-M1
    Preamp: deHavilland Ultraverve 3
    Transport/Dac: L.K.S MH-DA004, North Star Design USB dac32, Cayin Venus cd-100i,
    Musical Paradise mp-d2 mkI
    Speakers: Rosso Fiorentino Volterra
    Speaker Cables: Organic Audio Organic 2, Analysis Plus Black Mesh Oval 9,
    Cerious Technologies Graphene Extreme
    Interconnects: Analysis Plus Solo Crystal Oval, Analysis Plus Copper Oval-In Micro,
    Cerious Technologies Graphene Extreme
    Power Cables by: Cullen Cables, 6sons Audio, Swiss Cables
  • DSkipDSkip Posts: 16,121
    It is true they don’t build six figure components for the us market. It’s all for Asia. However it doesn’t make them severely marked up.
  • txcoastal1txcoastal1 Posts: 10,586
    Why do you think it's called "The rabbit hole"

    Just like any other hobby is not cheap...ie golf, and cars

    2-channel: Modwright KWI-200 Integrated, Dynaudio C1-II Signatures
    Desktop rig: LSi7, Polk 110sub, Dayens Ampino amp, W4S DAC/pre, Sonos, JRiver
    Gear on standby: Melody 101 tube pre, Unison Research Simply Italy Integrated
    Gone to new homes: (Matt Polk's)Threshold Stasis SA12e monoblocks, Pass XA30.5 amp, Usher MD2 speakers, Dynaudio C4 platinum speakers, Modwright LS100 (voltz), Simaudio 780D DAC
  • Joey_VJoey_V Posts: 7,072
    Definitely a rabbit hole
    Joey's Gear:
    Current Gear:
    Torus RM15 -> Emm Labs DAC2x and TSDX Transport -> Cary SLP-05 preamp -> Boulder 2060 stereo amp (w/ Audioquest WEL Signature) -> new speakers
    Rotel RA1592 Super Integrated -> Sonus Faber Olympica 3
    Rotel RC1570 preamp -> Rotel RB1582 amp -> Focal Kanta 2

    Old Gear:
    Speakers: BW PM1 (3.5/5), CM10s2 (3.75/5), BW800D3 (5/5), Rockport Aviors (5/5), Sonus Faber Stradivari (5/5), BW 802D2 (4.5/5), Martin Logan Summits (4.25/5), Martin Logan Vantage (4/5), Sonus Faber Cremona Auditor (3.75/5), AV123 Strata Mini (3.5/5), ML Mosaic (3.25/5), Onix Ref1 (3/5), Sonus Faber Concerto (2.75/5), SF Concertino (2.5/5), Axiom M22ti (2/5), Polk LSi9 (3/5), LSi7 (2.9/5)
    Source: Squeezebox 3 -> PS Audio Digital Link III -> Cary 306/200 CDP -> Cary 306 SACD -> EMM LABS DAC2X/TSDX
    Preamplification: Rotel RC1070 -> Rogue Perseus -> Cary SLP98 -> Cary SLP98F1 -> Cary SLP05 (sold and then repurchased)
    Amplification: HK AVR330 -> Rotel RB1070 -> Rotel RB1090 -> Plinius SA102 -> Cary 211FE -> Classe M600 -> Boulder 2060
    Subwoofer: Infinity Entra2 sub -> SVS 25-31PC+ sub
  • Joey_VJoey_V Posts: 7,072
    Markup is there for high end speakers

    For example a Sonus Faber AIDA. 7 drivers I believe? Bigger cabinet but something that isn’t out of the realm for their craftsmen who are already accustomed to building tons of normal and slightly larger size enclosures, cost? $165,000.

    And how does a single level rack command a price of $2000?

    It’s all craziness

    Joey's Gear:
    Current Gear:
    Torus RM15 -> Emm Labs DAC2x and TSDX Transport -> Cary SLP-05 preamp -> Boulder 2060 stereo amp (w/ Audioquest WEL Signature) -> new speakers
    Rotel RA1592 Super Integrated -> Sonus Faber Olympica 3
    Rotel RC1570 preamp -> Rotel RB1582 amp -> Focal Kanta 2

