Need soundproofing advice...

rs159 · February 2003

Ok, maybe not "off-topic", but this doesn't really fit anywhere else.
I will soon be moving all of my gear into the basement

,but there is a problem. The family room is directly above where the HT will be, and my family likes their tv LOUD!!!!! You can hear it all through the basement. :mad: The walls are very solid and soundproof, but that wretched ceiling.. UGH! Luckily, it's only a drop in ceiling so making changes should be easy. What material would work best to isolate the two environments without making everything to dead? Preferable material would be replacement 2'x4' ceiling tile just b/c my **** is lazy and I don't want anything that should be too much work. Also, a removeable ceiling should make wiring jobs rediculously easy. Also must be relatively cheap.

Suggestions? Anybody?

Jstas · February 2003

Hang fiberglas insulation between the ceiling tiles and the floor above. You can hang it with wires and staples between the floor joists. It will deaden sound and keep the temperature in the two rooms much more stable.

rs159 · February 2003

Oh, I forgot to mention - there's allready insul in there (keeps temperature seperate but sound? no way) Perhaps it should be replaced?

RuSsMaN · February 2003

Staying cheap, thats going to be hard.

A boatload of Dynamat would work, I have seen some spray-on dynamat-type stuff out there. I'll see if I can find a link.

Cheers,
Russ

Ceruleance · February 2003

spray on? sounds like a gimic, you need mass to make good soundproofing

Ceruleance · February 2003

hmm, seems to have a following on ebay, I withdraw my previous statement, if it works, it works

rs159 · February 2003

Dynamat - does it deaden the sound of a room too much? I use my system music/movies - 90/10, so I don't want to make the room sound overly dry and synthetic for music.

dthomps · February 2003

Hey- along the lines of dynamat- for my old 240 volvo beast, dynamat makes kits to deaden road noise becasue there is virtually no soundproofing. I took the reccomendation from a volvo forum and used concrete roofing material- which is virtually identical to dynamat in look ( I dont know about functionality) and it works wonders. It is wayyyyyy cheaper too. The dynamat kit was something like 90$ and I did it myself for like 15 bucks.

goingganzo · February 2003

we used a fire bat that is also a sound proofer. it is dencer than fiberglass and itches twice as bad but works great.

Tour2ma · February 2003

Originally posted by rs159
Oh, I forgot to mention - there's allready insul in there (keeps temperature seperate but sound? no way) Perhaps it should be replaced?

If the existing insulation is between the fam room's floor and basement ceiling's drywall, then the sound goes right around it through the beams. (Sound actually loves the denser media).

If you have room, drop an Armstrong (or other) drop ceiling in the basement. The banding that holds it can't carry much, and the tiles and insulation will go far towards killing the sound, even if its only a 6" space. Acoustical tile stapled to the existing ceiling is a less effective option.

madmax · February 2003

I've never really looked into this because I hate drop ceilings anyway but how about **** a layer of drywall to the joists then putting the tiles back up? Some people screw on the drywall then add sand from the upper floor but that would be a real hassle and the sand is meant to help reduce bass energy. I have heard that higher freq such as from a tv can be muffled pretty easily with soft foam. Maybe some of those cheap foam bedding foams laying on top of the drop tiles?
madmax

mantis · February 2003

Isn't dynamat a car product??
Anyway I'm going to use acoustiblox.I have installed it many times and the **** works well.It's heavy dense rubber.You can buy it in rolls.Expensive but well worth it.

www.acoustiblox.com

rs159 · February 2003

I really think anything that replaced, sit on top of, whatever... the tile ceiling would be more effective since very little of it would actually be touching the upper floor, so it transfers less energy. By the way, the tv has some midbass performance, and the system in the basement would certainly have a lot more low end punch and rumble, so bass damping is a must.

madmax · February 2003

This morning on a home improvement radio talk show they were talking about little s shaped thingys that you used when putting up drywall which isolates vibration. I have no clue how they are used or what they look like but it might be worth checking into.
madmax

Tour2ma · February 2003

rs, sorry to disagree, but the beams are the real issue here.

Yes, max... I remember these isolators now as well. Ones I have seen were not "S's", but more of a sponge rubber grommet. Basically anything that keeps the surface of the drywall from touching the beams will work...

One downside of the drop ceiling I did not mention earlier is that they can create "buzz and rattle" issues themselves. This is especially around light fixtures. So while they'd solve the upstairs issue, they can create listening room issues. Solvable, but pesky..

rs159 · February 2003

Actually, all of the light fixtures I will be taking out and instead using wall mounted lights. They will look better in the room I think. And did I make myself clear? The drop in ceiling allready exists, in time and space and in 3 dimensions. It works, kinda - even when the tv is on loud, words are hard to make out from in the basement, but there is definately a considerable amount of bass leakage. Think about it, if the little 5 inch speakers in the tv can be heard through the ceiling, what would an SVS 20-39 be like? That's why I'm worried about maximum bass damping between the two rooms.

