Club Polk Perception
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Jstas
Posts: 14,712
OK, I'm not picking fights here or anything. I've been on vacation and not paying attention to anything since August 4th. In addition, I have a few big life changes currently pending that have been taking up a majority of my free time and some of my work time. So I missed all your hubbub from the past week.
But, after reading through most of it (I got bored with it half way through and stopped), I wanted to weigh in on some things here.
I've been coming here a very long time. 20 years at this point. There wasn't even a forum to speak of when I first signed up for Club Polk. It was a snail-mail newsletter and an email majordomo. That was it. The forum was "Coming Soon!"
Since that time, I've been to multiple Polkfests and meets. Been to HQ several times and even tried to get the last one into motion in 2016 that never materialized because Polk Audio didn't put any effort in on their side. That was a shame. But we did 10 years running of Polkfests and nobody stepped up for 2016 because Polk themselves claimed it at the bar in my basement in 2015. So the streak was broken by them. Hell, it was going to be broken in 2015 because nobody stepped up and I didn't want to see that happen so I did back-to-back Polkfests and let these yahoos into my home, three times actually.
Thing is, though, this place has 20 years of history. 20 years of threads of good info. Most of it still shows up in Google searches. Club Polk will come up as links to info about many, many other companies products because they have all been discussed in depth at some point here. Maybe not recently but at some point. We don't really rehash old topics and prefer you use the search functions or we just post the link to the old thread ourselves. So to say that there isn't anything useful is a load of baloney.
This is not just a forum. This is a community. People have mentioned about how they will do a Club Polk Pony Express or just hang out or call up someone who needs a hand. I have personally spent 14+ hours of a Saturday an hour from my home with a truck full of tools because another forum member needed help installing some expensive gear into his truck. We went all out and I pulled every install skill I had on that project and he ended up with a professional level install and all it cost was a few beers and a nice Italian dinner. All because he said he needed help and I found out how close he lived to me. I went and helped because I could. He's not the only one I helped either. I've had a few members come to me with a new-to-them car with a botched install on a stereo by a previous owner. I sat in my driveway rewiring their car for them because they didn't know where to go or who to talk to. So I helped because I used to do installs for a living and could.
I helped another member move from one town to another in NJ.
I've repaired broken stuff for people.
It's not just helping either. There were a number of times I just showed up at Mr. Grand's house for coffee and BS. I know I'm not the only one who did that. Many member have also gone to multiple funerals for deceased Club Polk members and family. Everything from piles and piles of flowers, cards and charitable contributions to actually being there. I also can't count how many times a member somewhere fell on hard times and needed a hand. Some had to sell stuff and members have bought their gear, packed it up, stored it and never used it waiting for the person they bought it from to get back on their feet. When that time came, they sold it back at a steeply discounted rate or just mailed it back and it showed up on a doorstep one day. All done because they didn't want someone to have to let go of a rig they watched them put so much time and effort in to.
This isn't just a forum. We take care of each other here. We get numerous new members in a year. Less than 10% stick around. But when you have a couple thousand new members in a year, 10% is still 200 folks. Out of that 200, 1% make a problem out of themselves and that can drive away many other new members who see it as just another Internet cesspool like the other audio forums plagued with cliques and warring factions.
This place is a clique. It's a Club Polk clique. There may be some smalls groups of good friends but they aren't exclusive. Anyone is welcome here. Everyone gets help here.
I know I have dissertations on car audio 101 and subwoofer box design/construction in the car audio forums for users that were a one post wonder never to be seen again. Others are technical nerd wars from some bloviating bunghole with a good cut and paste game but no understanding of what they are actually writing.
