Group Buy '16: Dreadnought Avel Lindberg 1000VA Isolation Transformers

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  • heiney9
    heiney9 Posts: 25,699
    edited January 2017
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    I followed Jesse's well written write up on the 4 pole Neutrik install on my dreadnaught and cup. If I can do it and get it right you can rest assured that anyone can do it. As others have mentioned Neutrik is the only way to go on both the terminal cup and the case.

    Where is the write-up, that's what I'm asking for? Why 4 pole and not 2?

    H9

    "Appreciation of audio is a completely subjective human experience. Measurements can provide a measure of insight, but are no substitute for human judgment. Why are we looking to reduce a subjective experience to objective criteria anyway? The subtleties of music and audio reproduction are for those who appreciate it. Differentiation by numbers is for those who do not".--Nelson Pass Pass Labs XA25 | Galion TS P75 Pre | Holo Audio Cyan 2 Dac | MIT Shotgun S1 | Puritan Audio PSM136 Pwr Condtioner & Classic PC's | Legend L600 | Roon Nucleus 1 w/LPS - Tubes add soul!
  • heiney9
    heiney9 Posts: 25,699
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    I'm talking with Vr3 mods right now to get new Satin finish terminal cups with the Neutrik connection.

    http://vr3mods.com/Home.php

    H9

    "Appreciation of audio is a completely subjective human experience. Measurements can provide a measure of insight, but are no substitute for human judgment. Why are we looking to reduce a subjective experience to objective criteria anyway? The subtleties of music and audio reproduction are for those who appreciate it. Differentiation by numbers is for those who do not".--Nelson Pass Pass Labs XA25 | Galion TS P75 Pre | Holo Audio Cyan 2 Dac | MIT Shotgun S1 | Puritan Audio PSM136 Pwr Condtioner & Classic PC's | Legend L600 | Roon Nucleus 1 w/LPS - Tubes add soul!
  • F1nut
    F1nut Posts: 52,406
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    The 4 pole version has better specs and is built better.
  • heiney9
    heiney9 Posts: 25,699
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    What do you use the other poles for? Leave them unused?
    "Appreciation of audio is a completely subjective human experience. Measurements can provide a measure of insight, but are no substitute for human judgment. Why are we looking to reduce a subjective experience to objective criteria anyway? The subtleties of music and audio reproduction are for those who appreciate it. Differentiation by numbers is for those who do not".--Nelson Pass Pass Labs XA25 | Galion TS P75 Pre | Holo Audio Cyan 2 Dac | MIT Shotgun S1 | Puritan Audio PSM136 Pwr Condtioner & Classic PC's | Legend L600 | Roon Nucleus 1 w/LPS - Tubes add soul!
  • motorstereo
    motorstereo Posts: 2,427
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    heiney9 wrote: »
    I followed Jesse's well written write up on the 4 pole Neutrik install on my dreadnaught and cup. If I can do it and get it right you can rest assured that anyone can do it. As others have mentioned Neutrik is the only way to go on both the terminal cup and the case.

    Where is the write-up, that's what I'm asking for? Why 4 pole and not 2?

    H9

    That's a good question as I can't find that thread either.
  • F1nut
    F1nut Posts: 52,406
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    heiney9 wrote: »
    What do you use the other poles for? Leave them unused?

    Correct, unused.
  • F1nut
    F1nut Posts: 52,406
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    heiney9 wrote: »
    I followed Jesse's well written write up on the 4 pole Neutrik install on my dreadnaught and cup. If I can do it and get it right you can rest assured that anyone can do it. As others have mentioned Neutrik is the only way to go on both the terminal cup and the case.

    Where is the write-up, that's what I'm asking for? Why 4 pole and not 2?

    H9

    That's a good question as I can't find that thread either.

    Here, Jay nailed it.

    http://forum.polkaudio.com/discussion/comment/2287728/#Comment_2287728
  • vcwatkins
    vcwatkins Posts: 1,992
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    Sorry, I had hoped to put together a little parts and assembly compilation but haven't had time.

    I think most of the posts with useful details are within the threads linked in the Further Info of the top post above but it takes way too much time to page through. If I get some time in the next few days I'll try to put something together.

