The road to hell is paved with good intentions...
steveinaz
Posts: 19,536
....to paraphrase A Randy Travis song.
Time to tell this story. Names won't be mentioned, because in the grand scheme of things it doesn't matter "who."
A cautionary tale about having a little too much trust:
I'm a trust first, judge later kind of person. I like to think that generally people will do the right thing if I feel a basis of integrity exists---and furthermore, I'm willing to take a risk every now and then in an effort to boost my own faith in people. Almost my entire time in the Army, I had a ritual of leaving a $20 bill on my desk, 24/7, 365 days a year---why, you ask?---I like to know the character of those I work with. In my 15 years of serving, the $20 never disappeared. Sometimes it sat there while I was on 30, even 45 days of leave--untouched upon my return. It made me feel good about the people I worked with.
I don't "hate" people, or anything really. To me, hate makes about as much sense as a monkey slinging its **** in a cage--it serves no purpose, really. It's a wasted emotion in my opinion; to hate means you must of loved it at some time, and no one I've ever loved have I grown to hate. But I do disconnect from people, and when I do that, it's a done deal. First time, shame on you, second time shame on me kinda thing. I'm babbling.
Back in July of 2008, I sold an item here in the FM. The item was sold with the understanding that payments would be made--and that's all good. In fact my exact words to the individual were: "pay what you can, when you can" when he fell on hard times. I received 2 small payments, 1 in 08, and 1 in Jan 09, then nothing. Contact lost. Emails unanswered--Emails, mind you, where I simply asked for contact---not harping about money due.
It isn't about the money. I'll blow $600 in a night in Vegas, it's the damn principle of the thing. My $20 bill is missing, and the blow to my image of so-called trusted members is far more severe than a measly 600 bucks.
Moral of the story---If nothing else, always maintain your integrity. Had this person simply made contact with me, I was going to announce "Happy Birthday" the preamp is yours, paid in full, don't send another cent---but I waited, and waited, and waited....nothing.
Have honor people. Have integrity. Have humility. It's ok to back out, it's not ok to just disappear.
Time to tell this story. Names won't be mentioned, because in the grand scheme of things it doesn't matter "who."
A cautionary tale about having a little too much trust:
I'm a trust first, judge later kind of person. I like to think that generally people will do the right thing if I feel a basis of integrity exists---and furthermore, I'm willing to take a risk every now and then in an effort to boost my own faith in people. Almost my entire time in the Army, I had a ritual of leaving a $20 bill on my desk, 24/7, 365 days a year---why, you ask?---I like to know the character of those I work with. In my 15 years of serving, the $20 never disappeared. Sometimes it sat there while I was on 30, even 45 days of leave--untouched upon my return. It made me feel good about the people I worked with.
I don't "hate" people, or anything really. To me, hate makes about as much sense as a monkey slinging its **** in a cage--it serves no purpose, really. It's a wasted emotion in my opinion; to hate means you must of loved it at some time, and no one I've ever loved have I grown to hate. But I do disconnect from people, and when I do that, it's a done deal. First time, shame on you, second time shame on me kinda thing. I'm babbling.
Back in July of 2008, I sold an item here in the FM. The item was sold with the understanding that payments would be made--and that's all good. In fact my exact words to the individual were: "pay what you can, when you can" when he fell on hard times. I received 2 small payments, 1 in 08, and 1 in Jan 09, then nothing. Contact lost. Emails unanswered--Emails, mind you, where I simply asked for contact---not harping about money due.
It isn't about the money. I'll blow $600 in a night in Vegas, it's the damn principle of the thing. My $20 bill is missing, and the blow to my image of so-called trusted members is far more severe than a measly 600 bucks.
Moral of the story---If nothing else, always maintain your integrity. Had this person simply made contact with me, I was going to announce "Happy Birthday" the preamp is yours, paid in full, don't send another cent---but I waited, and waited, and waited....nothing.
Have honor people. Have integrity. Have humility. It's ok to back out, it's not ok to just disappear.
