New Internal Wiring for 3.1TL's

After enjoying the results of a rewire in the 2.3TL's, I decided to give the 3.1's the same treatment. I used 13 ga. Supra Rondo.

7dx6ytg6wzqr.jpg

I went against Polks original color choice and instead utilized 'Mike Color Choices' :) Red for Positive, Black for Negative. Ordered a few feet extra and made up some Jumpers as well.

yx974hyejrpm.jpg

Putting them all back together and going to let the new wire 'settle in' for a bit before giving them a proper listen.





Comments

  • soupbone
    soupbone Posts: 104
    Looking forward to hear how this works out Mike.
  • pitdogg2
    pitdogg2 Posts: 24,477
    Nice Mike! I did the same when I rewired my 2.3tl's with DH Labs 14ga. Silver plated OCC copper. Red + Black-
  • JayCee
    JayCee Posts: 1,474
    soupbone wrote: »
    Looking forward to hear how this works out Mike.

    Likewise. Have upgraded multiple sets of speakers but the one thing I've never done is internal wire and would be the finishing touch on my 1.2tl's (owned since 2010'ish). I also have a new to me pair of 3.1tl's that I just worked over the XO's, dynamat, BH5, etc. and am waiting on the last 2 inductors that were backordered. Mike, what was the total length of wire for the 3.1's?
    Speakers: Polk1.2tl's (Uber Mods) Pre/Amp/DAC: PS Audio BHK Signature & 250, DirectStream Cables/IC's: MIT S1Bi-Wire/S1 Balanced +Avel Lindberg 1000VA "Dreadnought" Power Conditioner: PS Audio P15 Power Plant Power Cords: Core Power Technologies Gold, DH Labs Power Plus DIY w/Neotech NC-P301 & P311ends Streaming: Roon ROCK on wifi'd NUC, TP-Link WAP, & Uptone EtherREGEN, AfterDark, Emperor Double Crown Clock, Black Modernize LPS, PS Audio AirLens⟿Ω☯☥☮⟿🔊♩♪♫♬♩♪♫♬♩♪♫♬
  • Mike Reeter
    Mike Reeter Posts: 4,314
    soupbone wrote: »
    Looking forward to hear how this works out Mike.

    I can tell you now, it's a worthwhile improvement. The Stock Wire is around thirty years old, I believe it needs to be refreshed along with the x-overs, and Binding Posts, etc.
    pitdogg2 wrote: »
    Nice Mike! I did the same when I rewired my 2.3tl's with DH Labs 14ga. Silver plated OCC copper. Red + Black-

    Yes, Your Thread, machones, and others that have upgraded Internal Wiring prompted me to perform this on my 2.3TL's. The difference is quite notable, the 3.1's are liking the fresh wire as well.


    JayCee wrote: »
    soupbone wrote: »
    Looking forward to hear how this works out Mike.

    Likewise. Have upgraded multiple sets of speakers but the one thing I've never done is internal wire and would be the finishing touch on my 1.2tl's (owned since 2010'ish). I also have a new to me pair of 3.1tl's that I just worked over the XO's, dynamat, BH5, etc. and am waiting on the last 2 inductors that were backordered. Mike, what was the total length of wire for the 3.1's?

    For the 3.1TL's I purchased 34' total of Supra Rondo 2x25mm from Madisound, this gave me 68' of total wire. But, I ordered about 4' extra to make up some jumpers as well. So, just for the speakers around 30' should do it.

    I'm not positively for sure, but I think Polk originally used a higher caliber wire in the 1.2TL's. Some Cardas, maybe?

    I'm sure someone knows for a fact.

  • pitdogg2
    pitdogg2 Posts: 24,477

    I'm not positively for sure, but I think Polk originally used a higher caliber wire in the 1.2TL's. Some Cardas, maybe?

    I'm sure someone knows for a fact.

    Yea They (1.2) were different but to my eyes it just looked like some standard clear jacketed rope lay wire. I do not think they were Cardas as that would have required extra work since most Cardas I'm aware of has enamel coating on all the strands that would require removal or a solder pot. The quick connects would not crimp very well to that soldered end.

    Yes I'd like to know as well as I have not seen the chassis wire for them up close and personal.