It takes all kinds here and for a long time, all kinds were coming here. If you got to be too much of a jerk, you were told about it by others. We didn't need moderation because we didn't have people coming in and claiming that there were bullies here. Being a bully is not about being blunt and brutally honest. Being a bully is about degrading and demeaning another person in an effort to promote yourself and feel better about yourself. There's no bullying here. There are disagreements and people who can't get it through their thick heads that you aren't going to change anything through badgering and perpetual belligerence, both aggressive and passive-aggressive, but you know what? That's life. Those kinds of people are everywhere. They have problems not being accepted somewhere, anywhere and they often fail to see that they are their own worst enemy. That doesn't mean anyone is being a bully to them. It just means that others are intolerant of their shenanigans and smaller numbers of those are more vocal about it than the rest. Again, that's life. Deal with it or move on. You don't see a straight guy walking into a **** night club and getting all loud and obnoxious because none of the girls there are interested in him. He (typically) gets the hint and just doesn't go there if he's looking for a date since there isn't going to be one there for him. That doesn't mean he can't go and have a good time and be accepted by those who frequent the place as just a decent human being with a differing perspective and opinion. It's all about his attitude and perception. You don't go to a Ford dealer and tell everyone how much Fords suck and Chevy rules and expect to be accepted as a cool guy instead of seen as just a loud-mouthed jerk.
So if you think it's "just a forum", you missed something here. Probably because your attitude has excluded you because nobody wants to deal with it. In meatspace, people just walk away from you. They can't walk away in a forum and you get to be a nuisance in perpetuity because of the captive audience. An adult just realizes when they don't get along with someone and just leaves things be. The opposite seems to be true on many fronts, lately. It causes problems because people can't seem to get along and leave each other alone. I'm not talking about you saying something that is inaccurate and someone else calling you on it, whether they are your buddy or not. I'm talking about someone being so butthurt with you that they follow you around and post something non-contributing in every thread just to get under your skin. That seems to happen a bunch. If it's not that it's unnecessary reporting of non-offending posts just to create an air of dissent and aggravate mods to the point where they lose patience and go scorched earth.
But, after reading through most of it (I got bored with it half way through and stopped), I wanted to weigh in on some things here.
I've been coming here a very long time. 20 years at this point. There wasn't even a forum to speak of when I first signed up for Club Polk. It was a snail-mail newsletter and an email majordomo. That was it. The forum was "Coming Soon!"
Since that time, I've been to multiple Polkfests and meets. Been to HQ several times and even tried to get the last one into motion in 2016 that never materialized because Polk Audio didn't put any effort in on their side. That was a shame. But we did 10 years running of Polkfests and nobody stepped up for 2016 because Polk themselves claimed it at the bar in my basement in 2015. So the streak was broken by them. Hell, it was going to be broken in 2015 because nobody stepped up and I didn't want to see that happen so I did back-to-back Polkfests and let these yahoos into my home, three times actually.
Thing is, though, this place has 20 years of history. 20 years of threads of good info. Most of it still shows up in Google searches. Club Polk will come up as links to info about many, many other companies products because they have all been discussed in depth at some point here. Maybe not recently but at some point. We don't really rehash old topics and prefer you use the search functions or we just post the link to the old thread ourselves. So to say that there isn't anything useful is a load of baloney.
This is not just a forum. This is a community. People have mentioned about how they will do a Club Polk Pony Express or just hang out or call up someone who needs a hand. I have personally spent 14+ hours of a Saturday an hour from my home with a truck full of tools because another forum member needed help installing some expensive gear into his truck. We went all out and I pulled every install skill I had on that project and he ended up with a professional level install and all it cost was a few beers and a nice Italian dinner. All because he said he needed help and I found out how close he lived to me. I went and helped because I could. He's not the only one I helped either. I've had a few members come to me with a new-to-them car with a botched install on a stereo by a previous owner. I sat in my driveway rewiring their car for them because they didn't know where to go or who to talk to. So I helped because I used to do installs for a living and could.
I helped another member move from one town to another in NJ.
I've repaired broken stuff for people.
It's not just helping either. There were a number of times I just showed up at Mr. Grand's house for coffee and BS. I know I'm not the only one who did that. Many member have also gone to multiple funerals for deceased Club Polk members and family. Everything from piles and piles of flowers, cards and charitable contributions to actually being there. I also can't count how many times a member somewhere fell on hard times and needed a hand. Some had to sell stuff and members have bought their gear, packed it up, stored it and never used it waiting for the person they bought it from to get back on their feet. When that time came, they sold it back at a steeply discounted rate or just mailed it back and it showed up on a doorstep one day. All done because they didn't want someone to have to let go of a rig they watched them put so much time and effort in to.
