Does anyone use equalizers anymore?

Conradicles

lightman1 wrote: »

You 2ch in the GARAGE!

That is why I need an EQ.:o

Hillbilly61

I had a friend years ago who owned a parametric equalizer. 12 frequency ranges/channel (sub octave level) with a pink noise generator and mike. Cool device. You could set it on auto calibrate mode and it will generate pink noise. The feeback via the mike allowed the equalizer to make the room as sound neutral as possible by adjusting the output frequency sound pressure level. By definition that included nuances introduced by the specific speaker placement too.

My friend also preferred his sound ever so slightly warm. After adjusting for the room/speaker placement, he'd tinker with the tone controls to achieve a pleasing refinement.

Equalization seems to have its place. Otherwise basic treble, mid and bass controls would have disappeared from audio equipment years ago. For the record, I do not have an equalizer, never have had one, but one day might have one (provided it had all of the controls and calibration features my friend's equalizer had). IMO basic five frequency equalizers seem to be nothing more than fancy treble/mid/bass controls.

lightman1

Conradicles wrote: »

That is why I need an EQ.:o

I have a TEAC EQA-5 you can have. 10 bands per channel AND a tape monitor loop. That roll-up door may cause some nasty refraction, though.:rolleyes:

joeparaski

I have always owned eq's since the 70's and always used them to tailor the sound to the way I like it. Then I joined this forum and discovered that there is a whole world of "eq-less" people out there. (yes, I was in my own little audio world). So...I figured what the heck, let me go "pure" with no tone controls and see what happens.

So I disconnected my eq from the chain for many months. Did that convert me?..no, I'm back with my SAE 2800 parametric eq and I enjoy the sound much more. I don't care about preserving the purity of the original recording, heck it's already been modified by the engineers. I don't care about adding another component in the signal path, "I" happen to like having many components. I don't care if Mr. Golden Ears doesn't like the sound from my gear, "I" happen to like it.

I did trim down to 2 eq's though. The big SAE 2800 for the HT rig and the smaller SAE 1800 for the 2-channel rig. In my opinion, the eq brings the music to life for me.

We all don't hear sounds the same way. Perhaps my 51 year old ears need some help, because if I don't boost up the treble a bit, or bring in some more bass, it doesn't sound right to me.

I heard those mega-buck systems at the audio show. And though they sounded good, frankly I would have liked to hear more bass in the music I was listening to.

There are times when my gear, for reasons unknown, sounds like crap. And yet there are many more times when I'm just sitting there with a huge grin on my face, soaking in the sweets sounds emanating from my EQ'D SDA's.

So there, I'm an Equaliser user, I freely and openly admit this and I am proud of it.

Joe

ben62670

Joe you need to tighten things up a little my friend;) All that pro gear, and probably lack of decent cabling is hindering your experience. I am saying this with kindness, and as a suggestion Bro.
Love ya.
Ben

joeparaski

Ben, all the system is apart once again. I was hearing "noise" from one of the amps so I sent it out to get checked by this new guy I met last year. He is an electrical engineer and an audio/music nut. He has already restored several of my amps and now I'm going through the rest of the amps and gear once more to be certain that they are all in top shape.

Almost all my cabling is from Audio Art, there is no cheapie stuff anywhere. All the amps have upgraded power cords, and most have had the binding posts and rca connectors upgraded too. He replaced many capacitors and "thingies" in the amps also. Adjusted the bias and "whatever" needed adjusting. (Sorry, I don't remember the technical jargon).

He found quite a few issues in some components such as oxidation and weak solders. Not surprising considering the age of some of those components.

He is also servicing the gear for a Marantz nutcase and a Sansui nutcase...the Sansui guy has just about every piece of gear Sansui ever built and is putting together a Sansui museum.

All this to say that I am dedicated to bringing this vintage gear to "like new" condition and bring the sound quality up to the ultimate potential of the existing gear. The final topping will be the upgrading of the SRS crossovers, which will be done by the best guy I know of....YOU!

Joe

ben62670

I wish I knew half the **** people think I know:p

jinjuku

ben62670 wrote: »

Joe you need to tighten things up a little my friend;) All that pro gear, and probably lack of decent cabling is hindering your experience. I am saying this with kindness, and as a suggestion Bro.
Love ya.
Ben

Ignore him Joe. If you have a different opinion than the regulars here your gear is junk.