    Craig
    Beach Audio: Rega RP6 (mods) - AT33PTG/II - Parks Budgie SUT - PSAudio NPC * Eversolo DMP-A6 * Topping D90iii * Joule-Electra LA-100 mkIII * Pass Aleph 30 * MIT S3 * Polk SRS 2.3tl (mods) * PSAudio PPP3
    Beach Study: Pro-Ject Stream Box S2 Ultra & Pre Box S2 * Pass ACA * DH Labs SS Q10 * Brines Folded ML-TQWT RS 40-1354 * PSA Dectet
    Beach Master: WiiM Pro * Dayens Menuetto * Zu Libtec * Dynaudio Audience 50
    Beach Den: Bluesound Powernode 2i * DH Labs SS Q10 * Zu Omen DWII * Richard Gray RGPC
    Town Study: WiiM Pro * Chord Qute (Pardo) * Elekit TU-8600 * MIT S3 * Revel M22 * Beyer DT-990 * Shunyata Hydra 2
    Town Den: Music Hall mm5.1se - Denon DL-103r - Jolida JD9ii (mods) * WiiM Pro * Cary xCiter * Rogue 99 Magnum * Schiit Aegir * MIT S3 * Polk SRS 1.2tl (mods) * Dectet * Bottlehead Crack - Senn 600
    Town Porch: WiiM Pro Plus * Sunfire Sig II * Canare 4S11 * Magnepan 1.6 * Dectet
  • heiney9
    heiney9 Posts: 25,699
    edited January 2017
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    It appears Parts Express is much cheaper than Amazon. I have gift cards for Amazon and thought I'd use those, but so far they are 2-3 times the price on the Neutrik stuff I've looked up

    Just a heads up.

    H9

    P.s. I'll be purchasing from Parts Express. Even with free shipping at Amazon it's about 50% more than Parts Express.
    "Appreciation of audio is a completely subjective human experience. Measurements can provide a measure of insight, but are no substitute for human judgment. Why are we looking to reduce a subjective experience to objective criteria anyway? The subtleties of music and audio reproduction are for those who appreciate it. Differentiation by numbers is for those who do not".--Nelson Pass Pass Labs XA25 | Galion TS P75 Pre | Holo Audio Cyan 2 Dac | MIT Shotgun S1 | Puritan Audio PSM136 Pwr Condtioner & Classic PC's | Legend L600 | Roon Nucleus 1 w/LPS - Tubes add soul!
  • heiney9
    heiney9 Posts: 25,699
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    (4) 4 pole male connectors; (2) 4 pole female connectors and (2) gaskets

    Amazon is $69.02 with free Prime shipping

    Parts Express is $35.25 w/shipping for the exact same items!!!

    Holy Cow, I'm glad I shopped around. Only thing is for the Parts Express order it doesn't say anywhere if the Female connector is size "D" to fit the chassis of the case.

    H9
    "Appreciation of audio is a completely subjective human experience. Measurements can provide a measure of insight, but are no substitute for human judgment. Why are we looking to reduce a subjective experience to objective criteria anyway? The subtleties of music and audio reproduction are for those who appreciate it. Differentiation by numbers is for those who do not".--Nelson Pass Pass Labs XA25 | Galion TS P75 Pre | Holo Audio Cyan 2 Dac | MIT Shotgun S1 | Puritan Audio PSM136 Pwr Condtioner & Classic PC's | Legend L600 | Roon Nucleus 1 w/LPS - Tubes add soul!
  • vcwatkins
    vcwatkins Posts: 1,992
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    Thanks, H!
    Beach Audio: Rega RP6 (mods) - AT33PTG/II - Parks Budgie SUT - PSAudio NPC * Eversolo DMP-A6 * Topping D90iii * Joule-Electra LA-100 mkIII * Pass Aleph 30 * MIT S3 * Polk SRS 2.3tl (mods) * PSAudio PPP3
    Beach Study: Pro-Ject Stream Box S2 Ultra & Pre Box S2 * Pass ACA * DH Labs SS Q10 * Brines Folded ML-TQWT RS 40-1354 * PSA Dectet
    Beach Master: WiiM Pro * Dayens Menuetto * Zu Libtec * Dynaudio Audience 50
    Beach Den: Bluesound Powernode 2i * DH Labs SS Q10 * Zu Omen DWII * Richard Gray RGPC
    Town Study: WiiM Pro * Chord Qute (Pardo) * Elekit TU-8600 * MIT S3 * Revel M22 * Beyer DT-990 * Shunyata Hydra 2
    Town Den: Music Hall mm5.1se - Denon DL-103r - Jolida JD9ii (mods) * WiiM Pro * Cary xCiter * Rogue 99 Magnum * Schiit Aegir * MIT S3 * Polk SRS 1.2tl (mods) * Dectet * Bottlehead Crack - Senn 600
    Town Porch: WiiM Pro Plus * Sunfire Sig II * Canare 4S11 * Magnepan 1.6 * Dectet
  • heiney9
    heiney9 Posts: 25,699
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    Dumb question, but do the Neutrik female connectors come with screws? Or de we need to source those as well?
    "Appreciation of audio is a completely subjective human experience. Measurements can provide a measure of insight, but are no substitute for human judgment. Why are we looking to reduce a subjective experience to objective criteria anyway? The subtleties of music and audio reproduction are for those who appreciate it. Differentiation by numbers is for those who do not".--Nelson Pass Pass Labs XA25 | Galion TS P75 Pre | Holo Audio Cyan 2 Dac | MIT Shotgun S1 | Puritan Audio PSM136 Pwr Condtioner & Classic PC's | Legend L600 | Roon Nucleus 1 w/LPS - Tubes add soul!
  • Malbec
    Malbec Posts: 558
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    To mount them, you have to source your own. At least that's what I remember.
  • F1nut
    F1nut Posts: 52,406
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    You have to supply your own screws, washers and nuts, which should be 3mm.
  • agfrost
    agfrost Posts: 2,497
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    Malbec wrote: »
    To mount them, you have to source your own. At least that's what I remember.