  • JayCee
    JayCee Posts: 1,474
    edited January 2020
    Appreciate the lengths! First I've seen mention of Cardas as OE. I believe, sans searching, DK upgraded to Cardas? Kind of recall him using a soldering pot and/or scraping individual wires? In any case, my binding posts are Cardas. Glad to see you both experience positive results with the DH Labs and Supra Rondo. Have inquired re. wire a while ago and now am motivated to readdress and get me read on. Thanks, gents.

    ....edit to add: Found it, DK upgraded to Cardas Litz back in 2013. As per a DK production, detailed and informative. ;)https://forum.polkaudio.com/discussion/139282/cardas-internal-wire-replacement-for-the-sda-srs-1-2tl/p1
    Speakers: Polk1.2tl's (Uber Mods) Pre/Amp/DAC: PS Audio BHK Signature & 250, DirectStream Cables/IC's: MIT S1Bi-Wire/S1 Balanced +Avel Lindberg 1000VA "Dreadnought" Power Conditioner: PS Audio P15 Power Plant Power Cords: Core Power Technologies Gold, DH Labs Power Plus DIY w/Neotech NC-P301 & P311ends Streaming: Roon ROCK on wifi'd NUC, TP-Link WAP, & Uptone EtherREGEN, AfterDark, Emperor Double Crown Clock, Black Modernize LPS, PS Audio AirLens⟿Ω☯☥☮⟿🔊♩♪♫♬♩♪♫♬♩♪♫♬
  • Mike Reeter
    Mike Reeter Posts: 4,314
    JayCee wrote: »
    Appreciate the lengths! First I've seen mention of Cardas as OE. I believe, sans searching, DK upgraded to Cardas? Kind of recall him using a soldering pot and/or scraping individual wires? In any case, my binding posts are Cardas. Glad to see you both experience positive results with the DH Labs and Supra Rondo. Have inquired re. wire a while ago and now am motivated to readdress and get me read on. Thanks, gents.

    ....edit to add: Found it, DK upgraded to Cardas Litz back in 2013. As per a DK production, detailed and informative. ;)https://forum.polkaudio.com/discussion/139282/cardas-internal-wire-replacement-for-the-sda-srs-1-2tl/p1

    I was close :D as in Hand Grenades

  • GlennDog
    GlennDog Posts: 3,084
    Lots of new kit at the Reeter household . . . Rock on, bother! 🥳
    AC Regenerator PS Audio PerfectWave Power Plant 10
    Source Lumin U1 Mini into Lampi Baltic 4
    Pre Cary SLP-05
    Power Rogue M180 Dark monos
    Mains Salk HT2-TL
    Rythmik F12
  • Mike Reeter
    Mike Reeter Posts: 4,314
    GlennDog wrote: »
    Lots of new kit at the Reeter household . . . Rock on, bother! 🥳

    I'm doin' just that :D The Amber and the new Transport are more than likely going to be all the new 'kit' that I come by this year.

    I've spent a little time working on the SDAs as of late, Winter Projects that keep me outta the Bars :D

  • F1nut
    F1nut Posts: 49,708
    Polk never used Cardas wire. The stuff in the SDA SRS is clear jacketed copper of an unknown source.
    Political Correctness'.........defined

    "A doctrine fostered by a delusional, illogical minority and rabidly promoted by an unscrupulous mainstream media, which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible to pick up a t-u-r-d by the clean end."


