Seems like the Bear Market has begun?

Seems like this is a legitimate case for a stock market bear market. Indicators are bad, multiple sectors are in the red.

I have not seen anything like this since 2008.

This is no bueno.

Kinda makes me wonder I bought the Boulder 2 months ago... ayiyi.....
Joey's Gear:
Current Gear:
Torus RM15 -> Emm Labs TSDx/Bluesound Node 2 -> Emm Labs DAC2x -> Audio Research Reference 40th Anniversary -> Boulder 2060 stereo amp (w/ Audioquest WEL Signature) -> new speakers + JL Audio F113v2 x2
Rotel RA1592 Super Integrated -> Sonus Faber Olympica 3
Oppo 105D -> Rotel RC1570 preamp -> Rotel RB1582 amp -> Focal Kanta 2


Main speakers system evolution over the years:
Klipsch Promedia 4.1 -> Axiom M22ti -> Sonus Faber Concertino -> Sonus Faber Concerto -> Polk LSi7 -> Polk LSi9 -> Martin Logan Mosaic -> AV123 Onix Ref 1 -> Martin Logan Vantage -> AV123 Strata Mini -> Martin Logan Summit -> Sonus Faber Cremona Auditor -> BW 802D2 -> Sonus Faber Stradivari -> Rockport Avior -> BW 802D3 -> BW 800D3 -> ???

Old Gear:
Speakers:
BW PM1 (3.5/5), CM10s2 (3.75/5), BW800D3 (5/5), Rockport Aviors (5/5), Sonus Faber Stradivari (5/5), BW 802D2 (4.5/5), Martin Logan Summits (4.25/5), Martin Logan Vantage (4/5), Sonus Faber Cremona Auditor (3.75/5), AV123 Strata Mini (3.5/5), ML Mosaic (3.25/5), Onix Ref1 (3/5), Sonus Faber Concerto (2.75/5), SF Concertino (2.5/5), Axiom M22ti (2/5), Polk LSi9 (3/5), LSi7 (2.9/5)
Source:
Squeezebox 3 -> PS Audio Digital Link III -> Cary 306/200 CDP -> Cary 306 SACD -> EMM LABS DAC2X/TSDX
Preamplification:
Rotel RC1070 -> Rogue Perseus -> Cary SLP98 -> Cary SLP98F1 -> Cary SLP05 (sold and then repurchased) -> ARC 5se -> ARC Ref 40th Anniversary
Amplification:
HK AVR330 -> Rotel RB1070 -> Rotel RB1090 -> Plinius SA102 -> Cary 211FE -> Classe M600 -> Boulder 2060
Subwoofer:
Infinity Entra2 -> SVS 25-31PCi -> SVS 25-31PC+ -> Dual JL Audio F113v2
«1

Comments

  • steveinazsteveinaz Posts: 19,409
    Yeah, not encouraging at all and I don't think realestate is gonna do much of anything either for quite a long time. I'm just gonna hunker down and ride it out.
    Source: Bluesound Node 2i - Preamp/DAC: Benchmark DAC2 DX - Amplifier: Parasound Halo A21 - Speakers: PSB Imagine T2 - Cables: Kimber Hero XLR; Kimber 8VS Bi-Wire; DH Labs D-75 dig coaxial
  • Joey_VJoey_V Posts: 7,388
    edited January 2016
    steveinaz wrote: »
    Yeah, not encouraging at all and I don't think realestate is gonna do much of anything either for quite a long time. I'm just gonna hunker down and ride it out.

    I have gone conservative since last week after losing 5 figures.

    My 401k Used to be 95% stocks...

    Now I am about 40% bonds and rest in stocks, but also into dividend stocks. Down to 5% international too.

    Once the market hits bottom or whatever seems low, I'm dumping every cent I have back in.

    My other investment account is now in full bonds and money market. Zero stocks. Was told by my advisor that to expect that we do not engage the stock market for 2016.

    All signs point to a bear market and a Dow hitting 11,500.

    He said that and I was like adios. I'm not going to put myself through 12 months misery and end up losing half my net worth and waiting 7 years to make it back up. I would rather accept that this will be a bad year, reinvest when the market looks worse and ride it up.
    Joey's Gear:
    Current Gear:
    Torus RM15 -> Emm Labs TSDx/Bluesound Node 2 -> Emm Labs DAC2x -> Audio Research Reference 40th Anniversary -> Boulder 2060 stereo amp (w/ Audioquest WEL Signature) -> new speakers + JL Audio F113v2 x2
    Rotel RA1592 Super Integrated -> Sonus Faber Olympica 3
    Oppo 105D -> Rotel RC1570 preamp -> Rotel RB1582 amp -> Focal Kanta 2


    Main speakers system evolution over the years:
    Klipsch Promedia 4.1 -> Axiom M22ti -> Sonus Faber Concertino -> Sonus Faber Concerto -> Polk LSi7 -> Polk LSi9 -> Martin Logan Mosaic -> AV123 Onix Ref 1 -> Martin Logan Vantage -> AV123 Strata Mini -> Martin Logan Summit -> Sonus Faber Cremona Auditor -> BW 802D2 -> Sonus Faber Stradivari -> Rockport Avior -> BW 802D3 -> BW 800D3 -> ???

