Dreadnaught build question

2

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  • Schurkey wrote: »
    I looked around on the A-L web site, and did not confirm that the secondary windings are a different gauge wire from the primary...but I'm sure that's true, too.

    The primary and secondary wire gauges sizes are definitely different on the 800V that I bought a few years ago. Just don't recall which was thicker.

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  • Viking64
    Viking64 Posts: 6,646
    edited December 2017
    The primary and secondary wire gauges sizes are definitely different on the 800V that I bought a few years ago. Just don't recall which was thicker.
    On my 800VA, the blue/gray/violet/brown are thicker than the black/red/orange/yellow. The first set (thicker) says "2 x 115v" on the label. The thinner wires have 2 @ 0 volts and 2 @ 115V.

    qjji8mq6l8gt.jpg

    Post edited by Viking64 on
  • I personally could careless if my 1000V Dreadnought is a true 1:1 ratio per say or not. It works and sounds great, definitely better then the AI-1 Polk made.

    I use different length wires since mine sits by one speaker. Using DK's test results I choose to use the shorter wire on the side that tested out to have the minuet lower test result and the longer wire on the side that tested higher.

    It's sounds great to me, that's what matters.

    Unless someone can come up with a better design this is as good as it gets. Why argue about tech specs when the performance results speak for themselves.

    Jealousy possibly... Hard to say. If you don't like it design a better wheel.
    "Make a man a fire and he'll be warm for a day. Light
    a man on fire and he'll be warm for the rest of his life."


  • westmassguy
    westmassguy Posts: 6,850
    Viking64 wrote: »
    The primary and secondary wire gauges sizes are definitely different on the 800V that I bought a few years ago. Just don't recall which was thicker.
    On my 800VA, the blue/gray/violet/brown are thicker than the black/red/orange/yellow. The first set (thicker) says "2 x 115v" on the label. The thinner wires have 2 @ 0 volts and 2 @ 115V.

    qjji8mq6l8gt.jpg

    Looks strangely familiar................
    Home Theater/2 Channel:
    Front: SDA-2ATL forum.polkaudio.com/discussion/143984/my-2as-finally-finished-almost/p1
    Center: Custom Built forum.polkaudio.com/discussion/150760/my-center-channel-project/p1
    Surrounds & Rears: Custom Built forum.polkaudio.com/discussion/151647/my-surround-project/p1
    Sonicaps, Mills, RDO-194s-198s, Dynamat, Hurricane Nuts, Blackhole5
    Pioneer Elite VSX-72TXV, Carver PM-600, SVS PB2-Plus Subwoofer

    dhsspeakerservice.com/
  • pitdogg2
    pitdogg2 Posts: 24,477
    More residual's Dave hehe
  • 3. The case I use, which you probably saw in one of the threads, is Cast Aluminum. Aluminum is great for RF shielding. The Copper adds EMI shielding, which is different. The Copper Foil MUST be separated from the Aluminum by etching primer and several top coats of Enamel. Galvanic corrosion will result if you don't.

    In what situation does shielding the transformer from stray RF matter? I've got my transformer in a steel case (plenty magnetic). It sits in a cabinet close to the floor while all the other components are about 3 feet up from that. Is it interference from the other components that is the problem or just ambient RF from nearby transmission towers or something like that?

    I haven't ever noticed any hum or anything like that. (As an aside, I had a "high-bandwidth" amp once that I could swear would hum differently depending on where it was in the house.) I'm pretty sure I've asked this question before and been told that extra shielding from aluminum is of dubious value, but seems like aluminum is all the rage now.
  • F1nut
    F1nut Posts: 49,708
    It is absolutely not of dubious value.
    Political Correctness'.........defined

    "A doctrine fostered by a delusional, illogical minority and rabidly promoted by an unscrupulous mainstream media, which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible to pick up a t-u-r-d by the clean end."


    President of Club Polk

  • westmassguy
    westmassguy Posts: 6,850
    edited January 2018
    3. The case I use, which you probably saw in one of the threads, is Cast Aluminum. Aluminum is great for RF shielding. The Copper adds EMI shielding, which is different. The Copper Foil MUST be separated from the Aluminum by etching primer and several top coats of Enamel. Galvanic corrosion will result if you don't.

    In what situation does shielding the transformer from stray RF matter? I've got my transformer in a steel case (plenty magnetic). It sits in a cabinet close to the floor while all the other components are about 3 feet up from that. Is it interference from the other components that is the problem or just ambient RF from nearby transmission towers or something like that?

