LSiM 707 Review

bsoko2

How does a site like this sell these so cheap?

http://www.audiophileliquidator.net/product_info.php?manufacturers_id=9&products_id=13126&osCsid=18f3950b12d555fdff70047f7834a0d0

I'm toying with buying a full 9 speaker set for my living room HT.

F1nut

bsoko2 wrote: »

How does a site like this sell these so cheap?

Gray market, no factory warranty.

Esreuter

Interesting, but are they real polks
Or a fake knock off?

Esr

bsoko2

F1nut wrote: »

Gray market, no factory warranty.

Sent a email and asked about warrenty.

F1nut

It's right on their site, http://www.audiophileliquidator.net/information.php?osCsid=18f3950b12d555fdff70047f7834a0d0&info_id=12

NO factory warranty.

mantis

F1nut wrote: »

It's right on their site, http://www.audiophileliquidator.net/information.php?osCsid=18f3950b12d555fdff70047f7834a0d0&info_id=12

NO factory warranty.

I would never buy anything online without a warranty.

leroyjr1

mantis wrote: »

I would never buy anything online without a warranty.

What's the difference, people buy used all the time off Craigslist, eBay and Audiogon without warranties. I don't see a difference here, and you're getting a third off plus it's new. I've owned dozens of new and used polks and never needed a warranty.

Esreuter

True. But are they real polks or a cheap imitator?
I could have got my light meter from some Chinese imitator, lookedike sekonic, said sekonic but wasn't skonic.

Esr

marvda1

i think if they were going to make and sell knockoffs they would pick on higher end manufacturers.

mantis

leroyjr1 wrote: »

What's the difference, people buy used all the time off Craigslist, eBay and Audiogon without warranties. I don't see a difference here, and you're getting a third off plus it's new. I've owned dozens of new and used polks and never needed a warranty.

I would buy used I have no problem , I wouldn't buy anything new without a warranty. I also support Authorized dealers who took the time to take the correct steps in earning the right to sell the given products.

Face

leroyjr1 wrote: »

What's the difference, people buy used all the time off Craigslist, eBay and Audiogon without warranties. I don't see a difference here, and you're getting a third off plus it's new. I've owned dozens of new and used polks and never needed a warranty.

Glad to see you're a team player.

Esreuter

that is a valid point.

but the knockoffers will do anything man, uber expensive brands or not.

its amazing what little fingers can create in a sweat shop.

ESR:loneranger:

Drenis

leroyjr1 wrote: »

What's the difference, people buy used all the time off Craigslist, eBay and Audiogon without warranties. I don't see a difference here, and you're getting a third off plus it's new. I've owned dozens of new and used polks and never needed a warranty.

There is a BIG difference though with buying something used and buying something *claimed* to be new from a non-authorized retailer.

leroyjr1

Face wrote: »

Glad to see you're a team player.

It has nothing to do with being a team player. It's about saving money.

Face

leroyjr1 wrote: »

It has nothing to do with being a team player. It's about saving money.

Do you buy hot goods too?

Esreuter

oooooooo, thats a character in conflict!!

be a honest person and pay full price and support everything rightfully or the shady dealer down the street undercutting every one in the process.

i see a story in the making here. lulz

esr:loneranger:

