Monster 14-4 vs Audioquest 14-4
mantis
Posts: 17,394
Yeah Bored today, doing laundry , waiting on clothes to dry so I can swap over my laundry. It's been snowing all day long, I didn't even get a shower yet.
So I decided since I had my monster cable cables in my hand to just do a shootout as I have not done this in years.
Song I picked 2 to keep it simple and to pay attention to the details I know all so well.
Mike Dawes "Encomium
Kip Winger "How far will we go?"
I know these 2 songs as good as any other 2 so they made the list, they sound great and there is a lot of stuff to focus on to hear any differences in swapping out speaker cables.
I ran both songs on both cables all the way through, Then I focused on 1 minute of each song on each pair and tried to find any differences at all.
So the Audioquest cables I know exactly how they sound. They are clear as day, clean and do not restrict anything that I can hear. They are natural and beautiful sounding. I can't find a single thing about how they pass the sound to the speakers and handle the wattage that I can put my finger on that is faulty or bad. These are excellent cables , they are cheap as the day is long compared to some of my other cables that cost Hundreds more.
The Monstercables have a slightly different sound. Something is different and I'm having a hard time putting my finger on it. I think the volume dropped ever so slightly. It seems all the detail is still there, nothing seems to be missing. I can hear and feel the dynamic range of these 2 songs . I gotta swap back in the Audioquest to compare.
So back went in the audoquest cables and there is a slight volume up. I should have grabbed my SPL meter to confirm what I'm noticing. At 8 foot lengths of 14-4 copper wire speaker cables, there should be absolutely no difference in output. There is no restriction at this volume or at this length vs the gauge and wattage output I'm using. I was probably around 85-90 DB max with soft passages and loud dynamics.
Back went in the Monstercables and now I'm not noticing the volume differences but again something ever so slightly is different. What the hell is it???
Back goes in the Audioquest and I think I found it. It's the volume of things inside the sound. The finger picking, the thump on the guitar with Mike's song . On Kip's song, his voice , you can notice his breath more.
Back in the Monster and yup , that is what it was. There is just a small ever so slight difference in detail. The monster sits the finger noise, the breath and the thumps a tad back.
So now you have to wonder which cable is doing the original recording right or wrong? I have no idea which way is correct. I can say what I like better but as being accurate? No Idea.
I don't hate or dislike how the Monster cables sound. They have a pleasant sound to them that is nice and without the audioqest cables pointing out certain things, they are pretty nice sounding cables, if cables make sound LOL. It's the ability to transfer the sound is probably a better way to refer to this as. The Audioquest cables bring things a bit more forward instead of slightly laid back as the monster do.
Construction wise the Audioqest cables use more solid core conductors and less strands. Monster uses more fine conductors and rerverse wind them . If you were to ask me what's the difference. I think the difference lays in how these cables are constructed. Both use high quality copper, no idea who's is better. They both are the exact same gauge, both are bi wires , both are using their own Banana plugs. They are also both cold welded so there is no heat solder joints to worry about.
In the end of this time consuming fun little test, audioquest and monster have good quality cables with an ever so slight difference in how they present sound. Again I can't sit here and tell you who's is better. Both songs sounded great on both cables.
If this was a blind test, I think I would say I prefer A over B or I like the way B sounds relaxed and maybe A is aggressive in a small way. All the sounds are there neither cable missed anything. So with things like this , I think it's just what you like OR you figure out how to find out which cable is closer to presenting correctly and go that way if you prefer.
So I decided since I had my monster cable cables in my hand to just do a shootout as I have not done this in years.
Song I picked 2 to keep it simple and to pay attention to the details I know all so well.
Mike Dawes "Encomium
Kip Winger "How far will we go?"
I know these 2 songs as good as any other 2 so they made the list, they sound great and there is a lot of stuff to focus on to hear any differences in swapping out speaker cables.
I ran both songs on both cables all the way through, Then I focused on 1 minute of each song on each pair and tried to find any differences at all.
So the Audioquest cables I know exactly how they sound. They are clear as day, clean and do not restrict anything that I can hear. They are natural and beautiful sounding. I can't find a single thing about how they pass the sound to the speakers and handle the wattage that I can put my finger on that is faulty or bad. These are excellent cables , they are cheap as the day is long compared to some of my other cables that cost Hundreds more.
The Monstercables have a slightly different sound. Something is different and I'm having a hard time putting my finger on it. I think the volume dropped ever so slightly. It seems all the detail is still there, nothing seems to be missing. I can hear and feel the dynamic range of these 2 songs . I gotta swap back in the Audioquest to compare.
So back went in the audoquest cables and there is a slight volume up. I should have grabbed my SPL meter to confirm what I'm noticing. At 8 foot lengths of 14-4 copper wire speaker cables, there should be absolutely no difference in output. There is no restriction at this volume or at this length vs the gauge and wattage output I'm using. I was probably around 85-90 DB max with soft passages and loud dynamics.
