DIY Super Center Channel

Options
1356

Comments

  • Systems
    Systems Posts: 14,873
    edited November 2008
    Options
    Early B. wrote: »
    Ben & GV --

    What do you think about this driver --

    http://www.madisound.com/catalog/product_info.php?products_id=834
    Not bad but won't dig real deep and the xmax is not even close to the Dayton I linked to.I use a variant of this in my mains crossing it over at 60 and 300.hz

    Sensitivity may only be 88db but using 2 will add 6 db.
    Testing
    Testing
    Testing
    · Share on FacebookShare on Twitter
  • Systems
    Systems Posts: 14,873
    edited November 2008
    Options
    ben62670 wrote: »
    I looked at that driver, and yuck! What a bumpy road:eek:
    Which one?If you are reffering to the coax's response shown in the datasheet then yes the tweeters response is a bit rough but this is the raw response without the crossover.With the xover the response will be substantially smoother.

    Several years ago I built a pair of speaks ( even had an article printed in a Speaker Builder ) using the first generation of the SEAS coax.It has a number of benfits that make it a good choice for center channel usage.
    Testing
    Testing
    Testing
    · Share on FacebookShare on Twitter
  • Early B.
    Early B. Posts: 7,900
    edited November 2008
    Options
    megasat16 wrote: »
    And also high efficiency driver with good sound (Fs) is very hard to achieve at this price point. It's like you gotta make a trade off between efficiency and sounds quality and decides what favors you. You can hardly get the best of both world under strict budget.

    Agreed.

    So what are tradeoffs? Perhaps my speakers won't go as low as I want them to. I can live with that. Maybe the speakers aren't high efficiency. I can live with that, too. But sound quality is the most important factor here, so that's where I need to focus my attention.

    I agree with Ben's view of the ribbon tweeter. Yeah, vertical dispersion may be an issue, but it is not enough to rule it out, IMO. The VMPS center channel I sold yesterday was the best one I've owned and it had a ribbon tweeter and a ribbon midrange, but from what I could ascertain from the sitting position, vertical dispersion was never an issue. This center channel will sit even higher.
    HT/2-channel Rig: Sony 50” LCD TV; Toshiba HD-A2 DVD player; Emotiva LMC-1 pre/pro; Rogue Audio M-120 monoblocks (modded); Placette RVC; Emotiva LPA-1 amp; Bada HD-22 tube CDP (modded); VMPS Tower II SE (fronts); DIY Clearwave Dynamic 4CC (center); Wharfedale Opus Tri-Surrounds (rear); and VMPS 215 sub

    "God grooves with tubes."
    · Share on FacebookShare on Twitter
  • Systems
    Systems Posts: 14,873
    edited November 2008
    Options
    Early B. wrote: »

    Yeah, vertical dispersion may be an issue, but it is not enough to rule it out, IMO. The VMPS center channel I sold yesterday was the best one I've owned and it had a ribbon tweeter and a ribbon midrange, but from what I could ascertain from the sitting position
    How long were the ribbons in it?It's less of an issue with shorter ribbons.
    This center channel will sit even higher.
    Ah OK, I initially thought it would be sitting very low.
    Testing
    Testing
    Testing
    · Share on FacebookShare on Twitter
  • Early B.
    Early B. Posts: 7,900
    edited November 2008
    Options
    GV#27 wrote: »
    How long were the ribbons in it?It's less of an issue with shorter ribbons.

    The proposed ribbon tweeter will be 3".
    HT/2-channel Rig: Sony 50” LCD TV; Toshiba HD-A2 DVD player; Emotiva LMC-1 pre/pro; Rogue Audio M-120 monoblocks (modded); Placette RVC; Emotiva LPA-1 amp; Bada HD-22 tube CDP (modded); VMPS Tower II SE (fronts); DIY Clearwave Dynamic 4CC (center); Wharfedale Opus Tri-Surrounds (rear); and VMPS 215 sub

    "God grooves with tubes."
    · Share on FacebookShare on Twitter
  • tryrrthg
    tryrrthg Posts: 1,896
    edited November 2008
    Options
    My advice, build a proven design like the WTMW design built with the Dayton Reference Series drivers. Two 8 inch drivers.