    Yes. Screws/washers/nuts.

    Don't forget about buying connectors to go from the transformer wires to the Neutrik chassis connector's spade tabs, unless you're planning on soldering them.
    Jay
    SDA 2BTL * McCormack DNA 0.5 amp * Oppo BDP-93 * Modded Adcom GDA-600 DAC * Rythmik F8 (x2)
    Micro Seiki DQ-50 * Mitsubishi LT-30 * Hagerman Cornet 2 Phono
    Preamp rotation: Krell KSL (SCompRacer recapped) * Manley Shrimp * PS Audio 5.0
  • heiney9
    heiney9 Posts: 25,699
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    Thanks guys, see this is why I wanted a detailed write up. I had no idea we'd need these little things as I've never done one before. I don't happen to have some of this stuff around.

    Any other little tid bits you can remember
    "Appreciation of audio is a completely subjective human experience. Measurements can provide a measure of insight, but are no substitute for human judgment. Why are we looking to reduce a subjective experience to objective criteria anyway? The subtleties of music and audio reproduction are for those who appreciate it. Differentiation by numbers is for those who do not".--Nelson Pass Pass Labs XA25 | Galion TS P75 Pre | Holo Audio Cyan 2 Dac | MIT Shotgun S1 | Puritan Audio PSM136 Pwr Condtioner & Classic PC's | Legend L600 | Roon Nucleus 1 w/LPS - Tubes add soul!
  • agfrost
    agfrost Posts: 2,497
    edited January 2017
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    Jesse's build thread was food for my planning. Picture shows the grouping of wires from the A-L transformer and the connectors Jesse (and I in his fashion) used to connect Xformer to Neutrik:

    http://forum.polkaudio.com/discussion/142058/a-slightly-different-take-on-the-dreadnought/p1

    Connector Needs:
    1) Stainless Steel Bolt/washers/lockwashers/nut(s)--for mounting transformer to case. Needs to be non-magnetic stainless.
    2) Screws/washers/nuts for fastening Neutrik connectors to case & speaker terminal cups

    Am I missing anything? Get 'em all on a single Fastenal order for one-shipping price.

    Heck--here's a screenshot of *my* Fastenal order. I strongly recommend vetting this against other build threads to check on stuff I haven't thought about in 3 years--like "is that bolt the right size?" I suspect it is, but do some extra homework before ordering what I'm currently 85% sure is what I installed...

    Screen%20Shot%202017-01-26%20at%204.24.19%20PM_zpsmyuuxevf.png

    Looks like I ordered extra parts (as I tend to when shipping is greater cost than the parts themselves). If I can locate them, I'll tally them up and see about putting up a Karma.
    Jay
    SDA 2BTL * McCormack DNA 0.5 amp * Oppo BDP-93 * Modded Adcom GDA-600 DAC * Rythmik F8 (x2)
    Micro Seiki DQ-50 * Mitsubishi LT-30 * Hagerman Cornet 2 Phono
    Preamp rotation: Krell KSL (SCompRacer recapped) * Manley Shrimp * PS Audio 5.0
  • agfrost
    agfrost Posts: 2,497
    edited January 2017
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    ...I can see that I ended up purchasing both 3/8" & 5/16" bolts to test for my preferred fit--I'll see if I can ascertain which diameter "the loser" ended up being.

