What the hell were they thinking?

nooshinjohn

deleted

Face

nooshinjohn wrote: »

Let's not forghet that now that your heath is the government's business, they will use that power to tell you what you can eat, smoke, drink and possibly wear(high heels are dangerous to your ankles) Everything and anything can be deemed as bad for your health, from car exhaust to red meat.

Between the EPA, the DHS, and now the ACA, there is ont one single aspect of your life that is not now, or cannot in the future, be controlled by the government. Even the ability to have a family is subject being controlled. Dangerous times these are.

Is there something you've been meaning to tell us?

gwg_97

The fact is that everyone in America already has "insurance" and we (as more fortunate people) already pay for it. For example, when my brother was 22 he fractured his wrist in about 8 places. It was about $20,000 to patch him up. He had no insurance and he couldn't afford to pay his bill. That will teach him to go skating boarding after 8 beers! No problem, the hospital ate the cost and my brother got a small ding on his credit rating. All done. Not a big deal, after all, the businesses that run the hospitals already account for this lost revenue by passing it on to the customers who already pay for their own insurance. As more people become uninsured, those who are responsible citizens keep paying more for everyone's "insurance". Call me naive but this is certainly not sustainable. As far as Obama care being a first step into the European socialist model, I don't buy it. As a business owner I have no "control" over how much I pay for my employees insurance, nor do I have any control over where my insurance company invests "my" money. China? Sure, I can stop offering my employees a sweet benefits package and that would be great for my year end distribution but I bet they wouldn't appreciate it much. Do you think my insurance rates would go up? Maybe we can just let all those uninsured people who get seriously injured take care of themselves. How hard can it be to give yourself a double bypass anyway?

I usually stay away from this kind of stuff but this is fun.

Timothy Smith

cnh wrote: »

I did not realize that I was here to write treatises for free for you! Look my friend. We disagree Politically! Accept that! And let it go! Because I'm NOT going to change anything you think or believe and we're only going to get this thread shut down. I'm trying to be as polite as I can.

cnh

I don't mean to offend you either.

I am just curious as to what your opinion is. If you find that is an unbearable affront than I do not know what to do.

I guess that is a good way to shut down conversation and the possibility of changing someone's mind, or at least showing them that there is another way to look at things.

You may not believe this, but some of my best and oldest friends hold views that are very different than mine. But we feel free to talk about controversial subjects in order to explore them and maybe get new insights. Talking to intelligent people who think differently than you sharpens the mind rather than just finishing each others sentences and high-fiving people who think and speak exactly like you do. So I guess diversity is good in all things, except for opinions.

Why do you feel you are not capable of changing anything that I think or believe? Do you somehow know that I am so simple or stubborn that I could not possibly understand a new thought or concept. Or are your beliefs so weak or unsubstantiated that you could not explain or defend them? Or maybe you just don't want to put forth the effort or risk embarrassment.

And how do you presume to know what I think or believe on all subjects? I don't pretend to know that about you, and I likely read as many of your posts as you do mine.

I should probably stop before.this thread gets shut dow...............

Timothy Smith

codyc1ark wrote: »

Whoa dude, calm it down. Sheesh!

Do you see this face?.....this is my calm face.

gdb

Sorry, this gave me a chuckle, had to share.

Timothy Smith

gdb wrote: »

Sorry, this gave me a chuckle, had to share.

Yes, I remember Jesus demanding that the Romans provide free health care including contraception, viagra, and cosmetic surgery.

gdb

"contraception, viagra, and cosmetic surgery. "

Those sound like some of the core values of ancient Rome !

tonyb

steveinaz wrote: »

The government forcing citizens to buy a private product is UNCONSTITUTIONAL. I don't care what the idiots on the "supreme" court concede to.

I'm done with this topic.