    Old Gear:
    Speakers:
    BW PM1 (3.5/5), CM10s2 (3.75/5), BW800D3 (5/5), Rockport Aviors (5/5), Sonus Faber Stradivari (5/5), BW 802D2 (4.5/5), Martin Logan Summits (4.25/5), Martin Logan Vantage (4/5), Sonus Faber Cremona Auditor (3.75/5), AV123 Strata Mini (3.5/5), ML Mosaic (3.25/5), Onix Ref1 (3/5), Sonus Faber Concerto (2.75/5), SF Concertino (2.5/5), Axiom M22ti (2/5), Polk LSi9 (3/5), LSi7 (2.9/5)
    Source:
    Squeezebox 3 -> PS Audio Digital Link III -> Cary 306/200 CDP -> Cary 306 SACD -> EMM LABS DAC2X/TSDX
    Preamplification:
    Rotel RC1070 -> Rogue Perseus -> Cary SLP98 -> Cary SLP98F1 -> Cary SLP05 (sold and then repurchased) -> ARC 5se -> ARC Ref 40th Anniversary
    Amplification:
    HK AVR330 -> Rotel RB1070 -> Rotel RB1090 -> Plinius SA102 -> Cary 211FE -> Classe M600 -> Boulder 2060
    Subwoofer:
    Infinity Entra2 -> SVS 25-31PCi -> SVS 25-31PC+ -> Dual JL Audio F113v2
  • I have gone conservative since last week after losing 5 figures.

    My 401k Used to be 95% stocks...

    Now I am about 40% bonds and rest in stocks, but also into dividend stocks. Down to 5% international too.

    Once the market hits bottom or whatever seems low, I'm dumping every cent I have back in.


    I'm not sure how good your crystal ball is , but historically this is not a very good idea:

    1. Since 1995, six of the ten best days for the S&P 500 occurred within two weeks of the ten worst days.

    2. Market timing is almost impossible to get right over the long run.

    "Nobel laureate William Sharpe found that market timers must be right an incredible 82% of the time just to match the returns realized by buy-and-hold investors."

    "A study by SEI Investments reviewed all the bear markets since World War II. According to the study, reported in The Wall Street Journal, stocks rose an average of 32.5% in the 12 months following the bear-market bottom. Yet, if you missed the bottom by just a week, that return fell to 24.3%. Waiting three months after the market turned cut your gain to less than 15%."

    "Between 1986 and 2005, the S&P 500 compounded at an annual rate of return of 11.9% - even in the face of the market crash in 1987, two recessions, two wars, 9/11, the 2000's "tech-wreck," accounting scandals (i.e. Enron), and more. Due to market timing, the average investor's return during that time was only 3.9%."

    3. This is because most of the gains come in the six months after a bear market. The market timer must get two decisions right…When to get out and when to get back in.




    jgc.pdf 300.1K
    HT- Samsung PN50B860/Integra DTR 30.3/Rt55 Fronts
    Rt35i Surrounds/Cs1000p Center/SVS BP1000 Sub
    2CH - B&K MC-101 pre/B&K EX-442 amp/NAD 2400 amp
    Polk SDA1C, Polk Monitor 7, New Large Advents and Polk RTA 8T
    BR - Yamaha CR800/Polk monitor 5
  • EndersShadowEndersShadow Posts: 17,112
    edited January 2016
    @Joey_V

    Instead of losing 5 figures in the stock market, just shoot 1 of those 5 my way :smile:..... that will make you happy you didnt lose another 5, and me happy I just doubled my retirement savings lol....
    "....not everything that can be counted counts, and not everything that counts can be counted." William Bruce Cameron, Informal Sociology: A Casual Introduction to Sociological Thinking (1963)
  • tonybtonyb Posts: 32,464
    Every presidential election year seems to tank the markets. The exception here is debt, lots of it and world wide. The markets have been overblown for so long, a big correction was due anyway.

    I said to cash out late last year, which I did, and hit the bottom when it happens. That bottom may not be seen for awhile though....maybe this time next year.

    Any lay person knows, you can't keep borrowing money, loading up the credit card without a day of reckoning. They also know you can't keep printing money out of thin air for long, which we have been doing. These are tactics used to hide the real problems that exist that nobody wants to talk about or tackle.