    President of Club Polk

  • verb
    verb Posts: 10,176
    Nice job Mike! :smile:
    Basement: Polk SDA SRS 1.2tl's, Cary SLP-05 Pre with ultimate upgrade,McIntosh MCD301 CD/SACD player, Northstar Designs Excelsio DAC, Cambridge 851N streamer, McIntosh MC300 Amp, Silnote Morpheus Ref2, Series2 Digital Cables, Silnote Morpheus Ref2 Series2 XLR's, Furman 15PFi Power Conditioner, Pangea Power Cables, MIT Shotgun S3 IC's, MIT Shotgun S1 Bi-Wire speaker cables
    Office: PC, EAR Acute CD Player, EAR 834L Pre, Northstar Designs Intenso DAC, Antique Sound Labs AV8 Monoblocks, Denon UDR-F10 Cassette, Acoustic Technologies Classic FR Speakers, SVS SB12 Plus sub, MIT AVt2 speaker cables, IFI Purifier2, AQ Cinnamon USB cable, Groneberg Quatro Reference IC's
    Spare Room: Dayens Ampino Integrated Amp, Tjoeb 99 tube CD player (modified Marantz CD-38), Analysis Plus Oval 9's, Zu Jumpers, AudioEngine B1 Streamer, Klipsch RB-61 v2, SVS PB1000 sub, Blue Jeans RCA IC's, Shunyata Hydra 8 Power Conditioner
    Living Room: Peachtree Nova Integrated, Cambridge CXN v2 Streamer, Rotel RCD-1072 CD player, Furman 15PFi Power Conditioner, Polk RT265 In Wall Speakers, Polk DSW Pro 660wi sub
    Garage #1: Cambridge Audio 640A Integrated Amp, Project Box-E BT Streamer, Polk Tsi200 Bookies, Douglas Speaker Cables, Shunyata Power Conditioner
    Garage #2: Cambridge Audio EVO150 Integrated Amplifier, Polk L200's, Analysis Plus Silver Oval 2 Speaker Cables, IC's TBD.
  • westmassguy
    westmassguy Posts: 6,850
    Nice work Mike!
    Home Theater/2 Channel:
    Front: SDA-2ATL forum.polkaudio.com/discussion/143984/my-2as-finally-finished-almost/p1
    Center: Custom Built forum.polkaudio.com/discussion/150760/my-center-channel-project/p1
    Surrounds & Rears: Custom Built forum.polkaudio.com/discussion/151647/my-surround-project/p1
    Sonicaps, Mills, RDO-194s-198s, Dynamat, Hurricane Nuts, Blackhole5
    Pioneer Elite VSX-72TXV, Carver PM-600, SVS PB2-Plus Subwoofer

    dhsspeakerservice.com/
  • Mike Reeter
    Mike Reeter Posts: 4,314
    Nice work Mike!

    Thanks David! I leave the complicated work to those like you that 'know what their doing' :D

  • machone
    machone Posts: 1,471
    It looks great.
    Mojo Audio Illuminati v3>>Quantum Byte w/LMS>>Rpi/PiCoreplayer>> Starlight 7 USB >> Mojo Audio Mystique v2 SE>>ModWright SWL 9.0 SE Signature>>Hafler DH-500 Amp+ (Musical Concepts Fully Modded)>>
    SRS 2.3TL (Fully Modded)...Velodyne Optimum 8 subwoofer
    1KVA Dreadnought

    Marantz SA 8005
    Pioneer PLX-1000 Turntable - Shure SC35C/N35X - V15III/VN35HE
    Yamaha TX-540 Tuner...Sony BDP-S570
    Sony PS4

    Separate subpanel with four dedicated 20 amp circuits.
    1. Amplification 2. Analog 3. Digital 4. Video

    "All THAT IS LOST FROM THE SOURCE IS LOST FOREVER"
  • Mike Reeter
    Mike Reeter Posts: 4,314
    verb wrote: »
    Nice job Mike! :smile:

    Thanks, A Rewarding Project that won't break the Bank.
    machone wrote: »
    It looks great.

    Thanks man, you and others prompted this Tweak some time ago, the 3.1's have responded rather nicely.

  • Gardenstater
    Gardenstater Posts: 4,136
    @Mike Reeter Very nice work indeed. I see that Supra Cables claims that the tin plating over the 5N OFC Copper (nice) reduces the chances of electrons making the strand to strand jump......hmmm.

    Is this the stuff you used.......Supra RONDO 2x2.5mm Speaker Wire per foot (13 AWG).
    I already ordered Neotech OCC 12 ga for my midbass driver, 15.5 ga. Cardas Litz for the tweeter circuits, and 11.5 ga. Cardas Litz for the binding post to crossover and enough of that to make a swapout for the Neotech to see which sounds better, for re-wiring my 7Bs which is much less of a hard job than what you had:

    https://www.madisoundspeakerstore.com/speaker-wire/supra-rondo-2x2.5mm-speaker-wire-per-foot-13-awg/

    wapby85bb2pg.png
    George / NJ

    Polk 7B main speakers, std. mods+ (1979, orig owner)
    Martin Logan Dynamo sub w/6ft 14awg Power Cord
    Crown D150 amp
    Logitech Squeezebox Touch Streamer w/EDO applet
    iFi nano iDSD DAC
    iPurifier3
    iDefender w/ iPower PS
    Custom Steve Wilson 1m UPOCC Interconnect
    iFi Mercury 0.5m OFHC continuous cast copper USB cable
    Custom Ribbon Speaker Cables, 5ft long, 4N Copper, 14awg, ultra low inductance
    Custom Vibration Isolation Speaker Stands and Sub Platform
  • Mike Reeter
    Mike Reeter Posts: 4,314
    @Mike Reeter Very nice work indeed. I see that Supra Cables claims that the tin plating over the 5N OFC Copper (nice) reduces the chances of electrons making the strand to strand jump......hmmm.