    Old Gear:
    Speakers: BW PM1 (3.5/5), CM10s2 (3.75/5), BW800D3 (5/5), Rockport Aviors (5/5), Sonus Faber Stradivari (5/5), BW 802D2 (4.5/5), Martin Logan Summits (4.25/5), Martin Logan Vantage (4/5), Sonus Faber Cremona Auditor (3.75/5), AV123 Strata Mini (3.5/5), ML Mosaic (3.25/5), Onix Ref1 (3/5), Sonus Faber Concerto (2.75/5), SF Concertino (2.5/5), Axiom M22ti (2/5), Polk LSi9 (3/5), LSi7 (2.9/5)
    Source: Squeezebox 3 -> PS Audio Digital Link III -> Cary 306/200 CDP -> Cary 306 SACD -> EMM LABS DAC2X/TSDX
    Preamplification: Rotel RC1070 -> Rogue Perseus -> Cary SLP98 -> Cary SLP98F1 -> Cary SLP05 (sold and then repurchased)
    Amplification: HK AVR330 -> Rotel RB1070 -> Rotel RB1090 -> Plinius SA102 -> Cary 211FE -> Classe M600 -> Boulder 2060
    Subwoofer: Infinity Entra2 sub -> SVS 25-31PC+ sub
  • DSkipDSkip Posts: 16,121
    Joey_V wrote: »
    Markup is there for high end speakers

    For example a Sonus Faber AIDA. 7 drivers I believe? Bigger cabinet but something that isn’t out of the realm for their craftsmen who are already accustomed to building tons of normal and slightly larger size enclosures, cost? $165,000.

    And how does a single level rack command a price of $2000?

    It’s all craziness

    It's what it takes to compete at such levels. There is a TON of technology and knowledge gained through R&D in those racks - the good ones at least. You don't just slap one together. I'm not sure why there is this frustration with racks and platforms costing so much just because they are 'passive' devices.

    If all you've got is wood shelving then no, they're completely overpriced.
  • PSOVLSKPSOVLSK Posts: 4,120
    edited July 11
    DSkip wrote: »
    Joey_V wrote: »
    Willow wrote: »
    Joey_V wrote: »
    I still don’t see why they cost so much
    Much of it is mark up
    And a lot of it is priced to keep a certain “air” about them.

    Pretty much goes for almost everything out there

    To a point, but I believe audiophile products in particular are priced to meet expectation rather than the materials or engineering itself.

    I disagree.

    I agree with your disagree.
    Things work out best for those who make the best of the way things work out.-John Wooden
  • mhardy6647mhardy6647 Posts: 23,012
    PSOVLSK wrote: »
    DSkip wrote: »
    Joey_V wrote: »
    Willow wrote: »
    Joey_V wrote: »
    I still don’t see why they cost so much
    Much of it is mark up
    And a lot of it is priced to keep a certain “air” about them.

    Pretty much goes for almost everything out there

    To a point, but I believe audiophile products in particular are priced to meet expectation rather than the materials or engineering itself.

    I disagree.

    I agree with your disagree.

    hard to argue with that B)
  • kharp1kharp1 Posts: 3,349
    mhardy6647 wrote: »
    PSOVLSK wrote: »
    DSkip wrote: »
    Joey_V wrote: »
    Willow wrote: »
    Joey_V wrote: »
    I still don’t see why they cost so much
    Much of it is mark up
    And a lot of it is priced to keep a certain “air” about them.

    Pretty much goes for almost everything out there

    To a point, but I believe audiophile products in particular are priced to meet expectation rather than the materials or engineering itself.

    I disagree.

    I agree with your disagree.

    hard to argue with that B)

    I agree with your hard to argue with his agreeing with his disagree of the original disagree.
    Main System:
    Joule-Electra LA 100 MKIII Upgraded by Rich Brkich Pre
    Butler Audio TBD 2250 Amp
    PS Audio DirectStream DAC and MemoryPlayer Transport
    LSA-1 Statement
    SVS SB4000 & SB2000
    Wireworld Equinox 7 bi-wire, Wireworld Silver Eclipse 7 IC

    Secondary Rig:
    Parasound P5, Audio Electronics by Cary Constellation
    Marsh a200s, Audio Elecrtonics by Cary Hercules
    Pioneer Elite DV-45a, Denon DVD-2910
    Klipsch Epic CF-1, Vandersteen 3CE sig
    Analysus Plus Oval

    Backup Gear:
    Pass Labs Aleph 30, McCormack DNA-125, Parasound A21
    Marantz SA-14S1
    Usher CP-6311/Tyler Acoustics Taylo Reference Monitor, LSA-1
  • audioluvraudioluvr Posts: 1,348
    kharp1 wrote: »
    mhardy6647 wrote: »
    PSOVLSK wrote: »
    DSkip wrote: »
    Joey_V wrote: »
    Willow wrote: »
    Joey_V wrote: »
    I still don’t see why they cost so much
    Much of it is mark up
    And a lot of it is priced to keep a certain “air” about them.