JimAckley

oy... I just logged in for the 1st time in a while. I love drama

Subdusted

To testdrive such speakers the rest of the gear - ALL OF IT !!!! I repeat, all of it down to power cables on your SACD player which you didn't use for testing( WHAT ???) should be of the highest quality. You should also make sure that your powerline is free from any interference caused by other equipment, like computers for instance. Ideally, you need to have two separate power lines -one for analogue equipment, one for digital... and , of course, nothing else can run off them. The cabling is poor as well, you should have tried at least Audioquest Rocket 88... anything lower than that would not let the speakers reveal their beauty. The use of the receiver really shocked me... Like I said, every component has to be of the highest quality because no matter how good the speakers are you always hear the weakest link in your system. There had to be separates all the way, of Krell or similar quality,not some " top off the line " receiver. Receivers are not made for music, period. If you cannot hear a difference between a receiver and good quality dedicated stereo setup then you shouldn't review speakers.
the fact that you used lossless files doesn't mean anything, there's so much really bad quality stuff in lossless formats out there that only 1-3 % can actually be used for testing . There are plenty of high quality special testing CDs ( high - res stereo or SACD format ) that should have been used. Plus, you used the DACs of your receiver... I mean, come on !
I don't want to sound mean , but this review is totally misleading and does more harm than good, simply because you couldn't possibly make these speakers sound the way they were meant to sound and your review affects people's decisions and choices.

marvda1

So what you are saying is people with under $50,000 systems need not apply. i find that a little snobbish. that's why you list the equipment you are using so a reader can put your results in context.

mantis

Subdusted wrote: »

To testdrive such speakers the rest of the gear - ALL OF IT !!!! I repeat, all of it down to power cables on your SACD player which you didn't use for testing( WHAT ???) should be of the highest quality. You should also make sure that your powerline is free from any interference caused by other equipment, like computers for instance. Ideally, you need to have two separate power lines -one for analogue equipment, one for digital... and , of course, nothing else can run off them. The cabling is poor as well, you should have tried at least Audioquest Rocket 88... anything lower than that would not let the speakers reveal their beauty. The use of the receiver really shocked me... Like I said, every component has to be of the highest quality because no matter how good the speakers are you always hear the weakest link in your system. There had to be separates all the way, of Krell or similar quality,not some " top off the line " receiver. Receivers are not made for music, period. If you cannot hear a difference between a receiver and good quality dedicated stereo setup then you shouldn't review speakers.
the fact that you used lossless files doesn't mean anything, there's so much really bad quality stuff in lossless formats out there that only 1-3 % can actually be used for testing . There are plenty of high quality special testing CDs ( high - res stereo or SACD format ) that should have been used. Plus, you used the DACs of your receiver... I mean, come on !
I don't want to sound mean , but this review is totally misleading and does more harm than good, simply because you couldn't possibly make these speakers sound the way they were meant to sound and your review affects people's decisions and choices.

You sound like you got a small clue but your way off base my man. Where your going wrong here is synergy. These speakers are not super high end and one who is going to purchase them most likely will not be driving them with Krell or equal quality. Also saying you can't use a receiver for music is total **** , many people including myself use receivers andget very pleasing results doing so. Just so you know I blew away a room full of Audiophiles with a SC-68 and a pair of Magnepan 1.7's wired with Cardas Crosslinks , Audioquest , Wattbox surge and 24/192 files from a Mac Mini. No one could believe that sound quality we got from a audio video receiver , most thought we where running some high end separates.
You also sound like you learned some things but need much polishing , your not on the wrong path but you are very misguided.

I fully respect this review and I have been doing reviews for well over 15 years.

Subdusted

My point is, again, that you always hear the weakest link in the system. And in that particular setup there were too many of them. And they did not allow to hear the potential these speakers have. With better equipment you can hear how they actually CAN sound, what they are capable of.
When I was choosing my speaker wire, a buddy of mine , who is a dealer, hauled a huge box of them. He refused to tell me the names and/or prices, instead he told me to just listen to them, compare...and chose the one that sounds best in my system. Among all that was the incredible quality hand-made silver cable, I mean, the wire inside was made of pure silver, I saw the pictures and videos of the process , that wire was put in a whole tube with some rope that went along the wire slightly twining around it , because the best insulation is air... anyway, there were cables that made the system sound too harsh ( and one of them turned out to cost 1500 ) or muddy...or not having enough dynamics... after 4 hours of listening I picked two, and listened to them for a couple of weeks. The ones I picked were AQ Rocket 88 and Supra Ply 3. They were almost identical in sound. I ended up getting the Supra as it was cheaper. So... the speaker wire alone made such a difference, from totally uncomfortable to the sound I was absolutely happy with.
Right now I am auditioning power cables for my Oppo 95 - I have Offlex, TTAF, Silentwire and a few more. With power cables it's a lot more complicated because they require a lot more break-in time, I mean, they have to play in a particular system for at least 100 hours. Silver power cables require 400 hrs, and during that period of time the sound keeps changing, it gets better, then worse, then again better..and it goes on.