    summarized in these two threads

    http://www.htguide.com/forum/showthread.php4?t=15323

    http://www.htguide.com/forum/showthread.php4?t=22393

    or there is the Statement center channel that uses a ribbon tweet, but only 6.5" mids.

    http://www.htguide.com/forum/showthread.php4?t=27552
    Sony KDL-40V2500 HDTV, Rotel RSX-1067 Receiver, Sony BDP-S550 Blu-ray, Slim Devices Squeezebox, Polk RTi6, CSi3 & R15, DIY sub with Atlas 15
    · Share on FacebookShare on Twitter
  • Systems
    Systems Posts: 14,873
    edited November 2008
    Options
    tryrrthg wrote: »
    My advice, build a proven design like the WTMW design built with the Dayton Reference Series drivers. Two 8 inch drivers.

    summarized in these two threads

    http://www.htguide.com/forum/showthread.php4?t=15323

    http://www.htguide.com/forum/showthread.php4?t=22393

    or there is the Statement center channel that uses a ribbon tweet, but only 6.5" mids.

    http://www.htguide.com/forum/showthread.php4?t=27552
    I have read through some of those threads previously and there are some excellent choices amongst those designs.
    Testing
    Testing
    Testing
    · Share on FacebookShare on Twitter
  • tryrrthg
    tryrrthg Posts: 1,896
    edited November 2008
    Options
    GV#27 wrote: »
    I have read through some of those threads previously and there are some excellent choices amongst those designs.
    Yep, those guys know their ****. I wish I was that knowledgeable about speaker design.
    Sony KDL-40V2500 HDTV, Rotel RSX-1067 Receiver, Sony BDP-S550 Blu-ray, Slim Devices Squeezebox, Polk RTi6, CSi3 & R15, DIY sub with Atlas 15
    · Share on FacebookShare on Twitter
  • ben62670
    ben62670 Posts: 15,969
    edited November 2008
    Options
    I am thinking the RS 7" 4's would be a good option. The Dayton's seem to be a little more honest with their ratings than some of the brand names. They are pretty flat too:)

    Or a wmtmw
    http://www.parts-express.com/pe/pshowdetl.cfm?&DID=7&Partnumber=295-374&ctab=2#Tabs

    http://www.parts-express.com/pe/showdetl.cfm?Partnumber=295-376
    Please. Please contact me a ben62670 @ yahoo.com. Make sure to include who you are, and you are from Polk so I don't delete your email. Also I am now physically unable to work on any projects. If you need help let these guys know. There are many people who will help if you let them know where you are.
    Thanks
    Ben
    · Share on FacebookShare on Twitter
  • ben62670
    ben62670 Posts: 15,969
    edited November 2008
    Options
    http://www.htguide.com/forum/showthread.php4?t=27552 I like some of the speaker designs in the avitars;)

    Love the limited edit feature:rolleyes:
    Please. Please contact me a ben62670 @ yahoo.com. Make sure to include who you are, and you are from Polk so I don't delete your email. Also I am now physically unable to work on any projects. If you need help let these guys know. There are many people who will help if you let them know where you are.
    Thanks
    Ben
    · Share on FacebookShare on Twitter
  • tryrrthg
    tryrrthg Posts: 1,896
    edited November 2008
    Options
    Yep, the Statements look bad ****.

    http://www.geocities.com/cc00541/Statements.html

    http://www.htguide.com/forum/showthread.php4?t=28728
    Sony KDL-40V2500 HDTV, Rotel RSX-1067 Receiver, Sony BDP-S550 Blu-ray, Slim Devices Squeezebox, Polk RTi6, CSi3 & R15, DIY sub with Atlas 15
    · Share on FacebookShare on Twitter
  • Early B.
    Early B. Posts: 7,900
    edited November 2008
    Options
    The Statement is cool, but not big enough. What I want is essentially a large floorstanding speaker for a center channel. Hell, I even thought about using one of my VMPS speakers as a center channel (16x16x44).:p
    HT/2-channel Rig: Sony 50” LCD TV; Toshiba HD-A2 DVD player; Emotiva LMC-1 pre/pro; Rogue Audio M-120 monoblocks (modded); Placette RVC; Emotiva LPA-1 amp; Bada HD-22 tube CDP (modded); VMPS Tower II SE (fronts); DIY Clearwave Dynamic 4CC (center); Wharfedale Opus Tri-Surrounds (rear); and VMPS 215 sub