Back went in the Monstercables and now I'm not noticing the volume differences but again something ever so slightly is different. What the hell is it???
Back goes in the Audioquest and I think I found it. It's the volume of things inside the sound. The finger picking, the thump on the guitar with Mike's song . On Kip's song, his voice , you can notice his breath more.
Back in the Monster and yup , that is what it was. There is just a small ever so slight difference in detail. The monster sits the finger noise, the breath and the thumps a tad back.
So now you have to wonder which cable is doing the original recording right or wrong? I have no idea which way is correct. I can say what I like better but as being accurate? No Idea.
I don't hate or dislike how the Monster cables sound. They have a pleasant sound to them that is nice and without the audioqest cables pointing out certain things, they are pretty nice sounding cables, if cables make sound LOL. It's the ability to transfer the sound is probably a better way to refer to this as. The Audioquest cables bring things a bit more forward instead of slightly laid back as the monster do.
Construction wise the Audioqest cables use more solid core conductors and less strands. Monster uses more fine conductors and rerverse wind them . If you were to ask me what's the difference. I think the difference lays in how these cables are constructed. Both use high quality copper, no idea who's is better. They both are the exact same gauge, both are bi wires , both are using their own Banana plugs. They are also both cold welded so there is no heat solder joints to worry about.
In the end of this time consuming fun little test, audioquest and monster have good quality cables with an ever so slight difference in how they present sound. Again I can't sit here and tell you who's is better. Both songs sounded great on both cables.
If this was a blind test, I think I would say I prefer A over B or I like the way B sounds relaxed and maybe A is aggressive in a small way. All the sounds are there neither cable missed anything. So with things like this , I think it's just what you like OR you figure out how to find out which cable is closer to presenting correctly and go that way if you prefer.
Dan
My personal quest is to save to world of bad audio, one thread at a time.
My personal quest is to save to world of bad audio, one thread at a time.
Comments
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It could also be the different banana connectors, may be different metal or internal construction, having an impact on the sound.
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Liked this comparison.
A big Monster fan here.
Have Monster’s ME2K and the 2.2s.
Really like the Sigma’s, my findings are that they’re a tad more laid back in the treble with a strong emphasis on bass.
If one has a very revieling system the Sigma’s can tame that top end of needed.
Also tried Monster’s Sigma Retro Gold’s.
They were way too relaxed of a speaker cable, almost to the point that they had too much of a difference on the top end freq’s.
Too laid back in my system that’s already a mellow sound.
They may have worked well with the Infinity Prelude MTS’s as they’re a very revieling speaker.
Never got the chance to try them on those. -
It could also be the different banana connectors, may be different metal or internal construction, having an impact on the sound.
Audioquests banan plugs are made of High-purity Beryllium Copper. However the Monsters I think are gold plated Some kind of copper alloy mix. They very well could be brass, I don't remember.Dan
My personal quest is to save to world of bad audio, one thread at a time. -
skipshot12 wrote: »Liked this comparison.
A big Monster fan here.
Have Monster’s ME2K and the 2.2s.
Really like the Sigma’s, my findings are that they’re a tad more laid back in the treble with a strong emphasis on bass.
If one has a very revieling system the Sigma’s can tame that top end of needed.
Also tried Monster’s Sigma Retro Gold’s.
They were way too relaxed of a speaker cable, almost to the point that they had too much of a difference on the top end freq’s.
Too laid back in my system that’s already a mellow sound.
They may have worked well with the Infinity Prelude MTS’s as they’re a very revieling speaker.
Never got the chance to try them on those.
I have owned and tried out almost ever monster cable made. Analog , HDMI , Digital , speaker wires etc. Monster made pretty solidstuff back in the day meaning 90's -2000's. After that they started to change for the worse, things got strange and at that point we were deep into Audioquest. Moved on from Tributaries , monster , and Transparent.
At Bryn Mawr then Tweeter we use to have all kinds of wire shootouts. I use to like the MCX cables which where more affordable then the 2.2's but gave off some awesome sound quality.
I still have a lot of analog RCA cables in like new condition just chilling. I also have a few Coax digital cables as well.Dan
My personal quest is to save to world of bad audio, one thread at a time. -
The single biggest problem with Monster ICs (especially the “higher end” ones) is the fact that they suffer from significant under-spec in their dimensions, which leads to ridiculously tight connections, and ultimately costly damage. I can’t tell you how many RCA jacks I have replaced for people over the years, due to the shields being pulled free of the gear with the interconnect cable. In every single case, it was Monster Cable. Every one. I know you can just jamb the shield back over the Jack and hope for the best, but to fix it correctly, you need a new RCA block that meets spec, and it needs to be soldered to the PCB.