I have LSi15s and a balanced ( XLR ) stereo setup. When I tried to drive LSi15s off the reciever ( Integra 70.1 ) the sound was sluggish...although Integra provides 160 watts at 6 Ohms per channel, if not more.. When I used preouts on the receiver and hooked them to my amplifier , only then they really started to sound. Still, when I use my pre-amp / power amp combo ( Thule Audio 250 PR / Thule Audio 350 PA - that's 350 watts of class A amplification ), the sound in stereo is much better than if it's a reciever / power amp. The gear is decent but it's not the greatest and right now I am working on my room acoustics to get the best out of it. Yet, if I was auditioning these speakers, I could only say how they sounded with this particular set up in this particular room... not how they sound in general, because I simply would not know that. So, calling this an LSiM 707 review means that these speakers are evaluated, but with so many weak points in that setup this cannot be a fair evaluation.

Subdusted

mantis wrote: »

You sound like you got a small clue but your way off base my man. Where your going wrong here is synergy. These speakers are not super high end and one who is going to purchase them most likely will not be driving them with Krell or equal quality. Also saying you can't use a receiver for music is total **** , many people including myself use receivers andget very pleasing results doing so. Just so you know I blew away a room full of Audiophiles with a SC-68 and a pair of Magnepan 1.7's wired with Cardas Crosslinks , Audioquest , Wattbox surge and 24/192 files from a Mac Mini. No one could believe that sound quality we got from a audio video receiver , most thought we where running some high end separates.
You also sound like you learned some things but need much polishing , your not on the wrong path but you are very misguided.

I fully respect this review and I have been doing reviews for well over 15 years.

I did not hear that setup so I cannot be objective... but Magnepans have low sensitivity ( 86 I believe), and a Pioneer receiver cannot possibly provide the control a separate amplifier in the same price range can, or even better - monoblocks. And control is what really matters. But it's just theory... It very well may be that you have really good room acoustics and a happy marriage of your components ( which is very hard to achieve ) and when they work together in that particular room - they shine, moreover, they outshine the separates that are considerably more expensive but incompatible and work in worse acoustic situations, however, I have no doubts that if your Pioneer was replaced with a suitable amp in the same price range, the sound would improve dramatically.

Subdusted

you cannot have an "all-in-one" thing perform just as good as a device that was designed for just one particular purpose. Would you rather have your heart operated on by a heart surgeon or by a regular family doctor ? an SUV is another "all-in-one" but it is not as fast and maneuverable as a car in the same price range and it doesn't have the hauling power and off-road abilities of a truck...just like everywhere else - we call someone a "professional" only if he is skillful , experienced and knowledgeable in his particular field , because only then he will be able to do the job well. Same applies to receivers, they are another "all-in-one" product...That does everything but cannot possiblycompete with separates. In decent amplifiers toroidal transformers weigh more than whole receivers... just look at Emotiva lines, which are pretty inexpensive. I have an Integra 70.1 ( Onkyo 3007 ), which is considered a top receiver, but a lot cheaper integrated Arcam Delta 290 beat it effortlessly in stereo. That's why I have Integra for HT only.

JimAckley

Well shoot man, let me PM you my address and you can buy all of that for me to use in my future reviews, that way I can foot the bill for all my other hobbies, bills, trips, etc., and still write reviews that will satisfy you.