    I haven't ever noticed any hum or anything like that. (As an aside, I had a "high-bandwidth" amp once that I could swear would hum differently depending on where it was in the house.) I'm pretty sure I've asked this question before and been told that extra shielding from aluminum is of dubious value, but seems like aluminum is all the rage now.
    A guy way smarter than me confirmed the advantages of a shielded enclosure:
    http://forum.polkaudio.com/discussion/74472/the-ai-1-dreadnought-project-pt-1/p1
    Home Theater/2 Channel:
    Front: SDA-2ATL forum.polkaudio.com/discussion/143984/my-2as-finally-finished-almost/p1
    Center: Custom Built forum.polkaudio.com/discussion/150760/my-center-channel-project/p1
    Surrounds & Rears: Custom Built forum.polkaudio.com/discussion/151647/my-surround-project/p1
    Sonicaps, Mills, RDO-194s-198s, Dynamat, Hurricane Nuts, Blackhole5
    Pioneer Elite VSX-72TXV, Carver PM-600, SVS PB2-Plus Subwoofer

    dhsspeakerservice.com/
  • westmassguy
    westmassguy Posts: 6,850
    F1nut wrote: »
    It is absolutely not of dubious value.
    Baked Potato?
    Home Theater/2 Channel:
    Front: SDA-2ATL forum.polkaudio.com/discussion/143984/my-2as-finally-finished-almost/p1
    Center: Custom Built forum.polkaudio.com/discussion/150760/my-center-channel-project/p1
    Surrounds & Rears: Custom Built forum.polkaudio.com/discussion/151647/my-surround-project/p1
    Sonicaps, Mills, RDO-194s-198s, Dynamat, Hurricane Nuts, Blackhole5
    Pioneer Elite VSX-72TXV, Carver PM-600, SVS PB2-Plus Subwoofer

    dhsspeakerservice.com/
  • Viking64
    Viking64 Posts: 6,646
  • westmassguy
    westmassguy Posts: 6,850
    Viking64 wrote: »
    Baked Potato?

    yl2xhdzknrxe.jpg

    Pugtastic!
    Home Theater/2 Channel:
    Front: SDA-2ATL forum.polkaudio.com/discussion/143984/my-2as-finally-finished-almost/p1
    Center: Custom Built forum.polkaudio.com/discussion/150760/my-center-channel-project/p1
    Surrounds & Rears: Custom Built forum.polkaudio.com/discussion/151647/my-surround-project/p1
    Sonicaps, Mills, RDO-194s-198s, Dynamat, Hurricane Nuts, Blackhole5
    Pioneer Elite VSX-72TXV, Carver PM-600, SVS PB2-Plus Subwoofer

    dhsspeakerservice.com/
  • VSAT88
    VSAT88 Posts: 1,226
    Same subject different question. I have a 115/120 VAC Isolation transformer from an old combo veriac/isolation transformer. Would that be OK to use ? Even if it were not an A/L would it make a good experiment ?
  • Schurkey
    Schurkey Posts: 2,100
    Will it pass 5+ amps without saturating? If so, it's worth a try.
  • F1nut
    F1nut Posts: 49,708
    There are numerous isolation transformers out there, but few are audio grade.
    Political Correctness'.........defined

    "A doctrine fostered by a delusional, illogical minority and rabidly promoted by an unscrupulous mainstream media, which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible to pick up a t-u-r-d by the clean end."


    President of Club Polk

  • VSAT88
    VSAT88 Posts: 1,226
    F1nut wrote: »
    There are numerous isolation transformers out there, but few are audio grade.

    Thanks.
  • F1nut wrote: »
    It is absolutely not of dubious value.

    <Laughing at self for being a dum bass> My bad for taking the word of the guy I got the case from.
    A guy way smarter than me confirmed the advantages of a shielded enclosure:
    http://forum.polkaudio.com/discussion/74472/the-ai-1-dreadnought-project-pt-1/p1

    Thank you for the link! That thread looks familiar, but I'm sure I glazed over before getting down to the spot with the measurements after the transformer was in the aluminum enclosure. Sounds like whenever I get around to my next batch of 2B upgrades it'll be time to move to the Neutriks since I need a new box anyway. Till then maybe I'll buy some heavy duty aluminum foil and make an AV-1000 sized baked potato.


  • audioluvr
    audioluvr Posts: 5,420
    edited February 2018
    Well, got ' er done!

    1dkep9j46j4h.jpeg

    Thank you @DarqueKnight for the science experiment that created the dreadnaught!
    Thanks also to @westmassguy, @f1nut and all the other member here who provided invaluable information on building my rediculously Ghetto version. Might be the vodka talking but you guys ROCK!

