Couple Ordered to Stop Holding Bible Study at Home Without Permit
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<object width="425" height="344"><param name="movie" value="http://www.youtube.com/v/EuAVgWJ28Hw&hl=en&fs=1"></param><param name="allowFullScreen" value="true"></param><param name="allowscriptaccess" value="always"></param><embed src="http://www.youtube.com/v/EuAVgWJ28Hw&hl=en&fs=1" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" allowscriptaccess="always" allowfullscreen="true" width="425" height="344"></embed></object>I refuse to argue with idiots, because people can't tell the DIFFERENCE!
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That is the funniest thing I have seen in quite a while Obieone. ROFL. The friggin flame thrower had me in tears.
Heres another related story.
BONITA, Calif. -- A local pastor said the County has cited him for hosting a weekly Bible study in his home. The County said visitors who drive to those meetings are affecting traffic in the neighborhood.
Pastor David Jones has been hosting weekly Bible studies at his Bonita home during the past five years. About 15 people attend the meetings, he told 10News.
Jones said a visitor to a neighbor's house called the County after a Bible study member hit the visitor’s car while leaving. Shortly after, a county code enforcement officer gave him a citation that said he needed a permit to host the weekly Bible study meetings, he said.
Jones and his attorneys sid he shouldn't have to get a permit for what he does inside his house. "We think it is clearly permissible. We think this is a violation of our constitutional rights," Jones told 10News.
A County spokeswoman says the County is concerned with parking and its impact on the neighborhood.
The two sides met Wednesday but resolved nothing.
Jones said they're scheduled to meet again on June 9.My Main Gear
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In solving the parking and the traffic problems, what if they just car pooled to the place? Seems the parking and traffic problem would be solved however I guess they would still need to pay for the permit huh.
Halen -
I love how some of you think that because 51-53% of the population of California votes Democratic, that ALL Californians are a**hole socialists. You're right though, let's alienate the other 47-9% of Californians that vote Republican, Independant, or in general hate stupid crap like this.
As a Californian and a libertarian, I think your comments demonstrate a certain amount of ignorance and short-sightedness. Most of the Californians I know who now live (either in vacation homes or in full time residences) in other states (namely Arizona and Nevada) do so to ESCAPE the overzealous "Left" in California, NOT to bring it with them.
Bash California all you want, and God knows it deserves most of it, but remember, there are still those in California that don't agree with the crappy decisions our leftist legislature have made to put us in this F*cked up situation in the first place.
Now, with regards to the issue at hand, I have to deal with never being able to find a "guest" parking spot for when we have friends over because our stupid neighbors can never park in their garages because they have ten tons of crap in their garages and therefore park in the guest spots full time.
I used to be a huge supporter of Fox News, but honestly, this isn't an attack on Christians; it's the neighbors getting pissed off at not having any parking spaces.
That said, $10,000 permit isn't going to solve any problems, just serve as a deterrent to continuing the 'infraction' or whatever you want to call it. -
Those County folks would be phartin the Beatitudes if they tried that here. The neighbors can complain but the G-man is outside of the Constitution. 15 people can gather at a home without harrassment by the government.>
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I live in RURAL S.C. and a couple of years ago, a relative in MA was telling me how, AFTER they'd spent $1,000's of dollars to build a fence, they were THREATENED by the town that they might have to take it down, or face serious fines. Because they didn't get permission from THEM, to build a fence on their OWN PROPERTY!!!
Needless to say, I was laughing the whole time!
Sorry, but I don't feel pity for schmucks who put up with abuse.I refuse to argue with idiots, because people can't tell the DIFFERENCE! -
I heard of this during the morning in passing and have not had a chance to verify details to my rigourous (but probaby loose in the larger consideration of things) satisfaction. What was understood is that so many people was coming to their house, what was happening constitued a church gathering, not a Bible study among several individuals.
With assemblies of any significant size, regardless of purpose, things get complicated real fast. First fire codes kick in. 'can't have the building/house catching fire and killing everyone via the fire or a stampede. Then there is parking, etc, etc.