    Is this the stuff you used.......Supra RONDO 2x2.5mm Speaker Wire per foot (13 AWG).
    I already ordered Neotech OCC 12 ga for my midbass driver, 15.5 ga. Cardas Litz for the tweeter circuits, and 11.5 ga. Cardas Litz for the binding post to crossover and enough of that to make a swapout for the Neotech to see which sounds better, for re-wiring my 7Bs which is much less of a hard job than what you had:

    https://www.madisoundspeakerstore.com/speaker-wire/supra-rondo-2x2.5mm-speaker-wire-per-foot-13-awg/

    wapby85bb2pg.png

    Yes, this is the wire that I used for both the 2.3TL's and the 3.1's. It is very easy to work with and has a 'smooth' sonic signature to it. I used the same wire throughout, including Jumpers.

    Trey "VR3" has used this wire for quite some time I believe, I think Larry "Toolfan" has used this wire as well in his Supreme 1.2TL's as well.

    I figured if these guys were happy with it, it would work for me. And, it certainly does.

    A little less expensive here https://www.ebay.com/itm/SUPRA-Rondo-4x2-5-by-the-meter-for-DIY-BI-WIRE-or-BI-AMP-What-HiFi-BEST-BUY/151370352553?hash=item233e6047a9:g:~~wAAMXQxKxR84BL plus you get some White/Light Grey also.


  • VR3
    VR3 Posts: 27,968
    The rondo series is fantastic for internal wiring. Easy to work with, flexible, won't oxidize, sounds great, easy to solder, can't beat it
    - Not Tom ::::::: Any system can play Diana Krall. Only the best can play Limp Bizkit.
  • pkquat
    pkquat Posts: 742
    What are the thoughts on Supra Classic (13, 11, 9Ga) vs. Rondo?
  • Mike Reeter
    Mike Reeter Posts: 4,314
    I can't help you out as I've never tried the Classic wire. VR3 might chime in, I'm sure he has experience with both.

    Or, you might just give Madisound a call. They answer the phone and are very helpful.
  • VR3
    VR3 Posts: 27,968
    The classic series is ok but the jacket does not hold up well to soldering
    - Not Tom ::::::: Any system can play Diana Krall. Only the best can play Limp Bizkit.
  • headrott
    headrott Posts: 5,484
    edited January 2020
    soupbone wrote: »
    Looking forward to hear how this works out Mike.

    I can tell you now, it's a worthwhile improvement. The Stock Wire is around thirty years old, I believe it needs to be refreshed along with the x-overs, and Binding Posts, etc.
    pitdogg2 wrote: »
    Nice Mike! I did the same when I rewired my 2.3tl's with DH Labs 14ga. Silver plated OCC copper. Red + Black-

    Yes, Your Thread, machones, and others that have upgraded Internal Wiring prompted me to perform this on my 2.3TL's. The difference is quite notable, the 3.1's are liking the fresh wire as well.


    JayCee wrote: »
    soupbone wrote: »
    Looking forward to hear how this works out Mike.

    Likewise. Have upgraded multiple sets of speakers but the one thing I've never done is internal wire and would be the finishing touch on my 1.2tl's (owned since 2010'ish). I also have a new to me pair of 3.1tl's that I just worked over the XO's, dynamat, BH5, etc. and am waiting on the last 2 inductors that were backordered. Mike, what was the total length of wire for the 3.1's?

    For the 3.1TL's I purchased 34' total of Supra Rondo 2x25mm from Madisound, this gave me 68' of total wire. But, I ordered about 4' extra to make up some jumpers as well. So, just for the speakers around 30' should do it.

    I'm not positively for sure, but I think Polk originally used a higher caliber wire in the 1.2TL's. Some Cardas, maybe?

    I'm sure someone knows for a fact.