Now, to throw the Pioneer Elite SC-37 with all other "all-in-one" receivers is a gross mistake. It's by no means "separates", but it's miles ahead of nearly every receiver out there. I don't think I've seen someone underrate it so severely.

Oh, and you obviously haven't driven a 2004-2006 Yukon XL 2500 SLT Autoride with a 496 and 4.11 differential. It does everything that you just claimed an SUV can't do well.

Subdusted

Really ? so, speed and maneuverability wise it can successfully compete with cars in it's price range, let's say, a Corvette? As for it's hauling abilities, have you ever seen anyone who does hauling for a living, use it as their truck?

ZLTFUL

It appears that someone is trying to steal that "Troll of the Year" title away from JHyman...

JimAckley

Subdusted wrote: »

Really ? so, speed and maneuverability wise it can successfully compete with cars in it's price range, let's say, a Corvette? As for it's hauling abilities, have you ever seen anyone who does hauling for a living, use it as their truck?

Well, my 2004 XL 2500 cost less 4 years ago than a base 2004 Corvette does today but it was comparable to the base 'vette. The Autoride suspension let it take corners in ways that other SUVs can't. I hauled with it every week without it breaking a sweat. Oh and it can do all of that while carrying 8 people with room for groceries, all of those big speakers like the LSi25s I used to have, go over speed bumps at more than 5 mph, jump railroad tracks at high speeds without breaking anything... you know, all of those things that other cars, let's say a Corvette, can't do.

We're not talking about your soccer mom's light-duty Suburban here...


Nonetheless, that's enough of that. This thread is supposed to be an informative review about my experience with the 707s, not senseless banter with elitists. I'd venture to say it relates better to the common individual than a review with all the stuff you listed anyway.

nooshinjohn

Subdusted wrote: »

I did not hear that setup so I cannot be objective... but Magnepans have low sensitivity ( 86 I believe), and a Pioneer receiver cannot possibly provide the control a separate amplifier in the same price range can, or even better - monoblocks. And control is what really matters. But it's just theory... It very well may be that you have really good room acoustics and a happy marriage of your components ( which is very hard to achieve ) and when they work together in that particular room - they shine, moreover, they outshine the separates that are considerably more expensive but incompatible and work in worse acoustic situations, however, I have no doubts that if your Pioneer was replaced with a suitable amp in the same price range, the sound would improve dramatically.

I gotta call bs here. I have a Pioneer SC37 and can tell you I have zero problems with the sound I get from my Magnepan MG-20's. They are a far more difficult load than the 1.7's. You have much knowledge young padawan, but you are no Jedi yet.

Face

Try a real amp on them and you'll see.

NutsAndBolts

Greetings, new member here. Thank you for the review Jim. I am looking to upgrade to LSIM 707s. But now I am going to have to consider the 703s instead based on this review.

Subdusted wrote: »

...
Right now I am auditioning power cables for my Oppo 95 - I have Offlex, TTAF, Silentwire and a few more. With power cables it's a lot more complicated because they require a lot more break-in time, I mean, they have to play in a particular system for at least 100 hours. Silver power cables require 400 hrs, and during that period of time the sound keeps changing, it gets better, then worse, then again better..and it goes on..

I understand breaking in speakers, but what is this about breaking in a power cable? What is there to break in? Square electrons that needs to be rounded off :eek:

BTW, I am a proud owner of a Pioneer SC-37 also. And it is a great A/V receiver, sounds perfect. I would argue that it has enough power to drive the 707s or even the RTi A9s (which are rated up to 500Watts vs 300Watts of 707s). If I cannot use the 707s or the A9s with a 140W per channel, then I will have to stay away from them. By the way Polk says you can use the 707s with a 20W amp. What is that about? My Pioneer TV has built in amps rated at 18W and when I wound up the volume on the TV driving TSI500s (rated at 275W by Polk) the walls were rattling, that was before my SC-37 arrived. So I am not buying this "you must have dedicated 500W amps to drive these speakers" argument.