You mention another audio enthusiasts web site and that site (no matter the site) are all sheeple that think all amps sound the same.

As long as you enjoy your setup, as long as you enjoy the benefits that your particular electronics bring you, rock on.

I have never seen so many people beat down others with valid opinions. I thought cliques like this were over with in high school. You need to drive a $1000 speaker with $3K of electronics and uber expensive cabling.

lightman1

Where in the hell did that come from?
May I haves him for him for my play toys, masters? Please! I will treats him nice and make sure he has lotions on his pretty skins.

blakeh

I have never seen so many people beat down others with valid opinions. I thought cliques like this were over with in high school.

Jesus, half your posts are about how much you hate the tone, people, opinions, cliques, posts, and direction of this forum. Unlike high school, you don't HAVE to be here. Why not move on somewhere else where you'd feel more appreciated? Posting acerbic opinion after acerbic opinion really just makes you look rather sad.

The reason you hang around is because you're a troll who likes drama. Why else hang around people you don't like? You've listed a litany of other audio forums that you like better, and that you claim have more accurate information and people who think like you. After awhile it's not really annoying that you're here ranting and raving after just signing up for the forum, but perplexing. Why waste all this time and energy?

What kind of idiot tries a restaurant and finds he hates the food, decor, presentation, waitstaff, location and theme yet comes back every night for another helping ranting and raving all the while?

Move on to greener pastures.

Face

jinjuku wrote: »

have never seen so many people beat down others with valid opinions. I thought cliques like this were over with in high school. You need to drive a $1000 speaker with $3K of electronics and uber expensive cabling.

What if your speakers are more than $1,000?

ben62670

jinjuku wrote: »

Ignore him Joe. If you have a different opinion than the regulars here your gear is junk.

You mention another audio enthusiasts web site and that site (no matter the site) are all sheeple that think all amps sound the same.

As long as you enjoy your setup, as long as you enjoy the benefits that your particular electronics bring you, rock on.

I have never seen so many people beat down others with valid opinions. I thought cliques like this were over with in high school. You need to drive a $1000 speaker with $3K of electronics and uber expensive cabling.

You sir are an idiot. Most people are ignoring you. I have actually spoken with Joe on the phone, and I consider him a friend;) My post was friendly advice:)
Thanks
Ben

lightman1

May I? Pleeeease?

treitz3

Polkapolka, to answer your question(s). There are a lot of reasons folks use EQ"s and a lot of reasons folks do not. You have already learned of some of them. Please allow me to introduce another perspective.

I have had many an EQ starting back when I was around 8 years old or so. I have had 2 EQ's in the same rig. I have had 8-band all the way up to a dual channel 48 band EQ, both pro and home [actually, home was at a dual 30 band EQ tops]. Some EQ's had the spectrum analyzers, pink noise, white noise, phase.....blah, blah, blah.

That said, there are some things that with an EQ you can learn. Some good, some bad. A lot of it has to do with where you are in your audio journey. Here's why, at least in my opinion. Hear me out.

When you start on your audio journey, usually an EQ helps out. Not only can you improve [to your ears] what the sound can be shaped like.....you can also learn what frequencies do what. Like a lower frequency will boost a drum kick or a lightening strike as well as a voice that's hard to hear might be improved a bit by adding some emphasis to the 1Kh frequency. Here's another example. When the tweeter of your rig makes your ears bleed? Well, tone down the 18KHz or associated bands to tame the top end. That, to me, is part of the learning curve. An EQ can and will let you know how to shape the sound to achieve what you may want in its reproductive qualities.

As you move on in your audio journey [provided your gear moves up the chain as well] and you discover new and exciting things when it comes to audio, things change a little bit...at least this was the case in my audio journey. One may discover that the use of an EQ no longer gets the dreaded "U" shaped curve whilst at the same time boosting the bass and treble to max. That, in itself is the absolute #1 reason new to the hobby folks blow up speakers and dick out an amplifier. Not to mention, it sounds like ****. Well, that depends on where you are in your journey though. Many folks like this setup. Why? Hell if I know. I have never figured that one out since I was a virgin in this hobby.