    Now, we will be back to the government picking the winners and losers like in '08-'09. You watch....banks will have to be recapitalized, insurance companies bailed out etc.....and the best part is, you get to foot the bill for a lot of it. Then the process will start all over again.
    HT SYSTEM-
    Sony 850c 4k
    Pioneer elite vhx 21
    Sony 4k BRP
    SVS SB-2000
    Polk Sig. 20's
    Polk FX500 surrounds

    Cables-
    Acoustic zen Satori speaker cables
    Acoustic zen Matrix 2 IC's
    Wireworld eclipse 7 ic's
    Audio metallurgy ga-o digital cable

    Kitchen

    Sonos zp90
    Grant Fidelity tube dac
    B&k 1420
    lsi 9's
  • txcoastal1txcoastal1 Posts: 11,303
    We had this discussion in August and this was before oil was a another trigger...gonna be a bumpy ride

    http://forum.polkaudio.com/discussion/169063/wow-bad-day-for-the-market/p4
    txcoastal1 wrote: »
    I see this more as a correction on our end. The big banks are still above their 52 week high.
    Where the slam is coming from are the commodities. I by and sell copper as part of my business. Copper is a tell tale sign of where building and material lies through the world. Copper have been on a downfall for several months.

    I did a serious market pull back in April and May using copper as a warning sign that China construction had come to halt and was over inflated and would soon cause a ripple effect.
    txcoastal1 wrote: »
    tonyb wrote: »
    txcoastal1 wrote: »
    I see this more as a correction on our end. The big banks are still above their 52 week high.
    Where the slam is coming from are the commodities. I by and sell copper as part of my business. Copper is a tell tale sign of where building and material lies through the world. Copper have been on a downfall for several months.

    I did a serious market pull back in April and May using copper as a warning sign that China construction had come to halt and was over inflated and would soon cause a ripple effect.
    My question is.....are we not in the same boat ?

    Absolutely, just not as bad as China, and not as bad as we were in 2008. Real estate and banks are leveled out. If they were not we would be in the same boat China is now....same as we were in 2008 but worse.

    I still see the market being over inflated by 3000 pts or maybe a little more. Volatility will probably continue to trickle the DOW down till will reach that point, but again who the h-ell knows...just an assumption. Maybe the next 24months of volatility till after election.
    2-channel: Modwright KWI-200 Integrated, Dynaudio C1-II Signatures
    Desktop rig: LSi7, Polk 110sub, Dayens Ampino amp, W4S DAC/pre, Sonos, JRiver
    Gear on standby: Melody 101 tube pre, Unison Research Simply Italy Integrated
    Gone to new homes: (Matt Polk's)Threshold Stasis SA12e monoblocks, Pass XA30.5 amp, Usher MD2 speakers, Dynaudio C4 platinum speakers, Modwright LS100 (voltz), Simaudio 780D DAC

    erat interfectorem cesar et **** dictatorem dicere a
  • tonybtonyb Posts: 32,464
    Thing is pal, there's been many "triggers" that the markets were just shrugging off. That's a sure sign the jig is up. Like seeing a sign that the bridge ahead is out, but you hit the gas.

    Everybody is in debt up to their eyeballs, China, Russia, Europe, South America, U.S. The usual tactics of printing money or devaluing currency is causing ripple effects. Add to all that Opec's plan of destroying shale and world economies is actually working. You can't fight wars when your broke, right. The pen is mightier than the sword as they say. What else happens when everyone is broke ? Turmoil...chaos, and your going to see more of it all over.
    HT SYSTEM-
    Sony 850c 4k
    Pioneer elite vhx 21
    Sony 4k BRP
    SVS SB-2000
    Polk Sig. 20's
    Polk FX500 surrounds

    Cables-
    Acoustic zen Satori speaker cables
    Acoustic zen Matrix 2 IC's
    Wireworld eclipse 7 ic's
    Audio metallurgy ga-o digital cable

    Kitchen

    Sonos zp90
    Grant Fidelity tube dac
    B&k 1420
    lsi 9's
  • steveinazsteveinaz Posts: 19,409
    Just remember, and worth repeating; "Unrealized losses" are just that, if you don't sell after the bottom falls out. I'm gonna stick with the strategy I've been using for years, and it got me thru 2008 relatively well.
    Source: Bluesound Node 2i - Preamp/DAC: Benchmark DAC2 DX - Amplifier: Parasound Halo A21 - Speakers: PSB Imagine T2 - Cables: Kimber Hero XLR; Kimber 8VS Bi-Wire; DH Labs D-75 dig coaxial
  • txcoastal1txcoastal1 Posts: 11,303
    lightman1 wrote: »