    My case was created out of an old GE aluminum meter box i cut down. I lined the inside with bed liner, then copper tape, wrapped the 800 va transformer with dynomat (probably totally unnecessary), then covered the outside of the box with aluminum tape for that polished look.

    This journey was part total PITA/ part fun I'm sure I will be happy with the end results . Now if i can only get my crossovers back from DHS...
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    Harman Kardon T65C w/Grado Gold. (Don't laugh. It sounds great!)


    There is about a 5% genetic difference between apes and men …but that difference is the difference between throwing your own poo when you are annoyed …and Einstein, Shakespeare and Miss January. by Dr. Sardonicus
  • Schurkey
    Schurkey Posts: 2,100
    audioluvr wrote: »
    Thanks also to... ...all the other member here who provided invaluable information on building my rediculously Ghetto version.
    You've got nothing to be ashamed of.

    JUST WAIT until I finish mine. You guys "ain't seen nothin' yet" in terms of creative re-purposing of goofy old enclosures.

    No promises in terms of completion date...it's been two years and counting.
  • FestYboy
    FestYboy Posts: 3,861
    With cans on, I used to be able to hear a < .5dB shift, but sitting in a room with all the reflections, you'd never hear any shift at the levels you're talking.
  • audioluvr
    audioluvr Posts: 5,420
    After 30 years of being around heavy equipment and loud music I'm not sure I'd be able to hear a 5db difference...
    Gustard X26 Pro DAC
    Belles 21A Pre modded with Mundorf Supreme caps
    B&K M200 Sonata monoblocks refreshed and upgraded
    Polk SDA 1C's modded / 1000Va Dreadnaught
    Wireworld Silver Eclipse IC's and speaker cables
    Harman Kardon T65C w/Grado Gold. (Don't laugh. It sounds great!)


    There is about a 5% genetic difference between apes and men …but that difference is the difference between throwing your own poo when you are annoyed …and Einstein, Shakespeare and Miss January. by Dr. Sardonicus
  • Gerres26
    Gerres26 Posts: 859
    I started ordering some parts for my Dreadnought build today. I couldn't put it off any longer. I have a question though, what are you guys using to terminate the transformer wires to the back of the speakon connectors inside the enclosure? I've been reading through basically all of the old threads but didn't see it mentioned.
  • pitdogg2
    pitdogg2 Posts: 24,477
    edited February 2018

    IIRC
    Some use quick connects and some have soldered direct.

    Personally I'd be in the gold plated quick connects camp.
  • F1nut
    F1nut Posts: 49,708
    You're twisting two wires together for each connection, fastons are the way to go.
    Political Correctness'.........defined

    "A doctrine fostered by a delusional, illogical minority and rabidly promoted by an unscrupulous mainstream media, which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible to pick up a t-u-r-d by the clean end."


    President of Club Polk

  • Viking64
    Viking64 Posts: 6,646
    If you add jumpers between the +1 and +2 and the -1 and -2 contacts, you can use a 4-conductor wire for your interconnect cable.
  • Gerres26
    Gerres26 Posts: 859
    F1nut wrote: »
    You're twisting two wires together for each connection, fastons are the way to go.

    Which fastons and where is the best place to buy? Do you recommend using the same thing for the wires in the speaker cabinet or solder those since it is just one wire each?
  • RandyCroissant
    RandyCroissant Posts: 475
    edited February 2018
    I use gold plated copper fastons available at Autozone
    Post edited by RandyCroissant on
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    Wish list SVS sub

  • vcwatkins
    vcwatkins Posts: 1,993
    I believe this is what I used, but I was ordering other parts at the time so shipping cost was not an issue.
    https://parts-express.com/gold-12-awg-1-4-female-disconnect-5-pair--095-810

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  • Gerres26
    Gerres26 Posts: 859
    Did you use them for the connection to the neutrik inside the speaker as well? ...also, i was thinking of using canare 4s11 cable for my new interconnect cable since thats what my speaker cables are made from, what gauge should i use for this? I believe i ordered the neutrik connector with the screw down terminal.
  • pitdogg2
    pitdogg2 Posts: 24,477
    Gerres26 wrote: »
    Did you use them for the connection to the neutrik inside the speaker as well? ...also, i was thinking of using canare 4s11 cable for my new interconnect cable since thats what my speaker cables are made from, what gauge should i use for this? I believe i ordered the neutrik connector with the screw down terminal.

    Not all the Neutrik's are air tight. If these are on the speaker make sure they are.
    Canare 4s11 is only one gauge, so use it. The smaller gauges are 4s6 and 4s8 i believe. Go with the 4s11 and twist 2 of the 4 wires together.