Back to my point. As one moves on, the EQ gets less and less emphasis. Whether it be from gain or attenuation of a particular frequency. One exception being room nulls or spikes. The knowledge gained by years of tuning the system to your liking starts to pay off. As one swaps gear, it is quick for the EQ to make up for the differences in the new gear thrown into the loop.

Now, here's where the differences and both sides of the fence come to a clash. When you are at the point of losing the EQ. When the EQ is gone, now you have to rely on experience with frequencies to get what you once were able to quickly achieve using the EQ. Since it is gone, you can no longer get the quick fix. You actually have to work toward getting all that you had before but this time? Man, it sucks because there is no instant fix.

So, you move on in your audio journey. You swap gear, you try new things, you listen to new music, you expand your audio horizons to achieve what you once had. You learn this thing called synergy. Oh! That sucks because that's one of the hardest things, if not THE hardest thing to achieve in our hobby. It's not as "convenient" as an EQ.

Well, let me tell you this and I've said it before.......convenience = compromise in my book.

Now, as one moves on with their audio journey, they will discover that KISS is their best friend. Not only that, but tone controls are now considered "knobs of sin". There are folks on this thread that said they haven't used tone controls for years. There is a reason for that and unless you are at that point in your audio journey, there is really no point in arguing with them as to why they feel that way. They have just progressed further along the journey that perhaps you might have. There is no shame in that, only wisdom......and sometimes a lot of money spent. :eek:

Now, that said. I have progressed to the point of not using an EQ in my rig for a long time and I for DAMN SURE haven't changed the bass or treble from the flat setting for years. I have relied upon other things in the rig to influence the shaping of the sound as I deem warranted to my ears.

Ok, now you all know basically where I stand with EQ's up until this point. Now, I'd like to share with you what I discovered when I hooked up one hell of an EQ to my latest rig and actually engaged it into the loop.

With the best IC's that I found to [and there were many] not add noise, alteration, coloration or influence the sound, I went ahead and hooked it back up. These are my observations.........

The one thing that I had spent so much money on, had been disrupted. That being the sound stage. The pinpoint spatial imagery had been FUBAR'd. There were phase issues that were audible and though I could boost the top end? There was still something missing. The difference was instead of hearing a natural roll off of a "ping", I heard a ping. That was it. It was more of a sharp ping than a natural ping. The spatial imagery was smeared and the pinpoint imaging was gone. The texture of the music was lost. I had digressed to a sound that I had heard years before. Basically, I took a step back in my audio journey. Tones were incorrect and overall the sound was hampered by something I couldn't put my finger on within the time I have allotted to make this post tonight.

So, I will conclude this post with this. For some folks, an EQ will do you justice. However, for some folks an EQ is just like the "knobs of sin". It all depends on where you are in your own personal audio journey. EQ's can be a good thing to learn and [depending on the gear you use] they can also be the biggest detriment to your rig.

It all boils down to where you are at in your journey. Good luck. Have fun and no matter what, enjoy the ride.

Fongolio

Very well said treitz3. But then I'm one of those whack jobs who likes sonic holography.

lightman1

Jimminy Crickets, Tom. Can you even hear the music anymore? Beyond the critical breakdown of every frequency that you propose to hear?

If not, I'll be glad to give you a white noise test disc and you can put that sucker on loop. Then, be a hyper-critic of each Hz across the spectrum as it relates to the sound you are expecting, wanting to hear from your gear.
People do acually make music in the 15-25k range. It's out there. try listening to some of it. EQ or no EQ. The music is out there, find it and listen.

Lightman

treitz3

Shut up Russ, I was just offering my perspective. Take a bath. I can smell you from here. :eek:

lightman1

treitz3 wrote: »

Shut up Russ.

Music hater! Hz freak!

....Valid points on all parts. I like my Rane 32 band 1/3 octave EQ on certain things. I don't have much faith in the AVR EQ's. BUT, they are handy for a quick fix in a room.
I have mixed a few sessions on the Digi-Q's out there. Most on good days some on bad days. Personally, I don't like them. I like sliders at my finger tips and nice monitors. My opinion.
If you want an Eq in your chain, so be it. I have two set-ups that don't need it and one that I like to hear what happens when I tweak this cycle up and this one flat and maybe a little more low-octave here.....
Trust your ears and don't by the cheap stuff if you want one. Trust your ears and enjoy if you you don't need or want one.
To use a beat up term....Agree to disagree and f*ck everything else.





buncha hacks
Lightman

lightman1

treitz3 wrote: »

Shut up Russ, I was just offering my perspective. Take a bath. I can smell you from here. :eek:

Don't make me get banned here, Tom.

lightman1

Fongolio wrote: »

Very well said treitz3. But then I'm one of those whack jobs who likes sonic holography.

eeewwww!

lightman1

Keiko wrote: »

Russ will only take a bath if Michelle's already in the tub.