    Tobacco, alcohol, ammo, and hot sauce...everything is edible with hot sauce
    2-channel: Modwright KWI-200 Integrated, Dynaudio C1-II Signatures
    Desktop rig: LSi7, Polk 110sub, Dayens Ampino amp, W4S DAC/pre, Sonos, JRiver
    Gear on standby: Melody 101 tube pre, Unison Research Simply Italy Integrated
    Gone to new homes: (Matt Polk's)Threshold Stasis SA12e monoblocks, Pass XA30.5 amp, Usher MD2 speakers, Dynaudio C4 platinum speakers, Modwright LS100 (voltz), Simaudio 780D DAC

    erat interfectorem cesar et **** dictatorem dicere a
  • mhardy6647mhardy6647 Posts: 25,814
    steveinaz wrote: »
    Just remember, and worth repeating; "Unrealized losses" are just that, if you don't sell after the bottom falls out. I'm gonna stick with the strategy I've been using for years, and it got me thru 2008 relatively well.

    That's a big 10-4. Paper losses are -- paper losses... but if one sells low, those paper losses magically become real losses. Fine if one needs a tax write off against capital gains, otherwise, not so much.

    ... and all of this is why one's investment portfolio should be diversified.

    Yeah, we did OK in 2008, too -- indeed, we decided to build the new house, figuring the builders would be fairly hungry for business.

  • tonybtonyb Posts: 32,464
    steveinaz wrote: »
    Just remember, and worth repeating; "Unrealized losses" are just that, if you don't sell after the bottom falls out. I'm gonna stick with the strategy I've been using for years, and it got me thru 2008 relatively well.

    Well, obviously....nothing is realized until you cash out. Thing is...if you never cash out, then nothing is ever realized and....whats the point then ?

    Most are in it for the long term, meaning they may need to cash out at retirement time. Your still gabling that particular time will correlate with an up market. If it's a down market, you either hold off retiring or realize the losses. Then you balance that decision with how you want to live and even how many more years you have to live.

    Be interesting what a new president does with the IRS code, that may change some peoples outlook for better or worse....depending.
    HT SYSTEM-
    Sony 850c 4k
    Pioneer elite vhx 21
    Sony 4k BRP
    SVS SB-2000
    Polk Sig. 20's
    Polk FX500 surrounds

    Cables-
    Acoustic zen Satori speaker cables
    Acoustic zen Matrix 2 IC's
    Wireworld eclipse 7 ic's
    Audio metallurgy ga-o digital cable

    Kitchen

    Sonos zp90
    Grant Fidelity tube dac
    B&k 1420
    lsi 9's
  • maximillianmaximillian Posts: 2,126
    Could copper be down because of increase of installs with plastic (CPVC/PEX)?
  • txcoastal1txcoastal1 Posts: 11,303
    Could copper be down because of increase of installs with plastic (CPVC/PEX)?

    (CPVC/PEX) has been used for years. Copper was inflated with China's construction boom. Now they have ghost cities.
    2-channel: Modwright KWI-200 Integrated, Dynaudio C1-II Signatures
    Desktop rig: LSi7, Polk 110sub, Dayens Ampino amp, W4S DAC/pre, Sonos, JRiver
    Gear on standby: Melody 101 tube pre, Unison Research Simply Italy Integrated
    Gone to new homes: (Matt Polk's)Threshold Stasis SA12e monoblocks, Pass XA30.5 amp, Usher MD2 speakers, Dynaudio C4 platinum speakers, Modwright LS100 (voltz), Simaudio 780D DAC

    erat interfectorem cesar et **** dictatorem dicere a
  • Joey_VJoey_V Posts: 7,388
    edited January 2016
    steveinaz wrote: »
    Just remember, and worth repeating; "Unrealized losses" are just that, if you don't sell after the bottom falls out. I'm gonna stick with the strategy I've been using for years, and it got me thru 2008 relatively well.

    I just moved to my 401k to a conservative model. It is now transitioned from a 95-5 stock heavy portfolio to a. 60-40 portfolio with near even split of stocks and bonds.

    Plan is to continue max input contributions into the 401k even as the market tumbles and then when the advisor says we have positive indicators, transition to full 95-5 stock heavy portfolio again.

    Paper losses are paper losses. And yes, biggest days are right after a downturn...

    But if for example I have 100k (hypothetical) in the current market.

    Bear market hits and I have 50k after.

    I would need a 100% gain to go back to 100k.

    Whereas if I pull now that I am at 95,000. Wait a bit and transition back to full stocks .. Even if I miss the 100% gain and only gain 75% of that potential, I'd be sitting at 170k.