Source: Bluesound Node 2i - Preamp/DAC: Benchmark DAC2 DX - Amp: Parasound Halo A21 - Speakers: MartinLogan Motion 60XTi - Shop Rig: Yamaha A-S501 Integrated - Shop Spkrs: Elac Debut 2.0 B5.2
Post edited by steveinaz on
Comments
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Totally agree. I cant sleep at night if I have your $20. You have to be able to look at yourself in the mirror everyday and like what you see.
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Totally agree Steve. I have had people disappear and I would have forgotten everything if contact had been made. Too much pride gets in the way sometimes.Michael
In the beginning, all knowledge was new!
NORTH of 60° -
Exactly, I feel sorry for him---seriously. I don't know why he couldn't trust me the way I trusted him.Source: Bluesound Node 2i - Preamp/DAC: Benchmark DAC2 DX - Amp: Parasound Halo A21 - Speakers: MartinLogan Motion 60XTi - Shop Rig: Yamaha A-S501 Integrated - Shop Spkrs: Elac Debut 2.0 B5.2
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I just wish the guy would contact me at least, I'd still let'em off the hook--but I have to know that I'm just not being snubbed--ya know? Lesson learned for me, and it would let him get some self-respect restored, and I'm cool with that.Source: Bluesound Node 2i - Preamp/DAC: Benchmark DAC2 DX - Amp: Parasound Halo A21 - Speakers: MartinLogan Motion 60XTi - Shop Rig: Yamaha A-S501 Integrated - Shop Spkrs: Elac Debut 2.0 B5.2
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Folk's, don't ever let yourself think you can't dig your way out--you can; but when you get so frustrated, and down with yourself that you turn "bad guy" nothing good ever comes of it.Source: Bluesound Node 2i - Preamp/DAC: Benchmark DAC2 DX - Amp: Parasound Halo A21 - Speakers: MartinLogan Motion 60XTi - Shop Rig: Yamaha A-S501 Integrated - Shop Spkrs: Elac Debut 2.0 B5.2
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I just wish the guy would contact me at least, I'd still let'em off the hook--but I have to know that I'm just not being snubbed--ya know? Lesson learned for me, and it would let him get some self-respect restored, and I'm cool with that.
I don't know the what or who in your situation, but I do know that some people's consciences allow them to do stuff like that with them being bothered by it all.
Thankfully, I'm not one of them.My equipment sig felt inadequate and deleted itself. -
still a lot more good people out there than bad.
time to put out a new $20
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Nothing irks me more than someone's lack of integrity and also their fullness of greed. I have encountered people who simply don't care about **** people over for a simple buck. Sometimes it's not even about money, they simply want to be better than you (however they define that). It grates me and makes me think low of mankind.
Thankfully I encounter people who are also just the opposite. I think this place has more of these people. -
Very good post. I know it wasn't the outcome that you had hoped for, but you know that you're a good person and that your $20 shows it. I grew up in a rural area of Ohio and if you didn't have integrity, you had nothing. That was taught to me at a very young age and I truly believe that there are a lot more good people out there than bad.
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Integrity or not....I'd still want my $600. That is no small change. My hats off to you Steve, you are a man of honor, but I sure would like to see you get the pre-amp back or the money. If I made a deal like that, and I couldn't pay up, I'd return the item.
JoeAmplifiers: 1-SAE Mark IV, 4-SAE 2400, 1-SAE 2500, 2-SAE 2600, 1-Buttkicker BKA 1000N w/2-tactile transducers. Sources: Sony BDP CX7000es, Sony CX300/CX400/CX450/CX455, SAE 8000 tuner, Akai 4000D R2R, Technics 1100A TT, Epson 8500UB with Carada 100". Speakers:Polk SDA SRS, 3.1TL, FXi5, FXi3, 2-SVS 20-29, Yamaha, SVS center sub. Power:2-Monster HTS3500, Furman M-8D & RR16 Plus. 2-SAE 4000 X-overs, SAE 5000a noise reduction, MSB Link DAC III, MSB Powerbase, Behringer 2496, Monarchy DIP 24/96. -
steveinaz, I too think along the same lines as you. BUT.. I have met the opposite people in my life. Not many good ones or with merit, scruples or conscience.
Since I've been selling my stereo gear and speakers the past year, I've met alot of great, pure, honest and caring and giving people!!