I'm not saying what these folks were doing was wrong or some out of control local government are at blame here, but there is a reason some of these regulations exist. The best ones are to protect the attendees if something were to go wrong and/or to maintain a sanitary environment.
A couple of years back a local B&B having private group sex/swap parties was shut down. Not on moral grounds, but the attendee presence had gotten too large. The situation was a big laugh locally, but the reason to crack down on the B&B by the town was legitimate and for reasons stated. -
JohnLocke88 wrote: »I love how some of you think that because 51-53% of the population of California votes Democratic, that ALL Californians are a**hole socialists. You're right though, let's alienate the other 47-9% of Californians that vote Republican, Independant, or in general hate stupid crap like this.
Thank you, as a native Californian, I agree. All the freaks out here are transplants. So with the general feeling about natives, give us some support to help them a little further west:D, if you know what I mean :cool: -
I live in RURAL S.C. and a couple of years ago, a relative in MA was telling me how, AFTER they'd spent $1,000's of dollars to build a fence, they were THREATENED by the town that they might have to take it down, or face serious fines. Because they didn't get permission from THEM, to build a fence on their OWN PROPERTY!!!
Needless to say, I was laughing the whole time!
Sorry, but I don't feel pity for schmucks who put up with abuse.
The reason those laws are in place is to protect the welfare of the community.
What if you lived in a neighborhood and the shmuck next to you built a fence and did a half **** job, then the next time a wind storm came through a section of the fence ripped off, flew into your yard, and killed your five year old kid? Or smashed a chunk out of your house?
Because the dumbass went to Home Depot and bought a bunch of crap to build a fence, had no experience, didn't know the code, and why the code exists?
It takes money to run a department of people to be sure that people build things that meet safety requirements, that are usually in place for a reason.
Paying a fee to have the town approve your plans and an engineer to come out and be sure the Right Thing is being done and sign off on the project seems quite reasonable to me. -
The only fence that needs to be built properly is the one between the government and our rights.>
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Speaking of the government, that reminds me that I don't need sex.
The government Fu(ks me everyday.~ In search of accurate reproduction of music. Real sound is my reference and while perfection may not be attainable? If I chase it, I might just catch excellence. ~ -
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No, I get that from my wife.....bless her heart.~ In search of accurate reproduction of music. Real sound is my reference and while perfection may not be attainable? If I chase it, I might just catch excellence. ~
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Polkersince85 wrote: »The only fence that needs to be built properly is the one between the government and our rights.
Like the right of every American to build structures on their property that endanger not only their own life (I'm fine with that) but also the life and safety of their neighbors?
A friend of mine just built a deck. Had to pay $30, go show the plans of the deck to the permit guy. Then someone had to come out and sign off on it to be sure it was done correctly and was a safe structure.
Won't get an argument from me. -
The reason those laws are in place is to protect the welfare of the community.
What if you lived in a neighborhood and the shmuck next to you built a fence and did a half **** job, then the next time a wind storm came through a section of the fence ripped off, flew into your yard, and killed your five year old kid? Or smashed a chunk out of your house?
Because the dumbass went to Home Depot and bought a bunch of crap to build a fence, had no experience, didn't know the code, and why the code exists?
It takes money to run a department of people to be sure that people build things that meet safety requirements, that are usually in place for a reason.
Paying a fee to have the town approve your plans and an engineer to come out and be sure the Right Thing is being done and sign off on the project seems quite reasonable to me.
I'm glad I don't live in one of those communities or near you.Political Correctness'.........defined
"A doctrine fostered by a delusional, illogical minority and rabidly promoted by an unscrupulous mainstream media, which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible to pick up a t-u-r-d by the clean end."
President of Club Polk -
Thank you, as a native Californian, I agree. All the freaks out here are transplants. So with the general feeling about natives, give us some support to help them a little further west:D, if you know what I mean :cool:
Don't the natives have their own legislature over in California? Casinos and all.
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Don't the natives have their own legislature over in California? Casinos and all.
It's all part of the master plan for a new nation
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Patient: "Doc, it hurts when I do this..."