    "God grooves with tubes."
    · Share on FacebookShare on Twitter
  • Early B.
    Early B. Posts: 7,900
    edited November 2008
    Options
    This center channel comes closest to what I'm trying to do. Check the specs:

    http://www.sierraaudio.com/loludspeakers/spc.html
    HT/2-channel Rig: Sony 50” LCD TV; Toshiba HD-A2 DVD player; Emotiva LMC-1 pre/pro; Rogue Audio M-120 monoblocks (modded); Placette RVC; Emotiva LPA-1 amp; Bada HD-22 tube CDP (modded); VMPS Tower II SE (fronts); DIY Clearwave Dynamic 4CC (center); Wharfedale Opus Tri-Surrounds (rear); and VMPS 215 sub

    "God grooves with tubes."
    · Share on FacebookShare on Twitter
  • Systems
    Systems Posts: 14,873
    edited November 2008
    Options
    Here ya go.It even has the ever popular ring radiator tweet. http://clearwaveloudspeaker.googlepages.com/dynamic4ccpictures


    He sells a parts kit(no box) including all drivers and crossover parts for $452.
    Testing
    Testing
    Testing
    · Share on FacebookShare on Twitter
  • ben62670
    ben62670 Posts: 15,969
    edited November 2008
    Options
    GV#27 wrote: »
    Here ya go.It even has the ever popular ring radiator tweet. http://clearwaveloudspeaker.googlepages.com/dynamic4ccpictures


    He sells a parts kit(no box) including all drivers and crossover parts for $452.

    Now those speakers are hot!
    Please. Please contact me a ben62670 @ yahoo.com. Make sure to include who you are, and you are from Polk so I don't delete your email. Also I am now physically unable to work on any projects. If you need help let these guys know. There are many people who will help if you let them know where you are.
    Thanks
    Ben
    · Share on FacebookShare on Twitter
  • Early B.
    Early B. Posts: 7,900
    edited November 2008
    Options
    GV#27 wrote: »
    Here ya go.It even has the ever popular ring radiator tweet. http://clearwaveloudspeaker.googlepages.com/dynamic4ccpictures


    He sells a parts kit(no box) including all drivers and crossover parts for $452.


    Hell, yeah!!!! That's what I'm talking about!!!!

    Ben -- change of plans. Let's do this one.

    Thanks, GV.
    HT/2-channel Rig: Sony 50” LCD TV; Toshiba HD-A2 DVD player; Emotiva LMC-1 pre/pro; Rogue Audio M-120 monoblocks (modded); Placette RVC; Emotiva LPA-1 amp; Bada HD-22 tube CDP (modded); VMPS Tower II SE (fronts); DIY Clearwave Dynamic 4CC (center); Wharfedale Opus Tri-Surrounds (rear); and VMPS 215 sub

    "God grooves with tubes."
    · Share on FacebookShare on Twitter
  • ben62670
    ben62670 Posts: 15,969
    edited November 2008
    Options
    Nope. Not doing it.
    Please. Please contact me a ben62670 @ yahoo.com. Make sure to include who you are, and you are from Polk so I don't delete your email. Also I am now physically unable to work on any projects. If you need help let these guys know. There are many people who will help if you let them know where you are.
    Thanks
    Ben
    · Share on FacebookShare on Twitter
  • Systems
    Systems Posts: 14,873
    edited November 2008
    Options
    Early B. wrote: »
    Hell, yeah!!!! That's what I'm talking about!!!!
    Yeah it looks like it has the potential to give you a good kick in the berries with appropriate sound tracks.;):D