Exactly, the SC just chose to toss it back at the administration and let them take the fall. If they can mandate you buy a product, what else is yet to come ? A mandate you all buy electric cars ....or pay a tax ? A mandate you keep your thermostat at 65 in the winter....or pay a tax ? A mandate that all kids do civil service before entering college.....or pay a fine ? Any audio gear not efficient enough will be subject to heavy taxes........

Where are the lines drawn....where does it end ? Government doesn't like to operate within a box with defined boundaries, but they sure want you to do so. Our only hope now is Romney getting rid of the whole thing if he wins and holds up his end.

Timothy Smith

gdb wrote: »

"contraception, viagra, and cosmetic surgery. "

Those sound like some of the core values of ancient Rome !

Maybe that's why there is a book named "The Decline and fall of the Roman Empire", and not one titled "Why the Roman Empire is Still doin' Just Super"

gdb

Timothy Smith wrote: »

Maybe that's why there is a book named "The Decline and fall of the Roman Empire", and not one titled "Why the Roman Empire is Still doin' Just Super"

That there is funny, I don't care which side of the aisle yer on !!!

Timothy Smith

tonyb wrote: »

Exactly, the SC just chose to toss it back at the administration and let them take the fall. If they can mandate you buy a product, what else is yet to come ? A mandate you all buy electric cars ....or pay a tax ? A mandate you keep your thermostat at 65 in the winter....or pay a tax ? A mandate that all kids do civil service before entering college.....or pay a fine ? Any audio gear not efficient enough will be subject to heavy taxes........

Where are the lines drawn....where does it end ? Government doesn't like to operate within a box with defined boundaries, but they sure want you to do so. Our only hope now is Romney getting rid of the whole thing if he wins and holds up his end.

I agree.

Just because something is judged "constitutional" does not make it necessarily a good idea or one that we the people will accept.

It would technically be "constitutional" for Congress to vote to raise the federal tax rate to 100% of every person's earnings, and for the President to sign that into law and enforce it, since there is nothing in the constitution to prevent that. The constitution does, thankfully, provide for elections of our President and Congress, and if any Congress passed that law, and the President signed it, the voters would remove them.

That is what I think will actually happen, on a smaller scale, in November.

pearsall001

It's a sad day indeed for the good 'ole US of A...eroding right before our eyes. November can't get here fast enough!!!

gwg_97

Timothy Smith wrote: »

The constitution does, thankfully, provide for elections of our President and Congress, and if any Congress passed that law, and the President signed it, the voters would remove them.

However, if the election was really, really close it would be up to the Supreme Court to choose the President :eek: Sorry, I couldn't resist.

AsSiMiLaTeD

I'm shocked this thread has been allowed to survive this long. There's a reason political threads aren't allowed on here, most of you newer guys probably weren't around for it, but these thread often erode quickly into heated arguments and name calling. I'm shocked that hasn't happened here already, probably because there's an overwhelming majority and the minority have decided not to jump in.

gwg_97

Anyway, does anyone know where I can find a nice Carver a-753x?

bmbguy

AsSiMiLaTeD wrote: »

I'm shocked this thread has been allowed to survive this long. There's a reason political threads aren't allowed on here, most of you newer guys probably weren't around for it, but these thread often erode quickly into heated arguments and name calling.

You mean they're like cable threads?

BlueFox

AsSiMiLaTeD wrote: »

I'm shocked that hasn't happened here already, probably because there's an overwhelming majority and the minority have decided not to jump in.

Actually, there are the usual suspects who are a vocal minority, and they jump at every chance to complain on this forum about how their vision is being destroyed. The majority ignore them.

AsSiMiLaTeD

Worse, people tent to feel more passionately about religion and politics than they do cables.

Polk also probably does not want to be affiliated with discussions that could potentially alienate them or put off potential customers, and things like guns, religion and politics can do just that.

Those are the rules they set forth and that everyone agrees to follow, nobody should get special treatment and be able to post whatever they want.

gudnoyez

gwg_97 wrote: »

Anyway, does anyone know where I can find a nice Carver a-753x?