Doc: "Well, then, don't do that!"
The reason I told that joke was to prove a point: If YOU don't like bending over, then DON'T!!I refuse to argue with idiots, because people can't tell the DIFFERENCE! -
What if you lived in a neighborhood and the shmuck next to you built a fence and did a half **** job, then the next time a wind storm came through a section of the fence ripped off, flew into your yard, and killed your five year old kid? Or smashed a chunk out of your house?
Because the dumbass went to Home Depot and bought a bunch of crap to build a fence, had no experience, didn't know the code, and why the code exists?
Well at least you're not overly dramatic at all. :rolleyes:If you will it, dude, it is no dream. -
another classical example of people and governments using wrong methods to tackle a problem. the crux of he issue here is not what is going on in the home, but the disruption having that gathering might be causing to the neighborhood.
Why actually work the real problem when you can make it about religion and thus create a possible constitutional case in front of the supreme court:rolleyes:? I'm just saying there has to be a better way to handle it than calling the county and having them go to the door asking "do you say Amem?" etc. I'm not terribly religious, and that STILL scares me a little.
solutions?, simple. have the community get together with the town and enact tough parking regulations. cant have a gathering too large if there is no place to park can you. (I still maintain 15 people cant be too much of a biggie, but if a neighbor of mine had...say...50 people over every week.....it might be a problem)
set up no parking zones. if people park in them......time for a tow. all this, and less grounds for a constitutional fight because you are actually addressing the problem at hand, not the reason why people are getting together.Living Room 2 Channel -
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ohskigod wrote:solutions?, simple. have the community get together with the town and enact tough parking regulations. cant have a gathering too large if there is no place to park can you. (I still maintain 15 people cant be too much of a biggie, but if a neighbor of mine had...say...50 people over every week.....it might be a problem)
set up no parking zones. if people park in them......time for a tow. all this, and less grounds for a constitutional fight because you are actually addressing the problem at hand, not the reason why people are getting together.
Sounds ok on the surface. BUT what if one of the neighbors wants to have a family reunion at their home? It's not unusual for that to happen and 40-50 (or more) people attend. How about a party of any sort in one's home? What about a Polk Fest like at Troy's or Ted's or Mark's? Under those strict parking regs those events could not occur. There are a myriad of events that one may want to hold at their home where the parking spills over into the neighborhood...it is just a part of living in close proximity to one's neighbors. How is not allowing a person to have a large group of people at their home the right thing to do? I'm not sure it would be right to limit the number of events one could have either. At best it would be setting an arbitrary number.
To me this sounds like a bitchy neighbor...that just likes to complain. :rolleyes:"Just because youre offended doesnt mean youre right." - Ricky Gervais
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OK, I got two problems here.
First off, if some lame-brain drove in to someone else's car, call the police, REPORT THE ACCIDENT and then get the offender's INSURANCE COMPANY TO PAY FOR IT! Citing a single accident as a reason for citing a guy for unlawful congregation is insane!
Secondly, that unlawful congregation was 15 PEOPLE! Holy hell, I gather more than that when my family comes over for a birthday party! My **** neighbors have parties where as many as 60 people show up. Sometimes they even block my driveway and I have to walk in to the middle of the party and yell over the music a license plate number that has 5 seconds to move the vehicle attached to that license plate before it gets violently yanked out of the way by a much bigger vehicle.
Hell, the Polkfests tend to gather 2-4 times as many people at a house.
The whole thing is lame and was handled quite improperly. Whether it was in The Peoples' Socialist Republic of Kalifornia or not.Expert Moron Extraordinaire
You're just jealous 'cause the voices don't talk to you! -
What I don't understand is why didn't the complaining neighbors just go over and talk to the people?
All it would have taken is for the couple to talk to the attendees and say to them "hey, when you come over, try parking down the road, or over a block or two and then walk to the house instead of trying to park as close as you can"
Jstas has it right there ... some bitchy neighbor who called the police instead of just talking to the neighbors and trying to work things out in a civil manner. -
Like the right of every American to build structures on their property that endanger not only their own life (I'm fine with that) but also the life and safety of their neighbors?