I can’t tell you already hear folks saying “…you need to remove them gently, and “twist” as you pull them free…”. Yea, ok - OR, Monster could spec their ends correctly (like virtually every other cable manufacturer) so that this damage didn’t occur in the first place.“Human beings are born with different capacities. If they are free, they are not equal. And if they are equal, they are not free.”
― Aleksandr Solzhenitsyn -
^Agree 100%.
They are very tight on the ME2K Sigma Interconnects.
If one's using those rca's interconnects I highly recommend upgrading the rca jack or that's exactly what happens.
Was running rca's to my Infinity Prelude MTS's, line level connection to the sub, and pulled the sleeve right off.
Good luck with the spinning technique with those interconnects.
Why on earth did they use such gorilla grip ends on those?
Have quite a few XLR balanced ME2K Sigma interconnects but, most of my gear is vintage now and don't have the capabilities.
They are wicked nice cables, can only use them if the Krell AVS is in the system. Then, it's only from the disc spinner to the Processor. Amp & preamp I'm out of luck. -
The single biggest problem with Monster ICs (especially the “higher end” ones) is the fact that they suffer from significant under-spec in their dimensions, which leads to ridiculously tight connections, and ultimately costly damage. I can’t tell you how many RCA jacks I have replaced for people over the years, due to the shields being pulled free of the gear with the interconnect cable. In every single case, it was Monster Cable. Every one. I know you can just jamb the shield back over the Jack and hope for the best, but to fix it correctly, you need a new RCA block that meets spec, and it needs to be soldered to the PCB.
I can’t tell you already hear folks saying “…you need to remove them gently, and “twist” as you pull them free…”. Yea, ok - OR, Monster could spec their ends correctly (like virtually every other cable manufacturer) so that this damage didn’t occur in the first place.
It's actually not an issue when you know how to use them. They are unlike anything on the market that I know of. The Turbine connectors were special. When we were Monstercable dealers , we got trained on all their connections. The turbine connectors are designed to be Twisted ON and Twisted OFF. This way you never break a RCA female end. If you try to just pull them on or push them on without twisting, this is where damage can occur. Overkill? Maybe but the engineers are Monstercable said this is how we achieve a air tight seal between the RCA Male and RCA Female connector. Again overkill? Maybe. I know it works and they don't fall off when you move around your Amp or CD player. Those cables stay on.
You know one thing I miss working with Monster even over the nice banana plugs they made is the fact they use a high strand count and their cables are flexible. I'm so tired of working with solid core cables, heavy non wanting to bend HDMI cables etc. It sucks when your wiring up a rack and the cables fight you. Forget about high end power cords, they are the worse and most of the time due to the stupid weight, they can easily just fall out. I'm all out on all of it.Dan
My personal quest is to save to world of bad audio, one thread at a time. -
Why do we need an air tight seal on RCA cables again?
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Why do we need an air tight seal on RCA cables again?
According to the engineers at Monster, this keeps corrosion out and keeps a purity contact. When air gets in there, it can degrade the signal, not my words , theirs from memory.
If you ask me if that is important? Well no one else does that and I have had IC's from so many brands and Monster is the only ones who worry about such things. I guess it could be an interesting conversation?Dan
My personal quest is to save to world of bad audio, one thread at a time. -
A Monster Cable Turbine connector is a patented, high-performance connector, often 24k gold-plated, known for its unique helical or "turbine" design, providing enhanced signal transfer, corrosion resistance, and a secure, air-tight fit for audio/video interconnects, used in various Monster products from RCA cables to headphone jacks, featuring features like split-tip center pins and compression for superior performance.
These are the words from Monster on this matter, not my wordsDan
My personal quest is to save to world of bad audio, one thread at a time. -
By the way if anyone comes across any of these, I'll buy them. They are by far the very best banana plugs I have ever used to date. Sure they are TWIST design and working with cables who wind clockwise instead of like Monster counter clockwise can be slightly tricky to some, but they grip very well, they stay on and the twist makes them incredibly strong and super easy to terminate bare wire.Dan
My personal quest is to save to world of bad audio, one thread at a time. -
They probably have to be airtight, especially after you twist them off a few times and ruin the plating. I never have a problem with the furutech locking banana and RCA plugs.
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The single biggest problem with Monster ICs (especially the “higher end” ones) is the fact that they suffer from significant under-spec in their dimensions, which leads to ridiculously tight connections, and ultimately costly damage. I can’t tell you how many RCA jacks I have replaced for people over the years, due to the shields being pulled free of the gear with the interconnect cable. In every single case, it was Monster Cable. Every one. I know you can just jamb the shield back over the Jack and hope for the best, but to fix it correctly, you need a new RCA block that meets spec, and it needs to be soldered to the PCB.