    Thanks, GV.
    Your welcome.Here is a link to his home page.http://clearwaveloudspeaker.googlepages.com/home
    Testing
    Testing
    Testing
    · Share on FacebookShare on Twitter
  • Systems
    Systems Posts: 14,873
    edited November 2008
    Options
    ben62670 wrote: »
    Nope. Not doing it.
    :eek:
    Testing
    Testing
    Testing
    · Share on FacebookShare on Twitter
  • Early B.
    Early B. Posts: 7,900
    edited November 2008
    Options
    Nevermind...
    HT/2-channel Rig: Sony 50” LCD TV; Toshiba HD-A2 DVD player; Emotiva LMC-1 pre/pro; Rogue Audio M-120 monoblocks (modded); Placette RVC; Emotiva LPA-1 amp; Bada HD-22 tube CDP (modded); VMPS Tower II SE (fronts); DIY Clearwave Dynamic 4CC (center); Wharfedale Opus Tri-Surrounds (rear); and VMPS 215 sub

    "God grooves with tubes."
    · Share on FacebookShare on Twitter
  • ben62670
    ben62670 Posts: 15,969
    edited November 2008
    Options
    I'll do it:) I was just kidding:D It does place it over budget, but that has to be one of the baddest centers I have seen. The TB mids are great performers from what I read. it does drop at about 75 pretty fast. The Dayton 8"er wants a huge box as in 8.5 feet to go low.The 7" Dayton kicks its butt all over the place. Also the 8" Silver flute romps it. Both will go to 40 3db down with a 4.5cf box.
    Please. Please contact me a ben62670 @ yahoo.com. Make sure to include who you are, and you are from Polk so I don't delete your email. Also I am now physically unable to work on any projects. If you need help let these guys know. There are many people who will help if you let them know where you are.
    Thanks
    Ben
    · Share on FacebookShare on Twitter
  • Systems
    Systems Posts: 14,873
    edited November 2008
    Options
    ben62670 wrote: »
    it does drop at about 75 pretty fast.
    He states with that measurement he didn't slice in the ports response,thats why the apparent drop in level below 75hz.He claims response into the 30s.:)


    All in all a nice little CC.
    Testing
    Testing
    Testing
    · Share on FacebookShare on Twitter
  • ben62670
    ben62670 Posts: 15,969
    edited November 2008
    Options
    I did model that Dayton, and the model agrees with his graph. The 7's would be able to drop down low, but the 8's can not pull it off. I would rather see 2 8's. It would not look as impressive, but the bass would be better. I just modeled 2 8's, and a 4 foot box tuned to 33hz with 2 3" vents 6.5 inches long would be flat to 40hz, and drop 3db at 30hz. 2 8's save $110, and he will be able to listen to all but the lowest notes on a pipe organ:D
    Please. Please contact me a ben62670 @ yahoo.com. Make sure to include who you are, and you are from Polk so I don't delete your email. Also I am now physically unable to work on any projects. If you need help let these guys know. There are many people who will help if you let them know where you are.
    Thanks
    Ben
    · Share on FacebookShare on Twitter
  • Early B.
    Early B. Posts: 7,900
    edited November 2008
    Options
    It's only 9" tall. Crazy question, but I gotta ask -- can we make it 12" without 'effing up the design? If not, I'll find a way to boost it by 3" once it's built so my TV will be centered at eye level.
    HT/2-channel Rig: Sony 50” LCD TV; Toshiba HD-A2 DVD player; Emotiva LMC-1 pre/pro; Rogue Audio M-120 monoblocks (modded); Placette RVC; Emotiva LPA-1 amp; Bada HD-22 tube CDP (modded); VMPS Tower II SE (fronts); DIY Clearwave Dynamic 4CC (center); Wharfedale Opus Tri-Surrounds (rear); and VMPS 215 sub

    "God grooves with tubes."
    · Share on FacebookShare on Twitter
  • ben62670
    ben62670 Posts: 15,969
    edited November 2008
    Options
    real rough figure is 50.5x14x16

    Edit:I'm Also thinking some 5.5's for the mids to keep the power handling up. The tang bands don't like high power. I know:o
    Please. Please contact me a ben62670 @ yahoo.com. Make sure to include who you are, and you are from Polk so I don't delete your email. Also I am now physically unable to work on any projects. If you need help let these guys know. There are many people who will help if you let them know where you are.
    Thanks
    Ben
    · Share on FacebookShare on Twitter
  • Early B.
    Early B. Posts: 7,900
    edited November 2008
    Options
    ben62670 wrote: »
    real rough figure is 50.5x14x16

    Edit:I'm Also thinking some 5.5's for the mids to keep the power handling up. The tang bands don't like high power. I know:o

    Huh? Once I buy the kit, that's it.