Almost 50 yrs. of bottom of the barrel and two yrs. at the top. I surely picked the wrong profession to work in all my life!
Now I've met some good people in those 50 yrs. but only honor or respect a couple. Maybe a few.........SAD isn't it.Most people just listen to music and watch movies. I EXPERIENCE them. -
Sorry to hear about this. Some people are not worth the worry. Karma will come back to bite them.Sunfire TGP, Sunfire Cinema Grand, Sunfire 300~2 (2), Sunfire True Sub (2),Carver ALS Platinum, Carver AL III, TFM-55, C-19, C-9, TX-8, SDA-490t, SDA-390t
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One of my very favorite sayings.Dan
My personal quest is to save to world of bad audio, one thread at a time. -
Are you sure he's not dead or otherwise incapacitated? Just saying...
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Sorry for that Steve, you just can't let that one bad experience taint your core belief in people. Has more to do with who you are rather than who he is. **** happens sometimes, just the way it is,just stay true to yourself and move on.HT SYSTEM-
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It's possible something could have happen to him, thats why no name will be given. I would hope that nothing tragic has happened.Source: Bluesound Node 2i - Preamp/DAC: Benchmark DAC2 DX - Amp: Parasound Halo A21 - Speakers: MartinLogan Motion 60XTi - Shop Rig: Yamaha A-S501 Integrated - Shop Spkrs: Elac Debut 2.0 B5.2
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Well considering this guy was posting regularly up through August of 2009, a year after he got the preamp, I'm thinking he had plenty of time to square things away with steve.mdaudioguy wrote: »Are you sure he's not dead or otherwise incapacitated? Just saying...
I know he went through a rough stretch working in car sales and changing jobs and all, but the guy had over a year to make good on the deal before he dissapeared.
He wasn't some newbie guys, he was a regular. We worry so much about the newbs **** us, but often times it's from within our own group that the worst of these scenarios occur.
I still think the good in this place far outweighs the bad, and I commend steve for putting the $20 out there to begin with.
Keep the faith brother, don't let one sour apple spoil the whole deal. -
Hope everything is ok with him, but still crappy deal. He hasnt been on in a while. I am a firm believer in Karma. What goes around comes around.
Pauly
.Life without music would♭ -
Get a rope.~ In search of accurate reproduction of music. Real sound is my reference and while perfection may not be attainable? If I chase it, I might just catch excellence. ~
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Steve,
I am very sorry to hear this happened to you. I understand your wishes and will honor them, I hope if you see them offer to someone though in the FM you might let the seller know, but that is up to you.
You know I spent a lifetime (my choice I suppose) dealing with the thugs, crooks, murderer's, and low level meat market types our society has to offer, it has changed me, I wish I could trust like you, sometimes I can, especially with these guys.
I do hear ya man 20 bucks or what have you (yours is obviously more) is not going to matter much in the big picture, but the way one man will disgrace theirself is something I never understood, except to say they seem to feel no remorse. But I just have seen way too much it. Yes something might have happened but generally those type things somehow become known. I suspect you have tried to communicate to no avail.
Best to you and family.
RT1 -
I don't know the what or who in your situation, but I do know that some people's consciences allow them to do stuff like that with them being bothered by it all.
Thankfully, I'm not one of them.
No conscience = Sociopath
No heart or conscience = Psychopath
Psychopath; Superficially charming, psychopaths tend to make a good first impression on others and often strike observers as remarkably normal. Yet they are self-centered, dishonest and undependable, and at times they engage in irresponsible behavior for no apparent reason other than the sheer fun of it. Largely devoid of guilt, empathy and love, they have casual and callous interpersonal and romantic relationships. -
It's possible something could have happen to him, thats why no name will be given. I would hope that nothing tragic has happened.
That was my first thought being a relatively trusting person, however . . . -
AsSiMiLaTeD wrote: »Well considering this guy was posting regularly up through August of 2009, a year after he got the preamp, I'm thinking he had plenty of time to square things away with steve.
I know he went through a rough stretch working in car sales and changing jobs and all, but the guy had over a year to make good on the deal before he dissapeared.