How about this Heatwave 100 degrees here with a heat index of 116, spose to last another week. I am still frantically searching forums and craigslist for a good deal on a amp and preamp to power my SDA2B's.

gdb

There's a 750wpc Carver Pro amp on the bay right now that might go cheap. The carver "gurus" say it's sound is identical to the "home" version.

nooshinjohn

Topics as important as this can be discussed without getting too political or falling into chaos. These threads usually come off the rails when the uber left/right start getting out of hand. This topic, though it may be seen as political in nature, has absolutely nothing to do with anything more than how this specific law will affect you personally, your family and our country as a whole.

If you cannot separate the politics from having an honest disscussion about what today's descision means for your health and the future of your family, well sorry, but I can't help you there.

gwg_97

gdb wrote: »

There's a 750wpc Carver Pro amp on the bay right now that might go cheap. The carver "gurus" say it's sound is identical to the "home" version.

Hmmmm, I don't see it.

dkg999

SteveinAZ - the way I read the decision is that SCOTUS correctly ruled that the commerce clause doesn't allow the federal government to mandate that any citizen buy or consume anything. So they did rule against the individual mandate. What they also said is that the individual mandate that POTUS had claimed was not a tax, really is a tax, and the federal goverment has the power to levy taxes, even if it is creatively designed to force citizens into a behavior the federal government wants to mandate. So now we have the largest tax increase in history, squared straight at those least able to afford it, combined with the court providing a ruling that limits how and what the federal government can push down to the states as far as costs and penalties. It's really a perfect storm of unintended consequences.

So where is the pie when we need it?

pietro944

dkg999 wrote: »

SteveinAZ - the way I read the decision is that SCOTUS correctly ruled that the commerce clause doesn't allow the federal government to mandate that any citizen buy or consume anything. So they did rule against the individual mandate. What they also said is that the individual mandate that POTUS had claimed was not a tax, really is a tax, and the federal goverment has the power to levy taxes, even if it is creatively designed to force citizens into a behavior the federal government wants to mandate. So now we have the largest tax increase in history, squared straight at those least able to afford it, combined with the court providing a ruling that limits how and what the federal government can push down to the states as far as costs and penalties. It's really a perfect storm of unintended consequences.

So where is the pie when we need it?

This is exactly correct.....In essence they lied about this being the largest tax increase in american history....and a grotesque ponzi scheme,to boot......You all remember "The day the music died"?....well folks.....this is the "day" Democracy died....Karl Marx would be proud:sad:

DMara

rooftop59 wrote: »

"3) The discussion of politics and religion is irrelevant to good audio and is, therefore, not allowed on this forum."

http://www.polkaudio.com/forums/announcement.php?f=33

If this does not constitute politics, then I don't know what does.

Just avoid speaking in a thread you don't like, just let the mods take care of the rule book.

stubby

Seems to me there has been federal government coersion of state laws for years. If your state does not have stiff laws regarding speed limits, helmets, smoking, unleaded gasoline, (just to go way back) and so on, the state will not receive federal money for road improvements or myriad other projects.

But now under this administration in particular, the feds have gone too far? This his been happening for years people. Where was all the shouting when automobile insurance was required by law? I know, I know; you don't have to drive. Its your choice to do that! Yeah, thats an option.

obieone

Congress had to pass a law abolishing slavery, because SCOTUS deemed it constitutional. This ain't the first time they screwed up.
And it won't be the last.

Phasewolf

Forcing people to pay a private company money or being fined is more or less saying you need to pay this fee for your citizenship or your a law breaker and not paying the fine can end you up in jail. How is this American?

nooshinjohn

Phasewolf wrote: »

Forcing people to pay a private company money or being fined is more or less saying you need to pay this fee for your citizenship or your a law breaker and not paying the fine can end you up in jail. How is this American?

Especially in light of the fact that anyone here illegally will get the same care as a citizen and not face fines, deportation or jail time... go figure.