This isn't just a forum. We take care of each other here. We get numerous new members in a year. Less than 10% stick around. But when you have a couple thousand new members in a year, 10% is still 200 folks. Out of that 200, 1% make a problem out of themselves and that can drive away many other new members who see it as just another Internet cesspool like the other audio forums plagued with cliques and warring factions.
This place is a clique. It's a Club Polk clique. There may be some smalls groups of good friends but they aren't exclusive. Anyone is welcome here. Everyone gets help here.
I know I have dissertations on car audio 101 and subwoofer box design/construction in the car audio forums for users that were a one post wonder never to be seen again. Others are technical nerd wars from some bloviating bunghole with a good cut and paste game but no understanding of what they are actually writing.
It takes all kinds here and for a long time, all kinds were coming here. If you got to be too much of a jerk, you were told about it by others. We didn't need moderation because we didn't have people coming in and claiming that there were bullies here. Being a bully is not about being blunt and brutally honest. Being a bully is about degrading and demeaning another person in an effort to promote yourself and feel better about yourself. There's no bullying here. There are disagreements and people who can't get it through their thick heads that you aren't going to change anything through badgering and perpetual belligerence, both aggressive and passive-aggressive, but you know what? That's life. Those kinds of people are everywhere. They have problems not being accepted somewhere, anywhere and they often fail to see that they are their own worst enemy. That doesn't mean anyone is being a bully to them. It just means that others are intolerant of their shenanigans and smaller numbers of those are more vocal about it than the rest. Again, that's life. Deal with it or move on. You don't see a straight guy walking into a **** night club and getting all loud and obnoxious because none of the girls there are interested in him. He (typically) gets the hint and just doesn't go there if he's looking for a date since there isn't going to be one there for him. That doesn't mean he can't go and have a good time and be accepted by those who frequent the place as just a decent human being with a differing perspective and opinion. It's all about his attitude and perception. You don't go to a Ford dealer and tell everyone how much Fords suck and Chevy rules and expect to be accepted as a cool guy instead of seen as just a loud-mouthed jerk.
So if you think it's "just a forum", you missed something here. Probably because your attitude has excluded you because nobody wants to deal with it. In meatspace, people just walk away from you. They can't walk away in a forum and you get to be a nuisance in perpetuity because of the captive audience. An adult just realizes when they don't get along with someone and just leaves things be. The opposite seems to be true on many fronts, lately. It causes problems because people can't seem to get along and leave each other alone. I'm not talking about you saying something that is inaccurate and someone else calling you on it, whether they are your buddy or not. I'm talking about someone being so butthurt with you that they follow you around and post something non-contributing in every thread just to get under your skin. That seems to happen a bunch. If it's not that it's unnecessary reporting of non-offending posts just to create an air of dissent and aggravate mods to the point where they lose patience and go scorched earth.
Expert Moron Extraordinaire
You're just jealous 'cause the voices don't talk to you!
You're just jealous 'cause the voices don't talk to you!
Comments
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(continued)...If you think there is nothing useful here, then you clearly haven't even scratched the surface of what is here. Some of it's buried in threads but there is a tremendous amount of info on here from crossover design to the fundamentals of driver construction to even actual discussion on cables and why they do and don't matter with no reference to feelings about it. But speakers are complex things because it's not about physical settings. Any idiot can read a manual and figure out a fancy, glowing box of a thinking machine. To understand the physics of things like wave guides or off-axis response or crossover curves and noise floors takes more effort than just reading a manual. To think they are not complex is being deliberately ignorant.
If you think there is no community here then it's because you are outside it by your own volition either through lack of meaningful participation or a caustic/toxic attitude/behavior. We have so many people from so many walks of life that get along just fine here. It's an example of diversity. When people come in and claim there is none, it starts fights because all you see here is names on a screen. You have no idea what race, gender, ethnicity, profession or religion is behind that name. Yet so many just assume and go on that, later making a fool of themselves when reality bites them in the aft regions. So when you assume and take cheap shots, you come off as just a jerk and get ostracized. When you're vocal and belligerent about it, your ostracization is commensurate with your attitude. Complaining to mods that nobody likes you and won't let you play with the ball does nothing to endear you to anyone and you will struggle to have positive experience here. But something tells me that you'd struggle to have a positive experience any where in life.