    Far cry from the 100k and I won't get heartburn at nigt while I watch it plummet.
    Joey's Gear:
    Current Gear:
    Torus RM15 -> Emm Labs TSDx/Bluesound Node 2 -> Emm Labs DAC2x -> Audio Research Reference 40th Anniversary -> Boulder 2060 stereo amp (w/ Audioquest WEL Signature) -> new speakers + JL Audio F113v2 x2
    Rotel RA1592 Super Integrated -> Sonus Faber Olympica 3
    Oppo 105D -> Rotel RC1570 preamp -> Rotel RB1582 amp -> Focal Kanta 2


    Main speakers system evolution over the years:
    Klipsch Promedia 4.1 -> Axiom M22ti -> Sonus Faber Concertino -> Sonus Faber Concerto -> Polk LSi7 -> Polk LSi9 -> Martin Logan Mosaic -> AV123 Onix Ref 1 -> Martin Logan Vantage -> AV123 Strata Mini -> Martin Logan Summit -> Sonus Faber Cremona Auditor -> BW 802D2 -> Sonus Faber Stradivari -> Rockport Avior -> BW 802D3 -> BW 800D3 -> ???

    Old Gear:
    Speakers:
    BW PM1 (3.5/5), CM10s2 (3.75/5), BW800D3 (5/5), Rockport Aviors (5/5), Sonus Faber Stradivari (5/5), BW 802D2 (4.5/5), Martin Logan Summits (4.25/5), Martin Logan Vantage (4/5), Sonus Faber Cremona Auditor (3.75/5), AV123 Strata Mini (3.5/5), ML Mosaic (3.25/5), Onix Ref1 (3/5), Sonus Faber Concerto (2.75/5), SF Concertino (2.5/5), Axiom M22ti (2/5), Polk LSi9 (3/5), LSi7 (2.9/5)
    Source:
    Squeezebox 3 -> PS Audio Digital Link III -> Cary 306/200 CDP -> Cary 306 SACD -> EMM LABS DAC2X/TSDX
    Preamplification:
    Rotel RC1070 -> Rogue Perseus -> Cary SLP98 -> Cary SLP98F1 -> Cary SLP05 (sold and then repurchased) -> ARC 5se -> ARC Ref 40th Anniversary
    Amplification:
    HK AVR330 -> Rotel RB1070 -> Rotel RB1090 -> Plinius SA102 -> Cary 211FE -> Classe M600 -> Boulder 2060
    Subwoofer:
    Infinity Entra2 -> SVS 25-31PCi -> SVS 25-31PC+ -> Dual JL Audio F113v2
  • Polkie2009Polkie2009 Posts: 3,836
    txcoastal1 wrote: »
    We had this discussion in August and this was before oil was a another trigger...gonna be a bumpy ride

    http://forum.polkaudio.com/discussion/169063/wow-bad-day-for-the-market/p4
    txcoastal1 wrote: »
    I see this more as a correction on our end. The big banks are still above their 52 week high.
    Where the slam is coming from are the commodities. I by and sell copper as part of my business. Copper is a tell tale sign of where building and material lies through the world. Copper have been on a downfall for several months.

    I did a serious market pull back in April and May using copper as a warning sign that China construction had come to halt and was over inflated and would soon cause a ripple effect.
    txcoastal1 wrote: »
    tonyb wrote: »
    txcoastal1 wrote: »
    I see this more as a correction on our end. The big banks are still above their 52 week high.
    Where the slam is coming from are the commodities. I by and sell copper as part of my business. Copper is a tell tale sign of where building and material lies through the world. Copper have been on a downfall for several months.

    I did a serious market pull back in April and May using copper as a warning sign that China construction had come to halt and was over inflated and would soon cause a ripple effect.
    My question is.....are we not in the same boat ?

    Absolutely, just not as bad as China, and not as bad as we were in 2008. Real estate and banks are leveled out. If they were not we would be in the same boat China is now....same as we were in 2008 but worse.

    I still see the market being over inflated by 3000 pts or maybe a little more. Volatility will probably continue to trickle the DOW down till will reach that point, but again who the h-ell knows...just an assumption. Maybe the next 24months of volatility till after election.

    You are correct, things started going south in the Asian markets around late July and there was a lot of chatter about Sept. being a bloodbath, decided to pull out in early Sept. I thought a number of other members here also pulled out and went to cash then too.
  • cnhcnh Posts: 13,310
    edited January 2016
    Markets? Aren't they "irrational" as opposed to "rational", populated by a squadron of Business gamblers who love the extra money that "you" give them to place their bets? When will we learn? Never, I suppose.

    Sure "you" can weather the storms if you have "resources" but if you're just an average Joe who has less than 30K or 40K anywhere, and most Americans don't even have that, you're screwed, because you'll NEVER be able to run with the big boys. And, lest this sound like a rant on my part. Yeah, even a bourgeois Professor can sort of survive most of this free market nonsense-and so much the worse the sting when we make it through without losing everything and we see all those who DID NOT make it!

    God Bless the little guy, and may He NEVER, as we as a society always do, blame him for losing "everything"!
    Post edited by cnh on
    Currently orbiting Bowie's Blackstar.!