    Pretty much goes for almost everything out there

    To a point, but I believe audiophile products in particular are priced to meet expectation rather than the materials or engineering itself.

    I disagree.

    I agree with your disagree.

    hard to argue with that B)

    I agree with your hard to argue with his agreeing with his disagree of the original disagree.

    Agreed?
    Home System:
    SDA 1C's - Full mod with the help by Dave...
    1000 Va Dreadnought- w/ WireWorld Mini-Eclipse cables
    WireWorld Mini-Eclipse 7 speaker cables
    WireWorld Silver Eclipse IC's
    Cambridge Audio Azur 851N - DAC/Streamer
    B&K Reference 50 Pre/Pro
    B&K M200 Sonata Monoblocks
    BLE-Design 16mm Power Cables
    Denon DVD 2900

    Barn system:
    SDA SRS 2.3's Full mod done by myself
    Carver C-1 pre
    Carver M1.5t
    BluDenso - Bluetooth receiver/DAC
  • nooshinjohnnooshinjohn Posts: 21,335
    I can agree with Skip on this... the cost to develop new product is crazy.
    The Gear... Carver "Statement" Mono-blocks, TriangleArt Reference SE with Pass Labs Xono Phono Preamp, Walker Precision Motor Drive, ClearAudio Goldfinger Diamond v2 cartridge and Origin Conquerer Mk3c tonearm, Polk Audio "Signature" Reference Series 1.2TL with complete mods, Pass Labs X0.2 three chassis preamp, PS Audio PerfectWave DAC MkII, Pioneer Elite SC-LX701, Oppo UDP-205 4K Blu-ray player, Sony XBR70x850B 4k, Polk audio AB700/800 "in-wall" surrounds.

    Saying that it's "too hard" to pursue your dreams is no different than admitting to yourself that you are too lazy to achieve them.

    “If it moves, tax it. If it keeps moving, regulate it. And if it stops moving, subsidize it.”
  • Joey_VJoey_V Posts: 7,072
    I will disagree with your agree to agree to disagree.

    :)
    Joey's Gear:
    Current Gear:
    Torus RM15 -> Emm Labs DAC2x and TSDX Transport -> Cary SLP-05 preamp -> Boulder 2060 stereo amp (w/ Audioquest WEL Signature) -> new speakers
    Rotel RA1592 Super Integrated -> Sonus Faber Olympica 3
    Rotel RC1570 preamp -> Rotel RB1582 amp -> Focal Kanta 2

    Old Gear:
    Speakers: BW PM1 (3.5/5), CM10s2 (3.75/5), BW800D3 (5/5), Rockport Aviors (5/5), Sonus Faber Stradivari (5/5), BW 802D2 (4.5/5), Martin Logan Summits (4.25/5), Martin Logan Vantage (4/5), Sonus Faber Cremona Auditor (3.75/5), AV123 Strata Mini (3.5/5), ML Mosaic (3.25/5), Onix Ref1 (3/5), Sonus Faber Concerto (2.75/5), SF Concertino (2.5/5), Axiom M22ti (2/5), Polk LSi9 (3/5), LSi7 (2.9/5)
    Source: Squeezebox 3 -> PS Audio Digital Link III -> Cary 306/200 CDP -> Cary 306 SACD -> EMM LABS DAC2X/TSDX
    Preamplification: Rotel RC1070 -> Rogue Perseus -> Cary SLP98 -> Cary SLP98F1 -> Cary SLP05 (sold and then repurchased)
    Amplification: HK AVR330 -> Rotel RB1070 -> Rotel RB1090 -> Plinius SA102 -> Cary 211FE -> Classe M600 -> Boulder 2060
    Subwoofer: Infinity Entra2 sub -> SVS 25-31PC+ sub
  • decaldecal Posts: 3,172
    So let's leave it alone 'cause we can't see eye to eye
    There ain't no good guy, there ain't no bad guy
    There's only you and me and we just disagree
    If you can't hear a difference, don't waste your money.
  • mhardy6647mhardy6647 Posts: 23,012
    kharp1 wrote: »
    mhardy6647 wrote: »
    PSOVLSK wrote: »
    DSkip wrote: »
    Joey_V wrote: »
    Willow wrote: »
    Joey_V wrote: »
    I still don’t see why they cost so much
    Much of it is mark up
    And a lot of it is priced to keep a certain “air” about them.