If you want things to be water under the bridge then leave them there, move on and if you have a controversial opinion on a topic you would like to discuss, change how you present it. If you present it in a way that comes off like an arrogant jerk, it is not the fault of those reacting to you that things go haywire. It's your fault for not presenting it in a manner that doesn't come off that way. Further, asking people why they don't understand your point is not going to go over well when they ask for more info, clarification or challenge it for arguments sake. It is not the onus of the listener to understand what you are trying to say. It is your responsibility to present it in a manner that your audience can comprehend what you are trying to say. Lastly, being a pedantic jerk and nitpicking on minor details, especially when someone is trying to clarify and simplify a complex topic serves no purpose but to sew the seeds of strife and frustration while detracting from the topic being discussed as a whole.
So, cool your jets, you get more bees with honey, look farther than your nose and all that happy bull hockey.
I come here to jabber at my friends, talk shop, help where I can and get a good laugh when I need one. Spoil that for me and I won't like you. You'll know because I won't talk to you. You should follow my lead. Mainly because I'm just that awesome. But mostly because, it works well.
Expert Moron Extraordinaire
You're just jealous 'cause the voices don't talk to you! -
Well said John.....
Many of us have said similar...multiple times, but it always seems to go in one ear and out the other. Not much else we as members can do, except keep parroting the same things every few years.HT SYSTEM-
Sony 850c 4k
Pioneer elite vhx 21
Sony 4k BRP
SVS SB-2000
Polk Sig. 20's
Polk FX500 surrounds
Cables-
Acoustic zen Satori speaker cables
Acoustic zen Matrix 2 IC's
Wireworld eclipse 7 ic's
Audio metallurgy ga-o digital cable
Kitchen
Sonos zp90
Grant Fidelity tube dac
B&k 1420
lsi 9's -
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This thread should now be closed and moved to the top! Well said!
CJA so called science type proudly says... "I do realize that I would fool myself all the time, about listening conclusions and many other observations, if I did listen before buying. That’s why I don’t, I bought all of my current gear based on technical parameters alone, such as specs and measurements." -
Very well said, Jstas. Your post could almost be made a "Sticky".
I was going to post some additional thoughts, but your post should stand as is.
Most excellent.
Sal Palooza -
Pio Elete Pro 520
Panamax 5400-EX
Sunfire TGP 5
Micro Seiki DD-40 - Lyra-Dorian and Denon DL-160
PS Audio GCPH phono pre
Sunfire CG 200 X 5
Sunfire CG Sig 405 X 5
OPPO BDP-83 SE
SDA SRS 1.2TL Sonicaps and Mills
Ctr CS1000p
Sur - FX1000 x 4
SUB - SVS PB2-Plus
Workkout room:
Sony Bravia XBR- 32-Inch 1080p
Onkyo TX-DS898
GFA 555
Yamaha DVD-S1800BL/SACD
Ft - SDA 1C
Not being used:
RTi 38's -4
RT55i's - 2
RT25i's -2, using other 2 in shop
LSI 15's
CSi40
PSW 404 -
I'm still too much of a newb to comment on how things were on here..Do like the interaction though..sometimes it can be downright entertaining too..Heck..every once in awhile a question comes up audio related that I can actually throw my two cents into and help out a bit...LOL!..
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Shut up John.
"Some people find it easier to be conceited rather than correct."
"Unwad those panties and have a good time man. We're all here to help each other, no matter how it might appear." DSkip -
Your mom, @ZLTFULExpert Moron Extraordinaire
You're just jealous 'cause the voices don't talk to you! -
I basically grew up here. Joined when I was 14 or so in high school and now I'm about to turn 30. Went from a single cs245i and an aiwa receiver to an Rti HT, SDA and musical fidelity, and now to an Lsi HT. All with the help of members good deals and advice. Hell, I remember when Russman would offer payment plans to people so they could experience better gear without breaking the bank. Never made it to a Polkfest unfortunately but that's alright, I've had a fun audio journey.