    Polk Lsi-7s, Def Tech 8" sub, HK 3490, HK HD 990 (CDP/DAC), AKG Q701s
    [sig. changed on a monthly basis as I rotate in and out of my stash]
  • nooshinjohnnooshinjohn Posts: 22,782
    We are selling a condo now to free up 300k in cash. this will be used to buy gold and hold back waiting for things to correct, then oil futures are on the table. Now is the time to be ready to buy when the winds change.
    The Gear... Carver "Statement" Mono-blocks, TriangleArt Reference SE with Pass Labs Xono Phono Preamp, Walker Precision Motor Drive, ClearAudio Goldfinger Diamond v2 cartridge and Origin Conquerer Mk3c tonearm, Polk Audio "Signature" Reference Series 1.2TL with complete mods, Pass Labs X0.2 three chassis preamp, PS Audio PerfectWave DAC MkII, Krell Evolution 505 SACD Player, Pioneer Elite SC-LX701, Oppo UDP-205 4K Blu-ray player, Sony XBR70x850B 4k, Polk audio AB800 "in-wall" surrounds.

    I swear by my life and my love of it that I will never live for the sake of another man, nor ask another man to live for mine.” .

    “If it moves, tax it. If it keeps moving, regulate it. And if it stops moving, subsidize it.”
  • lightman1lightman1 Posts: 10,684
    Save your beans....and create your owns winds of change.






    What am I.... 12??!! :p
  • tonybtonyb Posts: 32,464
    Beans ?? I love beans....hate counting them but love eatin' 'em.
    HT SYSTEM-
    Sony 850c 4k
    Pioneer elite vhx 21
    Sony 4k BRP
    SVS SB-2000
    Polk Sig. 20's
    Polk FX500 surrounds

    Cables-
    Acoustic zen Satori speaker cables
    Acoustic zen Matrix 2 IC's
    Wireworld eclipse 7 ic's
    Audio metallurgy ga-o digital cable

    Kitchen

    Sonos zp90
    Grant Fidelity tube dac
    B&k 1420
    lsi 9's
  • tonybtonyb Posts: 32,464
    cnh wrote: »
    Markets? Aren't they "irrational" as opposed to "rational", populated by a squadron of Business gamblers who love the extra money that "you" give them to place their bets? When will we learn? Never, I suppose.
    !

    Lessons learned from the homeland ?? lol

    It's a good gig eh ? Use other peoples money to make you money and kick back a percentage....all perfectly legal. Except if you or I did that we'd go to jail.

    The majority of our problems, and the worlds, revolve around money. I say we get rid of it an go back to bartering. What else am I gonna do with all these pie tins I've collected ....and Oscar Meir Weiner Whistles ?
    HT SYSTEM-
    Sony 850c 4k
    Pioneer elite vhx 21
    Sony 4k BRP
    SVS SB-2000
    Polk Sig. 20's
    Polk FX500 surrounds

    Cables-
    Acoustic zen Satori speaker cables
    Acoustic zen Matrix 2 IC's
    Wireworld eclipse 7 ic's
    Audio metallurgy ga-o digital cable

    Kitchen

    Sonos zp90
    Grant Fidelity tube dac
    B&k 1420
    lsi 9's
  • mhardy6647mhardy6647 Posts: 25,814
    tonyb wrote: »
    Beans ?? I love beans....hate counting them but love eatin' 'em.

    Heh -- we grow 'em, too...
  • Joey_VJoey_V Posts: 7,388
    Polkie2009 wrote: »
    txcoastal1 wrote: »
    We had this discussion in August and this was before oil was a another trigger...gonna be a bumpy ride

    http://forum.polkaudio.com/discussion/169063/wow-bad-day-for-the-market/p4
    txcoastal1 wrote: »
    I see this more as a correction on our end. The big banks are still above their 52 week high.
    Where the slam is coming from are the commodities. I by and sell copper as part of my business. Copper is a tell tale sign of where building and material lies through the world. Copper have been on a downfall for several months.

    I did a serious market pull back in April and May using copper as a warning sign that China construction had come to halt and was over inflated and would soon cause a ripple effect.
    txcoastal1 wrote: »
    tonyb wrote: »
    txcoastal1 wrote: »
    I see this more as a correction on our end. The big banks are still above their 52 week high.
    Where the slam is coming from are the commodities. I by and sell copper as part of my business. Copper is a tell tale sign of where building and material lies through the world. Copper have been on a downfall for several months.

    I did a serious market pull back in April and May using copper as a warning sign that China construction had come to halt and was over inflated and would soon cause a ripple effect.
    My question is.....are we not in the same boat ?

    Absolutely, just not as bad as China, and not as bad as we were in 2008. Real estate and banks are leveled out. If they were not we would be in the same boat China is now....same as we were in 2008 but worse.

