I pulled the trigger...

13

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  • george daniel
    george daniel Posts: 12,096
    edited October 2010
    I'm gonna' replace all the caps and resistors except for and unless I can find a suitable replacement for the 5Uf Hovland in the tweeter circuit. I'm considering sonicaps and dueland ,,any suggestions are always appreciated.
    JC approves....he told me so. (F-1 nut)
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  • Face
    Face Posts: 14,340
    edited October 2010
    Vr3MxStyler2k3 wrote: »
    What all are you replacing in the chain George?

    I hope my binding post arrive today I would love to hear what this all sounds like lol
    Be sure to give them a little time to break in before making any impressions.
    george daniel wrote: »
    I'm gonna' replace all the caps and resistors except for and unless I can find a suitable replacement for the 5Uf Hovland in the tweeter circuit. I'm considering sonicaps and dueland ,,any suggestions are always appreciated.
    http://www.partsconnexion.com/capacitor_film_duelund_pio_speaker.html

    :D
    "He who fights with monsters should look to it that he himself does not become a monster. And when you gaze long into an abyss the abyss also gazes into you." Friedrich Nietzsche
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  • george daniel
    george daniel Posts: 12,096
    edited October 2010
    waaaaaaaaaaaa-- 3400.00 for that cap-- maybe I can get one this year,,and wait and do the other speaker next fall,,,,, ,, on a more serious note-- any other suggestions for a good 20 watt resistor.
    JC approves....he told me so. (F-1 nut)
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  • Face
    Face Posts: 14,340
    edited October 2010
    Depends on where it's being used. In series with a driver, parallel 2 Duelund resistors. In parallel with a woofer or mid: http://www.partsconnexion.com/resistors_mills_mrc.html
    "He who fights with monsters should look to it that he himself does not become a monster. And when you gaze long into an abyss the abyss also gazes into you." Friedrich Nietzsche
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  • george daniel
    george daniel Posts: 12,096
    edited October 2010
    Thanks Face-- I'll look inside again,,IIRC the two resistors in series are in the tweeter circuit,,they are the 20 watt Eagle brand.
    JC approves....he told me so. (F-1 nut)
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  • george daniel
    george daniel Posts: 12,096
    edited October 2010
    Cap values are 4 uf(400 volt),,31 uf,, 12 uf,,the 31 and 12 are 100 volt caps,,I'm gonna shop around cause I've always used sonicaps in crossovers,,Trey,, sorry for stomping on your thread,,I really like your idea about the external crossovers,please post pic's when you are finished --please and thanks--george :)
    JC approves....he told me so. (F-1 nut)
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  • VR3
    VR3 Posts: 28,748
    edited October 2010
    Hey George I only see eagle resistors that are 10 watts.

    Also, on my binding post the wire was oxidizing (silver plated copper) so might want to check your wiring as well...

    I ran all new internal wiring, new solder joints, the works

    Just need my binding post and I will have sound again!!!
    - Not Tom ::::::: Any system can play Diana Krall. Only the best can play Limp Bizkit.
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  • george daniel
    george daniel Posts: 12,096
    edited October 2010
    Vr3MxStyler2k3 wrote: »
    Hey George I only see eagle resistors that are 10 watts.

    Also, on my binding post the wire was oxidizing (silver plated copper) so might want to check your wiring as well...

    I ran all new internal wiring, new solder joints, the works

    Just need my binding post and I will have sound again!!!

    Yep-- you are correct sir,, my bad--that just made things easier.Thanks
    JC approves....he told me so. (F-1 nut)
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  • VR3
    VR3 Posts: 28,748
    edited October 2010
    George, fwiw I was very impressed with the performance of the Clarity Cap SA series on the woofer network...

    I noticed alot more bass response and an openness in the mids that was not there before almost immediately
    - Not Tom ::::::: Any system can play Diana Krall. Only the best can play Limp Bizkit.
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  • VR3
    VR3 Posts: 28,748
    edited October 2010
    Well I couldnt wait any longer on my binding post.. lol

    I had some spare parts laying around in the closet...

    so I just twisted some wires together to go to the speaker, heat shrinked them - wrapped wires about the post, heat shrinked them together

    Called it a day! lol

    First impressions between left speaker to right speaker are very positive...

    Changes done to the left speaker vs. right

    1) gaskets put between drivers and enclosure
    2) Reattached and sealed ports to enclosure
    3) Lined enclosure with a sheet of No-Rez particularly around the drivers, the very back of the enclosure and bottom
    4) New Wiring throughout
    5) Clarity MR series on the tweeter network
    6) External crossovers
    7) 18" Tile, elevated off the floor by felt pads - with speaker spiked to it...
    8) Diffraction be gone

    With all of these changes, it was immediately easier to pick out micro details, more so easier to understand and process these micro details..