    Edit: Caliper appears to show I've got a pair of 3/8" bolts that I did *NOT* use, which would indicate I went with the 5/16". Can any past Dreadnought builder confirm this?
    Jay
    SDA 2BTL * McCormack DNA 0.5 amp * Oppo BDP-93 * Modded Adcom GDA-600 DAC * Rythmik F8 (x2)
    Micro Seiki DQ-50 * Mitsubishi LT-30 * Hagerman Cornet 2 Phono
    Preamp rotation: Krell KSL (SCompRacer recapped) * Manley Shrimp * PS Audio 5.0
  • heiney9
    heiney9 Posts: 25,699
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    The transformer doesn't come with a mounting bolt or mounting plates? I bought a used 800vA from a member here a few years ago. Never used it and sold it. It had a mounting bolt and a lower plate.
    "Appreciation of audio is a completely subjective human experience. Measurements can provide a measure of insight, but are no substitute for human judgment. Why are we looking to reduce a subjective experience to objective criteria anyway? The subtleties of music and audio reproduction are for those who appreciate it. Differentiation by numbers is for those who do not".--Nelson Pass Pass Labs XA25 | Galion TS P75 Pre | Holo Audio Cyan 2 Dac | MIT Shotgun S1 | Puritan Audio PSM136 Pwr Condtioner & Classic PC's | Legend L600 | Roon Nucleus 1 w/LPS - Tubes add soul!
  • agfrost
    agfrost Posts: 2,497
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    I'm laughing at how invested I am in this, since mine's been done for a couple years...

    I'm going to open mine up and get some answers....

    OK: I've taken a few (cellphone) photos which I hope are helpful.

    Here's just a shot of my opened case, freshly retrieved from in between my 2BTLs. Others have twisted the matched wires--looks like I did not.

    pu73vjo3p9lh.jpg

    A closeup of one of two wires-to-Neutrik connections. Colors are harder to make out on this pic, but (Blue/Violet) are paired as are (Brown/Grey). I crimped both into female connector (yellow plastic) and hit the connection with some Cardas QE solder to boot.

    yjfva62zekd2.jpg

    The other side. (Red/Yellow) and (Orange/Black). If you look at other builds you'll notice that I used different tabs on the Neutrik than suggested by Jesse (F1nut) and perhaps others--This is because of the choices I made on where to solder my wires into the 4-pole Neutrik NLT4FX-BAG connectors I used on my cables. You'll need to match *your* choices made in the cables. You need continuity from transformer wiring to Neutrik to SDA cable to Neutrik to your speaker's internal SDA connections (I'm assuming you're going Neutrik on both ends)--or no worky. With the female disconnects, it's easy to choose which tabs to connect inside the transformer case. You've clamped and/or soldered your SDA cables, so no choices there. If you're using 2-pole Neutrik, a bit less to ponder. The screw/nut you see is the hardware holding the Neutrik NL4MP-UC to the case. You have to drill two holes for each side.

    dk7tvsjhc3ma.jpg

    Just a quick shot to show the 'washer sandwich' I made. All stainless. Fender washer, lock washer, nut. On the outside of the case I threaded another fender washer on the bolt before starting it in the hole in the case that Larry thoughtfully predrilled. (He probably just bribed a robot laser to do it)

    s8ohtj27cocy.jpg

    The money shot, as it were: Proof that I used a 5/16" stainless bolt. No way is a 3/8" fitting in that hole (this transformer is potted through the middle).

    b7thx3w5ykoz.jpg

    Jay
    SDA 2BTL * McCormack DNA 0.5 amp * Oppo BDP-93 * Modded Adcom GDA-600 DAC * Rythmik F8 (x2)
    Micro Seiki DQ-50 * Mitsubishi LT-30 * Hagerman Cornet 2 Phono
    Preamp rotation: Krell KSL (SCompRacer recapped) * Manley Shrimp * PS Audio 5.0
  • F1nut
    F1nut Posts: 52,406
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    Brock, do you want one of us to come and hold your hand?
  • heiney9
    heiney9 Posts: 25,699
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    F1nut wrote: »
    Brock, do you want one of us to come and hold your hand?

    No Jesse, but Jay's tutorial and pics have been extremely helpful. That's the kind of thing we do around here. Help each other out, make suggestions, share experiences, etc.