A friend of mine just built a deck. Had to pay $30, go show the plans of the deck to the permit guy. Then someone had to come out and sign off on it to be sure it was done correctly and was a safe structure.
Won't get an argument from me.
The problem with your argument is that the Authority Having Jurisdiction (AHJ) can't be held liable even if the AHJ signs off on the plans and it still kills the 5 year old kid.
Permits are money makers, plain and simple. If it looks like a tax, quacks like a tax, and especially smells like a tax....then it its. If permits weren't major money makers, then how come so many AHJ's are raising sales taxes and other taxes since the permit fees have dried up in the current economy???
WesLink: http://polkarmy.com/forums
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Exactly. Poetic justice, dontja think? Dumbasses. They want to be controlled, they're being controlled. Ain't socialism wonderful?
There was a guy from Kali on one of the gun forums I frequent, whining for help from other states' members. He got no love. You all choose to vote for these a-holes, you live with it. You won't rally for your cause, because, "well, that's just too much work and someone should do it for me."
I LOVE it. Kalifornians, you made your own bed, now sleep in it.
Maybe some of you gun-toting California-haters should attend one of these bible study meetings.
"Love thy neighbor as you would love yourself" - Jesus Christ(ian).
I thought this was supposed to be a fun audio forum anyway.
God Bless you."The good thing about science is that it's true whether or not you believe in it." Neil deGrasse Tyson. -
The problem with your argument is that the Authority Having Jurisdiction (AHJ) can't be held liable even if the AHJ signs off on the plans and it still kills the 5 year old kid.
Permits are money makers, plain and simple. If it looks like a tax, quacks like a tax, and especially smells like a tax....then it its. If permits weren't major money makers, then how come so many AHJ's are raising sales taxes and other taxes since the permit fees have dried up in the current economy???
Wes
You got that right. Three years ago I added a new entranceway and garage to my house. Here's some of my experience with the inspectors.
1. Mechanical inspector. I had to add two new heat ducts for the addition, which have to be inspected. He walked into the basement, and slapped "approved" on the ten year old furnace, he did ask if it was gas or electric, while leaning on the gas pipe!:rolleyes: Never came within 40 feet of the new ductwork.
2. Rough framing inspector. Failed, because I had no plumbing permit. Never mind that I was not installing any plumbing, or that if I was, that would have been the mechanical inspectors job. They did charge me an extra $75 though, to come back and approve it, once I explained that there was no plumbing!
3. Final inspection. Came to the front door, never even came in. Gave us the approval and was there less than 2 minutes. This was the same guy that failed us for not having a plumbing permit.
Safety doesn't seem to be the main concern here. Collecting over $700 in permit fees was definitely the main objective. -
If it looks like a tax, quacks like a tax, and especially smells like a tax....then it its.
Sure it is. And it pays for people who make sure that people adding things to their house do it according to building code. Great, that isn't going to happen for free. -
Safety doesn't seem to be the main concern here. Collecting over $700 in permit fees was definitely the main objective.
I never said that I was in favor of what you are talking about here, this is obviously a situation where you live in a f*kced up community.
Maybe the difference is I live in a small town where people know each other, and things like permits really are there to protect the safety of the community.
If you live somewhere where it's all about raking in cash ....
Obviously this is a situation where if someone here lives in a community like yours, then you will argue permits suck and are all about taxing you and you're right. Inspectors don't give a crap, they want money.
If you live somewhere like me where permit fees are reasonable, and inspectors come over and look at things and honestly care and talk to you about codes and safety and are checking things out to be sure you are safe, a future resident will be safer, etc ... then that's great.
Neither of us are incorrect, it's just our arguments and opinions are based on our local experiences and are different based on those experiences. -
Maybe some of you gun-toting California-haters should attend one of these bible study meetings.
"Love thy neighbor as you would love yourself" - Jesus Christ(ian).
I thought this was supposed to be a fun audio forum anyway.
God Bless you.
"He that hath no sword, let him sell his garment and buy one."
Jesus, Luke 22:36>
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