Tour2ma · February 2003

rs,
Sorry... somehow I got it my head that you had a solid ceiling affixed to the beams... re-read and clearly not the case... wasnt you it was me... :rolleyes: So now that I am close to being on the right page, a couple more questions

On the drop ceiling How is its metal frame attached to the beams? Straps? Screwed? Other?

You say there is already insulation. Is it lying on the 12x24 ceiling panels? Stapled to the floor above? Other?

How big is the gap between the panels and the floor above and is the whole of it filled with insulation?

rs159 · February 2003

-The frame just hangs from the beams from wire looped thru the holes in the frame
-In insul is stapled to the beams
-I measured ~9 inches between the floor above and the bottom of the insul. The ceiling hangs ~2.5 - 3 inches below the insul

Tour2ma · February 2003

Wow... I gotta get me some of those TV speakers...

Little baffled at this point, but the combo of my raging sinus infection, sinus med's and about four large Amareto's and coffee aren't helping. Think I'll sleep on it.

There are some good suggestions above.

rs159 · February 2003

The tv is a floorstanding model (the tube is built into the cabinet, the woofers are in the cabinet about 6" from the ground, and the cabinet is real wood). So I wonder if just getting the tv up on something to dampen its low frequencies would help. It also makes me wonder if a subwoofer on a concrete floor in a room with cinderblock walls would transfer that much energy to the rest of the house. But then again, hearing "turn that damn thing down" makes me want to act violently and curse like a drunken sailor so...

rs159 · February 2003

I take back what I just said. I put the woofer in the basement 5 minutes ago and all I can say is :supermad: :supermad: :supermad: :supermad: :supermad: . After a little hap-hazard speaker placement, upstairs, anything that wasn't nailed down was rattling. AND THIS WAS WITH THE PSW202!!!!. My final setup will include two psw202s and an svs 20-39. Also, I didn't have any other speakers hooked up, and the crossover on the sub was set as high as it would go. The midrange, even from the sub, got through to the room above. It's gonna take some serious soundproofing to make this workable. :supermad: :supermad: :supermad: BTW, any modifications have to be made from in the basement. Going in from the floor above is something my family doesn't want to be inconvenienced by. :mad:

rs159 · February 2003

BTW, the ceiling tiles vibrate and make noise when the hit the frame. How do you stop that?

rs159 · February 2003

Originally posted by mantis
Isn't dynamat a car product??
Anyway I'm going to use acoustiblox.I have installed it many times and the **** works well.It's heavy dense rubber.You can buy it in rolls.Expensive but well worth it.

www.acoustiblox.com

the link doesn't work and i can't find anything on the web, but I'm beginning to think that might be the best option. Tell me more. How is it attatched? Does it prevent bass leakage? Is there anything else like it?

Tour2ma · February 2003

Here's a bit that fell out of a search on acoustics I just did:

Here are two orgs that look promising:
http://www.acoustics.org/
http://asa.aip.org/acou_and_you.html

Here are two manfs:
http://www.acousticsystems.com/
http://www.acousticsfirst.com/

Still way ill, but on antibiotics at least... hang in there...

MxStYlEpOlKmAn · February 2003

y would u want to soundproof your walls or ceiling or nething? my neighbors came in my mom's store today saying they are tired of hearing this constant thump...I LOVE THIS JUNK MAN! THUMP D THUMP THUMP!

rs159 · February 2003

B/C my family isn't so tolerant. I want to listen at realistic volumes, and I don't want to hear "TURN THAT GODDAMN THING DOWN" every 15 minutes. It isn't for my neighbors or my family, it's for me.

hoosier21 · February 2003

RS

Man you have a real tough problem here. Stopping bass from transfering though the whole house is very hard, the room right above you is even harder to isolate. I can see the dampning material suggested above helping in the mid to high area, but stopping the bass will be nearly impossible. Think of the car driving by your house and how much of the bass energy from it makes it into your house. Now think of your SVS firing away in the basement, right below your family, oh man they are not only going to hear it but FEEL it.

Dr. Spec · February 2003

Originally posted by hoosier21
Now think of your SVS firing away in the basement, right below your family, oh man they are not only going to hear it but FEEL it.

Yes, it's bad news - mine rattles stuff all over the house at high volumes. The floor above is especially bad - it vibrates heavily during strong passages. It has even cracked open drywall joints in other rooms, and once caused a light upstairs to unplug itself from the wall.

I think you're fighting a losing battle. I think you might need to call a truce with the family and agree to times the HT system is in use and times they can watch TV upstairs.

BTW - Hoosier - I put a care package in the mail this morning coming your way - something about the Boss and Charleston, SC

Doc

hoosier21 · February 2003

Cool, I like packages

rs159 · February 2003

All I want is to listen at something more than 60db. I don't care if I can't hit 120db w/ the family in the house, I just don't want to be banned to the headphones.

rs159 · February 2003

Maybe bass shakers or butt kickers or whatever would make the system seem louder without actually turning it up that much? I know it can't compare to actually hearing a loud sound, but I need to be able to listen whenever I want. I can't stand listening to something and being interupted or not being able to listen when I want to so I need that kind of freedom.

Need soundproofing advice...

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