    Ben -- what's the estimate on the cost of the cabinet? I'm waayyy overbudget.
    HT/2-channel Rig: Sony 50” LCD TV; Toshiba HD-A2 DVD player; Emotiva LMC-1 pre/pro; Rogue Audio M-120 monoblocks (modded); Placette RVC; Emotiva LPA-1 amp; Bada HD-22 tube CDP (modded); VMPS Tower II SE (fronts); DIY Clearwave Dynamic 4CC (center); Wharfedale Opus Tri-Surrounds (rear); and VMPS 215 sub

    "God grooves with tubes."
    · Share on FacebookShare on Twitter
  • ben62670
    ben62670 Posts: 15,969
    edited November 2008
    Options
    Early B. wrote: »
    Huh? Once I buy the kit, that's it.

    If you get the kit you still need to build the box, and finish it. Also you will not reach you design goals. I am thinking wmtmw. This would not only save money, but you will reach your goals. Who is going to finish the cab? I can veneer it for you, but you will stain, and clear coat it?
    Please. Please contact me a ben62670 @ yahoo.com. Make sure to include who you are, and you are from Polk so I don't delete your email. Also I am now physically unable to work on any projects. If you need help let these guys know. There are many people who will help if you let them know where you are.
    Thanks
    Ben
    · Share on FacebookShare on Twitter
  • Systems
    Systems Posts: 14,873
    edited November 2008
    Options
    Early B. wrote: »
    It's only 9" tall. Crazy question, but I gotta ask -- can we make it 12" without 'effing up the design?
    The crossover was optimised for the 9" baffle but being as it is horzontal it likely won't affect response that much going to 12".However you do have to keep the internal volume the same so you can reduce the cabinet depth.
    ben62670 wrote: »

    Edit:I'm Also thinking some 5.5's for the mids to keep the power handling up. The tang bands don't like high power.
    Using 2 of them and crossing them over at what looks like around 350hz,PH shouldn't be an issue.
    Testing
    Testing
    Testing
    · Share on FacebookShare on Twitter
  • ben62670
    ben62670 Posts: 15,969
    edited November 2008
    Options
    2 8's $110
    http://www.parts-express.com/pe/showdetl.cfm?Partnumber=295-376
    2 5.5's $25
    http://www.madisound.com/catalog/product_info.php?manufacturers_id=150&products_id=844
    1 nippled tweeter $50
    http://www.madisound.com/catalog/product_info.php?manufacturers_id=153&products_id=1181
    I was thinking the double magnet Vifa, but the cheaper one should be a better match. It is 91.5 VS 92.7db. I would like to keep a resistor out of the tweetercuircuuit if possible. Also I prefer the Silver Flute 8's to the Dayton's. They are also cheaper, and go low.
    The drivers would be less than $200:)
    Please. Please contact me a ben62670 @ yahoo.com. Make sure to include who you are, and you are from Polk so I don't delete your email. Also I am now physically unable to work on any projects. If you need help let these guys know. There are many people who will help if you let them know where you are.
    Thanks
    Ben
    · Share on FacebookShare on Twitter
  • Systems
    Systems Posts: 14,873
    edited November 2008
    Options
    ben62670 wrote: »
    Also you will not reach you design goals.
    How does it not reach his design goals?:confused:
    ben62670 wrote: »
    2 8's $110
    http://www.parts-express.com/pe/showdetl.cfm?Partnumber=295-376
    2 5.5's $25
    http://www.madisound.com/catalog/product_info.php?manufacturers_id=150&products_id=844
    1 nippled tweeter $50
    http://www.madisound.com/catalog/product_info.php?manufacturers_id=153&products_id=1181
    I was thinking the double magnet Vifa, but the cheaper one should be a better match. It is 91.5 VS 92.7db. I would like to keep a resistor out of the tweetercuircuuit if possible. Also I prefer the Silver Flute 8's to the Dayton's. They are also cheaper, and go low.
    The drivers would be less than $200:)
    But with the kit you have an expertly designed crossover that according to the measurements does an excellent job of blending the drivers.The xover is the most important part.
    Testing
    Testing
    Testing
    · Share on FacebookShare on Twitter