    Sorry I've never built one before and many here have. I didn't think asking for advice was going to be such a pain in your azz.

    Thanks Jay, you've been extremely helpful. Now I don't have to order all these parts separately as I run into issues.

    H9
    "Appreciation of audio is a completely subjective human experience. Measurements can provide a measure of insight, but are no substitute for human judgment. Why are we looking to reduce a subjective experience to objective criteria anyway? The subtleties of music and audio reproduction are for those who appreciate it. Differentiation by numbers is for those who do not".--Nelson Pass Pass Labs XA25 | Galion TS P75 Pre | Holo Audio Cyan 2 Dac | MIT Shotgun S1 | Puritan Audio PSM136 Pwr Condtioner & Classic PC's | Legend L600 | Roon Nucleus 1 w/LPS - Tubes add soul!
  • This content has been removed.
  • agfrost
    agfrost Posts: 2,497
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    Please realize that I didn't do a single unique thing in my build--I just thought I'd transfer some of the practices I got from people who got in on group buy #1 (I was 2nd wave, the "scuba" one. Hmm. Wonder if he got in on this group buy?).

    Still worth your while to find/go through those older build threads (DK's, F1's). Most have used Dynamat in their cases. Still on the to-do list for me.

    Good job on all of this GB's participants: No one got banned this time!
    Jay
    SDA 2BTL * McCormack DNA 0.5 amp * Oppo BDP-93 * Modded Adcom GDA-600 DAC * Rythmik F8 (x2)
    Micro Seiki DQ-50 * Mitsubishi LT-30 * Hagerman Cornet 2 Phono
    Preamp rotation: Krell KSL (SCompRacer recapped) * Manley Shrimp * PS Audio 5.0
  • monepolk
    monepolk Posts: 1,154
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    Hey I appreciate all the info that you've provide. Thanks.
  • honestaquarian
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    Hey @heiney9 isn't the ONLY one benefitting from all of this. He's just the one asking the questions. I've never done this before either and obviously we aren't alone in this.
  • honestaquarian
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    DSkip wrote: »
    Hey @heiney9 isn't the ONLY one benefitting from all of this. He's just the one asking the questions. I've never done this before either and obviously we aren't alone in this.

    Maybe Rick can pull one of his geetars out and we can all sing kumbaya while we hold hands. o:)

    Yippeekyay muthaf@$%&#:!!!! :D;)
  • heiney9
    heiney9 Posts: 25,699
    edited January 2017
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    Check out Performance Audio

    http://www.performanceaudio.com/

    They have all the Neutrik connectors and they have a very good price on Canare 4S11 cable if you haven't decided on what cabling to use with your Dreadnought. I have used Canare before and currently use it in my office rig. It's damn good stuff and many manufacturer's, whom I won't mention, use this exact cable and put sheathing over it w/their own name on it and mark it up 10-20 times.

    $49 or more spent = free shipping. I have bought from them before and they are solid.

    Just another alternative.

    H9
    "Appreciation of audio is a completely subjective human experience. Measurements can provide a measure of insight, but are no substitute for human judgment. Why are we looking to reduce a subjective experience to objective criteria anyway? The subtleties of music and audio reproduction are for those who appreciate it. Differentiation by numbers is for those who do not".--Nelson Pass Pass Labs XA25 | Galion TS P75 Pre | Holo Audio Cyan 2 Dac | MIT Shotgun S1 | Puritan Audio PSM136 Pwr Condtioner & Classic PC's | Legend L600 | Roon Nucleus 1 w/LPS - Tubes add soul!
  • Unknown
    edited January 2017
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    This content has been removed.
  • heiney9
    heiney9 Posts: 25,699
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    Just an FYI,

    Parts Express carries the Gold, insolated disconnects for the lugs on the Neutrik female connectors on the tranny case.

    http://www.parts-express.com/gold-12-10-awg-0187-female-disconnect-5-pair--095-808

    H9
    "Appreciation of audio is a completely subjective human experience. Measurements can provide a measure of insight, but are no substitute for human judgment. Why are we looking to reduce a subjective experience to objective criteria anyway? The subtleties of music and audio reproduction are for those who appreciate it. Differentiation by numbers is for those who do not".--Nelson Pass Pass Labs XA25 | Galion TS P75 Pre | Holo Audio Cyan 2 Dac | MIT Shotgun S1 | Puritan Audio PSM136 Pwr Condtioner & Classic PC's | Legend L600 | Roon Nucleus 1 w/LPS - Tubes add soul!