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man -- a life, squandered.
(kidding, kidding!)
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Long live Polk!
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Is this an appropriate time for someone to start a slow clap?I disabled signatures.
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@jstas,
Bravo!
I still consider myself a relatively new member. I joined because I had a particular problem: I was trying to use non-common ground monoblocks with my SDA SRS1.2s. The posts of various members of the Forum enabled me to solve my problem.
They also started me down a long and deep dive into the rabbit hole!
I have enjoyed the "dive," and your comments are dead on!
Thanks for such a thoughtful and cogent post.Family Room, Innuos Statement streamer (Roon Core) with Morrow Audio USB cable to McIntosh MC 2700 pre with DC2 Digital Audio Module; AQ Sky XLRs to CAT 600.2 dualmono amp, Morrow Elite Speaker Cables to NOLA Baby Grand Reference Gold 3 speakers. Power source for all components: Silver Circle Audio Pure Power One with dedicated 20 amp circuit to main panel.
Exercise Room, Innuos Streamer via Cat 6 cable connection to PS Audio PerfectWave MkII DAC w/Bridge II, AQ King Cobra RCAs to Perreaux PMF3150 amp (fully restored and upgraded by Jeffrey Jackson, Precision Audio Labs), Supra Rondo 4x2.5 Speaker Cables to SDA 1Cs (Vr3 Mods Xovers and other mods.), Dreadnaught with Supra Rondo 4x2.5 interconnect cables by Vr3 Mods. Power for each component from dedicated 20 amp circuit to main panel, except Innuos Statement powered from Silver Circle Audio Pure Power One. -
Yippy were alive!! Thanks jstas!!!Some final words,
"If you keep banging your head against the wall,
you're going to have headaches."
Warren -
How do I know you are not computer generated alive?
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Well said and needed!Anaheim Hills CA,
HT 5.1: Anthem MRX 720 / BDP-Denon DBT1713UD / Polkaudio LSiM703 / W4S mAmp's / Polkaudio LSiM706c / Polkaudio LSiM702F/X's / SVS PC12-NSD / Panasonic TC P55VT30
2 Channel: Rogue RP-5 / WireWorld Electra power cord / Marantz TT-15S1/ Ortofon - Quintet Black MC / Marantz NA8005 DAC / W4S mAmp's / Synology DS 216+ll-4TB / Polkaudio LSiM703 -
I was promised audio paradice when I joined.
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He'll just toss boxcars
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Well said, John.Political Correctness'.........defined
"A doctrine fostered by a delusional, illogical minority and rabidly promoted by an unscrupulous mainstream media, which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible to pick up a t-u-r-d by the clean end."
President of Club Polk -
Yea John is on a roll today he must of slept in a Holiday Inn Express last night. He has put together some great stuff since early afternoon today.
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Very well said..
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Very well said John, I was thinking the same things when reading thru the "this place is dead" thread. It's silly to let something as mundane as a stupid forum interface interfere with the vibe this place has going. I've made some great friends here, have helped out from time to time, and have been the recipient of help from others here.
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Good post. Maybe the new management can be embarrassed into stepping up; but I doubt it.Source: Bluesound Node 2i - Preamp/DAC: Benchmark DAC2 DX - Amp: Parasound Halo A21 - Speakers: MartinLogan Motion 60XTi - Shop Rig: Yamaha A-S501 Integrated - Shop Spkrs: Elac Debut 2.0 B5.2
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Yea funny steve. K_M was taking to task today by KENcs in the closed sda thread. She still dancedPost edited by pitdogg2 on
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The Dude abides.
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There's more words in John's post than I write here in a year.Political Correctness'.........defined
"A doctrine fostered by a delusional, illogical minority and rabidly promoted by an unscrupulous mainstream media, which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible to pick up a t-u-r-d by the clean end."
President of Club Polk -
There's more words in John's post than I write here in a year.
Mr. E.F. Hutton speaks volumes -
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There's more words in John's post than I write here in a year.
Yeah, you are kinda laconic, aren't you?
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