    I still see the market being over inflated by 3000 pts or maybe a little more. Volatility will probably continue to trickle the DOW down till will reach that point, but again who the h-ell knows...just an assumption. Maybe the next 24months of volatility till after election.

    You are correct, things started going south in the Asian markets around late July and there was a lot of chatter about Sept. being a bloodbath, decided to pull out in early Sept. I thought a number of other members here also pulled out and went to cash then too.

    I have 3 main sections of investment:

    1. Whole life - unrelated gains to market, safe cash haven.
    2. My cash investments - since august, Yep, I'm all cash in money market and bonds.
    3. 401k - used to be 95% stocks and rest bonds. Now switched to 60% stocks 40% bonds.



    My
    Joey's Gear:
    Current Gear:
    Torus RM15 -> Emm Labs TSDx/Bluesound Node 2 -> Emm Labs DAC2x -> Audio Research Reference 40th Anniversary -> Boulder 2060 stereo amp (w/ Audioquest WEL Signature) -> new speakers + JL Audio F113v2 x2
    Rotel RA1592 Super Integrated -> Sonus Faber Olympica 3
    Oppo 105D -> Rotel RC1570 preamp -> Rotel RB1582 amp -> Focal Kanta 2


    Main speakers system evolution over the years:
    Klipsch Promedia 4.1 -> Axiom M22ti -> Sonus Faber Concertino -> Sonus Faber Concerto -> Polk LSi7 -> Polk LSi9 -> Martin Logan Mosaic -> AV123 Onix Ref 1 -> Martin Logan Vantage -> AV123 Strata Mini -> Martin Logan Summit -> Sonus Faber Cremona Auditor -> BW 802D2 -> Sonus Faber Stradivari -> Rockport Avior -> BW 802D3 -> BW 800D3 -> ???

    Old Gear:
    Speakers:
    BW PM1 (3.5/5), CM10s2 (3.75/5), BW800D3 (5/5), Rockport Aviors (5/5), Sonus Faber Stradivari (5/5), BW 802D2 (4.5/5), Martin Logan Summits (4.25/5), Martin Logan Vantage (4/5), Sonus Faber Cremona Auditor (3.75/5), AV123 Strata Mini (3.5/5), ML Mosaic (3.25/5), Onix Ref1 (3/5), Sonus Faber Concerto (2.75/5), SF Concertino (2.5/5), Axiom M22ti (2/5), Polk LSi9 (3/5), LSi7 (2.9/5)
    Source:
    Squeezebox 3 -> PS Audio Digital Link III -> Cary 306/200 CDP -> Cary 306 SACD -> EMM LABS DAC2X/TSDX
    Preamplification:
    Rotel RC1070 -> Rogue Perseus -> Cary SLP98 -> Cary SLP98F1 -> Cary SLP05 (sold and then repurchased) -> ARC 5se -> ARC Ref 40th Anniversary
    Amplification:
    HK AVR330 -> Rotel RB1070 -> Rotel RB1090 -> Plinius SA102 -> Cary 211FE -> Classe M600 -> Boulder 2060
    Subwoofer:
    Infinity Entra2 -> SVS 25-31PCi -> SVS 25-31PC+ -> Dual JL Audio F113v2
  • kevhed72kevhed72 Posts: 4,195
    steveinaz wrote: »
    Just remember, and worth repeating; "Unrealized losses" are just that, if you don't sell after the bottom falls out. I'm gonna stick with the strategy I've been using for years, and it got me thru 2008 relatively well.
    Nail....head.....explosion. I have to work another 20 years, so I am good.
    cnj2fi139j4a.jpeg


  • Joey_VJoey_V Posts: 7,388
    kevhed72 wrote: »
    steveinaz wrote: »
    Just remember, and worth repeating; "Unrealized losses" are just that, if you don't sell after the bottom falls out. I'm gonna stick with the strategy I've been using for years, and it got me thru 2008 relatively well.
    Nail....head.....explosion. I have to work another 20 years, so I am good.
    cnj2fi139j4a.jpeg


    Yeah there are several strategies to this.

    1. Buy and hold - you never sell. Eventually everything corrects and goes up.
    2. Buy sell and hold - you buy and you sell only in bear markets and then you hold until indicators turn positive and you buy again but at a discounted rate and you ride the wave up. You will miss the entirety of the upswing but you also missed a large portion of the down so generally you end up well above had you simply buy and hold.
    3. 3. Day trade - you simply play the market.

    I do #2. It's still a very long term plan, it takes some volatility out of the portfolio and it protects me in case I need the cash out for some emergency reason.