Puttin' on my bathing cap and gettin' my rubber-duckey!
Thanks, Mike!:):)

lightman1

Whoa! New pic!

lightman1

How 'bout them EQ's. Yes or no?


Oh Look! Butterflies!

lightman1

Keiko wrote: »

Did you know that in Japan men and women traditionally take baths together? What a country.

Saves water. Small country. Lots of people there. Go figure.

lightman1

jinjuku! Where you at?!

hearingimpared

blakeh wrote: »

I have never seen so many people beat down others with valid opinions. I thought cliques like this were over with in high school.

Jesus, half your posts are about how much you hate the tone, people, opinions, cliques, posts, and direction of this forum. Unlike high school, you don't HAVE to be here. Why not move on somewhere else where you'd feel more appreciated? Posting acerbic opinion after acerbic opinion really just makes you look rather sad.

The reason you hang around is because you're a troll who likes drama. Why else hang around people you don't like? You've listed a litany of other audio forums that you like better, and that you claim have more accurate information and people who think like you. After awhile it's not really annoying that you're here ranting and raving after just signing up for the forum, but perplexing. Why waste all this time and energy?

What kind of idiot tries a restaurant and finds he hates the food, decor, presentation, waitstaff, location and theme yet comes back every night for another helping ranting and raving all the while?

Move on to greener pastures.

That sums jinjuku up perfectly.

BigMac

Eq or no eq, who the F cares really (rhetorical)? Thread after thread of, does "X" make a difference in audio. For some yes and for some no. At the end of the day it's what sounds best to you and what you like in your system. If part of your audio enjoyment is tinkering with every last detail, who are we to say if it's wrong or right. If you have a crappy recording you can modify it all you want but at the end of the day it's still a crappy recording. All together now, lipstick on a pig. Once again, lipstick on a pig.

I say if you have a crappy recording and you HAVE to listen to it, then by all means make use of whatever you can to make it sound better. Me personally, I put in a different version of the recording or just move on to the other 12,353,589,234,095,155,278 songs available that do not sound like crap. Problem solved!!:rolleyes:

jinjuku

hearingimpared wrote: »

That sums jinjuku up perfectly.

I am really not all that worried, just received PM's at AH and AVSForum letting me knowing all the douchery that polksters are known for. Funny thing is they actually named a few specific polksters.

I guess your reputation does proceed you. Any ways there is enough information for an outsider to see what whacko's some of you are.

I participate in this thread not to have drama, but to put real and relevant information out there for someone that might not know better. The only problem is some of the 'know it all's' that really don't know what you think you know.

Enjoy your little club.

jinjuku

treitz3 wrote: »

It all boils down to where you are at in your journey. Good luck. Have fun and no matter what, enjoy the ride.

Very well said. Sorry about the h8t'ers that you have already attracted. It appears that unlike you or I, they handle difference of opinion like a child and really expect new comers to this hobby to follow blindly.

heiney9

jinjuku wrote: »

I am really not all that worried, just received PM's at AH and AVSForum letting me knowing all the douchery that polksters are known for. Funny thing is they actually named a few specific polksters.

I guess your reputation does proceed you. Any ways there is enough information for an outsider to see what whacko's some of you are.

I participate in this thread not to have drama, but to put real and relevant information out there for someone that might not know better. The only problem is some of the 'know it all's' that really don't know what you think you know.

Enjoy your little club.

Ju Ju, the thing you forget is your so called relevent information is just a single opinion and is no more valid than anyone else's opinion. YOU come off as the conceited one by arbitrarily dismissing everyone else's opinion and trying to make your's audio gospel.

If you dig EQ's, add your opinion and move on. You are a troll based on the actions on this board and in particular this thread. Talk out your **** all you want about spreading relevent information. In the end you're just a lonely troll who seems to get off on confrontation.

H9