    Pretty much goes for almost everything out there

    To a point, but I believe audiophile products in particular are priced to meet expectation rather than the materials or engineering itself.

    I disagree.

    I agree with your disagree.

    hard to argue with that B)

    I agree with your hard to argue with his agreeing with his disagree of the original disagree.

    Well put.
  • BlueFoxBlueFox Posts: 12,080
    The market for this gear is so small that there is no way to reduce the price and make a profit. I have visited Magico’s factory, and it is clean and functional, not luxurious. The employees seemed content, but I doubt they make more than other manufacturing employees in the area. Also, Magico is in the San Francisco Bay Area, which is one of the highest cost of living areas in the country.
    Bud - Silicon Valley

    Lumin X1
    Sony XA-5400ES SACD
    Pass XP-22 pre, X600.5 amps
    Magico S5 MKII Mcast Rose speakers, SPOD spikes

    Shunyata Triton v3/Typhon QR on preamp, Denali 2000 (2) on amps
    Shunyata Sigma XLR analog ICs, Sigma speaker cables
    Shunyata Sigma HC (2), Sigma Analog, Sigma Digital, Z Anaconda (3) power cables

    Mapleshade Samson V.3 four shelf solid maple rack, Micropoint brass footers
    Three 20 amp circuits.
  • JayCeeJayCee Posts: 571
    edited July 12
    BlueFox wrote: »
    Magico is in the San Francisco Bay Area, which is one of the highest cost of living areas in the country.

    I've traveled extensively in Switzerland. Also, been all over the world and have to say Switzerland is uber expensive in comparison to even the neighboring countries.

    With respect to CH Precision, this has to significantly affect their production costs. Definitely a high end audio company but would be interesting to know what they'd be priced at if not based in Switzerland.

    USD to CHF is about even; $1.02 to 1.00 CHF ....

    "Average salary in Switzerland: The average salary in Switzerland is among the highest in the world, but so too is the cost of living..."
    https://www.expatica.com/ch/employment/employment-law/swiss-minimum-wage-and-average-salary-in-switzerland-995110/

    Median annual Swiss salary is 114,084 CHF
    http://www.salaryexplorer.com/salary-survey.php?loc=210&loctype=1

    In comparison, the US median annual income is $46,644 (includes seasonal adjustments).
    https://www.thestreet.com/personal-finance/average-income-in-us-14852178

    Move production to China????? :smiley: High end audio for the masses at an affordable cost. LOL.
    Speakers: Polk1.2tl's (Uber Mods) Pre/Amp/DAC: PS Audio BHK Signature & 250, Perfectwave DirectStream Cables/IC's: MIT S1Bi-Wire/S1 Balanced +Avel Lindberg 1000VA "Dreadnought" Power Conditioner: Core Power Technologies EQUI=CORE 1800 Power Cords: Core Power Technologies Gold, DH Labs Power Plus DIY w/Neotech NC-P301 & P311ends FLAC Streamer: Roon ROCK on wifi'd NUC⟿Ω☯☥☮⟿🔊♩♪♫♬♩♪♫♬♩♪♫♬
  • joecoulsonjoecoulson Posts: 3,459
    A greed
    Auralic Vega G1/Rega TT/Denon SACD - Parasound P6 - PS Audio M700x2 - Elac Adante AF-61
  • daddyjtdaddyjt Posts: 1,043
    BlueFox wrote: »
    ...Also, Magico is in the San Francisco Bay Area...

    Wow - unless they’ve been there for decades, I can’t imagine why they would locate there. From a purely business standpoint, it would seem that production there would add significantly to both the cost of production, and the end price.
    Too much stuff to keep track of.

    Currently enjoying: Legacy Focus 20/20, McCormack DNA 225, Bill D C1, Oppo 105
  • ClipdatClipdat Posts: 7,138
    As far as I know, Magico has always been located in Hayward, CA.
    "Electronic music is human sound adapting to indulge technology, and for some, it feels like the signature sound of energy. New and abstract sounds over hypnotic rhythms can conjure vast soundscapes for escape, pleasure, and transcendence."
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