    .
    Joey's Gear:
    Current Gear:
    Torus RM15 -> Emm Labs TSDx/Bluesound Node 2 -> Emm Labs DAC2x -> Audio Research Reference 40th Anniversary -> Boulder 2060 stereo amp (w/ Audioquest WEL Signature) -> new speakers + JL Audio F113v2 x2
    Rotel RA1592 Super Integrated -> Sonus Faber Olympica 3
    Oppo 105D -> Rotel RC1570 preamp -> Rotel RB1582 amp -> Focal Kanta 2


    Main speakers system evolution over the years:
    Klipsch Promedia 4.1 -> Axiom M22ti -> Sonus Faber Concertino -> Sonus Faber Concerto -> Polk LSi7 -> Polk LSi9 -> Martin Logan Mosaic -> AV123 Onix Ref 1 -> Martin Logan Vantage -> AV123 Strata Mini -> Martin Logan Summit -> Sonus Faber Cremona Auditor -> BW 802D2 -> Sonus Faber Stradivari -> Rockport Avior -> BW 802D3 -> BW 800D3 -> ???

    Old Gear:
    Speakers:
    BW PM1 (3.5/5), CM10s2 (3.75/5), BW800D3 (5/5), Rockport Aviors (5/5), Sonus Faber Stradivari (5/5), BW 802D2 (4.5/5), Martin Logan Summits (4.25/5), Martin Logan Vantage (4/5), Sonus Faber Cremona Auditor (3.75/5), AV123 Strata Mini (3.5/5), ML Mosaic (3.25/5), Onix Ref1 (3/5), Sonus Faber Concerto (2.75/5), SF Concertino (2.5/5), Axiom M22ti (2/5), Polk LSi9 (3/5), LSi7 (2.9/5)
    Source:
    Squeezebox 3 -> PS Audio Digital Link III -> Cary 306/200 CDP -> Cary 306 SACD -> EMM LABS DAC2X/TSDX
    Preamplification:
    Rotel RC1070 -> Rogue Perseus -> Cary SLP98 -> Cary SLP98F1 -> Cary SLP05 (sold and then repurchased) -> ARC 5se -> ARC Ref 40th Anniversary
    Amplification:
    HK AVR330 -> Rotel RB1070 -> Rotel RB1090 -> Plinius SA102 -> Cary 211FE -> Classe M600 -> Boulder 2060
    Subwoofer:
    Infinity Entra2 -> SVS 25-31PCi -> SVS 25-31PC+ -> Dual JL Audio F113v2
  • You know..... there is this other option called Short.. Maybe it's just me.

    Halen
  • tonybtonyb Posts: 32,464
    Aww Joey, you forgot #4.

    Don't invest at all, head to Vegas and put it all on the don't pass line at the craps table.

    #5- Give it all to your cousin Vito who has a line on the game this Sunday.

    #6- put it all on the tip you got from the guy at the newspaper stand who knows a guy, who knows a guy, who made a fortune in South African diamond mines.

    #7- Send it all to a TV Evangelist who promises you God will take care of you for your generosity.

    #8- ....OR just send it to me. You'll never lose money when the market goes down and your gains will be locked in when it rises. You'll also never be able to cash out, wouldn't want you doing something silly with your money now would I ?
    HT SYSTEM-
    Sony 850c 4k
    Pioneer elite vhx 21
    Sony 4k BRP
    SVS SB-2000
    Polk Sig. 20's
    Polk FX500 surrounds

    Cables-
    Acoustic zen Satori speaker cables
    Acoustic zen Matrix 2 IC's
    Wireworld eclipse 7 ic's
    Audio metallurgy ga-o digital cable

    Kitchen

    Sonos zp90
    Grant Fidelity tube dac
    B&k 1420
    lsi 9's
  • Easy RunninEasy Runnin Posts: 458
    Once the market hits bottom or whatever seems low, I'm dumping every cent I have back in.

    Hey Joey, Are you back in yet? The S&P has been on a steady upswing for the past month.

    6c274zi6iqe6.jpg
    S&P.JPG 75.3K
    HT- Samsung PN50B860/Integra DTR 30.3/Rt55 Fronts
    Rt35i Surrounds/Cs1000p Center/SVS BP1000 Sub
    2CH - B&K MC-101 pre/B&K EX-442 amp/NAD 2400 amp
    Polk SDA1C, Polk Monitor 7, New Large Advents and Polk RTA 8T
    BR - Yamaha CR800/Polk monitor 5
  • mhardy6647mhardy6647 Posts: 25,814
    Nah, he's buyin' cans of Dinty Moore Beef Stew & buryin' em for a rainy day.

    ;- )
  • madmaxmadmax Posts: 12,438
    When stock prices go down so don't used audio prices, I'm ready to invest!
    Vinyl, the final frontier...

    Avantgarde horns, 300b tubes, thats the kinda crap I want... :D
Sign In or Register to comment.

Howdy, Stranger!

It looks like you're new here. If you want to get involved, click one of these buttons!