    Chestiness present in bass and vocals was no more.

    Bass accuracy is far superior

    Mids to highs transition is far smoother

    Tweeter is far more controlled

    I am excited to hear these things after the caps burn in and everything settles.

    To bad I will have to tear it all apart again to install my real binding post hahah
    - Not Tom ::::::: Any system can play Diana Krall. Only the best can play Limp Bizkit.
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  • VR3
    VR3 Posts: 28,748
    edited October 2010
    Here are some pics of my rigged up setup
    - Not Tom ::::::: Any system can play Diana Krall. Only the best can play Limp Bizkit.
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  • VR3
    VR3 Posts: 28,748
    edited October 2010
    Wow Im an idiot

    I was looking at the pic of the tweeter network and noticed I had the tweeter out of phase... LOL

    Now you want to talk about a pretty big difference?

    Ill keep my opinions and observations to myself but I am headed the right direction
    - Not Tom ::::::: Any system can play Diana Krall. Only the best can play Limp Bizkit.
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  • VR3
    VR3 Posts: 28,748
    edited October 2010
    Honestly I should have done these upgrades one by one but... I didnt feel like taking my speakers apart alot.

    The No Rez has made a huge improvement in just the quickness of the midbasses. I played some songs I am very familiar with and listened for midbass chestiness I had heard previously and none was to be found. Quite the opposite - very fast response with super clean upper midbass registries, even better than I once had. Very impressive.

    The highs are far more controlled than before, but I can't decide if it is the cap that is doing it or the Diffraction be gone.

    I also noticed the speaker throws out a far wider, deeper stage than the right speaker.

    The bass also digs much deeper. There was a particular song I played where the bass was much deeper on the left than the right and it was the same signal per side.

    Very interesting to listen to a decked out speaker vs. a stock speaker in the same rig at the same time.
    - Not Tom ::::::: Any system can play Diana Krall. Only the best can play Limp Bizkit.
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  • Face
    Face Posts: 14,340
    edited October 2010
    When they're both done, try them without the diffraction pads.
    "He who fights with monsters should look to it that he himself does not become a monster. And when you gaze long into an abyss the abyss also gazes into you." Friedrich Nietzsche
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  • VR3
    VR3 Posts: 28,748
    edited October 2010
    Ill give it a shot.

    I know standing right up on the speaker or directly infront of it it sounds 1,000,000 times cleaner with the diffraction be gone on. It sounds disoriented without it outside the sweet spot.
    - Not Tom ::::::: Any system can play Diana Krall. Only the best can play Limp Bizkit.
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  • VR3
    VR3 Posts: 28,748
    edited October 2010
    Lightman was over today

    And we both agreed

    The left speaker (Modded)

    Has cleaner, more controlled highs
    Deeper, cleaner, more textured bass
    More natural transition between mids and highs
    Integrated better with the sub
    Huge 3-D soundstaging, height-width-depth
    Incredible, spot on center image

    It honestly sounded like the right speaker was doing nothing in comparison.

    No contest, whatever the major difference is - the combination of the No Rez, the outboard crossovers, the better tweeter cap, the diffraction be gone, the new internal wiring, resealing the ports, putting gaskets behind the drivers....

    All of that combined has created a new level of speaker that unfortunately was subdued by poor quality parts.
    - Not Tom ::::::: Any system can play Diana Krall. Only the best can play Limp Bizkit.
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  • Face
    Face Posts: 14,340
    edited October 2010
    So when are you going to do the other one?
    "He who fights with monsters should look to it that he himself does not become a monster. And when you gaze long into an abyss the abyss also gazes into you." Friedrich Nietzsche
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  • VR3
    VR3 Posts: 28,748
    edited October 2010
    The minute my binding post arrive... lol

    I dont have anymore spare parts
    - Not Tom ::::::: Any system can play Diana Krall. Only the best can play Limp Bizkit.
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  • Ricardo
    Ricardo Posts: 10,636
    edited October 2010
    Vr3MxStyler2k3 wrote: »
    The left speaker (Modded)

    ......
    Incredible, spot on center image
    ......

    It honestly sounded like the right speaker was doing nothing in comparison.

    And exactly how did you evaluate this?
    _________________________________________________
    ***\\\\\........................... My Audio Journey ............................./////***

    2008 & 2010 Football Pool WINNER
    SOPA
    Thank God for different opinions. Imagine the world if we all wanted the same woman
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  • VR3
    VR3 Posts: 28,748
    edited October 2010
    We played familiar music - the left speaker was modded, the right speaker is not.

    The left speaker threw out a far greater stage, far better micro details, just really as soon as it got to the right side of the stage things just really fell apart.