    Mike, do you remember the total length for the 2.3TL's? I am going to do the internal wiring for mine, and thought you may remember the total length for the 2.3TL's, since you have done yours. I have used the Supra cable in the past to make an interconnect cable for my 2B's, so I know somewhat what it sounds like.

    Great job on the 3.1TL re-wiring! I may redo mine one day, but wil definitely start with my 2.3TL's.

    Thanks for your help Mike.
    Relayer-Big-O-Poster.jpg
    Taken from a recent Audioholics reply regarding "Club Polk" and Polk speakers:
    "I'm yet to hear a Polk speaker that merits more than a sentence and 60 seconds discussion." :\
    My response is: If you need 60 seconds to respond in one sentence, you probably should't be evaluating Polk speakers.....


    "Green leaves reveal the heart spoken Khatru"- Jon Anderson

    "Have A Little Faith! And Everything You'll Face, Will Jump From Out Right On Into Place! Yeah! Take A Little Time! And Everything You'll Find, Will Move From Gloom Right On Into Shine!"- Arthur Lee
  • Mike Reeter
    Mike Reeter Posts: 4,314
    edited January 2020
    headrott wrote: »
    soupbone wrote: »
    Looking forward to hear how this works out Mike.

    I can tell you now, it's a worthwhile improvement. The Stock Wire is around thirty years old, I believe it needs to be refreshed along with the x-overs, and Binding Posts, etc.
    pitdogg2 wrote: »
    Nice Mike! I did the same when I rewired my 2.3tl's with DH Labs 14ga. Silver plated OCC copper. Red + Black-

    Yes, Your Thread, machones, and others that have upgraded Internal Wiring prompted me to perform this on my 2.3TL's. The difference is quite notable, the 3.1's are liking the fresh wire as well.


    JayCee wrote: »
    soupbone wrote: »
    Looking forward to hear how this works out Mike.

    Likewise. Have upgraded multiple sets of speakers but the one thing I've never done is internal wire and would be the finishing touch on my 1.2tl's (owned since 2010'ish). I also have a new to me pair of 3.1tl's that I just worked over the XO's, dynamat, BH5, etc. and am waiting on the last 2 inductors that were backordered. Mike, what was the total length of wire for the 3.1's?

    For the 3.1TL's I purchased 34' total of Supra Rondo 2x25mm from Madisound, this gave me 68' of total wire. But, I ordered about 4' extra to make up some jumpers as well. So, just for the speakers around 30' should do it.

    I'm not positively for sure, but I think Polk originally used a higher caliber wire in the 1.2TL's. Some Cardas, maybe?

    I'm sure someone knows for a fact.

    Mike, do you remember the total length for the 2.3TL's? I am going to do the internal wiring for mine, and thought you may remember the total length for the 2.3TL's, since you have done yours. I have used the Supra cable in the past to make an interconnect cable for my 2B's, so I know somewhat what it sounds like.

    Great job on the 3.1TL re-wiring! I may redo mine one day, but wil definitely start with my 2.3TL's.

    Thanks for your help Mike.

    I don't remember for sure, I'll have to search for an Invoice or Payment and see what I can come up with.

    pitgogg2 and machine have both rewired their 2.3TL's also, maybe one of them might remember and chime in.

    **edit** Found this in an old thread
    November 2017
    pitdogg2 wrote: »
    Thanks did you use the ohno or ofc?

    OFC
    It took 15 meters to do the 2.3TL's.

    It takes more wire than you would think.

    A good thread that has a lot of good info https://forum.polkaudio.com/discussion/182947/cardas-litz-internal-re-wire-for-2-3tl

    Post edited by Mike Reeter on
  • headrott
    headrott Posts: 5,484
    Thank you again Mike! Great information!
    Relayer-Big-O-Poster.jpg
    Taken from a recent Audioholics reply regarding "Club Polk" and Polk speakers:
    "I'm yet to hear a Polk speaker that merits more than a sentence and 60 seconds discussion." :\
    My response is: If you need 60 seconds to respond in one sentence, you probably should't be evaluating Polk speakers.....


    "Green leaves reveal the heart spoken Khatru"- Jon Anderson

    "Have A Little Faith! And Everything You'll Face, Will Jump From Out Right On Into Place! Yeah! Take A Little Time! And Everything You'll Find, Will Move From Gloom Right On Into Shine!"- Arthur Lee