I can’t tell you already hear folks saying “…you need to remove them gently, and “twist” as you pull them free…”. Yea, ok - OR, Monster could spec their ends correctly (like virtually every other cable manufacturer) so that this damage didn’t occur in the first place.
It's actually not an issue when you know how to use them. They are unlike anything on the market that I know of. The Turbine connectors were special. When we were Monstercable dealers , we got trained on all their connections. The turbine connectors are designed to be Twisted ON and Twisted OFF. This way you never break a RCA female end. If you try to just pull them on or push them on without twisting, this is where damage can occur. Overkill? Maybe but the engineers are Monstercable said this is how we achieve a air tight seal between the RCA Male and RCA Female connector. Again overkill? Maybe. I know it works and they don't fall off when you move around your Amp or CD player. Those cables stay on.
You know one thing I miss working with Monster even over the nice banana plugs they made is the fact they use a high strand count and their cables are flexible. I'm so tired of working with solid core cables, heavy non wanting to bend HDMI cables etc. It sucks when your wiring up a rack and the cables fight you. Forget about high end power cords, they are the worse and most of the time due to the stupid weight, they can easily just fall out. I'm all out on all of it.
If your design requires you to train people on how to use your RCA cables so that they don’t damage their equipment, then I submit that your design is the problem.
I have used RCA cables from AQ, Kimber, MIT, Signal, Doug’s, and yes, Monster (and others too, I’m sure). I have NEVER experienced an RCA cable “fall off” when moving my equipment around. Perhaps though, that’s because I tend to unhook cables when I move gear around. That said, if I WERE to move gear around with cables attached, I’d much rather have them “fall off” than rip the connector shield off the RCA Jack…Why do we need an air tight seal on RCA cables again?
According to the engineers at Monster, this keeps corrosion out and keeps a purity contact. When air gets in there, it can degrade the signal, not my words , theirs from memory.
If you ask me if that is important? Well no one else does that and I have had IC's from so many brands and Monster is the only ones who worry about such things. I guess it could be an interesting conversation?
Corrosion? On 24k gold plated connections? Further, no matter how tight the RCA fits, I seriously doubt you could ever approach “air tight”.
Look - I know you’re defending Monster because of your background, and I get it - I remember wading through all the dealer hype about Monster back in the day - and yea, it worked on me in my early days in the hobby. I still have a tote full of monster stuff, and my front 3 HT speakers are wired with the “Z series” (I think?). I’m not saying that Monster is necessarily bad - but the tightness of their RCA cables is a known issue, and blaming the consumer is at the very least lazy…
“Human beings are born with different capacities. If they are free, they are not equal. And if they are equal, they are not free.”
― Aleksandr Solzhenitsyn -
By the way if anyone comes across any of these, I'll buy them. They are by far the very best banana plugs I have ever used to date. Sure they are TWIST design and working with cables who wind clockwise instead of like Monster counter clockwise can be slightly tricky to some, but they grip very well, they stay on and the twist makes them incredibly strong and super easy to terminate bare wire.
I think I have some of these floating around in the bottom of one of my totes - BUT, I know that the rubber insulators are probably shot (they tended to degrade over time). Are you interested in just the metal bananas?“Human beings are born with different capacities. If they are free, they are not equal. And if they are equal, they are not free.”
― Aleksandr Solzhenitsyn -
Mantis, which "Bryn Mawr then Tweeter" were you at? I used to frequent the ones in Townson, Dundalk and Columbia MD. My RTA11TLs came from the one on Reisterstown Rd but I think that was the only time.Stan
Main 2ch:
Polk LSi15 (DB840 upgrade), Parasound: P/LD-1100, HCA-1000A; Denon: DVD-2910, DRM-800A; Benchmark DAC1, Monster HTS3600-MKII, Grado SR-225i; Technics SL-J2, Parasound PPH-100.
HT:
Marantz SR7010, Polk: RTA11TL (RDO198-1, XO and Damping Upgrades), S4, CS250, PSW110 , Marantz UD5005, Pioneer PL-530, Panasonic TC-P42S60
Other stuff:
Denon: DRA-835R, AVR-888, DCD-660, DRM-700A, DRR-780; Polk: S8, Monitor 5A, 5B, TSi100, RM7, PSW10 (DXi104 upgrade); Pioneer: CT-6R; Onkyo CP-1046F; Ortofon OM5E, Marantz: PM5004, CD5004, CDR-615; Parasound C/PT-600, HCA-800ii, Sony CDP-650ESD, Technics SA 5070, B&W DM601 -
This is what I found in my tote - they’re yours if you want them…. Shoot me a PM…
“Human beings are born with different capacities. If they are free, they are not equal. And if they are equal, they are not free.”
― Aleksandr Solzhenitsyn