    In comparison the right speaker sounded just bad. If I had not modded them at all I obviously would have never thought this but seeing what has changed now compared to then the difference is huge.

    For example, there was one particular track where there was a bass beat identical in both channels, the right speaker sounded hollow where as the right sounded very full and deep. Things like this are what made the difference.

    I mean Russ sat down and immediately was like, wow - no contest, the left speaker is that much better...
    - Not Tom ::::::: Any system can play Diana Krall. Only the best can play Limp Bizkit.
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  • Ricardo
    Ricardo Posts: 10,636
    edited October 2010
    My question was just on the center image evaluation ;)
    _________________________________________________
    ***\\\\\........................... My Audio Journey ............................./////***

    2008 & 2010 Football Pool WINNER
    SOPA
    Thank God for different opinions. Imagine the world if we all wanted the same woman
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  • VR3
    VR3 Posts: 28,748
    edited October 2010
    Obviously the center image is harder to evaluate this way

    But I actually had to bring myself closer to the right speaker as the left speaker projected better - it was far more pronounced on the left.

    Not to mention things around the center image were far more distinguished.
    - Not Tom ::::::: Any system can play Diana Krall. Only the best can play Limp Bizkit.
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  • lightman1
    lightman1 Posts: 10,792
    edited October 2010
    Yep..The difference is leaps and bounds over the stock speaker. My high range hearing is only good up to around 11khz. But I could hear much more detail from the modded speaker. More presence and clarity from the tweets. The mids staging is wider and deeper. The midbass punch was rapid-fire sweetness. No decay or slop. Low end was gut punching and precise. Trey has built him a new set of speakers with the mods he's done.
    Two thumbs up!
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  • VR3
    VR3 Posts: 28,748
    edited October 2010
    I would like to take a second to thank Mike (Face) for all his help.

    His guidance in all of this has been priceless.

    He has helped me modify my speakers to what I would classify at this point the best rig I have ever heard.

    There truly is no contest here. I can find no faults with the left side of my stage, it is so good it makes me giggle. I havent giggled when listening to music in years.

    I mean seriously - wow. Guys, those Clarity MR capacitors with those duelund resistors are so hot they could catch water on fire. My god folks.

    Incredible! Absolutely incredible and worth every freaking penny.

    I cant wait till my binding post get here.
    - Not Tom ::::::: Any system can play Diana Krall. Only the best can play Limp Bizkit.
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  • Ricardo
    Ricardo Posts: 10,636
    edited October 2010
    I dunno. At $50ish each cap.....I can't bring myself to think they will sound that much better. I guess I won't know until I try, right?
    _________________________________________________
    ***\\\\\........................... My Audio Journey ............................./////***

    2008 & 2010 Football Pool WINNER
    SOPA
    Thank God for different opinions. Imagine the world if we all wanted the same woman
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  • VR3
    VR3 Posts: 28,748
    edited October 2010
    If I had extra money to light on fire I would do the whole crossover in them (woofer network) only problem is we are talking about 1,800 bucks in caps
    - Not Tom ::::::: Any system can play Diana Krall. Only the best can play Limp Bizkit.
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  • Face
    Face Posts: 14,340
    edited October 2010
    Vr3MxStyler2k3 wrote: »
    I would like to take a second to thank Mike (Face) for all his help.
    You're welcome!
    Ricardo wrote: »
    I dunno. At $50ish each cap.....I can't bring myself to think they will sound that much better. I guess I won't know until I try, right?
    So what are you waiting for? :D
    "He who fights with monsters should look to it that he himself does not become a monster. And when you gaze long into an abyss the abyss also gazes into you." Friedrich Nietzsche
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  • VR3
    VR3 Posts: 28,748
    edited October 2010
    Here is my finished product...

    It is not the best enclosure - but it is discrete and out of the way and you have to walk over to the corner of the room to notice them.

    A perfect world would be me being able to place them directly behind the speaker - but none the less this will work!

    Maybe one day I will put them in another enclosure? Who knows...

    I used DH Labs wiring...

    I used locking Banana plugs

    Insulated binding post, 99.99% copper with 24k gold plating

    There are 6 rubber dampening feet per enclosure...
    - Not Tom ::::::: Any system can play Diana Krall. Only the best can play Limp Bizkit.
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  • VR3
    VR3 Posts: 28,748
    edited October 2010
    And......... I did it again - the tweeter is out of phase.... lol
    - Not Tom ::::::: Any system can play Diana Krall. Only the best can play Limp Bizkit.
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  • Face
    Face Posts: 14,340
    edited October 2010
    Some wood boxes that match those cabinets would be a nice touch. ;)
    "He who fights with monsters should look to it that he himself does not become a monster. And when you gaze long into an abyss the abyss also gazes into you." Friedrich Nietzsche
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