He wasn't some newbie guys, he was a regular. We worry so much about the newbs **** us, but often times it's from within our own group that the worst of these scenarios occur.
I still think the good in this place far outweighs the bad, and I commend steve for putting the $20 out there to begin with.
Keep the faith brother, don't let one sour apple spoil the whole deal.
I now know of whom we speak. I'm really, really surprised!:( -
With so many shady dealers in our world, it's refreshing and reassuring to know that there are still many people like you, Steve, who look for and believe in the good in people. You help to bring it out, too."Wish I didn't know now what I didn't know then." Bob Seger
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I am as well, but then I've been surprised with the same scenario on here before, so this isn't the first time.hearingimpared wrote: »I now know of whom we speak. I'm really, really surprised!:( -
hearingimpared wrote:I now know of whom we speak. I'm really, really surprised!:(
As do I. I know he was really beat down with jobs and life in general. I guess he just decided to take a hike and leave everyone hanging. That is a shame. I know Steve would have made the gesture he described and that would have been a great thing. I wish the other party would have at least made contact. I know when he first ran into financial problems, several folks here on the forum offered to loan and/or give him some gear. I really liked the guy and I am dissappointed in him. I doubt it was ever his intention to stiff Steve, but it appears he has.
In the business I'm in I've seen a lot of personal financial devastation in the last couple of years and I understand that sometimes it simply overwhelms people to the point they give up, drop out and just go into a shell. They may be depressed, embarrased, etc. and they simply can't cope with anything.
I am in no way condoning what has happened. The recipient should have at least contacted Steve. I hope, that someday he gets turned around and will do the right thing and do what he can to take care of Steve in whatever manner he can.
For now...props to Steve...a good man."Just because youre offended doesnt mean youre right." - Ricky Gervais
"For those who believe, no proof is necessary. For those who don't believe, no proof is possible." - Stuart Chase
"Consistency requires you to be as ignorant today as you were a year ago." - Bernard Berenson -
I am surprised as well and I have tried to contact him as recently as last summer just to see what was up. Around the same time I missed a trip a couple others were taking to see him and pick up some gear.
Hope things are OK and he does the right thing
H9"Appreciation of audio is a completely subjective human experience. Measurements can provide a measure of insight, but are no substitute for human judgment. Why are we looking to reduce a subjective experience to objective criteria anyway? The subtleties of music and audio reproduction are for those who appreciate it. Differentiation by numbers is for those who do not".--Nelson Pass Pass Labs XA25 | EE Avant Pre | EE Mini Max Supreme DAC | MIT Shotgun S1 | Pangea AC14SE MKII | Legend L600 | BlueSound Node 3 - Tubes add soul! -
I had a "friend" call me about 2 months ago, as he had locked his keys in his car and didn't have a dime on him for a locksmith. So I called a local locksmith (from work mind you), put the charge on my check card, and sent them on out to his car to unlock it for him. $60 later he is back on the road.
A week goes by and he tells me "I'll have your money soon." I tell him "Just bring the receipt by so I have it for my records and you can pay me back whenever." Haven't seen or heard from him since. I'll call, text, no response at all.
I guess I paid $60 to figure out this dude is not cool at all....and definitely not a friend. Apparently it could have been more expensive...
I'm still struggling to get out from under my own financial burden, so I could have really used the $60, but like Steve said, it's more the principal than anything else.2007 Club Polk Football Pool Champ
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Trade me your soul for a $600 preamp, and I will make you wildly happy.
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Sometimes people want things badly enough to sacrifice their relationships. I recently lost a friend I had since highschool over $200ish dollars I lent him to help him out in a rough spot. He paid me back half, as per the pay when you can agreement, and his since stopped returning my calls. He lives with another of my old friends, who I've spoken to, and who mentioned that he now lives in mortal terror of seeing my name show up on his cell phone. I didn't want to let a hundred bucks come between me and someoen I've known for almost 10 years, but appraently that's how it's going to work out.
He wouldn't have ended up owing me the money if I needed it, because I'm just not that giving. Because of this, though, it was absolutely no issue whatsoever that he couldn't pay it back.
Sorry to go off on a tangent. Just trying to to relate to your situation a bit.
cheers
